Elder Dragon's before the Void [SPOILER discussion]

[Sajuuk Khar.1509]

5 hours ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

it was a half-assed writing to tell us "there is no other option, these actions must be taken" when all the setup prior told us otherwise

All setup prior told us each Elder Dragon had one weakness, and LWS3 told us Jormag and Primordus' weaknesses were each other. We find out in IBS this is because they were born/created as twins, something none of the other Elder Dragons were. The whole "twined weakness" thing is a pretty common trope in video games. I can't tell you how many video game bosses I've fought where this was an mechanic in-universe.

5 hours ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

and it was used to excuse idiotic writing decisions like Braham becoming champion of Primordus, which makes no sense as it got stressed several times in IBS itself (let alone the rest of the game) that champions don't control their Elder Dragons but are slaves to them.

Well no,

1. IBS doesn't stress that Champions are slaves to their Elder Dragons. Neither The Commander, nor Caithe, are slaves to Aurene, and they're the ones that are used as the comparison. Ryland was also not a slave, and retained free will while being Jormag's champion.
2. Braham wasn't controlling Primordus, not does the game ever say he is. In fact theres an explicit conversation where they mention

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wildfire_(story)

Quote

Braham Eirsson: What went wrong?

Wolf: The dragon felt no affinity with us. We were almost devoured. We need a way to anchor ourselves.

Raven: He must be tricked into claiming the connection. How do you stop an avalanche, Eirsson?

Braham Eirsson: You don't—you get above it... Primordus needs a champion. A champion like Ryland. A harness...

Braham Eirsson: But what if I become li—

Bear: Why are you doing this? The attention? The legend? The power?

Braham Eirsson: No! I'm doing it so everyone will be safe. So my friends will survive!

Bear: And that is your spirit, Braham Eirsson. Never doubt your spirit.

Braham was not controlling Primordus. You can't "stop" the avalanche, you can't stop Primordus from doing what it wants to do. All Braham did was focus Primordus' attention specifically to Jormag, something it already hated and wanted to fight anyways.

5 hours ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

I could honestly go on for paragraphs on the flaws of Icebrood Saga, most of them centered around Champions, and how the ambiguity left by not explaining plothooks from prior storylines was just bad writing fundamentals, in all honesty. But it kind of feels like beating a dead horse as it is.

The problem is the vast majority of supposed issues you've brought up with IBS in the past are things where you're seemingly misrepresenting what actually happened in IBS to make issues with it where there are none.

Edited August 30, 2022 by Sajuuk Khar.1509

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

3 hours ago, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

All setup prior told us each Elder Dragon had one weakness, and LWS3 told us Jormag and Primordus' weaknesses were each other.

Except that Season 3 pretty heavily implied that Mordremoth and ZHaitan were each other's weakness with the Unstable ABomination, and this is furthere supported by idle dialogue in Siren's Reef, as well as how Caladbolg was used to confront Zhaitan's corruption.

 

The establishment was being done that the Elder Dragons not only had a unique weakness -which three for three were cases of "their greatest strength can be exploited to become their greatest weakness" - but also had a pairing weakness. It was perfectly built up that there would be a reveal that there was a second weakness for Jormag and Primordus than each other - something tied to their own power, much to how in Edge of Destiny, Eir killed the Destroyer of Life by having primordial fire burn primordial fire until its heart burned away.

3 hours ago, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

Well no,

1. IBS doesn't stress that Champions are slaves to their Elder Dragons. Neither The Commander, nor Caithe, are slaves to Aurene, and they're the ones that are used as the comparison. Ryland was also not a slave, and retained free will while being Jormag's champion.
2. Braham wasn't controlling Primordus, not does the game ever say he is. In fact theres an explicit conversation where they mention

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wildfire_(story)

Braham was not controlling Primordus. You can't "stop" the avalanche, you can't stop Primordus from doing what it wants to do. All Braham did was focus Primordus' attention specifically to Jormag, something it already hated and wanted to fight anyways.

1. It actually is, over and over, whenever we confronted Bangar. Such as:
   Bangar Ruinbringer: Drakkar's death at my hands sends them all a message: I am Jormag's champion now. I alone can control the dragon.
   <Character name>: Jormag can't be controlled! That's not how this works.
   https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Voice_in_the_Deep
   That's not how this works is said to Bangar throughout IBS. And he learns the lesson the hard way in the end, while Ryland never tried to control Jormag. Similarly, Bangar and Ryland (and others) claim that the Commander controls Aurene which they repeatedly deny because champions do not control their Elder Dragon.
   But the moment Braham does the exact same thing as Bangar, the responses are:
   <Character name>: Braham's sacrificed himself to protect us all. How could he—
   and
   Rytlock Brimstone: What Braham did. What he's let himself become. Kid's a warrior.
   fram Greetsglory: He's controlling the pure destruction and hunger of the raging flame—that's no small feat.
2. What do you think "a harness" means, and from the very same story step:
   Aurene: Primordus is a wild beast. There is no directing him.
   Braham Eirsson: I'm norn, Aurene—we're not afraid of beasts. Spirits of the Wild'll give him all the brains he needs.
   [...]

   Raven: All this fire and not a spark in the dragon's head.

   Braham Eirsson: Not like you don't have experience reining in rowdies. Can't think of anyone better to lead Primordus to his last fight.

   "directing", being a "harness", "leading" - these are all synonyms that mean one thing, and one thing only. That they are making Primordus move against its will. Braham "focusing Primordus' attention on Jormag" is still a degree of control over it - it's controlling Primordus' attention on Jormag, and away from everyone else.

[Sajuuk Khar.1509]

1 hour ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

Except that Season 3 pretty heavily implied that Mordremoth and ZHaitan were each other's weakness with the Unstable ABomination, and this is furthere supported by idle dialogue in Siren's Reef, as well as how Caladbolg was used to confront Zhaitan's corruption.

The establishment was being done that the Elder Dragons not only had a unique weakness -which three for three were cases of "their greatest strength can be exploited to become their greatest weakness" - but also had a pairing weakness. It was perfectly built up that there would be a reveal that there was a second weakness for Jormag and Primordus than each other - something tied to their own power, much to how in Edge of Destiny, Eir killed the Destroyer of Life by having primordial fire burn primordial fire until its heart burned away.

I would disagree here.

• Going back to Edge of Destiny we had, as you mentioned, instances of primordial fire burning primordial fire.
• Back in the core story we had the Krait Orb which many people, ultimately rightly, assumed came from the water dragon, and repelled the Risen.
• Core also explicitly mentioned Elder Dragons can't corrupt each other's minions. Effectively stating a fundamental incompatibility between all of them.
• LWS2 had the god magic flame which repelled Mordrem, and was used to contain, and kill, the Shadow of the Dragon.
• LWS3 had Zhaitan and Mordremoth's magics not liking contact with each other.
• POF and LWS4 had Kralk's weakness be its own magic.

GW2 has always shown that lots of magics can inflict damage, or repel, lots of other magics. In some cases a dragon's own magic can harm its minions. That doesn't necessarily make them the "weakness" of that Dragon however.

Like, if Zhaitan and Mordremoth did fight, and their magics negated each other, Zhaitan might die, but that doesn't prevent Mordremoth form just moving his moving his mind into another part of his massive, hundreds of miles spanning, corruption to escape the destruction of that part of his corruption/body. The same is true of Jormag and Primordus. Even if they could negate each other, if either had Mordremoth's mind transfer ability then that would mean the one with that power wouldn't die because they could just transfer their mind elsewhere. At that point the "mind" element would still be the key weakness for them, not their elemental negation(thank god none of the other Elder Dragons seemed to absorb that power eh?)

Likewise, if all of the elder dragons worked on this paired energy weakness then Kralk's weakness should be the water dragon, but nothing ever even tried to imply it. The only water dragon magic we see was aimed at the Risen, not the Branded. And counter, we never see, or have any implications, that Brand magic is particularly useful against water dragon magic, at least that I can recall.

Given that, outside of a very brief mention of the concept in P3 of HoT, which we use to last minute deduct Mordremoth's weakness at the very end of HoT, the first time we got any real development on the Elder Dragon weakness bit was in LWS3, and was focused around how Jormag and Primordus are each other's fundamental weakness, and Taimi building a machine to shoot big old energy beams of each dragon's magic at the other, and talking about how otherwise the dragons would have to directly fight each other, I don't think Anet ever intended to set up a secondary weakness for both.

Trying to make up ANOTHER weakness for both dragons would create more story steps then either dragon was really going to get. As I've mentioned before, Anet has been pretty good about giving each dragon 3 open world maps + a dragon fight, and has been consistent about that from Zhaitan to Soo-Won.

• In LWS3 Primordus got two maps(Ember Bay and Draconis Mons), while Jormag got one(Bitterfrost Frontier)
• In IBS Jormag got two maps(Bjora Marches and Drizzlewood Coast), and, from what we can gather, Primordus would've gotten another map(Centaur lands), and then both would have shared the Dragonstorm map meta around Anvil Rock.

Even if Champions didn't happen, and IBS got to play out as it was originally going to, there's not really enough time to come up with other weaknesses for both dragons, establish them in such a way that player's don't see them as last minute asspulls, collect the things needed to implement these weaknesses, and then use them against the dragons themselves in Dragonstorm. You had like 2 big story steps(the Centaur lands, and Braham's vision of the past), before we got into the "actually fight the dragon" stage of the story(Dragonstorm), and by that point you should already already know/have everything you need to fight/defeat the dragon. Because if not, why would you be going into the fight in the first place?

You don't spend 75% of a story(the LWS3 dragon releases + the first half of IBS) setting up, and repeating, that THIS is the Elder Dragons' weakness, only to then pull out a completely other weakness in the back 25%, and use it to kill them.

1 hour ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

That's not how this works is said to Bangar throughout IBS. And he learns the lesson the hard way in the end, while Ryland never tried to control Jormag. Similarly, Bangar and Ryland (and others) claim that the Commander controls Aurene which they repeatedly deny because champions do not control their Elder Dragon.

Yes, but that doesn't change what you said about Champions being slaves to the Elder Dragons being wrong, which is what I was addressing.

1 hour ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

"directing", being a "harness", "leading" - these are all synonyms that mean one thing, and one thing only. That they are making Primordus move against its will. Braham "focusing Primordus' attention on Jormag" is still a degree of control over it - it's controlling Primordus' attention on Jormag, and away from everyone else.

No they are not. That's not what any of those terms means.

A horse can chose to run, and with reigns you may be able to steer it, but that doesn't mean you are moving the horse against its will. Its will is to run, which it is still doing. Giving something direction =/= moving it against its will.

Edited August 30, 2022 by Sajuuk Khar.1509

[draxynnic.3719]

On 8/31/2022 at 7:37 AM, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

Core also explicitly mentioned Elder Dragons can't corrupt each other's minions. Effectively stating a fundamental incompatibility between all of them.

No, it didn't. Observational evidence was that they didn't, but nothing explicitly said that this was by lack of ability rather than choosing not to. Why was left up to interpretation. But we do know that the Inquest, and later Primordus, were able to create minions that employed the powers of multiple dragons, although in Primordus's case it is important to note that he did so by adding additional powers to his own minions and the changes would later be reverted. Subject Alpha even combines dragon energies that are elsewhere presented as incompatible, so they're evidently not so fundamentally incompatible that they can never be combined.

[Kalavier.1097]

3 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

No, it didn't. Observational evidence was that they didn't, but nothing explicitly said that this was by lack of ability rather than choosing not to. Why was left up to interpretation. But we do know that the Inquest, and later Primordus, were able to create minions that employed the powers of multiple dragons, although in Primordus's case it is important to note that he did so by adding additional powers to his own minions and the changes would later be reverted. Subject Alpha even combines dragon energies that are elsewhere presented as incompatible, so they're evidently not so fundamentally incompatible that they can never be combined.

And it could be taken as dragons forcibly trying to corrupt another minion made issues.

Zhaitan's corruption just killed Sylvari instead of raising them, yet Caithe openly accepting Aurene's brand worked fine.

[draxynnic.3719]

38 minutes ago, Kalavier.1097 said:

And it could be taken as dragons forcibly trying to corrupt another minion made issues.

Zhaitan's corruption just killed Sylvari instead of raising them, yet Caithe openly accepting Aurene's brand worked fine.

Yeah, my personal theory is that the "reset loyalties" part of becoming a minion can only happen once, and a dragon therefore can't claim another dragon's minions. So a dragon could theoretically corrupt another dragon's minion, but the only effect is to give a rival dragon a stronger minion.

This would explain things where, for example, the sylvari aren't said to be immune to Zhaitan's corruption... but Zhaitan's corruption can't make them into Risen. An affected sylvari simply dies, as you say. This implies that the methods Zhaitan has to start converting someone into a Risen before they've actually died can still work on sylvari up to a point, but at the point where a member of another race would die and rise again as a Risen, the process affecting a sylvari just stops there. Under the hypothesis, Zhaitan doesn't turn sylvari into Risen because he'd just end up with Risen Sylvari that retain their prior loyalties and keep fighting him. (But the Supreme Eye of Zhaitan still tries to persuade a Sylvari PC to turn because if a sylvari turned to Zhaitan of their own volition, this wouldn't matter.)

It would also explain why Aurene can still bond with, and transform, sylvari. Aurene doesn't want slaves, so for her it's not a big deal that Caithe still retains her mental freedom after her transformation.

Edited September 3, 2022 by draxynnic.3719

[Sajuuk Khar.1509]

40 minutes ago, Kalavier.1097 said:

And it could be taken as dragons forcibly trying to corrupt another minion made issues.

Zhaitan's corruption just killed Sylvari instead of raising them, yet Caithe openly accepting Aurene's brand worked fine.

Caithe also mentions in that scene, when Taimi brings up the fact that Elder Dragons cant corrupt each other's minions, that what happened to her isn't corruption, its connection. They explicitly make reference that what happened to her is not corruption.

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

On 8/30/2022 at 5:37 PM, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

• Back in the core story we had the Krait Orb which many people, ultimately rightly, assumed came from the water dragon, and repelled the Risen.

This ends up just being no different than the fact that Elder Dragons never invaded each others' territories in core. It's not actually magical counters.

On 8/30/2022 at 5:37 PM, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

• Core also explicitly mentioned Elder Dragons can't corrupt each other's minions. Effectively stating a fundamental incompatibility between all of them.

As Drax said, this is never mentioned at all. People inferred it because outside of Crucible of Eternity it's never shown to happen, and people used this lack-of-happening to argue that sylvari are dragon minions despite other counters (Forgotten magic) existing (and once that was revealed, people used sylvari 'immunity' as proof that dragon minions can't be corrupted by other dragons). But it is never once stated, implied nor explicitly.

And even then, in Crucible of Eternity all the Inquest does is basic level experiments of "what happens if we expose X to Y?" which means they never do anything that the Elder Dragons could not, even if it's happening in a lab. They hadn't yet moved on to experiments of non-natural scenarios within a sterile environment before we got up in their business.

On 8/30/2022 at 5:37 PM, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

GW2 has always shown that lots of magics can inflict damage, or repel, lots of other magics. In some cases a dragon's own magic can harm its minions. That doesn't necessarily make them the "weakness" of that Dragon however.

But this isn't true. The only magic that has ever held effect on Elder Dragons and its strongest champions are either cases of "their unique strength is their greatest weakness", countered by a specific Elder Dragon's magic, or divine/Forgotten magic (e.g., non-Tyrian magic). And everything you listed in your bullet points is exactly that.

• Primordus' champion is weak only to its greatest strength in Edge of Destiny.
• Zhaitan's corruption is weak to Mordremoth's magic in PS and S3.
• Zhaitan's corruption is also weak to his own greatest strength in PS.
• Mordremoth is weak only to its greatest strength in HoT.
• Kralkatorrik is weak only to its greatest strength in S4.
• Jormag and Primordus are weak to each other's magic in S3 and IBS.
• All Elder Dragons are weak to non-Tyrian magic.

It's three running themes that are consistently active throughout the game... and completely ignored in IBS for the sake of forcing two Elder Dragons to confront each other.

[Sajuuk Khar.1509]

46 minutes ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

This ends up just being no different than the fact that Elder Dragons never invaded each others' territories in core. It's not actually magical counters.

Well no, they never invaded each other's territories in core because Anet didn't design scenarios around it. We know from lore that they do fight if they meet, which indicates they do come into contact in-universe. You're confusing gameplay design with in-universe canon again. And the Orb is a literal in universe explanation item that says this magic repels Risen.

46 minutes ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

As Drax said, this is never mentioned at all. People inferred it because...

This is just a point blank lie that you continue to ignore every time its been called out to you before, and not just by myself.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/The_Crystal_Blooms

Quote

Taimi: I thought dragon minions couldn't be corrupted by other dragons! Is it 'cause her egg absorbed Mordremoth's magic? How—

Caithe: Taimi, it's all right. She asked, and I accepted. This isn't corruption—it's connection.

Its explicitly mentioned in-game, by NPCs, that dragon minions cannot corrupt each other. It is not just a thing people inferred. Its an acknowledged fact in-universe.

46 minutes ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

But this isn't true. The only magic that has ever held effect on Elder Dragons and its strongest champions are either cases of "their unique strength is their greatest weakness", countered by a specific Elder Dragon's magic, or divine/Forgotten magic (e.g., non-Tyrian magic). And everything you listed in your bullet points is exactly that.

Except this is untrue

• Forgotten are native to Tyria, so Forgotten magic isn't non-Tyrian magic.
• Primoruds' champion was weak to the eternal fire, but that doesn't mean its the only thing its weak too, or even its greatest weakness. It was just the only thing they had on hand at the time to hurt it.
• Zhaitan's greatest strength was his ability to spread himself out via mouths and eyes. This had no effect on his actual corruption however.
• Jormag and Primordus are weak to each other's magic because each others magic are their greatest weakness

46 minutes ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

It's three running themes that are consistently active throughout the game... and completely ignored in IBS for the sake of forcing two Elder Dragons to confront each other.

The only "running themes" here are the ones you've constructed for yourself, based on your own pre-concieved notions of how you think the lore should work, which have been disproven by what the game actually says, and don't actually conflict if you just use what the game actually says.

You've built an entire house of cards for yourself, and refuse to budge from it, and just keep saying everyone else is wrong as its collapsing around you.

Edited September 3, 2022 by Sajuuk Khar.1509

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

11 minutes ago, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

This is just a point blank lie that you continue to ignore every time its been called out to you before, and not just by myself.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/The_Crystal_Blooms

Its explicitly mentioned in-game, by NPCs, that dragon minions cannot corrupt each other. It is not just a thing people inferred. Its an acknowledged fact in-universe.

That's not in Core, which was your original statement. To quote again, but with emphasis:

On 8/30/2022 at 5:37 PM, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

Core also explicitly mentioned Elder Dragons can't corrupt each other's minions. Effectively stating a fundamental incompatibility between all of them.

Taimi's one statement there is literally the only time it is ever said or implied by any NPC in the entire game, and even that is said in direct conflict to what she's witnessing.

11 minutes ago, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

• Forgotten are native to Tyria, so Forgotten magic isn't non-Tyrian magic.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/The_Forgotten_Not_Forgotten

This shows otherwise. In fact, all our lore on the Forgotten still agree: the Forgotten come from the Mists. It's just that it happened before the Six Gods came, unlike previously believed in GW1.

And for that matter, the divine fire you brought up from Season 2? Comes from the Forgotten and is explicitly called divine (aka from the Six Gods) which is non-Tyrian.

11 minutes ago, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

The only "running themes" here are the ones you've constructed for yourself, based on your own pre-concieved notions of how you think the lore should work, which have been disproven by what the game actually says, and don't actually conflict if you just use what the game actually says.

You've built an entire house of cards for yourself, and refuse to budge from it, and just keep saying everyone else is wrong as its collapsing around you.

Sure, the things I've "constructed for [myself]" using the facts of the story narrative. Just because an NPC doesn't state it with words, doesn't mean it isn't there.

Edited September 3, 2022 by Konig Des Todes.2086

[Sajuuk Khar.1509]

13 minutes ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

That's not in Core, which was your original statement. To quote again, but with emphasis:

Except Sylvari being immune to dragon corruption is stated in core. They may not have known why, but its was, indirectly, stated back in core. And later proven in HoT when we find out they are dragon minions, and reinforced in LWS4 when Taimi points it out.

13 minutes ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

Taimi's one statement there is literally the only time it is ever said or implied by any NPC in the entire game, and even that is said in direct conflict to what she's witnessing.

Except what she's witnessing isn't in direct conflict with that statement, as Caithe herself states, which was posted before, and will be posted again

Quote

Caithe: Taimi, it's all right. She asked, and I accepted. This isn't corruption—it's connection.

Caithe WAS NOT CORRUPTED by Aurene. This is 100% full stop, she was not. They explicitly call out she was not corrupted. Aurene branding Caithe is not in conflict because it was not corruption.

Again, you're just ignoring things that are inconvenient for you in order to try to make up issues where there are none.

13 minutes ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

This shows otherwise. In fact, all our lore on the Forgotten still agree: the Forgotten come from the Mists. It's just that it happened before the Six Gods came, unlike previously believed in GW1.

No, it really doesn't. It just shows a lore discrepancy from the original story of the Forgotten(that the gods brought them from the Mists to Tyria, and then we they went back there), and the GW2 story of the Forgotten that they came from Tyria, and have been here for like 10,000+ years.

13 minutes ago, Konig Des Todes.2086 said:

Sure, the things I've "constructed for [myself]" using the facts of the story narrative. Just because an NPC doesn't state it with words, doesn't mean it isn't there.

Right here you've just proven it isn't fact, its subjective opinions based on your own observations which you're taking as fact when the game has shown the real facts are, in fact, different.

1. Dragons cannot corrupt each other's minions
2. Caithe was not corrupted by Aurene
3. Various magics can harm Elder Dragons, and their minions, beyond their main weakness. The main weakness is just the surefire way to kill them
4. The Elder Dragons don't work on a perfect system of opposites = true weakness/negation
5. LWS3 sets up Jormag and Primordus being each other's true weakness, and their inevitably needed clash after Taimi's machine gets destroyed

Edited September 3, 2022 by Sajuuk Khar.1509

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

1 hour ago, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

Except Sylvari being immune to dragon corruption is stated in core. They may not have known why, but its was, indirectly, stated back in core. And later proven in HoT when we find out they are dragon minions, and reinforced in LWS4 when Taimi points it out.

I see you're changing the goalposts of your statements. This rather proves that discussion with you is still irrelevant.

"indirectly stated" is not "explicitly mentioned".

  

1 hour ago, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

No, it really doesn't. It just shows a lore discrepancy from the original story of the Forgotten(that the gods brought them from the Mists to Tyria, and then we they went back there), and the GW2 story of the Forgotten that they came from Tyria, and have been here for like 10,000+ years.

Check the link again, check the author of the book. It's Warden Ilyra - the same sylvari who told us that the Forgotten predate the gods state: "many believe they have gone back to the Mists from which they came"

Also, do double check the sources saying the Forgotten were from the previous dragonrise - not a single one of them say they're Tyrian origin.

So either the same NPC is contradicting herself as you claim... Or she never claimed they were Tyrian and the only lore discrepancy (if there is one, I doubt it) is the date they arrived.

Edited September 3, 2022 by Konig Des Todes.2086

[ugrakarma.9416]

The point of final dialogue inst much about ED "before void", but is about typical "griefing mother" plot. 

 

also talk about "before void" is something that dont fit the concept, because the concept of "primordial evil" is that, its  always there, and existed before everything else, its just sometimes unbalaced.

[Delta.1526]

On 8/31/2022 at 7:37 AM, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

Likewise, if all of the elder dragons worked on this paired energy weakness then Kralk's weakness should be the water dragon, but nothing ever even tried to imply it. The only water dragon magic we see was aimed at the Risen, not the Branded. And counter, we never see, or have any implications, that Brand magic is particularly useful against water dragon magic, at least that I can recall.

i mean, didn't Aurene's magic kinda body Soo-Won in the Yong Reactor?

[Sajuuk Khar.1509]

1 hour ago, Delta.1526 said:

i mean, didn't Aurene's magic kinda body Soo-Won in the Yong Reactor?

Aurene's magic isn't branded magic, its "prismatic" magic.

Edited September 5, 2022 by Sajuuk Khar.1509

[Kalavier.1097]

On 9/5/2022 at 1:49 PM, Delta.1526 said:

i mean, didn't Aurene's magic kinda body Soo-Won in the Yong Reactor?

It hurt Soo-won yes, but also dumped a ton of magic suddenly into her which did not help her mental status.

[Tyson.5160]

On 9/5/2022 at 12:09 PM, Sajuuk Khar.1509 said:

Aurene's magic isn't branded magic, its "prismatic" magic.

It is an interesting observation though, with Soo-Woon being hit with Aurene’s crystal magic along with the other magics.

 

Same as it’s an interesting observation that we battled Kralkatorrik while he was in the middle of the ocean injured with only one wing and no where to go.