(Suggestion) ANET let us mix outfits and armor skins!

[Linken.6345]

3 hours ago, Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:

We've had armor that hides other armor since launch.  It's not really something new.  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Savant_Epaulets

Dont one of the citadel of flame armors hide shoulder aswell?

[The Greyhawk.9107]

3 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

Dont one of the citadel of flame armors hide shoulder aswell?

And at least one of the sylvari cultural armors.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

I'm sure there are a few.  I only listed one that came to mind easily. 

[nobleboivin.4102]

Instead of mixing outfits, I think I'd prefer if they added a system that lets you wear heavy on a scholar or light on a heavy for instance.  I know a lot of people that would love a traditional robed priest using guardian for instance.

[Drok Kindleshot.1496]

Totally agree gearing, outfits, wardrobe, it's not working I know it's because of $$$$$ but I've been struggling with equiping my charr with armors I actually like only to be turned off by the "outfit" system of the gemstore.

[Artemis.8034]

you can do this with some gemstore skins magitech comes to mind the seven reapers unfortunatly with full outfits its never going to happen they are one skin.

[Rovaeden.8546]

On 11/23/2022 at 11:54 AM, Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:

We've had armor that hides other armor since launch.  It's not really something new.  https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Savant_Epaulets

Uhh.. new or not is irrelevant to the topic at hand.

What matters is solving the problem of mixing outfits and armor.

[kharmin.7683]

1 hour ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

 

What matters is solving the problem of mixing outfits and armor.

There is no problem.  Outfits and armor are working as intended.

[Rovaeden.8546]

6 minutes ago, kharmin.7683 said:

There is no problem.  Outfits and armor are working as intended.

What you aren't getting is that they could be so much better.

 

I can't understand the resistance to having better.

Edited November 27, 2022 by Rovaeden.8546

[Fueki.4753]

5 minutes ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

What you aren't getting is that they could be so much better.

 

I can't understand the resistance to having better.

Money isn't so hard to understand.

As much as many of us dislike it, Arenanet has no reason to spend resources on changing how Outfits work, since they sell well enough anyway.

And having to spend less resources is the very reason they chose doing Outfits in the first place.

[Rovaeden.8546]

18 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

Money isn't so hard to understand.

As much as many of us dislike it, Arenanet has no reason to spend resources on changing how Outfits work, since they sell well enough anyway.

And having to spend less resources is the very reason they chose doing Outfits in the first place.

I totally agree with you.

A point i have made, or tried to make a number of times is that if enough people demand a feature, it adds pressure and impetus for Anet to act.

As things stand, Anet has no incentive to adjust how Outfits work. Either they don't know we want a change to the feature (hence using the forum to inform them) or they don't care, as white knights and fanboys crusading on behalf of Anet love to tell everyone with certainty, what the developer (whom they themselves are not, i would like to again point out) can or cannot do!

If the fanboys block progress with blind devotion to the status quo, it's no wonder that Anet doesnt bother putting in effort to change and fix things.

Go ahead, make a post about bugs and you will have a small army of derps arguing that the bugs have been there since yadda yadda and Anet shouldn't be held accountable blah blah blah.

 

[Rovaeden.8546]

25 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

Money isn't so hard to understand.

As much as many of us dislike it, Arenanet has no reason to spend resources on changing how Outfits work, since they sell well enough anyway.

And having to spend less resources is the very reason they chose doing Outfits in the first place.

Another point.

I understand the resistance to extra work on Anets part.

What I utterly fail to understand is the resistance to having things better from the white knights and fanboys. Its not like the money is going into or leaving their pockets. They are just being blindly obsequious for no good apparent reason.
It is at them that my comment about resistance is directed.

Edited November 27, 2022 by Rovaeden.8546

[kharmin.7683]

19 minutes ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

Another point.

I understand the resistance to extra work on Anets part.

What I utterly fail to understand is the resistance to having things better from the white knights and fanboys. Its not like the money is going into or leaving their pockets. They are just being blindly obsequious for no good apparent reason.
It is at them that my comment about resistance is directed.

No, but re-working the entire  armor set and outfit concept from scratch would take a LOT of resources away from where they might be better used in making the game better for a far larger number of players than your request might include.   The only way to vote for change is with your wallet, and there are more than enough players who are satisfied in purchasing outfits that Anet probably won't change.

It's not being blind or having no apparent reason.  It's called having business sense.  Anet will continue to do whatever makes the most profit for their investors. 

[SuavePuppy.2809]

27 minutes ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

What I utterly fail to understand is the resistance to having things better

You can't just claim something is better without addressing the issues this idea introduces.

 

But, I have a clean solution to the outfit/armor system.

Scrap the outfit system. Go through and splice each set into its 6 pieces. Each of those pieces is now in your wardrobe if you own the outfit. Will they clip? Probably, but so does a bunch of other stuff. Everything falls under the wardrobe system. Everything takes a transmutation charge to alter. Armor sets continue to be sold as 6 individual pieces.  But, people are definitely going to be upset that they have to use 6 transmutation charges to put on an outfit now. I think people like having it free and having easy access to nice looking sets without too much effort. Oh well I guess.

 

That's the cleanest solution I can come up with. Would that be a lot of work? Probably. Will it happen? Probably not. But hey, the idea is out there now.

[Rogue.8235]

Just here to say that I, too, wish that armors can be mixed together.  I understand that each armor weight has a different skeletal rig, so I know this won't be done.  Changing something as foundational as the rigging system is a massive undertaking that can have unintentional effects on other aspects of the software.  I'm assuming that re-rigging everything is economically infeasible, and probably financially irresponsible.

End result: I still wish for it and understand why it won't be done.

Just my two copper.

 

[Rovaeden.8546]

1 hour ago, SuavePuppy.2809 said:

You can't just claim something is better without addressing the issues this idea introduces.

 

I... um.. WHAT?

Did you READ any of the thread or just react to the title and last post?

I DID address the issues! Up, down and sideways I addressed them.

[Rovaeden.8546]

1 hour ago, kharmin.7683 said:

No, but re-working the entire  armor set and outfit concept from scratch .....

Its NOT from scratch.

Its tweaking existing assets.

[Rovaeden.8546]

35 minutes ago, Rogue.8235 said:

Just here to say that I, too, wish that armors can be mixed together.  I understand that each armor weight has a different skeletal rig, so I know this won't be done.  Changing something as foundational as the rigging system is a massive undertaking that can have unintentional effects on other aspects of the software.  I'm assuming that re-rigging everything is economically infeasible, and probably financially irresponsible.

End result: I still wish for it and understand why it won't be done.

Just my two copper.

 

Its not re-rigging anything though.
It is my assumption, as a hobbiest digital animator, that everything is already rigged and set to channels within the database that defines where a model is to be drawn when equipped.
It is most likely that there is a flag that holds all the parts of the OUTFITS together as a single piece.
At most, a dev would have to do a pass to unlink the various parts (Head, Shoulders, Chest, Etc) within the model and at the least just untick a flag.

 

 

[SuavePuppy.2809]

30 minutes ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

I DID address the issues! Up, down and sideways I addressed them.

What you have addressed amounts to "I wish I could use the systems together despite them having no incentive to change the systems". You claim your recommendations are positive changes and fixes despite the fact that others prefer the way the work. I've posted several times laying out why they don't work together, and have now posted an actual change that would get you what you want.

Do you believe that changing it so that your outfit can be removed piece by piece to reveal your armor underneath addresses the issue of outfits bypassing transmutation charges?

Does it address the issue that it undermines the outfit-style armor sets they have sold recently for many more gems? Do that and we can start to get somewhere.

You say either they don't know about the changes you want, or they don't care, which implies that your idea speaks to the wishes of the community. You simply claim it's a change for the better. This is why people react with confused emojis.

[Rovaeden.8546]

29 minutes ago, SuavePuppy.2809 said:

What you have addressed amounts to "I wish I could use the systems together despite them having no incentive to change the systems". You claim your recommendations are positive changes and fixes despite the fact that others prefer the way the work. I've posted several times laying out why they don't work together, and have now posted an actual change that would get you what you want.

Do you believe that changing it so that your outfit can be removed piece by piece to reveal your armor underneath addresses the issue of outfits bypassing transmutation charges?

Does it address the issue that it undermines the outfit-style armor sets they have sold recently for many more gems? Do that and we can start to get somewhere.

You say either they don't know about the changes you want, or they don't care, which implies that your idea speaks to the wishes of the community. You simply claim it's a change for the better. This is why people react with confused emojis.

Ill post it again here just for you.
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Quote

 

You open the gem store. You see there is a cool new Outfit that you want to buy. You purchase it for, what the standard price seems to be, 700 gems.
Your mail icon pings and you open and retrieve your brand new Outfit.
You open your Hero Panel and select Outfits.
You are presented with the big table of icons on the left and your paper doll on the right showing what you are wearing. just like currently.

- Where I think improvements can be made, and the change I am proposing -

You select your new Outfit (or any other Outfit for that matter) and a vertical column of boxes appears, similar to armor, but it is populated by the Outfit parts for the Outfit that you selected.

Now, these boxes could be Head, Shoulders, Chest, Gloves, Legs and Boots, or some combination. Perhaps Head, Shoulders and Chest (Main Body).
These boxes populated with the Outfit parts would have check boxes in their upper right corner that allows you to disable or enable that particular part so that it does or does not display.
So for instance, if you disable your Outfit head visual, but enable your armor head visual, you will appear in-game as wearing your selected Outfit and your armor headgear instead of the Outfit headgear.
Should you chose to disable the headgear visuals on both the armor and Outfit panels, then your character would be seen wearing no headgear.

You can follow this logic through for each piece of Outfit appearance. Turn on and off as you wish any particular Outfit part in order for your armor visual appearance to show instead.

Simple. The workflow and systems already exists. We just need Anet to chose to put a dev or two on it.

 

And again (as I said below in another comment I made in this thread), NO! It will NOT take 9 months per piece! -because that amount of time is for developing from scratch and what we are talking about is tweaking an existing asset which is so much easier.

 

And now I will attempt to clarify.
1) You are not REMOVING anything. You are toggling the visual on or off like you can already do with a Back Item, Helm or Shoulders, etc.

2) The separate piece premium armor skins for 500 gems each is greedy and unacceptable.
Those pieces should be Outfits but rolled into a system such as what I have outlined above.

3) Transmutation charges are greedy and unacceptable, but are NOT a point I am making here in this thread. If you want to talk about them, great! Lets! Start a new thread.

4) Yes, I fully believe the community would be very happy with my changes if they were implemented exactly as I have outlined, but that would require the community to stop fan-boying long enough to engage brain and see past their own nose.

 

5) No offense intended, but I simply don't care about why you or anyone else believes this can't happen.
Unless you are a DEVELOPER OF GUILD WARS 2, your opinion (cuz that's all it is) is 100% irrelevant.
All you are succeeding in doing is stopping progress at the gate by deciding for Anet what they should and should not take a closer look at. It is unbelievably short sighted behavior and needs to stop.
If you want to add cool ideas, awesome! I'd love to hear them. If all you wanna do is say "No" then just don't. You are just being a speedbump.
Again. This is not meant as a personal attack. It is simply my perception as someone who has worked for a long time in IT that when you have an uninvolved person running their mouth about matters outside of their field and stating what cannot be done it serves no good end whatsoever.

 

Edited November 28, 2022 by Rovaeden.8546

[mythical.6315]

1 hour ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

It is simply my perception as someone who has worked for a long time in IT that when you have an uninvolved person running their mouth about matters outside of their field and stating what cannot be done it serves no good end whatsoever.

Unless you work in game design, and especially have intimate knowledge of how GW2 was designed, you cannot really comment that you know better than someone else.  IT itself is a very broad field. 

[SuavePuppy.2809]

1 hour ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

You are toggling the visual on or off like you can already do with a Back Item, Helm or Shoulders, etc.

I understand that, but what you are allowing is essentially free transmutations for part of your appearance, as outfits can be swapped without them. 

1 hour ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

Transmutation charges are greedy and unacceptable, but are NOT a point I am making here in this thread

As much as you want to avoid the topic, if you propose a system that undermines them, then they should be addressed. But I actually agree, I'd prefer if they weren't a thing.

1 hour ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

Those pieces should be Outfits but rolled into a system such as what I have outlined above.

I disagree, it's outfits that need to be integrated into the armor system, as it is the default system. What I have proposed is one armor system. You have proposed two systems overlapping, which I think is not as clean. But I agree, I think the armor sets are too expensive as well.

1 hour ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

stop fan-boyin

Stop calling people fan-boys for disagreeing with you, Anet makes plenty of mistakes and there's many things I would change about this game.

1 hour ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

I simply don't care about why you or anyone else believes this can't happen.

I said it earlier, I don't believe it can't happen, I just don't agree with the changes themselves. Not that they can't change, but that if we're going to change things, there are other ways I would suggest going about it. Again, I would prefer everything being sold as armor sets for the sake of having just one fashion system to deal with, which also allows for full customization of all pieces and dye channels. 

[kharmin.7683]

3 hours ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

Its NOT from scratch.

Its tweaking existing assets.

Which is not possible with the current coding.  It would have to be done from scratch.

[Fueki.4753]

11 hours ago, Rovaeden.8546 said:

A point i have made, or tried to make a number of times is that if enough people demand a feature, it adds pressure and impetus for Anet to act.

Arenanet has proven time and time again, that people complaining or demanding things does not add do anything to cause Arenanet to act even slightly.

The years long complains about Warrior being below the barrel and us wanting it to be better? Not only did Arenanet NOT make Warrior better, they even took away the one thing that Warriors had to offer for organized group content.

Fixing Sunqua Peak? As far as I am aware, that still didn't happen.

Having options to turn down the particle vomit without impacting any other graphics? Arenanet is dead silent.

Phasing out Soulbeast's far cloud after a few seconds? Arenanet is dead silent.

And those are just four of the bigger, more reasonable things that players want.

I doubt any amount of complains would add pressure for unreasonable demands like reworking every single armour skin and outfit in the game, so everything can be mixed.

[Forum Moderator.3419]

Hi Everyone,
I'm locking this thread as it's run its course.
Regards.