Khisanth.2948 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 5 hours ago, Danikat.8537 said: I think it depends on your PC. On my old one the game almost never crashed with DX9, so from my perspective it was very stable. When I tried DX11 it was crashing at least once an hour, usually when there were a lot of people on screen (which annoyingly meant it mainly crashed at key moments in WvW) but sometimes when loading cut scenes, or going between maps or seemingly for no reason at all. I had to disable it to actually play, but would re-enable it periodically to see if it was any better and it always crashed within an hour or so, often multiple times. That stopped when I got my new PC, I've been running the game on this one with DX11 enabled and haven't had any problems. I can't say if I've noticed any improvements because every part of the PC is an upgrade, so it's hard to know what's down to better hardware rather than DX11. There was also a lot of crashing within the first couple of months of DX11 being released. You can still toggle between dx9 and dx11 so it is pretty easy to tell if there is any difference. Since dx9 is still available it is pretty easy to compare. While standing in the exact same spot(spawn point of one of the GH). For me dx9 -> 55FPS, 27%, 95% GPU usage dx11 -> 90FPS, 45% CPU, 90% GPU usage dx9->vulkan -> 80 FPS, 30% CPU, 97% GPU dx11->vulkan -> 90 FPS, 37% CPU, 97% GPU The FPS improvement is pretty obvious but the CPU/GPU usage change was surprising. I guess on my system the dx9 on my GPU is slow enough that it is bottlenecking the CPU 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FriendlyFire.6275 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 Just now, Khisanth.2948 said: There was also a lot of crashing within the first couple of months of DX11 being released. You can still toggle between dx9 and dx11 so it is pretty easy to tell if there is any difference. Since dx9 is still available it is pretty easy to compare. While standing in the exact same spot(spawn point of one of the GH). For me dx9 -> 55FPS, 27%, 95% GPU usage dx11 -> 90FPS, 45% CPU, 90% GPU usage dx9->vulkan -> 80 FPS, 30% CPU, 97% GPU dx11->vulkan -> 90 FPS, 37% CPU, 97% GPU The FPS improvement is pretty obvious but the CPU/GPU usage change was surprising. I guess on my system the dx9 on my GPU is slow enough that it is bottlenecking the CPU Nah, the reason is that DirectX 11 can more efficiently load up your CPU. Even without a lot of changes on ANet's side, the DirectX 11 drivers from both main vendors tend to be better threaded and much more optimized, so you benefit from years of software engineering "for free". That'll increase CPU load (because more threads) but also improve frame rate. GPU utilization fluctuating around 5% is honestly probably just noise. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strixxe.2019 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 OP, are you smoking spoiled Charr-nip again? Because if you are still on some ancient hardware that is not dx11 compatible then not be able to play gw2 should be your least concern... 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epsilon Indi.2031 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 of all the systems on steam, less than 50% of 1% of them can't play DirectX11 games. I think it was something like 0.25% or close to that number. This is not just people who play GW2, but all of steam's userbase that participated in hardware surveys. DirectX11 also came out before GW1. If your PC was built with parts that aren't over 15ish years old, you'll be fine. You may experience frame dips on newer maps but your experience on older maps may even improve (And you'll likely be able to turn off more things to help your experience be even better). This is just outrage for outrage's sake. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vegeta.2563 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 I just want them to fix the text issues with DX11 .. like the missing shadows on names Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charybdis.9042 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 10 hours ago, Deadly Moth.5687 said: Regardless the point still stands I will likely be effected by these changes (even though this setup currently works well for me). The game will not load when DX9 rending is turned off (as you say; it appears to be the feature level which is the key factor) and therefore I will likely not beable to play as often or be spending as much money (until I do finally upgrade). You might want to take a look at an intermediate upgrade. Replacing the GPU with (say) an nVidia 1070 will address the DX11 requirement. Then carry the GPU over into the new PC, and finally upgrade the GPU when there is one available that you want. Then sell the 1070. Due diligence on hardware compatibility of course. Each of those steps will see a very noticeable improvement in game performance and you don't have to rely on the CPU/GPU market being at a price/performance sweet spot. This is the upgrade path that I've taken over the last 10 years and am still on (Intel 4770/nVidia 770 -> nVidia 1070 -> Intel 13600 -> ???) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 (edited) 21 hours ago, Colin.4568 said: It sure would be nice if they could come up with an acknowledgement that DX11 implementation is currently crashing for some users (that have DX11 compatible hardware). And that they will be looking into it. However that is not the feeling I had from the announcement... They are looking into it. There's been some crashes that were present a month ago but no longer happen now, for example. They are constantly fixing things, and it's likely that a lot of complaining players could safely play with dx11 now, but don't know it because they didn't try after their original bad experience many months ago. Now, there are indeed some issues with dx11 and windows 7 specifically (the infamous mosaic bug on some driver version/specific cards combo), but those can be gotten around with dxvk. Edited January 7, 2023 by Astralporing.1957 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dognosh.6327 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 Some here mentioned no crashes on DX9 ? I had many crashes on DX9, and now on DX11 too sometimes.(DX9 on an i7 and now DX11 on AMD 5950 ) There will always be bugs. Lets hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flomix.3982 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said: They are looking into it. There's been some crashes that were present a month ago but no longer happen now, for example. They are constantly fixing things, and it's likely that a lot of complaining players could safely play with dx11 now, They fix some bugs but also introduce others, which is why I'm concerned too about the announcement. My account can't play the game on dx11 at all since like 2 months, i have to use dx9 currently. dx11 crashes on startup still today. And I specifically say account, because a.) Alt accounts and accounts of friends start just fine, just my main account crashes on startup even before the char select screen, and b.) that account crashes on other computers too, exact same behavior. Mine is brand new hardware from 2022 btw. So it can neither be a driver nor a corrupt-game-data nor a too-old-hardware problem. All I can do is pray what will happen in 3 weeks... Edited January 7, 2023 by Flomix.3982 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 3 minutes ago, Flomix.3982 said: They fix some bugs but also introduce others, which is why I'm concerned too about the announcement. It's not dx11 specific. There are people that are still getting crashes on dx9. There are also people that get crashes on dx9 but not on dx11. I'd say, that (apart from some dx11-win7 interactions that can be worked around with dxvk) at this moment dx11 does not seem to be significantly more bugged than dx9 anymore. Sure, some people will be affected, but then some people were affected before dx11 was even a thing. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin.4568 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 18 hours ago, Infusion.7149 said: Have you cleared your shader cache and updated your drivers? I am quite curious what you are running. I am running version 512.95 (2022-05-24) of GeForce Game Ready Driver (installing the new 528.02 of 2023-01-05 right now) with an NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1650 As for the computer specs: Quote Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-9750H CPU @ 2.60GHz 2.59 GHz Installed RAM 16,0 GB (15,9 GB usable) System type 64-bit operating system, x64-based processor Edition Windows 10 Home Version 21H2 OS build 19044.2364 I can try clearing the cache, is this the following way to do so? https://computersluggish.com/windows-tutorials/optimise-maintain/how-to-clear-directx-shader-cache-in-windows-10/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khisanth.2948 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 6 hours ago, Vegeta.2563 said: I just want them to fix the text issues with DX11 .. like the missing shadows on names Are you still on win7? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bladestrom.6425 Posted January 7, 2023 Share Posted January 7, 2023 (edited) 8 hours ago, CrashTestAuto.9108 said: Yeah, I don't know why people feel so restricted by the "MMO" bit. Yes, it's an MMO, but that doesn't mean it has to be restricted to a specific formula. If you can attract Open World, Instanced Group, Competitive PvP, WvW, Fashion Wars, Lore Addict players etc. then why would you suddenly decide to reject people who want to spend part of their time enjoying the mechanics and their characters in a solo instanced context (which is a huge proportion of the story anyway)? People spends dozens/hundreds/thousands of hours investing in MMOs, and they become attached to the game, the world and their characters. Adding variety to what they can do in game is an obvious way to keep them engaged (and the game is absolutely full of side activities and solo content already). Also, the exact same argument could be said for instanced group content, which ignores the first "M". It just happens to traditionally be a feature of MMOs. If you want cooperative group content, you could go play Left 4 Dead (or many, many other games). 2 hours ago, Khisanth.2948 said: Are you still on win7? that would be a very risky thing to do as it is out of support. i.e Support for Windows 7 has been discontinued, Microsoft customer service no longer is able to provide technical assistance, and your PC no longer receives security updates. It's important that you move to a modern operating system such as Windows 11, which can provide the latest security updates to help keep you and your data safer. Edited January 7, 2023 by vesica tempestas.1563 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeon.4583 Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 DX9 has less skill-particles and cosmetic effects graphic noise. You force people into more sparkly DX11, then atleast give "Character Model Limit - Do not show other characters" which have been asked for ages. Eye killing graphical noise you have in-game already pushing away many. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fueki.4753 Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 33 minutes ago, Aeon.4583 said: DX9 has less skill-particles and cosmetic effects graphic noise. You force people into more sparkly DX11, then atleast give "Character Model Limit - Do not show other characters" which have been asked for ages. Eye killing graphical noise you have in-game already pushing away many. They also need to finally give us expansive options which particle effects to show and which not. I'm not looking forward to seeing more excessive particle vomit than I already see on DX9. 2 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashantara.8731 Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 My main concern is that the two biggest issues the current implementation of DX11 has will not be taken care of in time before the update rolls out: The non-rendering of vital AoE effects in endgame content, which can be fatal. The occasional crashes triggered under specific circumstances. If these things are not being taken care of soon(ish), I predict a ton of complaints from the playerbase, especially from those who were using the DX9 renderer up until then. 2 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stadsport.8714 Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 On 1/7/2023 at 3:27 AM, Charybdis.9042 said: You might want to take a look at an intermediate upgrade. Replacing the GPU with (say) an nVidia 1070 will address the DX11 requirement. Then carry the GPU over into the new PC, and finally upgrade the GPU when there is one available that you want. Then sell the 1070. Due diligence on hardware compatibility of course. Each of those steps will see a very noticeable improvement in game performance and you don't have to rely on the CPU/GPU market being at a price/performance sweet spot. This is the upgrade path that I've taken over the last 10 years and am still on (Intel 4770/nVidia 770 -> nVidia 1070 -> Intel 13600 -> ???) I picked up a 3gb GTX 1060 for $80 (it just needed a thorough cleaning) off FB Marketplace and it ran GW2 at very high settings like a dream. Then I later sold it for $100. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 8, 2023 Share Posted January 8, 2023 4 hours ago, Aeon.4583 said: DX9 has less skill-particles and cosmetic effects graphic noise. You force people into more sparkly DX11, then atleast give "Character Model Limit - Do not show other characters" which have been asked for ages. You do realize, that while upgrading to a new DX version may change how things are rendered, it does not change what is rendered? If you don't, then i will give you a hint: no, the amount of skill-particles and cosmetic effects did not change from dx9 to dx11. 2 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeon.4583 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 13 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said: You do realize, that while upgrading to a new DX version may change how things are rendered, it does not change what is rendered? If you don't, then i will give you a hint: no, the amount of skill-particles and cosmetic effects did not change from dx9 to dx11. Blizzard been saying same thing during Heroes of the Storm. Quote: DX9, DX10 and DX11 have same amount of particle effects. BUT! Then some people did research based on protoss characters with their wrist blade weapons. The higher DX was, more particles these weapons had 😉 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westenev.5289 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 The notice says any GPU made after 2009 can probably handle DX11. I'd be interested to know if this is true, and more interested to know what this means for players running the game on a "poor persons" integrated graphics card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Boz.2038 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 What even is this thread? How does four pages get spawned from straight up lies, overblown worries, and misunderstandings of words? 6 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProtoGunner.4953 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 OP's point is void as 'poor' players don't spend money at least not as poor as someone using freaking 15+ year old hardware. Sorry this is not the target audience. 1 1 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mythical.6315 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, The Boz.2038 said: What even is this thread? How does four pages get spawned from straight up lies, overblown worries, and misunderstandings of words? Well there is the hardware aspect and concerns about ArenaNet’s implementation. The hardware aspect honestly is a non-issue and easy to remedy. My concern is over the stability of their implementation as I’ve gotten significantly more crashes whenever I’m on DX11 mode than on DX9. Go to the bugs sub forum and view either of the DX11 threads to see that this concern/issue affects other players. Edited January 9, 2023 by mythical.6315 Typo; autocorrect hates me 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 (edited) 7 hours ago, Aeon.4583 said: Blizzard been saying same thing during Heroes of the Storm. Quote: DX9, DX10 and DX11 have same amount of particle effects. BUT! Then some people did research based on protoss characters with their wrist blade weapons. The higher DX was, more particles these weapons had 😉 That can happen when you make some effects already with higher dx in mind, and then have to downgrade them to lower version. In that case, indeed, some graphic effects can be lost. In the opposite case however it can't happen - changing dx is not going to add things that weren't originally there. The WoW comparison has likely been done with things that have been added long after higher dx versions got implemented. In GW2 currently there's no such thing however. Edit: oh, it's Heroes of the Storm. In that case, it was exactly what i am talking about - that game has been already done with higher dx in place. You are not talking here about new particle effects appearing after upgrading dx. You're talking about some effects getting lost when downgrading to lower dx version. As already mentioned, this is not a case for GW2, as it's dx9, not dx11, that forms the base. Basically, while lower dx may not show all effects that were made with higher dx in mind, higher dx can't show things that weren't there in the first place, unless they will get added manually later on. Edited January 9, 2023 by Astralporing.1957 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 Is this when we start getting stories about MMO gamers making runs on the vacuum tube market? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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