4th elite spec

[draxynnic.3719]

10 hours ago, Dawanarth.4601 said:

Give us something that isn't a Human

 

Like Scarlet with Twin Pistols or Rifle

Sylvari are still pretty close to human. I want to see more legends that aren't even humanoid.

That's harder to do, so I can see why they're less common, but playable race characters tend to have playable race professions.

 

7 hours ago, Ravenwulfe.5360 said:

You mean Shiro and Mallyx aren't edgey? Nevermind Kalla. I think that's pretty edgey too. And while Archemerous and Viktor might be weebs they are fairly bloodthirsty and edgey at each other too. I mean hell Archy talks to you constantly about how he can feel your anger rising, your bloood boiling, and how it's his turn to shine, and Viktor talks about how much he hates Archy. And don't get them started if you have Shiro as your alt Legend.

Shiro and Mallyx weren't among the last three. 

I think the point being made is that after having been originally told that revenants didn't care about the morality of the legend they channelled, at this point five out of seven are on the heroic (or at worst antiheroic) side of the spectrum. Shiro and Mallyx are the only villains.

[soul.9651]

Could there be any possible legends from the undead?

[Dadnir.5038]

9 hours ago, ScottBroChill.3254 said:

Rev needs an edgy elite spec. We've had 3 good legends in a row, give us a scoundrel next time, a real rapscallion.

Good and bad is always relative to the point of view of the character.

Shiro believed that the emperor would kill him at the harvest festival which is why he striked first. You can see him as the vilain of GW:faction, but it's legend isn't about what he did in faction.

Mallyx simply wanted to get back something that belong to it's kins, follower of Abbadon. What would you do if your spiritual anchor of your race had been killed and replaced by someone that would very likely have an heavy impact on the environment of your home. Without forgeting the fact that the follower of this entity is slaugthering your kins. Would you just stretch your neck and ask for a swift death?

 

 

[Phyrak.7260]

I'm probably an odd duck in wanting an e-spec that lets you camp a legend.

Scepter or focus make more sense as something a little more magic focused side.

As for the mechanism.

Base it around the use of the elite changing 1-5 to grant greater strength and aspect for the channeled legend.

The monk from gw1 who's name escapes me would be a good one to use this concept for - though with all the discussion of a non human/humanoid.

I'm sure there's plenty of NPCs in gw1 that could be used - been a long time since I've played gw1.

Edited January 18, 2023 by Phyrak.7260

[draxynnic.3719]

5 hours ago, soul.9651 said:

Could there be any possible legends from the undead?

Vizier Khilbron has sometimes been raised as a possibility. Would be another human, though, and probably hard to link to the theme of a future expansion.

 

5 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

Good and bad is always relative to the point of view of the character.

Shiro believed that the emperor would kill him at the harvest festival which is why he striked first. You can see him as the vilain of GW:faction, but it's legend isn't about what he did in faction.

Mallyx simply wanted to get back something that belong to it's kins, follower of Abbadon. What would you do if your spiritual anchor of your race had been killed and replaced by someone that would very likely have an heavy impact on the environment of your home. Without forgeting the fact that the follower of this entity is slaugthering your kins. Would you just stretch your neck and ask for a swift death?

 

 

Eh. Everyone thinks they're the hero of their own story, but they both either had substantial negative impact on the world or aimed to. Shiro was probably a victim in his first life, but he was given an opportunity for redemption and used it to double down (and I'm pretty sure the legend covers both, the Jade Wind is just what he is most known for). Mallyx wanted to destroy Tyria, and the attack on the Realm of Torment was a counterattack - the justification you give for his actions is basically a case of 'my victims fought back harder than I could handle!' He might have had some justification back when he was still human, but it is very clearly Legendary Demon Stance.

[Dadnir.5038]

39 minutes ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Eh. Everyone thinks they're the hero of their own story, but they both either had substantial negative impact on the world or aimed to. Shiro was probably a victim in his first life, but he was given an opportunity for redemption and used it to double down (and I'm pretty sure the legend covers both, the Jade Wind is just what he is most known for). Mallyx wanted to destroy Tyria, and the attack on the Realm of Torment was a counterattack - the justification you give for his actions is basically a case of 'my victims fought back harder than I could handle!' He might have had some justification back when he was still human, but it is very clearly Legendary Demon Stance.

Like I said, it's a matter of point of view.

Also, nothing in GW2 legendary assassin seem linked to faction's storyline as he wasn't an assassin there, he was a plague.

As for Mallyx, I don't remember him being anywhere close to being the mastermind of what happened in nightfall's storyline. I'm not sure why you bring the "human" part there. In any way I don't think Mallyx had the choice to refuse the transformation.

Strictly speaking, the human race in GW2 are outsiders/aliens. They came into Tyria through a gate created by the gods to escape whatever was threatening them and then fought for territory against the native.

From a general point of view, I know that the story put our side into the "good guy" shoes but are we truly? Our side is fighting for survival nothing more, nothing less. In front of us there are dragons and they are... There are Chaar who follow their tradictions and beliefs. There are Haratis who are pushed out of their territory by humans. In Cantha, the various emperor fought wars over wars to control an area where they were basicaly invaders. Does it make you the good guy when other bend to your strenght?

So, again, it's a matter of point of view.

[Ravenwulfe.5360]

12 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Sylvari are still pretty close to human. I want to see more legends that aren't even humanoid.

That's harder to do, so I can see why they're less common, but playable race characters tend to have playable race professions.

 

Shiro and Mallyx weren't among the last three. 

I think the point being made is that after having been originally told that revenants didn't care about the morality of the legend they channelled, at this point five out of seven are on the heroic (or at worst antiheroic) side of the spectrum. Shiro and Mallyx are the only villains.

Archemerous and Viktor are happenstance of fighting Shiro but otherwise hostile to each other. Kalla is definitely NOT a hero to anyone but Charr. Also the statement was edgey, edgey is not evil, just someone that pretty much doesn't have a positive view of life in general.

 

Also GLint and Ventari are not humanoid. Hell Valla can be argued to not be humanoid either.

Edited January 18, 2023 by Ravenwulfe.5360

[draxynnic.3719]

20 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

Like I said, it's a matter of point of view.

Also, nothing in GW2 legendary assassin seem linked to faction's storyline as he wasn't an assassin there, he was a plague.

His skills are still inspired by those he had at the end of Factions (and to a lesser extent Nightfall). Did he have them during his first life? Hard to say. Obviously, we don't have access to some of his more wipe-the-party mechanics like Meditation of the Reaper, but the same is true of, say, Glint. Possibly most importantly, there is at least one line from his stance that indicates that the legend is aware of events during Factions.

20 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

As for Mallyx, I don't remember him being anywhere close to being the mastermind of what happened in nightfall's storyline. I'm not sure why you bring the "human" part there. In any way I don't think Mallyx had the choice to refuse the transformation.

Mallyx was a Margonite. That makes him a human-turned demon rather than a 'natural' demon. And to earn that rank, he must have done something pretty significant at some stage, and given the modus operandi of Abaddon's forces, it probably wasn't purely defensive as you seem to be trying to claim. It was Abaddon's followers who struck the first blow. For all we know, it was Mallyx who first desecrated the Temple of the Six Gods which is what triggered the war in the first place.

Sure, he probably wasn't the mastermind behind Nightfall, but he certainly wasn't opposed to it.

20 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

Strictly speaking, the human race in GW2 are outsiders/aliens. They came into Tyria through a gate created by the gods to escape whatever was threatening them and then fought for territory against the native.

From a general point of view, I know that the story put our side into the "good guy" shoes but are we truly? Our side is fighting for survival nothing more, nothing less. In front of us there are dragons and they are... There are Chaar who follow their tradictions and beliefs. There are Haratis who are pushed out of their territory by humans. In Cantha, the various emperor fought wars over wars to control an area where they were basicaly invaders. Does it make you the good guy when other bend to your strenght?

So, again, it's a matter of point of view.

Doesn't matter what you think about humans. Shiro's Jade Wind hurt many other sapient species even worse than it did humans, with some being nearly entirely wiped out or corrupted, and the Afflicted didn't discriminate. Nightfall, if not stopped, would have been bad for every denizen of Tyria. A humanocentric viewpoint isn't needed to regard them as villains.

 

17 hours ago, Ravenwulfe.5360 said:

Archemerous and Viktor are happenstance of fighting Shiro but otherwise hostile to each other. Kalla is definitely NOT a hero to anyone but Charr. Also the statement was edgey, edgey is not evil, just someone that pretty much doesn't have a positive view of life in general.

Archemorus and Viktor's conversations have a jokey 'we're friends but we're supposed to be enemies' tone, and lorewise there was supposed to be a truce, however brief, during their time IIRC (it fell apart after their death). I agree that they're pretty weak by 'legend' standards, but villains they ain't.

Kalla is kind of important to non-charr because her rebellion was a step towards charr society becoming more capable of nonaggressive interaction with others. And I don't think anyone outside of Flame Legion fanatics would consider her a villain.

17 hours ago, Ravenwulfe.5360 said:

 

Also GLint and Ventari are not humanoid. Hell Valla can be argued to not be humanoid either.

I said 'more' for a reason. For my purposes, though, Kalla is humanoid. Ventari too, since it's somewhat more of a gameplay distinction than a technical morphological distinction, but I didn't really have a better term to use. Mallyx isn't for my purposes, since while he used to be human and still technically had arms and legs, his capabilities were far removed from what a player race could achieve (apart from by channeling him).

That's ultimately the point I'm making. Legends of a character who had a playable profession while alive tend to result in the legend finding something else to focus on instead (Ventari's tablet, Kalla's warband) or they end up feeling like they're borrowing from what could be an elite specialisation for another profession (Shiro is essentially a thief that trades stealth for more overt magic, while Archemorus and Viktor are basically a fire W/E and a guardian, and one could well say that collectively they still add up to guardian). Drawing from sources that are absolutely not simply exceptional members of an existing profession, however, allows for concepts that we probably wouldn't get otherwise.

[Yasai.3549]

10 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

I said 'more' for a reason. For my purposes, though, Kalla is humanoid. Ventari too, since it's somewhat more of a gameplay distinction than a technical morphological distinction, but I didn't really have a better term to use. Mallyx isn't for my purposes, since while he used to be human and still technically had arms and legs, his capabilities were far removed from what a player race could achieve (apart from by channeling him).

My man wants the coveted Quaggan legend. 

[Knighthonor.4061]

I haven't made elite specs in a while. But give me a weapon to focus on for making an elite spec

[Phyrak.7260]

2 hours ago, Knighthonor.4061 said:

I haven't made elite specs in a while. But give me a weapon to focus on for making an elite spec

If you make the mechanic camping the spec rather than swapping.

Maybe scepter or focus.

E-spec legend itself could be anyone 

 

 

[Kodama.6453]

6 hours ago, Knighthonor.4061 said:

I haven't made elite specs in a while. But give me a weapon to focus on for making an elite spec

Focus, simply for the reason that it is the only weapon not represented in any elite spec.

[Knighthonor.4061]

On 1/18/2023 at 11:26 AM, draxynnic.3719 said:

Vizier Khilbron has sometimes been raised as a possibility. Would be another human, though, and probably hard to link to the theme of a future expansion.

 

Eh. Everyone thinks they're the hero of their own story, but they both either had substantial negative impact on the world or aimed to. Shiro was probably a victim in his first life, but he was given an opportunity for redemption and used it to double down (and I'm pretty sure the legend covers both, the Jade Wind is just what he is most known for). Mallyx wanted to destroy Tyria, and the attack on the Realm of Torment was a counterattack - the justification you give for his actions is basically a case of 'my victims fought back harder than I could handle!' He might have had some justification back when he was still human, but it is very clearly Legendary Demon Stance.

I rather legends and future elite specs not be expansion themed honestly.  It limits the creative freedom 

[Kodama.6453]

5 hours ago, Knighthonor.4061 said:

I rather legends and future elite specs not be expansion themed honestly.  It limits the creative freedom 

For lore and world building reasons, it is better to have the specs match the theme of the expansion.

We are learning new elite specs by getting the profession taught to us from other people using it in the country we are traveling to. Like how Untamed is a spec that gets taught by the people in the Echovald, who conquered Urgoz' corruption and weaponized it for combat. Or how holosmith gets taught to us by Elonian engineers who crafted a device to harness the power of the sun, which has alot of religious meaning in the desert state.

As someone who enjoys lore and story telling, I prefer to keep it this way. You still have plenty of creative freedom, because you can still make stretches on how to interpret stuff in the lore into gameplay.

[Yasai.3549]

5 hours ago, Kodama.6453 said:

For lore and world building reasons, it is better to have the specs match the theme of the expansion.

We are learning new elite specs by getting the profession taught to us from other people using it in the country we are traveling to. Like how Untamed is a spec that gets taught by the people in the Echovald, who conquered Urgoz' corruption and weaponized it for combat. Or how holosmith gets taught to us by Elonian engineers who crafted a device to harness the power of the sun, which has alot of religious meaning in the desert state.

As someone who enjoys lore and story telling, I prefer to keep it this way. You still have plenty of creative freedom, because you can still make stretches on how to interpret stuff in the lore into gameplay.

More reason why we should have gotten Togo and a new take of summoning spirits instead of Warrior/Guardian remix. Before you say that "but that's too close to kalla" remember that Revenants are pretty much already all about invoking, similar to what Ritualists were like. 

Honestly, I have a strong feeling they were gonna Ritualist it up, I mean look at the icon. But they probably didn't know what to do with Greatsword and Togo. 

Edited January 23, 2023 by Yasai.3549

[draxynnic.3719]

Personally, I agree with @Knighthonor.4061. While having some of the elite specialisations coming from the location of the expansion certainly makes sense, I think requiring 8 or 9 of the elite specialisations to be based on the region is either overly restrictive, or it ends up resulting in some stretches being made (such as holosmith, which is intuitively asuratech-themed, but they shoehorned in a link with Zephyrite crystals in order to link it to Elona, even if there isn't much else to indicate that Amnoon had that level of technology).

It also makes it hard to introduce elite specialisations that draw from the existing cultures. 

 

12 minutes ago, Yasai.3549 said:

More reason why we should have gotten Togo and a new take of summoning spirits instead of Warrior/Guardian remix. Before you say that "but that's too close to kalla" remember that Revenants are pretty much already all about invoking, similar to what Ritualists were like. 

Honestly, I have a strong feeling they were gonna Ritualist it up, I mean look at the icon. But they probably didn't know what to do with Greatsword and Togo. 

Revenant has a similar symbol because it has a 'draw power from entities in the Mists' theme, but that's as far as it goes. It's basically GW2's dervish, but using race-agnostic legends instead of divine empowerment. The way revenant is designed, it's never going to be a satisfying ritualist replacement, and trying to force it to be one will just be holding it back.

[Eekasqueak.7850]

I actually like arch and vikky, Togo was kind of a bland character imo. I also feel like he had less historical significance than the two we got. 

[Scoobaniec.9561]

On 1/23/2023 at 6:11 AM, Kodama.6453 said:

For lore and world building reasons, it is better to have the specs match the theme of the expansion.

We are learning new elite specs by getting the profession taught to us from other people using it in the country we are traveling to. Like how Untamed is a spec that gets taught by the people in the Echovald, who conquered Urgoz' corruption and weaponized it for combat. Or how holosmith gets taught to us by Elonian engineers who crafted a device to harness the power of the sun, which has alot of religious meaning in the desert state.

As someone who enjoys lore and story telling, I prefer to keep it this way. You still have plenty of creative freedom, because you can still make stretches on how to interpret stuff in the lore into gameplay.

That makes no sense cuz Rytlock is the first revenant so hes the one to be teaching if anything.. And if they havent even met him before how there can be revenant with some different legend stuff? In fact how they are even aware? See what kind of big plothole it is? No surprise cuz again gw2 lore is.. whatever anyway

[draxynnic.3719]

5 hours ago, Scoobaniec.9561 said:

That makes no sense cuz Rytlock is the first revenant so hes the one to be teaching if anything.. And if they havent even met him before how there can be revenant with some different legend stuff? In fact how they are even aware? See what kind of big plothole it is? No surprise cuz again gw2 lore is.. whatever anyway

That's a valid point - the vindicator NPC is Tyrian anyway (a member of the Priory). The fluff does have said NPC comment about making contact with Canthan spirits after arriving in Cantha, and has also apparently made contact with Kaolai, but Kaolai is apparently even more of a pacifist than Ventari and therefore probably wouldn't make a good combat legend.

But it does indicate that there's no real reason that revenant elite specs HAVE to be from the expansion region if the fluff continues to be that all revenants come from Tyria. Cantha was probably one of the best candidate regions to have independently created revenants, but they apparently didn't.

[Yasai.3549]

2 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

But it does indicate that there's no real reason that revenant elite specs HAVE to be from the expansion region if the fluff continues to be that all revenants come from Tyria. Cantha was probably one of the best candidate regions to have independently created revenants, but they apparently didn't.

More like, it's very hard to escape "Human Legends". If the key requirement to be considered a Legend is "old and did alotta serious stuff" then GW1's Humans saturates this category greatly due to how human-centric GW1 was. 

Question is, what is the requirement in Anet's bible which designates one to be considered for a Legend? 

[Serephen.3420]

58 minutes ago, Yasai.3549 said:

More like, it's very hard to escape "Human Legends". If the key requirement to be considered a Legend is "old and did alotta serious stuff" then GW1's Humans saturates this category greatly due to how human-centric GW1 was. 

Question is, what is the requirement in Anet's bible which designates one to be considered for a Legend? 

I agree, this is largely why legends at least of decent quality lore wise would be usually humans. Though there are still a few I was surprised we never got. Talon Silverwing in Cantha, Zhed Shadowhoof in Elona, Vekk quite a successful Asura, Jora who defeated her brother Svanir and a few others like Pyre Fierceshot. Not sure they they went for more obscure options like the alliance and especially Karla.🤔

[Yasai.3549]

1 hour ago, Serephen.3420 said:

I agree, this is largely why legends at least of decent quality lore wise would be usually humans. Though there are still a few I was surprised we never got. Talon Silverwing in Cantha, Zhed Shadowhoof in Elona, Vekk quite a successful Asura, Jora who defeated her brother Svanir and a few others like Pyre Fierceshot. Not sure they they went for more obscure options like the alliance and especially Karla.🤔

It's difficult I imagine. With Kalla, you have a theme to formulate Legend mechanics around. Take Jora example, and how would you embody Jora without just being a copy of GW1 Warrior? Alliance with the wondertwins are basically already Warrior/Guardian lite, which rubs me the wrong way tbh because if anything I want Revenants to not really "copy" the classes that the Legends themselves were. 

[Serephen.3420]

1 hour ago, Yasai.3549 said:

It's difficult I imagine. With Kalla, you have a theme to formulate Legend mechanics around. Take Jora example, and how would you embody Jora without just being a copy of GW1 Warrior? Alliance with the wondertwins are basically already Warrior/Guardian lite, which rubs me the wrong way tbh because if anything I want Revenants to not really "copy" the classes that the Legends themselves were. 

I understand where you are coming from, and I agree regarding preferring the theme. 

Two examples of what I would potentially see (my thoughts):

 

Jora - focus on the theme of transformation and enhancement using the different totems of bear, wolf etc. Much like the norn totem elites that changed our abilities in gw1. As she was able to transform again into bear after defeating her brother.

 

Zhed - He was primarily an earth elementalist if I recall, but that ties well into taking inspiration from dervish earth prayers for a more control/hindering tanky build. He could also make use of the theme of resistance as I believe he helped lead his people against Joko? But I'm foggy on the details.

Edited January 25, 2023 by Serephen.3420
Typo

[Kodama.6453]

12 hours ago, Scoobaniec.9561 said:

That makes no sense cuz Rytlock is the first revenant so hes the one to be teaching if anything.. And if they havent even met him before how there can be revenant with some different legend stuff? In fact how they are even aware? See what kind of big plothole it is? No surprise cuz again gw2 lore is.. whatever anyway

You think of it in the way that there need to be actual revenants for this to work with the regions we are visiting.

Revenants are drawing their power from the echoes in the mist of personalities which had a major impact in history. Learning about these figures in other cultures is not inherently tied to being a performing revenant.

Taking EoD as an example, there is no need for actual revenants to live in Cantha. But there definitely will be Canthan scholars and historians which will be able to tell you about the alliance of the Luxon and Kurzick, which helped fighting back one of the biggest threats their country ever faced, Shiro Tagachi.

You can then take that knowledge from their culture and specifically search the mist of echoes from that time, related to these legendary heroes you got told about. The actual teaching of the skills and weapon usage doesn't have to come from the Canthan people who told you about their legend, either, since you get taught that stuff directly from the echoes of the mist you are linking yourself to.

It works differently than for other classes. If an engineer learns a new elite spec, they will get taught the tech used for that elite spec and all it's tools from the representatives of the profession. An engineer learns to become a mechanist by learning from other mechanists in Cantha.

For revenant, the revenants will come to a new place, learn about their tales and heroics, then search the mist for leftovers of these tales. Which will allow them to gain new powers.

So in my opinion, it still makes alot of sense to tie the themes of the elite specs for revenant to the specific location of the expansion.

[draxynnic.3719]

5 hours ago, Yasai.3549 said:

More like, it's very hard to escape "Human Legends". If the key requirement to be considered a Legend is "old and did alotta serious stuff" then GW1's Humans saturates this category greatly due to how human-centric GW1 was. 

Question is, what is the requirement in Anet's bible which designates one to be considered for a Legend? 

I don't think 'old' is actually a requirement, just significant enough for their echo in the Mists to be a suitable power source. Joko and Scarlet are clearly good enough according to the fluff, it just seems that ArenaNet has decided that the PC wouldn't want a copy of their own adversary in their head. More broadly, I'd suspect that anyone present in GW2's timeframe is not going to be available to player revenants, but I suspect this is a matter of avoiding spoilers and 'use the hounds of Balthazar to fight the hounds of Balthazar' scenarios.

I don't think humans dominating the historical narrative means that legends have to keep being human. There are still plenty of nonhumans we do know about, plus the potential of introducing figures that are unknown to the players because they aren't part of the human-centric narrative.

The threshold of what it takes to be a legend does seem to be lower than what was described around the time HoT released. Which is fine, as long as they come up with unique concepts. However...

4 hours ago, Serephen.3420 said:

I agree, this is largely why legends at least of decent quality lore wise would be usually humans. Though there are still a few I was surprised we never got. Talon Silverwing in Cantha, Zhed Shadowhoof in Elona, Vekk quite a successful Asura, Jora who defeated her brother Svanir and a few others like Pyre Fierceshot. Not sure they they went for more obscure options like the alliance and especially Karla.🤔

I don't think any former hero or henchman should qualify. Partially this is for the reason Yasai gave - I don't think it's a good use of the revenant concept to have a legend who is just a notable warrior, elementalist, ranger, or the like. Vindicator is already pretty close to that, but at least has the 'two legends in one' gimmick - but I don't think they can keep doing that.

The other reason is that any such character had better have done something really impressive after parting ways with the GW1PC, otherwise why isn't the GW1PC the legend? 

For most of the concepts you could consider, there's another historical character who had a larger impact and who did so without being second fiddle to the GW1PC. Kalla finished what Pyre started and then run away from, and she did it without the help of a human hero that had already defeated at least one of the great threats of their age. Despite being ultimately killed by Jora (and the GW1PC), Svanir still had a bigger effect on norn society through inspiring the Sons of Svanir, and Asgeir Dragonrender is the bigger symbol of defiance against Jormag (even if it turned out there was more to that story). Vekk is barely mentioned in GW2, while asura researchers still drool over the prospect of finding something Zinn, Oola, or even Blimm left behind. Talon is probably less important than his descendant who founded the Dominion of Winds, even if the latter isn't as well known by the player base.

1 hour ago, Kodama.6453 said:

You think of it in the way that there need to be actual revenants for this to work with the regions we are visiting.

Revenants are drawing their power from the echoes in the mist of personalities which had a major impact in history. Learning about these figures in other cultures is not inherently tied to being a performing revenant.

Taking EoD as an example, there is no need for actual revenants to live in Cantha. But there definitely will be Canthan scholars and historians which will be able to tell you about the alliance of the Luxon and Kurzick, which helped fighting back one of the biggest threats their country ever faced, Shiro Tagachi.

You can then take that knowledge from their culture and specifically search the mist of echoes from that time, related to these legendary heroes you got told about. The actual teaching of the skills and weapon usage doesn't have to come from the Canthan people who told you about their legend, either, since you get taught that stuff directly from the echoes of the mist you are linking yourself to.

It works differently than for other classes. If an engineer learns a new elite spec, they will get taught the tech used for that elite spec and all it's tools from the representatives of the profession. An engineer learns to become a mechanist by learning from other mechanists in Cantha.

For revenant, the revenants will come to a new place, learn about their tales and heroics, then search the mist for leftovers of these tales. Which will allow them to gain new powers.

So in my opinion, it still makes alot of sense to tie the themes of the elite specs for revenant to the specific location of the expansion.

But why do we have to assume that core Tyria is completely stagnant? Does everything has to come from the expansion zone? Could there not be something new (or, at least, not previously available to players) that arose in core Tyria, or some other region we've already been, but the mentor who's willing to teach the PC is in the expansion area not because they're a local or because they developed the skills there, but simply because they're part of the expedition and were willing to share their skills?

Did the holosmith need to be using Zephyrite crystals despite asura holotech being something that already exists? If EoD hadn't made jadetech a big part of the plot, could it not have been a better fit if the golem spec was asura-themed? Did willbender really need to be of Canthan origin when Almorra had already developed willbender-like abilities?

Sure, it's nice to have some specs link in to the new region, but like Renegade in PoF, I don't think they all need to. And if, for instance, ArenaNet were to make a ritualist-themed elite specialisation for, say, Necromancer, would it not be easier to just say that in the period between expansions, Canthan ritualists became more open to teaching their techniques to outsiders rather than coming up with some new local skillset that is basically ritualist with different assets and a different name?

Edited January 25, 2023 by draxynnic.3719