Armorer: The next elite spec I'd like to see for engineer.

[Lily.1935]

Engineer has a pretty good set of elite specs so far that fill a few fantasies for the class quite well. And aside from the clumsiness with scrapper's design at HoT's launch I think all of them are quite well suited to the class fantasy. But there's another class fantasy I'd really like to see and something we do see in other games. And that's the power armor. From Megaman to metroid to Ironman we see powerful mechanical armor being used quite a bit in science fantasy and science fiction with tinkerers, artificers and engineers so this is something Engineer would be perfect for.

The primary challenge of such a spec is the design. I think the idea of essentially giving them a "Shroud" would work very well but that would mean replacing their existing armor or covering it up with a new tech suit. Photon forge coats the wearer in light but this isn't quite the same fantasy I'm going for. An idea of modifying the armor through its traits much like mechanist does to give the spec's "shroud" a gun arm or shock gauntlets sounds great. Further modifications could be done using the utility skill type Armament which bladesworn gets.

One major class fantasy I'm after is the charge shot. The alpha version of Guild Wars 2 had charge skills which you could release at max charge to deal more damage. And giving the charge shot to the power armor "Shroud" to me would be super cool. Normally they're just little lemons but if you charge it up to its max you fire a large piercing ball of energy which has slight kickback like Bladesworn's Dragon's Roar. I love the idea of having skills nod to the classic games like Megaman and Metroid, especially with a skill like that.

I'll definitely hammer out a more complete idea later on, though that might take some time.

[SleepyBat.9034]

1 hour ago, Lily.1935 said:

large piercing ball of energy which has slight kickback

This is just Prime Light Beam.

Eh doesn't sound that interesting but who knows, you could be onto something.

[Kodama.6453]

Not really a fan of it. In general, engineer elite specs are becoming too scifi for my taste and this would be another one of these.

Also it might just be holoforge again with a slightly different flavor.

Edited August 3, 2022 by Kodama.6453

[Lily.1935]

3 hours ago, SleepyBat.9034 said:

This is just Prime Light Beam.

Eh doesn't sound that interesting but who knows, you could be onto something.

Its a giant lemon. Have you not played Megaman or Metroid?

[Lily.1935]

3 hours ago, Kodama.6453 said:

Not really a fan of it. In general, engineer elite specs are becoming too scifi for my taste and this would be another one of these.

Also it might just be holoforge again with a slightly different flavor.

Holoforge doesn't protect you. I'm talking about  giving them a proper shroud. Why I use it in quotations in the the post is because its not technically a shroud even though mechanically it is.

[Kodama.6453]

8 hours ago, Lily.1935 said:

Holoforge doesn't protect you. I'm talking about  giving them a proper shroud. Why I use it in quotations in the the post is because its not technically a shroud even though mechanically it is.

It's still a transformation which gives you a new set of weapon skills. The addition that your ressource protects your health by it being a shroud doesn't make it different enough from photon forge to make it interesting, so it's still a hard pass for me.

It also feels thematically boring for me. 

[Lily.1935]

24 minutes ago, Kodama.6453 said:

It's still a transformation which gives you a new set of weapon skills. The addition that your ressource protects your health by it being a shroud doesn't make it different enough from photon forge to make it interesting, so it's still a hard pass for me.

It also feels thematically boring for me. 

How is Photon forge differen't from Kits or gunsaber? And maybe it is to you. But to me a Elite spec which nods to the Armorer from Dungeons and dragons, Samus Aran from metroid, Megaman from Megaman and Iron man sounds amazing. A heavy metal spec with grappling beams, Ice beams, a bubble shield that you can shoot out, an auto attack that's fire rate is linked to how fast you hit the key or you can hold down to charge up a much more powerful charge shot, Missles that have different properties like electricity or freezing potential. Getting a Dash and having the Power suit's skills 1-5 be nearly fully customizable through traits and Utility skills sounds extremely enticing to me.

I've been stewing the idea for a while and skills 1-3 can be linked to traits while 4 and 5 could be linked to utility skills equipped. Either you get the normal tool belt skills in those slot you can select from each of your available utility skills or two unique skills which are based on Utility type equipped. Part of the idea is that the toolbelt skills would be replaced by the armor. And your armor skills would trigger Tool belt traits, although I have to be very very careful about how I go about designing that since some traits were not meant to be linked with an Auto attack so that skill might be omitted from triggering those traits entirely.

You just got to have a bit more imagination with it.

[Alcatraznc.3869]

I doubt a shroud like thing will happens because it would directly compete against Holosmith. If the shroud version deals the same amount of damage as the holosmith, it would already be a better holosmith just for the fact you have a second HP bar so you can afford to be more reckless. 

 

Personnally I think Anet could give Engineer a Bladesworn like spec, pressing F5 would give you a special weapon. I have proposed a rocket launcher because rocket launcher are fun with a tradeoff that using the rocket launcher would slow you down and hinder your mobility.

 

But another kind of spec Anet could definitely do (for engineer but also other class) is a spec that enhances what Engineer is. Like it wouldnt necessarily brings a new weapon or utility skill, however it would pushes to the extreme a certain aspect of the class. For instance a Demolishionist spec that is basically another explosive focus line that would boost explosive type damage or explosive effect and so on. Or a Pyromaniac spec that would further enhance the firearms trait as well as burning. 

[Kodama.6453]

1 hour ago, Lily.1935 said:

How is Photon forge differen't from Kits or gunsaber? And maybe it is to you. But to me a Elite spec which nods to the Armorer from Dungeons and dragons, Samus Aran from metroid, Megaman from Megaman and Iron man sounds amazing. A heavy metal spec with grappling beams, Ice beams, a bubble shield that you can shoot out, an auto attack that's fire rate is linked to how fast you hit the key or you can hold down to charge up a much more powerful charge shot, Missles that have different properties like electricity or freezing potential. Getting a Dash and having the Power suit's skills 1-5 be nearly fully customizable through traits and Utility skills sounds extremely enticing to me.

I've been stewing the idea for a while and skills 1-3 can be linked to traits while 4 and 5 could be linked to utility skills equipped. Either you get the normal tool belt skills in those slot you can select from each of your available utility skills or two unique skills which are based on Utility type equipped. Part of the idea is that the toolbelt skills would be replaced by the armor. And your armor skills would trigger Tool belt traits, although I have to be very very careful about how I go about designing that since some traits were not meant to be linked with an Auto attack so that skill might be omitted from triggering those traits entirely.

You just got to have a bit more imagination with it.

Kits and gunsabre have unlimited use, that's the difference. You can always use them as long as their individual skills are available.

Meanwhile both shroud and photon forge are limited in their usage through ressource management. Just inversed. Shroud is about building up a resspurce to spend. Photon forge builds up a ressource while getting used, but once you reach a limit, you will be locked out from it (either "voluntarily" by leaving the forge to prevent overheating or involuntarily by overheating and being locked out for a set time).

And I am aware that this is my personal opinion. If that's a thematic and gameplay you would enjoy, that's fair. I am just voicing my opinion that I hope this doesn't happen, since it would feel uninteresting for me, both mechanically and thematically.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

Engineers can have BsW. Warriors are fine with no 3rd and 4th elite specs. 

Edited August 4, 2022 by Grand Marshal.4098

[Lily.1935]

7 hours ago, Kodama.6453 said:

Kits and gunsabre have unlimited use, that's the difference. You can always use them as long as their individual skills are available.

Meanwhile both shroud and photon forge are limited in their usage through ressource management. Just inversed. Shroud is about building up a resspurce to spend. Photon forge builds up a ressource while getting used, but once you reach a limit, you will be locked out from it (either "voluntarily" by leaving the forge to prevent overheating or involuntarily by overheating and being locked out for a set time).

And I am aware that this is my personal opinion. If that's a thematic and gameplay you would enjoy, that's fair. I am just voicing my opinion that I hope this doesn't happen, since it would feel uninteresting for me, both mechanically and thematically.

Weapons and kits you generally always have access too right away. photon forge you have access too right away. Shroud you do not. Also Thief uses initiative with weapons and firebrand tomes have a resource mechanic and neither of those are called shrouds. The power armor idea is exceptionally different from photon forge which is just a kit with heat management. The differences in function between shroud, kits, photon forge, tomes, weapons, conjure weapons is very very minor ultimately. All of them change your skills 1-5.

[Lily.1935]

37 minutes ago, Grand Marshal.4098 said:

Engineers can have BsW. Warriors are fine with no 3rd and 4th elite specs. 

Not sure what BsW is. And also I don't agree. Warrior could have a healer spec like Paragon or something with chant skills.

[Kodama.6453]

1 hour ago, Lily.1935 said:

Not sure what BsW is. And also I don't agree. Warrior could have a healer spec like Paragon or something with chant skills.

Bsw is bladesworn.

[Lily.1935]

5 minutes ago, Kodama.6453 said:

Bsw is bladesworn.

Thanks.

[Infinity.2876]

This is from galaxy of heroes a turned based mobile game your post reminded me of him

 

I also kind of already Posted this

[SentriX.3209]

I'd like an Iron Man elite spec and the next baddy to be Thanos.

[Sindust.7059]

Incomplete and unbalanced suggestion for power armor.

 

Class skill+first minor trait: Enable power armor. Gain a resource "battery charge" which acts as a 2nd HP bar when power armor is active. Scales with vitality. Increase movement speed by 30% when active. When the power armor is active, movement, weapon skill use and taking damage drain the battery. When inactive, movement and weapon skill use recharge the battery. 

 

Additional effect of activating the armor depending on trait selected in the first column:

1. Overvolted Servos: Increase power by 50%. All your weapon skills are now additionally dealing explosion damage equal to 20% of their normal damage in a 360 radius around the target each time they do damage. All weapon skills now also count as blast finishers.

2. Volatile Fuel: Increase condition damage by 50%, and an additional 20% when using the Flamethrower. All your weapon skills apply an additional stack of burning each time they do damage. 1% of the fire damage you do is restored as battery charge.

3. Heavy Plating (this one would be an alternative for chrono in cases when the group needs a "real" tank): Increase toughness and concentration by 50%. Your weapon skills now apply 1s of quickness to your group. Toolkit (you know, the one everybody forgot it existed) skills also apply 1s alacrity. Gain the ability to absorb the healing effects used on you to regenerate the battery.

 

The healing skill would restore the energy by a large amount when used while PA is active and heal for a medium-low amount when PA is inactive. Idk how I would go about the rest.

[Matoro.9708]

I think the obvious answer is energy shields that recharge; you have an automatically refilling barrier. 

My first thought was armor plates that take a single hit then fall off, with some immunity in between, and regenerate, but that has more balance issues. 

And for those that remember the Reegar Carbine from ME3, that'd be pretty cool. Electric flamethrower. 

Meh. None of this will ever happen.

[Lily.1935]

Working out the traits I have the Adept traits so far, since they need to do 2 things. since the armor gains its 1-3 skills through traits each of the adept need to be related to skill 1.

Charging is a mechanic I'd introduce

Top: Shock gauntlets. A heavy strike skill that punches foes with a heavy shock. Can be charged to do a rush forward powerful strike.

Middle: Charge Shot: shoot a projectile 1/4th second cast time, or hold down the shot to charge it up and launch a large charged blast. Slightly knocks back the user if charged. Dodging an attack charges it instantly.

Bottom: Ice beam: Fire a powerful beam of Chilling energy. Charge it up to strike multiple times and pierce with the chilling beam. Inflicts Frostbite condition.
All sources of Chill become frostbite. Frostbite: Movement speed and skill recharge is reduced by 1% for each stack of frostbite up to 25%. Frostbite deals damage over time.

I'm very much a metroid fan so ice beam is kinda a must for me. But Chill on an auto attack would be too insane.

Two more I have for the Master tier.

Middle: Seeking Missiles: Fire off multiple Missiles which seek out their targets.

Bottom: Ice Missiles: Fire out a couple missiles which inflict the chilled condition. If Ice beam is taken all explosions have a chance to inflict the frostbite condition.

 

I'm Still working out the details. But I'm hammering some cool stuff out. Like I think the weapon that makes the most sense is Focus. Although I haven't decided if it should be paired with anything else or not. And of course each of the traits I have here are subject to major reworks as needed. Some of my ideas are extremely experimental.

[nomir.4597]

I think the charging mechanic could be really fun. I think a power resource mechanic fits well with the idea as well.

To mix things up, the toolbelt skills could be based on the weapon you choose. These would be your charge skills. Your hands could transform into a large Megaman/Samus blaster while firing, rocket boots could form on your feet for movement, or a shoulder mount could form to fire a swarm of missiles.

I was also thinking some rerouting skills could fit the theme. They would be flip over skills. When above around 50% power they are more offensive and use power. When below 50% they flip to increase your power and are defensive when used.

I could even see something like the Armorer taking 10% less damage and dealing 10% less damage when at full power. Then when power is empty you deal 10% more damage and take 10% more damage. You could then try to juggle your survivability and your damage.

There would be a column that deals with the resource and charge shots. One could make you charge faster, but you still use the same amount of power to fully charge, A player would be playing more aggressive and be on the lower side of power using this trait. Another would increase the speed your power increases, so you are playing with more power and thus more defensive.

One boon I would like to see on the Armorer is some more access to stability. Stability would be very important to be able to get off your charge shots without be interrupted every time.

[draxynnic.3719]

On 8/4/2022 at 11:01 AM, Lily.1935 said:

Holoforge doesn't protect you. I'm talking about  giving them a proper shroud. Why I use it in quotations in the the post is because its not technically a shroud even though mechanically it is.

It does if you take the right traits. It's just not a second health bar.

On the whole, while it's not the same as a shroud, it's certainly closer than anything else apart from Celestial Avatar.

[Eekasqueak.7850]

Dunno if we need more shroud specs, what if we gave engineer Clockwork traps and a shortbow instead?