Tempest/Ele feedback

[Xionor.8963]

I find the overcharge mechanic tiresome. You can't do anything for 4 seconds and it leaves you very vulnerable. The 1 stability you get with a trait is not enough. I would prefer it if it wouldn't be just a 4 second channeling  attack but a mode. It would be the same as it is now just that you can still dodge and use all your weapon skills. The breath attacks would maybe look a bit silly but apart from that I think everything else would work. For an example if you have d/d equipped and you use earth overcharge you would hover on that rock and when you use 2 the spikes will spawn around you, you would dash with 3,  create a shock around you with 4 and have the same channel attack with 5, all while still hovering on that rock. No additional animations needed I think. The 6 alacrity could also get increased a bit to give us a bit more breathing room especially if you want to go to water to heal you a bit and then swap back to dps.

Also I would love it if d/d could get a little update like the fire 5 creates a firefeld that keeps damaging the enemies. Just a weaker version of the warhorn 5 and the air 4 could create a damaging effect on 1 enemy similar to the focus 4 from the guardian. I don't mind that /d is weaker than /w because you have extra mobility but the question is how much of a dps loss is that mobility worth in pve?

The cooldown of the elemental glyphs are also too long. Reduce the cooldown and duration of the elements by 1/3 or something like that. It takes too long to spawn 4 of them. The elite elemental could be a permanent pet which changes according to your element outside of combat, but once inside of combat, it is locked to the element in which you started the fight.

In underwater you could create a sphere that just shoots at enemies which changes colour according to your element.

 

Edited June 29, 2022 by Xionor.8963

[Jillian.4502]

4 hours ago, Xionor.8963 said:

The elite elemental could be a permanent pet which changes according to your element outside of combat, but once inside of combat, it is locked to the element in which you started the fight.

I never thought of that, but that actually sounds genius. 

[Artemis.8034]

I dont know what will happen but it cant stay this way, its terrible Look at mech or HB with quick, both have far better ways to provide alac and quick, Ele as usual has to have a clunky mechanic in order to provide alac. It may have looked good on paper, but in practice it plain out sucks.

[AliamRationem.5172]

1 hour ago, Artemis.8034 said:

I dont know what will happen but it cant stay this way, its terrible Look at mech or HB with quick, both have far better ways to provide alac and quick, Ele as usual has to have a clunky mechanic in order to provide alac. It may have looked good on paper, but in practice it plain out sucks.

I figured based on the weak boon coverage of the new boonshare specs they intended to move to a meta where you bring full DPS with incidental or low-investment boonshare.  But of course that would require nuking mechanist and firebrand from orbit which we all know ANet will never do.  Why?  Heck, I don't know.  It's obviously the sensible thing to do, but for some reason they refuse to do it.

[soulknight.9620]

10 hours ago, AliamRationem.5172 said:

But of course that would require nuking mechanist and firebrand from orbit which we all know ANet will never do. 

Well if they come out with a philosophy that dps builds should do approx 30k dps, boon/dps approx 20-22k, heal support approx 5-10k dps, then fine, but they should get every profession into that criteria. Ele atm fits right into that. But i doubt it that they will nerf the "easy builds" cause like they said "people are better off playing easy builds". 

[Bleikopf.2491]

On 6/29/2022 at 3:59 PM, Xionor.8963 said:

You can't do anything for 4 seconds and it leaves you very vulnerable. The 1 stability you get with a trait is not enough.

So I just had a very stupid idea. I'm not saying this is a solution or anything, but let's just think of it as a thought experiment.

What if Overloads had a break bar?

I can only imagine it ending up absolutely broken lol.

 

On 6/29/2022 at 3:59 PM, Xionor.8963 said:

I would prefer it if it wouldn't be just a 4 second channeling  attack but a mode. It would be the same as it is now just that you can still dodge and use all your weapon skills.

Yes and no. It depends on what ANet wants from Tempest.
Tempest has the opportunity to be the "simple" elite spec for Ele. Making it so that you can still use weapons and dodges forces the overloads to be less effective and raises the skill ceiling for Tempest, and we all know how ANet doesn't like that and nerfs the cat out of us for that.

The overcharge mechanic could use some tuning though. It's a big thing, and it doesn't feel that big. But I'm not deep enough into Tempest to judge whether that's just a feeling or the risk and opportunity cost don't fit the reward of the mechanic.

[Xionor.8963]

How does it RAISE the skill ceiling. The rotation LITERALLY stays the same, nothing changes from a button input perspective.

Also Let me just make a simple comparison.

Renegade: Can use all his skills, dodge and revive, while giving alac and healing through his healing skill and elite

Mechanist: Can use all his skills, dodge and revive, while giving alac and barrier.

Ranger: Can use all his skills, dodge and revive, while giving alac and has very strong self revival once downed.

Thief: Can use all his skills, dodge and revive, while giving alac and can stealth to revive allies.

Chrono: Can use all his skills, dodge and revive, while giving alac and has canon fodder through clones.

 

Tempest: "DAZES" himself for 4 seconds EACH time you want to give alac while doing some damage or healing (damage that is still inferior to all other alac providers).

No healing, no dodges, no weapon or utilities available and no reviving of your fallen allies. Do any of the developers test that against high end content? Try to give your group perma alac in the T4 Joko fractal against the last boss. It is of course possible but absurdly more difficult than any other class.

It's the same with /d 5 on earth. You can't do anything for 2 seconds during that attack but also do less damage than any other condi dps class who don't have an attack that locks them for 2 seconds. It's just outdated and doesn't fit in the fast aoe spaming fights the game has introduced.

Edited July 1, 2022 by Xionor.8963

[Jski.6180]

Very much needs a conja wepon update they should be seen on the same level as kits for eng. It would go a long way for tempest with alacrity to have viable conja wepon build as you can get 20% cdr on the skills and 25% cdr from alacrity but due to the both casting of conja wepon and "losing" one to the ground it never works out well.

[Bleikopf.2491]

44 minutes ago, Xionor.8963 said:

How does it RAISE the skill ceiling. The rotation LITERALLY stays the same, nothing changes from a button input perspective.

Skill Ceiling as in "The most a player can get out of it".
Being able to use skills during Overcharge means that players can perform more complex rotations. Suddenly the best thing you can do is not only "press this button and 4 seconds" but "press this button, then perform a subrotation".

E: comparison "Skill Floor: The minimum amount of skill required to play this build."

Edited July 1, 2022 by Bleikopf.2491

[Xionor.8963]

30 minutes ago, Bleikopf.2491 said:

Skill Ceiling as in "The most a player can get out of it".
Being able to use skills during Overcharge means that players can perform more complex rotations. Suddenly the best thing you can do is not only "press this button and 4 seconds" but "press this button, then perform a subrotation".

E: comparison "Skill Floor: The minimum amount of skill required to play this build."

That's not how it would be. There is option 1 where you could  use attunement instantly. So you use F1 do your normal rotation while spinning in the fire tornado and then swap to F4. Press F4 again to summon your rock attunement pillar and do your normal rotation ect..

Or option 2 where you have to wait for attunement. Press F1 to become fire tornado and use normal rotation. Press F4 and do your rotation until the F4 attunement is ready, press F4 now while you're on the rock pillar press F3 to become air attuned to use air skills while being on the rock thingy. I would prefer option 1. But there is nothing more you could do. the only difference is that you don't have 4 seconds where you can't do anything. At the moment you already use every skill only once per elemental rotation except mabye the fire breath of dagger 2 which you use at the start and at the end. That's the point of tempest. Use all you skills once, then Press F1,F2,F3 or F4 to use overcharge and then swap and spam again every skill you have. There is no rhyme or reason just unleash everything once until the overcharge is ready. You can do some combo explosions but you still just spam them instantly and don't wait for the right moment. Which I don't mind as you can still "emergency" swap into a different attuenement for CC, mobility, ect...

Edited July 1, 2022 by Xionor.8963