General sPvP impressions from an Engineer perspective

[bethekey.8314]

Just general sPvP impressions, not many suggestions because we all know they won't get used. I'm curious how my biased Engineer viewpoint differs from others, and why.

Warrior - Bladesworn is one of the best current side node duelists. Dragon trigger is too protected to the point it's uninteractive and unfun to play against. Artillery Slash does too much damage for how spammable it is. I hardly ever see Berserker/Core played. Longbow variants seem to have potential and I wish they'd be buffed.

Thief - While the stealth changes reduce stealth camping, they seem like an overall buff that thief didn't really need. It does seem to open up interesting playstyles, which I'm for. Spectre has way too high survivability through sheer health + mobility.

Ranger - Core Ranger + Untamed seems generally strong right now with high survivability and burst. I'd like to see spirits and Druid especially played more. Relative to other weapons, Greatsword seems overloaded and other classes' weapons should ideally be brought up to its level.

Mesmer - One shot combos are overloaded. Virtuoso pairs heavy spike damage with ungodly amounts of defense. It's laughable to watch how frequent windows of evade, block, aegis, and stun (on opponent) are.

Necromancer - Harbinger remains dominant with such minor nerfs. No one is surprised. High damage, fairly tanky, good mobility. A complete package that reminds me of pre-nerf Holosmith. The float ability clearly needs a longer cooldown. I hardly see Reapers or Scourges anywhere, but it's difficult to tell if that's due to being weak or Harb being broken.

Guardian - The Willbender nerf is felt and the spec is more manageable. It's still dominant and over the top, relatively. Support Guardians seem largely dwarfed by Elementalists now.

Elementalist - Strong and well-rounded, with sometimes oppressive amounts of blocks, projectile hate, and stability. Nearly untouchable unless a melee build with stab/multiple stunbreaks. Their stability uptime makes them seem like a more complex and successful Juggernaut Flamethrower spec. Mostly see Tempests and Catalysts.

Revenant - Vindicator is too durable for how much spike damage it can do. A second dodge is hardly missed for more frequent, longer lasting, and more impactful dodges. Hardly see any Renegades.

Engineer - Mechanist is no longer pigeon-holed into stall-tank specs. Alacrity uptime is so heavily nerfed in PvP due to infinite Sanctuary rune interactions it's hardly relevant. Rifle was buffed, then promptly nerfed, as is Engineer tradition. The Rifle changes are still nice though and infused some diversity into the class. Core condition builds need love, pistol especially. I don't see any Engineer build being dominant/meta right now.

Edited July 6, 2022 by bethekey.8314

[Downstate.4697]

So everything but engi needs a nerf and engi needs buffs. 

[Myror.7521]

I must say bladesworn is not good cause of that Artillery Slash but cause of spaming shouts. The skill of bladesworn are all complete weak but became strong cause shout spam is heal + 25 Stacks might + 25 stack vulnerability and all this spamable lel.

 

Also every Single new EoD spec brokes pvp to me. Most of them are litterly spaming skills or are simply that tanky that you could eat full dps rotations of non EoD specs and still be at full life. Sry but those specs litterly made build over Player skill a thing and that in itself is Bad for a game xd!

[Terrorhuz.4695]

1 hour ago, Pati.2438 said:

I must say bladesworn is not good cause of that Artillery Slash but cause of spaming shouts. The skill of bladesworn are all complete weak but became strong cause shout spam is heal + 25 Stacks might + 25 stack vulnerability and all this spamable lel.

That is entirely not true. Artillery slash is a heavy hitter even without might spam.

In clip below: Helseth getting 100-0 by artillery slashes in 1.5s, no vuln on him and 7 stacks of might on opponent.

https://clips.twitch.tv/StylishEnticingKangarooTakeNRG-08Spu1e-1s3HZEy1

[Kuma.1503]

My experiences thus far:

Necro

🍔

 

Guardian

Easier to deal with post nerf, still a challenge, but it's easier to bait out their cooldowns and capitalize now. Kiting a willbender is still pretty much impossible. 

Core seems like it's falling off a bit in favor of tempest, but it is by no means bad. It's still definitely top 2 supports in the game right now at the absolute worst. 

 

Engi

Rifle Mech go brrr. And proceed to commit self delete into Magnetic Aura. Maybe one day your average rifle mech will learn to hit "Return to Me" when Tempests puts up the big brown bubble. 

Scrapper and Holo... Where'd u guys all go? You hiding in sneak gyro? 

 

Ranger

WTF IS A DRUID?

Seriously, these guys are like shiny pokemon. I haven't seen one. 

Untamed oneshots from stealth are kinda annoying, but managable enough WHEN THEY ACTUALLY RENDER ON MY SCREEN.

Pls fix stealth render lag ANet...

 

-Sincerely, My Sanity

Revenant

Anyone remember Renegade? Anyone?

Vindicator is tanky af, does good damage, and... for some reason people keep saying it's immobile. 

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Nomad's_Advance this has a 3 second cooldown and a very moderate energy cost. Doesn't require a target. Plus any additional ports they may have with sword and shiro, plus the 900 range dash that also inflicts chill on GS. These guys really aren't that slow. 

Heralds show up once in a blue moon and do all their usual tricks. You definitely can't sleep on them, especially if you're not playing FOTM. 

 

Mesmer

Another class I really don't see that often. When I do it's almost always virtuoso, and they're surprisingly difficult to focus with their blocks, stealth, and mobility. They can dish out some respectable damage too. I wouldn't go as far as to call them OP though. 

 

Thief

Specters are annoying, they can make one member of the enemy team (usually 🍔) a pain to kill, and devoting the time needed to kill it gives 🍔all the time it needs to freecast on you. They're good, but I'm not sure how strong they'd be if you removed Necro from the equation. 

 

Ele

Pretty sure tempest is a product of the meta right now. Rifle Mech is FOTM right now and it turns it off entirely. It also turns off the enemy 🍔temporarily while simultaneously enabling your own. This is a big deal when matches can have as many as 4 🍔in them. 

Other supports are also just... kinda bad right now (*cough* buff Heal Scrapper *cough*)

D/D Catalysts are actually pretty strong right now. Good cleanse, good mobility, good damage, stability, reflects... Biggest weakess they have is that they're still ele, meaning investing into the damage makes them paper against burst damage, and most seem to build aggressively. 

 

Warrior

No matter how bad this class gets, good Spellbreakers still wreck my ****. Pretty sure these people are thriving on pure spite at this point. 

Bladesworn are constantly screaming. I can't tell if it's directed at us or the ANET balance team. 

 

 

 

 

--Berserker who?

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 6, 2022 by Kuma.1503

[Hotride.2187]

9 minutes ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

That is entirely not true. Artillery slash is a heavy hitter even without might spam.

In clip below: Helseth getting 100-0 by artillery slashes in 1.5s, no vuln on him and 7 stacks of might on opponent.

https://clips.twitch.tv/StylishEnticingKangarooTakeNRG-08Spu1e-1s3HZEy1

Woah, I should try this. 10k ranged dmg sounds good. Though a power mesmer should know better than to get hit by anything.

[greedywholesome.9081]

21 minutes ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

That is entirely not true. Artillery slash is a heavy hitter even without might spam.

In clip below: Helseth getting 100-0 by artillery slashes in 1.5s, no vuln on him and 7 stacks of might on opponent.

https://clips.twitch.tv/StylishEnticingKangarooTakeNRG-08Spu1e-1s3HZEy1

 

You posted that months ago. Helseth's response was priceless. "What the...." 

[Myror.7521]

@Terrorhuz.4695 oh no a person get oneshotet by a skill that does 3k damage 3 times with lucky crit hits so it must deal big dmg lmao xD. Bruh its dmg is hard bad. Its only "good" cause you spam it 3 times in a row like a braindead chicken litterly xD, Sry man im tired of eod meta. All builds are litterly so forgiving that i fall asleep while playing pvp lel.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

2 hours ago, Pati.2438 said:

@Terrorhuz.4695 oh no a person get oneshotet by a skill that does 3k damage 3 times with lucky crit hits so it must deal big dmg lmao xD. Bruh its dmg is hard bad. Its only "good" cause you spam it 3 times in a row like a braindead chicken litterly xD, Sry man im tired of eod meta. All builds are litterly so forgiving that i fall asleep while playing pvp lel.

When glass hits glass, glass tends to shatter.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

3 hours ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

That is entirely not true. Artillery slash is a heavy hitter even without might spam.

In clip below: Helseth getting 100-0 by artillery slashes in 1.5s, no vuln on him and 7 stacks of might on opponent.

https://clips.twitch.tv/StylishEnticingKangarooTakeNRG-08Spu1e-1s3HZEy1

Yeah it's somehow overlooked.

That's like a 14k burst in relatively the same amount of time it would take to land a Rapid Fire or summon 3x clones and Power Shatter.

A Berserker/Eagle Sic Em Soulbeast would need to prime Quick Zephyr, Sic Em, OWP, and land a full Rapid Fire to tag that much damage, but a Bladesworn can land that same kind of damage in an extremely similar timeframe by spamming 3x Artillery Slash without even having buffs.

Edited July 6, 2022 by Trevor Boyer.6524

[Vancho.8750]

1 hour ago, Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

Yeah it's somehow overlooked.

That's like a 14k burst in relatively the same amount of time it would take to land a Rapid Fire or summon 3x clones and Power Shatter.

A Berserker/Eagle Sic Em Soulbeast would need to prime Quick Zephyr, Sic Em, OWP, and land a full Rapid Fire to tag that much damage, but a Bladesworn can land that same kind of damage in an extremely similar timeframe by spamming 3x Artillery Slash without even having buffs.

It works this way cause it is a band aid on top of band aid, the rest of the kit is kitten maybe the projectile destruction skill is fine, but that is about it.

Also terrible comparison Sick em has follow up with GS , BS follow up is to shout and heal up, a more proper comparison is Valk ranger, both play kinda the same tank damage, do ccs ,heal up  then do a surprise burst and loop back to the first part. Who ever thought Valk ranger is peak sidenoding and decided that having another one is good idea, needs a slap in the face.

[Terrorhuz.4695]

3 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

When glass hits glass, glass tends to shatter.

When did, precisely, shoutsworn get classified as "glassy"?

Edited July 6, 2022 by Terrorhuz.4695

[Grand Marshal.4098]

I mean if you play BsW with shouts... Yawn

.... 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

49 minutes ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

When did, precisely, shoutsworn get classified as "glassy"?

A lot of them use Berserker's Amulet and still pull high total healing numbers without any Healing Power due to the shear amount of healing. It's still glass stats versus glass stats.

[Terrorhuz.4695]

3 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

A lot of them use Berserker's Amulet and still pull high total healing numbers without any Healing Power due to the shear amount of healing. It's still glass stats versus glass stats.

Don't drop this bs on me, my man.

Glass means you're fragile; if people hit you, you die. I don't think that's the case for a bladesworn that can facetank basically everything.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

9 minutes ago, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

Don't drop this bs on me, my man.

Glass means you're fragile; if people hit you, you die. I don't think that's the case for a bladesworn that can facetank basically everything.

Glass stats are still glass stats. That video is the natural outcome of one character with glass stats hitting another character with glass stats that fails to dodge. Tactical Reload being the balance monstrosity that it is does not negate the fact that Power BSW still runs glass stats.

[Lighter.5631]

18 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

 

Warrior - Bladesworn is one of the best current side node duelists.

 

not close, 1v1 maybe, side node no.

and Artillery slash easily dodgeable.

helseth did nothing there, simply because he didnt expect it to do damage.

he could've avoid them all easily if he wanted.

and that 3 bullet would be half of BS main damage.

 

Edited July 6, 2022 by Lighter.5631

[bethekey.8314]

11 hours ago, FrownyClown.8402 said:

So everything but engi needs a nerf and engi needs buffs. 

 

18 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

I hardly ever see Berserker/Core played. Longbow variants seem to have potential and I wish they'd be buffed.

 

18 hours ago, bethekey.8314 said:

I'd like to see spirits and Druid especially played more.

I imagine you're joking, but to reiterate: I specifically put "from an Engineer perspective" to indicate bias and I'm curious how balance depends on viewpoint.

[bethekey.8314]

29 minutes ago, Lighter.5631 said:

not close, 1v1 maybe, side node no.

and Artillery slash easily dodgeable.

helseth did nothing there, simply because he didnt expect it to do damage.

he could've avoid them all easily if he wanted.

and that 3 bullet would be half of BS main damage.

 

For context, what class do you main?

Side nodes are mostly 1v1s and "duelist" implies 1v1.

Artillery slash has 3 ammo and a 15 sec cd. I have two dodges. He was dead in ~1.5  seconds, from range, spamming 1 ability. Warrior has other hard hitting skills. Dragon trigger is spammable.

All that aside, "just dodge" is a terrible argument and is rightfully meme'd on for it.

Edited July 6, 2022 by bethekey.8314

[Lighter.5631]

32 minutes ago, bethekey.8314 said:

For context, what class do you main?

Side nodes are mostly 1v1s and "duelist" implies 1v1.

Artillery slash has 3 ammo and a 15 sec cd. I have two dodges. He was dead in ~1.5  seconds, from range, spamming 1 ability. Warrior has other hard hitting skills. Dragon trigger is spammable.

All that aside, "just dodge" is a terrible argument and is rightfully meme'd on for it.

 

having 3 ammo = 45 second cooldown

1 ammo = 15 second cooldown

1 ammo did 4k crit on a glass light armor

now tell me what class does not have a 15 second cooldown skill that can crit a glass light armor for 4k

funny because you need to look at it in detail

it is 3 skills with each 15 second cool down in the same button that can only charge one by one, that's it. now it wouldn't look op at all wouldn't it, compared to all the extra buttons from other classes that can also crit 4k  on glass light armor.

 

after you spent the initial 3 bullets, you need to have to wait for it charge one by one, else it's just gonna be a 4k(3k more realistically) crit every 15 seconds, which is super low, when other classes can charge 3 different skills at the same time that also does similar DPS

 

side node needs to take 1v2 and avoid ganks, and bladesworn is weak at that. everyone can 1v1, my vindicator can 1v1, harb can 1v1, why would i take a bladesworn. because it is better? at what way?

 

in fact dodge is not a terrible argument in this case, because it is literally more dodge-able then rampage, which literally hits more with less. rampage will kill helseth in that situation in 2 hits, how about you start asking for rampage nerf as well

like i said, if he wanted to avoid it he could easily avoid it, the reaction time is high, even i could've avoided it easily

 

if you actually played any of the class at all, you would realize, BS without those 3 bullets, the damage output is minimum after the initial 3 bullets, as it's only charging 1 bullet one at a time, unless you wait 30-45 seconds and for a burst, then that means longer without damage.

 

Edited July 6, 2022 by Lighter.5631

[Khalisto.5780]

The simple fact that EoD specs have easier access to stab already makes them strong. On top of that they're doing about the same dps (at least) as their pre EoD meta counterparts.

 

I think they have to adress this stab issue otherwise ppl will just play the game of playing what has not been nerfed.

 

[Ragnar.4257]

54 minutes ago, Khalisto.5780 said:

The simple fact that EoD specs have easier access to stab already makes them strong. On top of that they're doing about the same dps (at least) as their pre EoD meta counterparts.

 

I think they have to adress this stab issue otherwise ppl will just play the game of playing what has not been nerfed.

 

Lol, what?

Which EoD specs are pumping significantly more stab than their core/HoT/PoF predecessors?

There's Catalyst and..... ???

[bethekey.8314]

2 hours ago, Lighter.5631 said:

 

having 3 ammo = 45 second cooldown

1 ammo = 15 second cooldown

1 ammo did 4k crit on a glass light armor

now tell me what class does not have a 15 second cooldown skill that can crit a glass light armor for 4k

funny because you need to look at it in detail

it is 3 skills with each 15 second cool down in the same button that can only charge one by one, that's it. now it wouldn't look op at all wouldn't it, compared to all the extra buttons from other classes that can also crit 4k  on glass light armor.

 

after you spent the initial 3 bullets, you need to have to wait for it charge one by one, else it's just gonna be a 4k(3k more realistically) crit every 15 seconds, which is super low, when other classes can charge 3 different skills at the same time that also does similar DPS

 

side node needs to take 1v2 and avoid ganks, and bladesworn is weak at that. everyone can 1v1, my vindicator can 1v1, harb can 1v1, why would i take a bladesworn. because it is better? at what way?

 

in fact dodge is not a terrible argument in this case, because it is literally more dodge-able then rampage, which literally hits more with less. rampage will kill helseth in that situation in 2 hits, how about you start asking for rampage nerf as well

like i said, if he wanted to avoid it he could easily avoid it, the reaction time is high, even i could've avoided it easily

 

if you actually played any of the class at all, you would realize, BS without those 3 bullets, the damage output is minimum after the initial 3 bullets, as it's only charging 1 bullet one at a time, unless you wait 30-45 seconds and for a burst, then that means longer without damage.

 

Again, for context, what class do you main?

You're getting awfully defensive, I'm just curious about other's perspectives here. Try to keep it civil.

I understand how the ammo system works. Most fights in Conquest are spaced out. At the start of most fights, you'll have 3 ammo. I believe Tactical Reload also restores charges. It's much more bursty than 1 Artillery Slash per 15 seconds like you allude to.

Bladesworn is top tier in 1v1s from its extremely high sustain, uninteractive dragon trigger, and spammable burst. In my opinion.

 

Edited July 6, 2022 by bethekey.8314

[Guirssane.7082]

only playable engi build is mortar scrapper, rest is poop

Edited July 6, 2022 by Guirssane.7082

[Myror.7521]

@bethekey.8314 well i mean he is actually right. bladesworns 3 ammo skill might be somewhat strong but it also is the only way to actually do somewhat decent dmg on the whole bladeskill setup. Also he is right when it comes to side node. Side nodes need to do 1vx and bladesworn cant do 1vx simply cause its still played on glassy stats (Tho i like that it actually is like this cause it would be too strong otherwise). Bladesworn ends up in been as necr. Hard self sustain thx to shouts ( like shroud of necr) so in 1v1 it shines. But it only get Max 3 stunbrakes but also get a 10 sek cd on sweap weap (or out of gunsaber kit) so while it have insane heal per shouts it also lacks in self sustain when it comes to Blocks or boons. Ends ub that bladesworn is ezy to counter when u use ccs.