Oct 4th update bad thoughts

[felix.2386]

1. Berserk now does no damage, and does not proc berserker's power, adrenaline health, cleansing ire

it's missing a lot of the burst factor which berserker should have.

warrior does not need another side node brawler.

maybe give the damage back to berserk and also remove 2 boons from enemy when hit, also remove some conditions.

 

 

2. Despite the overall good new sustain against power damage, warrior is still very vulnerable to condition damage.

specially now berserk does not proc cleansing ire.

cleansing ire was good buff, but overall landing burst skill is still very inconsistence and unreliable. 

and forcing you to take the new resistance on dodge trait

specially with shake it off nerfed, need more reliable way to deal with condition outside of mending and shake it off

 

3. the new defy pain, still shows lesser endure pain as a stun break, but only activating on elite skill cast.

which means, the stunbreak factor is not there anymore. which makes it not as good of a trait then it looks like initially.

with overall long cooldown and high cast time of warrior elite skills, outside of headbutt, but then berserk also give endure pain like effect when enter, so there's chance it will cancel out each other quite often.

maybe make it so it also turns the elite skill into a stunbreak so then it might compete with dodge resistance

 

4. strength is not a CC focused trait line, 

so i'm not sure how to feel about aggressive onslaught, seems to favor too heavily to spellbreaker, to a lesser extend berserker but not so much to core warrior.

i feel like if it's quickness on weapon swap, it would favors all warrior specs.

still feel kinda weak at the moment compared to the other 2 specs tho, maybe quickness on CC with a higher cooldown and  quickness on weapon swap and 25% speed increase would actually be nice.

 

5. good on realizing traits that spent only one tier adrenaline are weak.

same with a lot of tier 1 burst skills, also need buff like you did with traits.

 

6. daring dragon and immortal dragon both give protection on DT with dragonscale defense change.

 

7.same with cull the weak being too passive and not reactive, heightened focus needs to be changed too. 2 second of quickness with 15 sec CD against enemy below 50% is just too bad

seems unthoughtful and rushed tbh this change. 

 

7. last stance seems rather weak for grand master against the two other competitors, given how long of the cooldowns are for all the stances.

here probably would also be a good spot to implement stunbreak on elite instead of barrier.

like stability is just overall too good, and cleansing ire is too crucial for warrior for how bad it is against condition.

 

 

 

 

[Geoff Fey.1035]

1 minute ago, felix.2386 said:

1. Berserk now does no damage, and does not proc berserker's power, adrenaline health, cleansing ire

The damage was piddling (213 damage w/ 0.8 coeff + 3s Burn for 393 base) so really not losing much of anything.

It does, however have Blood Reckoning (2s) build in, so for 2s after going into Berserk (15s CD) you gain 33% of the damage you inflict as healing. 

Losing out on it counting as T3 sucks, but doing two T1 attacks (easy enough with Decapitate) will max out Berserker's Power. Plus, while Berserk is on CD you'll still have access to Core Bursts, meaning you can upkeep Berserker's Power/Adrenal Health more completely.

Quote

2. Despite the overall good new sustain against power damage, warrior is still very vulnerable to condition damage.... and forcing you to take the new resistance on dodge trait

You could take Mending for condi cleanse, or if you take Blood Reckoning it means that for every 60s you will have 23s coverage of 33% outgoing damage as healing, which is nuts, but agreed this only affects Berserkers.

The 3 choices in Defense Master now will be:

1. POWER Defense: Defy Pain - Anti-strike damage (-100%) for 4s upon Elite Skill. Most effective on Berserker (20s CD) & Bladesworn (30s CD). Means no Power damage for 4s every 20s on Berserker
2. CONDI Defense: Resilient Roll - Anti-non-damaging conditions (Cripple, Blind, Freeze, Slow, etc). Didn't see how long this lasts, but it means without vigor Every 10 seconds you can ignore all controlling conditions, and that's if you start with 0 endurance
3. DPS Increase: Merciless Hammer - Increase damage (+20% orig?) and +7 Adrenaline when striking disabled (Stun, Knockdown, etc) foe. Hammer can Knockdown someone for 3s and Mace can stun for 1-4s (burst dependent) with just the mainhand. You'll most likely get 1-3 attacks meaning after stunning even 1 person you'll mostly likely end up getting +14-+21 Adrenaline, nearly enough to go back into Berserk or use a T3 attack (or your Primal Burst).

All three will be pretty useful choices for Warriors depending on build and circumstance 

4 minutes ago, felix.2386 said:

4. strength is not a CC focused trait line, 

Hit and miss, combined with the proposed changes for Defense it makes it co-dependent for a super powerful combination of both damage & sustain. You can still go with STr/Disc/X for the oldschool playstyle, but Str/Def/X might inch in as the new meta simply because of the ludicrous amount of sustain/defense that's going to be baked in, with your weapons being the Utility providers.

I agree that Strength really isn't CC focused, but got to keep in mind that with Spellbreaker/Berserker, not having Might Makes Right means less self-sustain (Berserker slightly less so since it gets Blood Reckoning on Berserk activation 2s as standard), so it's a tradeoff of synergizing with your Might applications for sustain vs. Quickness

 

[oscuro.9720]

1. Yes you will lose the t3 activation, but with core bursts and instant activation, I have to think this is an overall net positive change that will improve berserker functionality.

 

2. The combination of multiple resistance sources, more passive healing from adrenal health, and cleansing ire give significant condition hate. Pair this with warriors already numerous clears, SIO reduced cooldown, and warrior is not in a bad spot for condition management.

 

3. No, it’s not a stunbreak, which is the point. It’s meant to be used proactively to mitigate damage rather than reactively. This works better now with reduced damage in game. Overall it’s not a bad master tier trait. Outside of stunbreak, you can run signet of rage with a 40s CD, which is just a second endure pain at that point. Which expands the bar by 1 slot to give a free endure pain. Again, imo not bad at all.
 

4. Warrior has plentiful CC access on all specs, and all specs use this CC access. It’s a great trait, synergizes well with all warrior builds, and relies actually landing CC (majority of which is highly telegraphed) meaning it scales well with user skill. Quick on weapon swap would be more degenerate and lower the skill requirement to leverage, which is bad imo. 
 

5. Yes, some t1 bursts need love, but it’s understandable that was not included in this patch imo. Scope has to be limited in some way, and Warrior already got far more than other classes this patch.

 

6. See 5. It’s just kind of beyond the scope of the patch. I agree Heightened Focus is not good, but discipline changes were not a part of this patch. Incidentally, Heightened focus technically got a buff through synergy with the new strength trait. 
 

7. I don’t remember enough about Last Stand change explicitly to comment. Ik it’s barrier+vigor, which is a bit behind the others. Did it still have the stance duration scalar? If it does, than it may be worth taking. If not, then I agree, it may be lacking, but it’s much better than 300s last stand at least.
 

I personally disagree with a lot of the points you make. That’s to be expected though, we are different people with different opinions. I think the changes they’ve made have been good at modernizing Warrior while maintaining the play style that it currently has. This was something that honestly worried me, as I play warrior because it’s the play style I enjoy most.  Of course, opinions may readily change when playing with the changes, since all of what we are doing now is conjecture and we have no idea how it will actually come together in game. 

[Stagnation.3659]

Does berserk mode not consume adrenaline?

[eXruina.4956]

i have no bad thoughts, more positive changes please. 😇🙏

[Verdict is Vengence.6912]

I like what's bound for us in the future. There was one thing though. Besides what's going to happen to bladesworn, I think the rest of the balancing nerfs are unnecessary. If warrior was dominating in any area, I would understand. But that's not the case.

There really is no reason for them to be as cautious as they are.

[felix.2386]

overall changes are good, but main concern really is that it is slowing down berserker and rendering yet another side node and compete with 3 other warrior specs.

 

they are bringing up overall viability is fine, but removing some of the good unique things which separate berserker from other warriors doesn't seem to be the way.

 

agree with Verdict, some are really unnecessary 

Edited September 20, 2022 by felix.2386

[MemeLord.1096]

On 9/20/2022 at 3:27 AM, felix.2386 said:

and forcing you to take the new resistance on dodge trait

Agree. Hammer is bad in the first place because of the blind spam fiesta. Now we get to choose between not taking the hammer trait to have resistance or taking the hammer trait and nothing change. But well, at least we get to make our choice now.

Edited September 21, 2022 by MemeLord.1096

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

7 hours ago, MemeLord.1096 said:

Agree. Hammer is bad in the first place because of the blind spam fiesta. Now we get to choose between not taking the hammer trait to have resistance or taking the hammer trait and nothing change. But well, at least we get to make our choice now.

Tough choice indeed. The obvious choice is the Resistance trait and Cleansing Ire, unless you are running a hammer gank build.

[Sylvia.4870]

I can't wait fot the upcoming patch and its results! *Grabs weapons* Warriors, attack! >.< 

[felix.2386]

9 hours ago, MemeLord.1096 said:

Agree. Hammer is bad in the first place because of the blind spam fiesta. Now we get to choose between not taking the hammer trait to have resistance or taking the hammer trait and nothing change. But well, at least we get to make our choice now.

yea, i feel like theres a lot of interesting new trait

but as long as anet does not fix warrior's outdated-ness, certain trait will always be better.

like i'm 80% sure cleansing ire will be better then rest of the other new grand master trait.

[Axl.8924]

So wait you get berserker to just heal and burst out of berserker and use only berserker for adrenal heal? thats it?

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

7 minutes ago, Axl.8924 said:

So wait you get berserker to just heal and burst out of berserker and use only berserker for adrenal heal? thats it?

I'm going to need you to clarify your question before I can give you an answer.

[Axl.8924]

24 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

I'm going to need you to clarify your question before I can give you an answer.

 

I mean it soudns as if you use your berserker energy to get adrenal heal and use outside of berserker mode to DPS.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

40 minutes ago, Axl.8924 said:

 

I mean it soudns as if you use your berserker energy to get adrenal heal and use outside of berserker mode to DPS.

Either. Berserk Mode won't trigger those traits any more just the core burst outside of BMode and Primal Burst within BMode.

[Vancho.8750]

8 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Tough choice indeed. The obvious choice is the Resistance trait and Cleansing Ire, unless you are running a hammer gank build.

Well warrior does have Berserker stance, Banner of tactics and Revenge counter and there are always Revenent Runes, so that is plenty of ways to defend yourself on a Merciless Hammer build. 

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

30 minutes ago, Vancho.8750 said:

Well warrior does have Berserker stance, Banner of tactics and Revenge counter and there are always Revenent Runes, so that is plenty of ways to defend yourself on a Merciless Hammer build. 

Oh, I know. I have plans for the 4th.

[Grand Marshal.4098]

Give Berserk Mode as a Rage skill Resolution for 5 sec on entering and Outrage 4 sec of Protection.