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I would play WvW, but...


Squeesidhe.4761

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...this is my experience every time:

 

"Where is everyone?"

*vast, empty landscape*

"OK, let me go over here."

*insta-ganked*

"That's OK, it's not like I even know what I'm doing. Let me try again."

*Running, running, running on Warclaw*

"Where is everyone?"

*a silent wind blows over the lonely expanse*

"Let me kill these centaurs then."

*kills centaurs*

"Well, that's done. Where is everyone?"

*nearby event!*

"Where? I don't see any indicator on the map where I'm supposed to go - is something supposed to be happening? Am I supposed to be doing something?"

*incomprehensible technical babble on chat*

"Huh? I have no idea what those acronyms mean. Are they speaking English?"

*Running, running, running on Warclaw*

"Am I achieving anything at all here? Let me check..."

*System message: you are currently tier 2 participation. You need to be tier 3 to start earning pips.*

"Are you kittening kidding me? I'm not even earning any kittening progress? Screw this, I'm wasting my time. I'm going back to PVE."

*leaves*

 

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39 minutes ago, Squeesidhe.4761 said:

...this is my experience every time:

 

"Where is everyone?"

*vast, empty landscape*

"OK, let me go over here."

*insta-ganked*

"That's OK, it's not like I even know what I'm doing. Let me try again."

*Running, running, running on Warclaw*

"Where is everyone?"

*a silent wind blows over the lonely expanse*

"Let me kill these centaurs then."

*kills centaurs*

"Well, that's done. Where is everyone?"

*nearby event!*

"Where? I don't see any indicator on the map where I'm supposed to go - is something supposed to be happening? Am I supposed to be doing something?"

*incomprehensible technical babble on chat*

"Huh? I have no idea what those acronyms mean. Are they speaking English?"

*Running, running, running on Warclaw*

"Am I achieving anything at all here? Let me check..."

*System message: you are currently tier 2 participation. You need to be tier 3 to start earning pips.*

"Are you kittening kidding me? I'm not even earning any kittening progress? Screw this, I'm wasting my time. I'm going back to PVE."

*leaves*

 

Hilarious!  

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I am in a good mood, so I do not assume the OP to be completely trolling. Here are some hints for you next venture into WvW:

  • If you are alone and nobody else is around, go for "small targets", like shrines, sentries and dolyaks not in your own colour.
  • If you are alone, be aware of enemy players that might intercept you, because after all, this is a competitive game mode. This means you can't just cruise around, but you have to look behind you and to your mini map frequently.
  • If you are alone and uncomfortable with that, try to tag along with either a commander tag or another allied player roaming around. Should you follow the other player, stick to what he/she is doing, so participate in a fight and don't run away (or teleport to spawn) if you are attacked and "shave off" the enemy on your ally.
  • To get rewards via pips, you need to have created a certain amount of participation by completing events in WvW. That one does not go down, when you leave WvW, but does decline, if you just idle away at a safe spot on a WvW map.
Edited by Gorani.7205
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I didnt see reference to asking questions about the game mode or looking anything up for yourself. If I were to just join a Raid LFG listing without knowing what any of the listing terminology meant, or a HP train for that matter, I would be just as lost. If you are joining a multi-year old game mode for the first time it is an excellent idea to do some research, including asking veterans for pointers. You even posted this thread in a forum that includes frequently asked questions threads and the like.

 

Edit: I do find it odd that you played long enough to get your warclaw without picking up anything else about the game mode.

Edited by Ashen.2907
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11 minutes ago, Gorani.7205 said:

I am in a good mood, so I do not assume the OP to be completely trolling.

 

I'm glad you're in a good mood, that's important for your mental health. I'm not trolling. I'm completely casual to the WvW game mode. I don't want to study 10 dissertations on how to be able to effectively engage with a video game. What I want is:

 

1. To enter WvW, and quickly find fun battles to engage in for a while. 

2. Leave

 

Do you guys ever step back and read some of the posts in this WvW forum? You sound like engineers discussing fluid dynamics or something. This seems less like a fun game mode for people to engage in, and more like a closed fart-sniffing chamber. 

 

I'll say it differently for the slow ones: it is hard for casual players to engage with WvW in any fun and enjoyable way. It is hard to locate where the action is happening. It is hard to feel engaged enough to want to bother learning more and investing time and energy to get better. Anet could do a much better job with a few simple communication prompts to help newbies get in the fight and have fun, and want to come back. 

 

You guys are so in the weeds you don't even see it. YOU know what to do, exactly how to link up with others, exactly where to go. New players don't know any of this. The game mode needs to support new players getting involved. If the expectation is that they need to study offline guides, then it's just going to be you folks alone in your little dead world, yelling at one another. 

 

 

 

 

 

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14 minutes ago, Squeesidhe.4761 said:

 

I'm glad you're in a good mood, that's important for your mental health. I'm not trolling. I'm completely casual to the WvW game mode. I don't want to study 10 dissertations on how to be able to effectively engage with a video game. What I want is:

 

1. To enter WvW, and quickly find fun battles to engage in for a while. 

2. Leave

 

Do you guys ever step back and read some of the posts in this WvW forum? You sound like engineers discussing fluid dynamics or something. This seems less like a fun game mode for people to engage in, and more like a closed fart-sniffing chamber. 

 

I'll say it differently for the slow ones: it is hard for casual players to engage with WvW in any fun and enjoyable way. It is hard to locate where the action is happening. It is hard to feel engaged enough to want to bother learning more and investing time and energy to get better. Anet could do a much better job with a few simple communication prompts to help newbies get in the fight and have fun, and want to come back. 

 

You guys are so in the weeds you don't even see it. YOU know what to do, exactly how to link up with others, exactly where to go. New players don't know any of this. The game mode needs to support new players getting involved. If the expectation is that they need to study offline guides, then it's just going to be you folks alone in your little dead world, yelling at one another. 

 

 

 

 

 

Just curious though, what kind of handholding are you looking for the game to do?  Literally there's an NPC called "Instructor [Tutorials]" at every entry point into every map.

Edit: OK, Maybe the NPC is missing from Desert BL...

Edited by Chaba.5410
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7 minutes ago, Squeesidhe.4761 said:

Do you guys ever step back and read some of the posts in this WvW forum? You sound like engineers discussing fluid dynamics or something. This seems less like a fun game mode for people to engage in, and more like a closed fart-sniffing chamber.

I feel the same, when I have to get into Raids, Strikes and higher level Fractals. The "guys there" demand way more from me, when it comes to participating in their game mode: Builds, gear, rotations, "do's and don'ts", show me your LI proof ...
I hope you have problems with their rocket science as well.

7 minutes ago, Squeesidhe.4761 said:

 

Anet could do a much better job with a few simple communication prompts to help newbies get in the fight and have fun, and want to come back.

Sure they could do that and it most likely would help. But you said you have the Warclaw unlocked, didn't that correlated achievement made you participate in WvW core activities?

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Warclaw_Companion

You had to take bigger structures and finish a complete track, which is about a 4-6 hour experience in WvW with other players.

 

7 minutes ago, Squeesidhe.4761 said:

You guys are so in the weeds you don't even see it. YOU know what to do, exactly how to link up with others, exactly where to go. New players don't know any of this. The game mode needs to support new players getting involved. If the expectation is that they need to study offline guides, then it's just going to be you folks alone in your little dead world, yelling at one another.

You don't have to read "offline guides", but as this is a multi-player experience, you have to be willing to communicate with you fellow players. You can ask them about things in game. You can learn from them. You can actually try to be nice and get some help, because you did not yell at them. Why don't start now?

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45 minutes ago, Squeesidhe.4761 said:

I'll say it differently for the slow ones

Oh yeah I REALLY want to help you out now after insulting the game mode and it's players... 🙄

You might as well take your salt over to spvp.

Nothing complicated about wvw, if you bother to take the time to learn it, just like every other mode in the game.

There's plenty of people willing to help even for simple newbie questions.

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1 hour ago, Squeesidhe.4761 said:

1. To enter WvW, and quickly find fun battles to engage in for a while.

That's exactly what happened. What you are misunderstanding is:

- it was fun for "the other player".

What you are basically expecting is:

"I want to enter, have "fun" while being absolutely clueless as to what I [You] are doing."

That's a rather difficult bar to meet in non strict pve modes. You are asking to get fed players weaker than you at the mode (in all of its angles) while being very inexperienced yourself. Very hard to design around.

 

Luckily there are 3 very good approaches you can take:

1. get gud. Literally, get better at your class/build/understanding of the mode. You can either do so on your own, which can be painful and requires a lot of trial and error, or you can use outside resources to read up on.

2. get help. Ask for your servers discord/ts. Get in touch with your server community. Find a guild on your sever which takes new players. Etc.

3. join an open tag when available. Goes hand in hand with some of the above but can also be done via regularly checking in on what is going on in the current match-up.

Good Luck.

Edited by Cyninja.2954
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Give yourself a goal. I wanted the war claw. I followed people like an idiot. Now Im loving wvw. But warclaw it's key to getting around quickly. As said, if no one around just kill guards, take camps. Take a ranged class.  It takes patience in the beginning and I understand your pain. 

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3 hours ago, Squeesidhe.4761 said:

...this is my experience every time:

 

"Where is everyone?"

*vast, empty landscape*

"OK, let me go over here."

*insta-ganked*

"That's OK, it's not like I even know what I'm doing. Let me try again."

*Running, running, running on Warclaw*

"Where is everyone?"

*a silent wind blows over the lonely expanse*

"Let me kill these centaurs then."

*kills centaurs*

"Well, that's done. Where is everyone?"

*nearby event!*

"Where? I don't see any indicator on the map where I'm supposed to go - is something supposed to be happening? Am I supposed to be doing something?"

*incomprehensible technical babble on chat*

"Huh? I have no idea what those acronyms mean. Are they speaking English?"

*Running, running, running on Warclaw*

"Am I achieving anything at all here? Let me check..."

*System message: you are currently tier 2 participation. You need to be tier 3 to start earning pips.*

"Are you kittening kidding me? I'm not even earning any kittening progress? Screw this, I'm wasting my time. I'm going back to PVE."

*leaves*

 

Ok first of all... look at wich server you are, some servers are dedicated, mean some are spanish, french or deuch for example, if you know nothing as in map and prepare yourself, some people troll some lie and some will tell you what to do and help.

First of all look for a tag, a commander that can lead and teach, if your map has none look in other maps, you have 4, eternal batllegrounds or the borderlands, look for a tag there and ask for help.

as for events, you only gain things killing flags and capturing them or camps, that is going alone, if you team up look for towers, citadels etc, you can see the icons in the minimap so nw.

and thatd be all, if you dont tag up and ask you will learn little about how it works as it has a lot to it, also look up in yt there are videos for sure

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2 hours ago, Squeesidhe.4761 said:

You guys are so in the weeds you don't even see it. YOU know what to do, exactly how to link up with others, exactly where to go. New players don't know any of this. The game mode needs to support new players getting involved. If the expectation is that they need to study offline guides, then it's just going to be you folks alone in your little dead world, yelling at one another. 

tl;dr: This might help as a reference if you did not see it or are not used to the GW2 Wiki on the website: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/World_versus_World.

You may not be wrong. You might also be right as some of the people in WvW came from other games that had WvW features so once they know how to enter the mode it feels similar. That said have been seeing more new people to mode or at least I assume new based on their levels and actions. Caught a group attacking bay, low levels which may indicate new to the mode and then knew they were when they deployed catapults against a gate and dropped them in the wrong direction and had to turn them before firing. So first off, welcome, and I am glad we are seeing new players. 

If WvW did get more development time then it does I could see it getting some new player experience polish like is seen with the Steam release. Some NPC that would give the player some quests to go take a sentry, camp, tower and keep. Will have to take a look at that tonight when back out there to see what it does have since you are right a lot of us wouldn't think about.

As Xen said though, not a good way to get people to try and engage when coming at the direction you did.

But that said, I agree with others, it sounds like you are trying to start out right into roaming which can be some of the more challenging ways to do it. Till you are more used to the ebb and flow would find a group to run with (or Guild) or find a public tag and run with the commander. Also called by some of us Zerg-surfing. Running with a zerg is a good way to get the feel for what's what and along the way you will find helpful people out there that are willing to help. Most roamers also will be willing to chat as they play about what and why they are doing what they are doing. A raomer may look like they are running around doing nothing but your mileage may vary on how much they might be helping out their side.

Will be on the lookout tonight trying to think like a new player to see what is out there for now and drop some feedback after. To the point of others above there is some good info out there that I wish I had come across in the beginning but didn't look for since the mode felt familiar enough that my guild just jumped out there at level 10 in white gear, and got run over, alot, till we said ok need some gear and levels. Hence I would take a look at the link above if you get a few and see if that helps. More once we can get back to gaming, good hunting!

Edited by TheGrimm.5624
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Hey new friend! I have you tried asking where there is action in team chat? Or ask for an explanation of what acronyms mean in team chat?
 

In wvw team chat, people can be very scathing or trolly, but generally if someone types “I’m new and don’t know what’s going on, could someone please help me?” Everyone is nice and tries to help the person (granted this may change depending on server I suppose). 
 

The best way for you to start is probably to go to Eternal Battlegrounds (EBG is the acronym, sometimes just EB), and find the commander in the minimal and follow them. They will usually be leading your friendly Zerg on the most active map, meaning fights, taking towers, etc.

 

As for participation, it’s not hard to build, you just need to kill people (probably more difficult for a new player running solo) or capture objectives. It’s quite easy to maintain if you know how to 🙂 

 

As for where objectives are, WvW uses a different format than PvE. If you look at the mini map or world map, you will see tower icons, camp icons, little flags (sentry points) and little yaks. Each of those that is not your teams color is an objective you can capture (in other words, that is the event marker). Camps can be captured by killing all the NPCS and standing in the ring. Sentries are captured by killing the lone soldier and standing in the ring (though it displays your location to enemies on map). Towers are a 1 level of defense objective, meaning you have to take out a gate or walk in order to go kill the lord and capture. Keeps are 2 levels of defense of objectives, meaning you have to go through an outer and an inner wall or gate to get to the lord. 
 

The acronym naming usually goes compass-based direction+first letter of the objective. So;

NC = north camp

SWT = south west tower

When you open your map, look for the most south-west tower, and that’s where the people are doing whatever they are doing. 
INC = incoming enemy

red/green/blue is referring to team color

Hills = eastern keep on the borderlands

Bay = western keep on the borderlands

Garri = northern keep on the borderlands

SMC/middle fort = the big castle in the middle of EBG

”home [insert objective]” = the objective of that type closest to your servers spawn. 
 

best of luck new person killing friend 🙂 

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Good points. Also watch for people calling out OJs. And though a tasty drink in this case they are indicating crossed orange swords. OJs will trigger at larger fights so if you are looking for action, head that way since they will typically draw in players for the encounter. Since the default is off would also recommended adjusting your chat settings to show what map people are saying things about in team chat. That could save you from getting reports at activity on NWT but not the NWT of the borderland you are on. You will also see people in EBG calling out shortened or abbreviations names since the layout is different. The directional calling on the red borderland works though but you might also see people call out the keeps by their elemental motif , Fire Keep, Earth, Air. Different servers may have some of their own nuisances to them as well you will need to get used to as linked servers change. 

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Well, at least you have a warclaw, so you've done something at least.

Sometimes maps are dead so don't be too afraid to switch. Also learn to read the map. People are usually going to attack targets next to ones they already own so teams will gradually keep across a map.

Also choose free camera and remember to look around yourself. If you get ganked, try to find a different path instead of going back there again. Sometimes it's worth going the long way around.

People aren't going to respond to generic questions like "where's the fights?". But if you tell them there's enemies or strucctures flipping (like when you got killed-- did you report that?), then you may see more players coming.

A lot of people that play this game mode are action junkies especially with the very boring lulls at times. As a result, you need to find a way to direct people to content or try to make some yourself by attacking things and asking for help that way.

But you can't be vague. "Green attacking a tower" is probably going to get ignored. 20 greens of x guild attacking SW tower may raise a few more eyebrows.

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6 hours ago, Squeesidhe.4761 said:

...this is my experience every time:

 

"Where is everyone?"

*vast, empty landscape*

"OK, let me go over here."

*insta-ganked*

"That's OK, it's not like I even know what I'm doing. Let me try again."

*Running, running, running on Warclaw*

"Where is everyone?"

*a silent wind blows over the lonely expanse*

"Let me kill these centaurs then."

*kills centaurs*

"Well, that's done. Where is everyone?"

*nearby event!*

"Where? I don't see any indicator on the map where I'm supposed to go - is something supposed to be happening? Am I supposed to be doing something?"

*incomprehensible technical babble on chat*

"Huh? I have no idea what those acronyms mean. Are they speaking English?"

*Running, running, running on Warclaw*

"Am I achieving anything at all here? Let me check..."

*System message: you are currently tier 2 participation. You need to be tier 3 to start earning pips.*

"Are you kittening kidding me? I'm not even earning any kittening progress? Screw this, I'm wasting my time. I'm going back to PVE."

*leaves*

 

I'm sure arenanet is preparing to implement tools and fix the litany of bugs and errors in WvW that will make it much easier for new players to find friends and things to do.

 

..

..

arenanet? 

..

..

beuller?

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Loads of really good suggestions in this thread. Some additionals from me:

You will get ganked, zerged & Corpse jumped.  It can be an incredibly frustrating experience.  Don't go on metabattle and pick the latest meta build (you will literally, be eaten alive), you will have to spend some time understanding your class and how to counter other players, as you will find everything from full zerk players, condition bunkers, bruisers etc.. and there are some really, really good players.  So understanding your chosen class well, is a really good start.

 

Your home map (your server) is actually a good place to start.  Because in general your side will have most keeps on the map taken.  So you have places to fall back to and most of the action will be centred around the camps/towers near the oppositions starting points (south on my map at least).  Start there and look for locations with swords, meaning it's being contested.  Always, always expect to be ganked/jumped outnumbered and learn to use terrain when needed, i.e.. blocking ranged or using for a teleport and escape route.  Never expect the opposition to fight fair either, it's a pvp game mode afterall.

 

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12 hours ago, Squeesidhe.4761 said:

*nearby event!*

"Where? I don't see any indicator on the map where I'm supposed to go - is something supposed to be happening? Am I supposed to be doing something?"

 

Hilarious. Thanks for the free bags.

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Wow, I am really reading someone asking in WvW to just get send worst players than him by anet to just "have fun" for a while? how to explain that even if its not just PvP, it is still a competitive game mode with PvP, so you can not ask other players to unlearn how to play so you can fight clueless all the time.

 

Its like the post in which they asked WvW to be like drizzlewood, ITS GOOD TO BE CASUAL BUT IS ALSO GOOD TO LIKE PVP. And just because you have easy pve modes for you it doesnt mean you can have the full game catered to your likes, even WvW that is not full PvP, but is still pvp = competitive game mode.

 

So as people has already stated it a multiplayer mode, ask people if you dont want to look up things neither dont want to learn "the hard way".

Edited by Nymthalas.4019
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... A long time ago - in the World versus World gamemode, somewhere in the Desert Borderlands, South of the map...

The Enemy Zerg: *enters the area of the south camp,looks at the roamer, capturing it , tries  to stomp the roamer with the fangs  and the claws of the Warclaws*

Me: *captures  the camp, encounters with the enemy zerg, feels excited, confused, afraid, heads to the east for luring them away from the area, starts to counterattack them*

The Enemy Zerg: Target acquired. Let the Hunt begin! *chases  the roamer with no second thoughts*

Me: By the Gods of Tyria! *kites  around, plays  around the Enemy Zerg, tries to fight them back with every inches of abilities available*

The Enemy Zerg: *continues on catching the roamer with the sharpened projectiles of Rangers, the fire magic, combined with the skills of Necromancers', of Guardians' and of Elementalists', the Spears of Justice from the Dragonhunters, the Confusion damage from the Mesmers, the damage from the claws of the Warclaws, the deathly marks  from the Deadeyes, the smashing from the front fighters*

Me: *enters  the downstate status  and the last breathe leaves from the body* Ack!

Also me: Report.There is an  enemy zerg in the south of the map. Be careful out there. 

Teammates: Understood.

One of the moments  in the World versus World gamemode.   >_<

 

Edited by Sylvia.4870
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