Did Arenanet ruin food?

[Moradorin.6217]

5 hours ago, yoni.7015 said:

The two new players from Ashantaras post are swimming in gold? My question was why these new players had to buy the stuff on the trading post and why they didn’t buy it with karma at the vendor. 

from past experience (when starting new accounts and trying to build karma via WIntersday) New players dont have enough Karma to buy 30 toys + wrapping paper. It takes time to get that much Karma. I recall on new accounts buying the toys to get the karma. I alternatively have wasted extra time running back and forth with is very teedious and unfun.

[Sobx.1758]

5 minutes ago, Moradorin.6217 said:

from past experience (when starting new accounts and trying to build karma via WIntersday) New players dont have enough Karma to buy 30 toys + wrapping paper. It takes time to get that much Karma. I recall on new accounts buying the toys to get the karma. I alternatively have wasted extra time running back and forth with is very teedious and unfun.

You can "not have enough karma" only single time at the start, when you can "kickstart" it extremely easly by either buying limited number of wrapped gifts (even if one at the start, just to re-use gained karma to buy next gifts) or by buying relevant cheap skins off tp to turn silver into karma. It barely takes any time above what it takes for any other player.

Edited December 26, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Cuks.8241]

6 hours ago, ugrakarma.9416 said:

some players liked "gambling" with festival bags, and bought them em massive numbers.... 

now probably the videos like "opening 50k bags" will be rarer or extinct.

It will be the same. People didnt open 50k presents for food but for rarer items. Now there will be no food from presents but presents will also be cheaper so in the its the same.

I'm not sure food was removed due to the research notes. They had no problems in the past changing specific items to be able to salvage/research them or not. Its just as possible that it was due to economy, because festival food/utilities basically made every non BIS (and some were even BIS) food useless and thus also materials worthless.

I dont mind the change. Well I wouldnt mind if I havent sold several tens of stacks of food and utilities at the start of the year while cleaning my inventories. I had a stack of every utility and useful food item on over 10 chars. And before festival season I decided I will consolidate those stacks into 1 stack in my shared inventory slots. I dont even want to know how much gold I threw away by today's prices. 😛

Edited December 26, 2022 by Cuks.8241
typos

[Ashen.2907]

8 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

How is the salvage n' sell relevant here? And if you understand that in reality that food was also not exactly rewarding then I'm not sure why you've said what you did in your previous post either. Overally... not sure how this response addresses anything that was said here, might need explanation.

Of course some people are complaining, they got used to popping up that dirt-cheap food by default without giving it a second thought, while nothing crafted with similar effects could realistically compete with it. Now that food is less free so some people will go out of their way to start threads how that somehow ruins food/event/presents or even try claiming people suddenly stopped attending the event altogether because of it. I don't see how that's true though.

Your post supports his original post about the perception of beimg rewarded.

[Sobx.1758]

1 minute ago, Ashen.2907 said:

Your post supports his original post about the perception of beimg rewarded.

How exactly?

And who decides what that "perception" is?

[Khisanth.2948]

8 hours ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

Perhaps the statement needs a tiny correction: not the food per se "was ruined", but the incentive to open festival bags, especially the Wintersday Gifts, has been killed by the removal of food.

What incentive? For several years there were people making videos mass opening those bags for the festivals and each time it resulted in a lost. Opening festival bags is basically gambling at a casino. The house always wins.

 

8 hours ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

I had conversations with two new players yesterday who started only on Christmas and were quite sad when they discovered that they couldn't get Wrapped Gifts for the orphans without spending what to them seems a fortune at the Trading Post as the old clothes no longer drop, either.

So did you help them by informing them about the cheaper alternatives or did you just deepen their misunderstanding?

 

3 hours ago, Cuks.8241 said:

I dont mind the change. Well I wouldnt mind if I havent sold several tens of stacks of food and utilities at the start of the year while cleaning my inventories. I had a stack of every utility and useful food item on over 10 chars. And before festival season I decided I will consolidate those stacks into 1 stack in my shared inventory slots. I dont even want to know how much gold I threw away by today's prices. 😛

and sometimes it goes the other way around when you don't sell. I've lost well over 1000g froma couple items dropping in price.

[Astralporing.1957]

5 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

And who decides what that "perception" is?

Players do for themselves. That should have been rather obvious.

[Sobx.1758]

14 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

How exactly?

Still unclear btw.

 

8 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

Players do for themselves. That should have been rather obvious.

Exactly (and I agree that it is rather obvious, just making sure we understand it the same way), so pretty much literally anything can be perceived as "rewarding" or "unrewarding" by any single person and as such I'm not sure why there was an attempt at throwing that blanket statement in there and how it is supposed to change anything that was being written in the previous posts.

Edited December 27, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Astralporing.1957]

1 hour ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Exactly (and I agree that it is rather obvious, just making sure we understand it the same way), so pretty much literally anything can be perceived as "rewarding" or "unrewarding" by any single person and as such I'm not sure why there was an attempt at throwing that blanket statement in there and how it is supposed to change anything that was being written in the previous posts.

Perception of a single individual indeed does not matter. It becomes different however if that perception ends up being shared by more people. And the market trends of Wintersday Gifts do seem to suggest, let, say, a significant decrease in interest in them.

[Sobx.1758]

17 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

Perception of a single individual indeed does not matter. It becomes different however if that perception ends up being shared by more people. And the market trends of Wintersday Gifts do seem to suggest, let, say, a significant decrease in interest in them.

Not really, the wintersday gift price kept going down each year without a change. And interest in the activities themselves didn't really go noticably down.

Edited December 27, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Ashantara.8731]

On 12/26/2022 at 12:32 PM, yoni.7015 said:

Why do they have to buy stuff at the trading post? Why didn’t they just buy the stuff for gifts with karma at the vendor? 

You are referring to the Wintersday toy weapons, I take it? AFAIK, new players don't swim in Karma, either.

In any case, prior to the change addressed in this thread's topic, you didn't have to buy anything. You could just open the gifts you earned through the festival and use the items you would receive from them.

[yoni.7015]

2 minutes ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

You are referring to the Wintersday toy weapons, I take it? AFAIK, new players don't swim in Karma, either.

In any case, prior to the change addressed in this thread's topic, you didn't have to buy anything. You could just open the gifts you earned through the festival and use the items you would receive from them.

You don’t have to swim in karma and you don’t have to spend gold on the trading post. Just do the race, the bell choir or the other activities and you have enough karma to buy the toy weapons for the gifts. 

Edited December 27, 2022 by yoni.7015

[Sobx.1758]

5 minutes ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

You are referring to the Wintersday toy weapons, I take it? AFAIK, new players don't swim in Karma, either.

In any case, prior to the change addressed in this thread's topic, you didn't have to buy anything. You could just open the gifts you earned through the festival and use the items you would receive from them.

If you didn't open the gifts, you could sell them -so one way or another you were exchanging gold for karma there. If that's all the player was interested in, they can sell the gifts, buy the skin, probably still have more gold/coins than they had and get their karma runs. Or, as already mentioned before, "kickstart" your karma farming by starting with lower number of wrapped gifts (not even "per day", literally exchange ONE and then buy more for the karma you gained. If someone somehow doesn't have enough karma to buy them all at once, they need to kickstart it just one time ever and then they're set for the whole farm consistently)

Edited December 27, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Ashantara.8731]

1 minute ago, Sobx.1758 said:

If you didn't open the gifts, you could sell them -so one way or another you were exchanging gold for karma there. If that's all the player was interested in, they can sell the gifts, buy the skin, probably still have more gold/coins than they had and get their karma runs.

I don't argue that it's still doable without a big loss of currency. I'm just saying that I liked it better when we had more options and that I miss the festive food from festival bags.

[Sobx.1758]

7 minutes ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

I don't argue that it's still doable without a big loss of currency. I'm just saying that I liked it better when we had more options and that I miss the festive food from festival bags.

So what was the point of saying"new players not swimming a karma" in that response? Because it seemed like an effort to present it as an issue while you understand it isn't exactly one?

You're free to prefer it whichever way though, not much to say about that in particular, but then again I wasn't commenting on your preference in that regard either, I was specifcally addressing the "just think about new players!" type of argument you went for in your previous post. The new players are still fine. Kickstarting the daily karma farm (if those new karma-less players are even aware of its existance) is still really easy.

Edited December 27, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Astralporing.1957]

19 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Not really, the wintersday gift price kept going down each year without a change.

No, on year to year basis it was going down only when Anet removed something from them.

19 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

And interest in the activities themselves didn't really go noticably down.

That's not something you or I can verify. That's also not what i am talking about. I'm talking about the change in amout of trades on TP, which is visible. There's a significant drop in demand for Gifts, and yet the supply remains unchanged - which means there's also less people selling.

[Sobx.1758]

9 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

No, on year to year basis it was going down only when Anet removed something from them.

What was removed consistently for the past few years?

9 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

That's not something you or I can verify. That's also not what i am talking about. I'm talking about the change in amout of trades on TP, which is visible. There's a significant drop in demand for Gifts, and yet the supply remains unchanged - which means there's also less people selling.

If the supply remains unchanged... it means those gifts are comming from somewhere. (actually demand is higher this year btw)

Edited December 27, 2022 by Sobx.1758

[Azureus.5428]

Welp, nah, the holiday foods should be something that's reserved mostly for the holiday season, not the default soldier chow.