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4 hours ago, Logan.4796 said:

Do NOT attempt to troll me. Don't attempt a strawman's argument with me.
 

No one knows the exact percentages but a simple example (probably not accurate but gives the idea in action here)

(probably not accurate but gives the idea in action here)

probably not accurate

not accurate

You are the one with the conspiracy theories about all servers opening up so mag can have competition. You then quoted a person who is basically just guessing the system that A/Net use for populations and using that as your justification. All of this and I am the one trolling?

Nobody outside of A/Net knows that system they use for determining activity on a server. They certainly aren't going to leave mag open for weeks and weeks while everyone transfers across there. They would have some sort of figures and, as an example, let 100 people transfer and then it becomes full. The person you quoted also said that A/Net opened Mag up a few weeks ago (not true, it was longer), and then, all of  sudden there was a massive influx of people. The person then says that populations aren't calculated on a minute by minute basis and these things are only performed periodically. But the whole "everyone transferred to mag" story just doesn't work with any logic because Tarnished Coast changed twice over the last 2 weeks, first from full to very high, and again now from vert high to high. If everyone was "transferring to mag over the last few weeks" and the server populations were being calculated periodically then it would make sense that mag would have ended up full after a week because that's how long the population changes take place (using TC as an example).

It's clear that A/Net have changed the metrics that they use for determining population. What changes were made, anyone can guess.

Edited by Graymatter.4723
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21 minutes ago, Graymatter.4723 said:

You are the one with the conspiracy theories about all servers opening up so mag can have competition. You then quoted a person who is basically just guessing the system that A/Net use for populations and using that as your justification. All of this and I am the one trolling?

Nobody outside of A/Net knows that system they use for determining activity on a server. They certainly aren't going to leave mag open for weeks and weeks while everyone transfers across there. They would have some sort of figures and, as an example, let 100 people transfer and then it becomes full. The person you quoted also said that A/Net opened Mag up a few weeks ago (not true, it was longer), and then, all of  sudden there was a massive influx of people. The person then says that populations aren't calculated on a minute by minute basis and these things are only performed periodically. But the whole "everyone transferred to mag" story just doesn't work with any logic because Tarnished Coast changed twice over the last 2 weeks, first from full to very high, and again now from vert high to high. If everyone was "transferring to mag over the last few weeks" and the server populations were being calculated periodically then it would make sense that mag would have ended up full after a week because that's how long the population changes take place (using TC as an example).

It's clear that A/Net have changed the metrics that they use for determining population. What changes were made, anyone can guess.




Genuinely all we can do is make educated guessed as to what's actually happening.

Logically that guy I quoted seemed to know what he was talking about.

But he could be entirely wrong for all I know.

Iunno. Best wishes. Please don't be mad at me if I'm wrong... It's almost like religion.

You can only guess at what the correct answer is. But nobody knows other than people in charge themselves.

Edited by Logan.4796
please is a nice word to edit in
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4 hours ago, Logan.4796 said:


Dev Tracker

Showing topics and articles tagged 'population', posted by 153 members and posted in for the last 9,999 weeks.

 

153: members

Time Period: Past 9999 weeks

 

There are no results to show in this activity stream yet


-------------------------------------


You really need to stop trolling. Especially with the excessive spam. Your dev comments do not exist.

holy moly...

@TheGrimm.5624 is right... i believe its been said in one of their streams.

btw, am i the only one thinking that the population has dropped.... because the population has dropped? I know alot of people that dont set a foot in WvW anymore. Solo roaming is nonexistant in EU.

 

Edited by Sahne.6950
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1 hour ago, Sahne.6950 said:

btw, am i the only one thinking that the population has dropped.... because the population has dropped? I know alot of people that dont set a foot in WvW anymore. Solo roaming is nonexistant in EU.

You're not. Based on my personal and imperfect understanding of the system, it takes a few weeks for the rolling average to budge in a direction so it would not be unexpected to see a seasonal holiday dip after some delay. It would also not be unexpected knowing of all the mass tanking by certain servers to avoid NA T1 matches, or just bored with those.

That said, the other possibility is that thresholds were adjusted. There would be no way to tell.

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11 hours ago, Logan.4796 said:



Dev Tracker

Showing topics and articles posted by 153 members and posted in for the last 999 weeks.





Pretty please do me a favor and look through the dev tracker and cite your sources / link some Dev posts. At least one of these "16" you claim exist.

First of as usual , thanks again to the people that put their time into the game wiki. You all have done a really good job and thank you for your time.

Logan a good first spot when I mentioned research is the game wiki. This is a crazy amount of information that people complied there. Again the 16 I was referring to is the 16 posts to this thread that you mentioned re-reading, not the full dev tracker that I think I was referring to.

Either way this might of interest, the first being the larger wiki page and the second being logic when they changed how populations would be calculated:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/World

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/wuv/World-Population-Changes-Are-Coming/page/5#post5326517 

Hope that helps.

Edited by TheGrimm.5624
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9 hours ago, Graymatter.4723 said:

 They certainly aren't going to leave mag open for weeks and weeks while everyone transfers across there.

 

They did exactly that.

 

9 hours ago, Graymatter.4723 said:

They would have some sort of figures and, as an example, let 100 people transfer and then it becomes full.

This is incorrect and can easily be shown so. Entire guilds routinely transfer in transfer windows without half of them getting locked out because some arbitrary number was reached. If it didn't work on a period system, it would be like trying to transfer BGs and hitting a queue. That doesn't happen, at least not to people who don't dawdle their transfer for days or weeks.

9 hours ago, Graymatter.4723 said:

The person you quoted also said that A/Net opened Mag up a few weeks ago (not true, it was longer)

December 19th to January 2nd. "A few weeks ago" seems pretty accurate to me. You're not batting very high in this post right now.

9 hours ago, Graymatter.4723 said:

But the whole "everyone transferred to mag" story just doesn't work with any logic because Tarnished Coast changed twice over the last 2 weeks, first from full to very high, and again now from vert high to high. If everyone was "transferring to mag over the last few weeks" and the server populations were being calculated periodically then it would make sense that mag would have ended up full after a week because that's how long the population changes take place (using TC as an example).

 

You're forgetting that the metric isn't calculated by population alone, it is measured by activity in WvW, and that activity isn't measured daily either. Maguuma opened because BG kept refusing to play and the other t1 server, SoS, only plays in Maguuma downtime. The tanking got so real that Maguuma wasn't even the #1 server for activity anymore because there was so little to do for much of the day. This wasn't a new problem either. Look at the links Maguuma was getting for months. FC. IoJ. YB. Not powerhouses by any means but as far as link activity go, definitely on the upper end of the scale. If it was just "population" Maguuma would have been getting desolations like DR and SF.

 

Most of your post is provably wrong and the idea ANet took direct action to open servers just isn't necessary.

Edited by Tryfan.1457
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21 hours ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

It was a drop through all tiers, did Mag scare the T3/4 servers too? Don't think it was a seasonal population drop, a big drop across the board like that tends to point to them moving the threshold lines for each level. The only people really sitting out is BG and SoS lately cause of T1, doesn't explain why T3/4 servers dropped also.

There is a certain comm and his fight guild in T4, along with a couple more fight guilds. SBI and SF are not known for having large fight guilds.

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20 hours ago, Tryfan.1457 said:

No.

 

There was no ANet intervention at all. This is still the same stupid algorithm failing again.

 

How it works is this. The population rating of each server is judged relative to the #1 server. No one knows the exact percentages but a simple example (probably not accurate but gives the idea in action here) would be 100%-75% (of the #1 server's activity) is "full", 75%-50% is "very high", 50%-25% is "high", and 25%-0% is "medium" (there is no "low" for various reasons, some financial some psychological).

 

What happened was Maguuma opened up a few weeks ago and hundreds of people transferred in. These population ratings don't change on a minute by minute basis, they are based on a period of time.

 

Now, these people have factored in to the activity tracker. And Maguuma, already the most populated server in the game, skyrocketed even higher. WAY higher.

 

Servers who were at 80% of its activity are now at 70%. Those at 55% are now at 45%. Etc.

 

ANet did nothing. You people should know by now there is no person paying any attention to the populations (or anything else in WvW) at all. They rely 100% on their failing algorithm to do their work for them. And now this has happened. Maguuma is so big that no other server can even get into the same population bracket as them.

How does this work? Do people sitting in a large queue to get into a BG get counted as active? 

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It’s pretty simple:

1) A lot of people transferred to Mag because they don’t want to fight Mag ever again.

2) Tier 1 servers stopped playing because Mag is basically unstoppable since anet nerfed all the support professions into oblivion

3) Tier 2 servers stopped playing because they don’t want to move into tier 1 and face Mag

4) Mag’s reputation is so prevalent that new people are hearing about it - so they’re not willing to step into WvW 

Mag is WvW. They’ve taken the game mode away from Anet. Anet’s obsession with balance in 2022 played right into Mag’s hands. 

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9 minutes ago, Hesione.9412 said:

How does this work? Do people sitting in a large queue to get into a BG get counted as active? 

Nobody knows but I seriously doubt it, unless they are in another battleground doing stuff while in queue.

 

Ask EU, they were apparently manipulating it at one point.

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if you are talking that the map is empty , yes we faced two servers and red side is legit empty 80% of time , we get even their main keep to t3 , i saw probably 5 reds the whole day , sm being taken for over 3 days and not being contested , its gonna be the same issue with population , there is legit no need for people to join wvw , no good rewards , everything is better in pve , no reason for you to win a skirm , no reason for you to win a whole match tryhardring ,   and they are actualy working on it , ijust hope they do it fast because this is not hard to impliment , i don't know whats taking so long , increase rewards , give rewards at the end a skirm , give a reward at the end of a match , reward people for roaming and defending , remove the god kitten desert map , im playing for almost a year and i still don't know where the kitten should i go on the side keeps to defend , its so confusing for new players that nobody wanna brother being there unless there is a q in ebg, and thats about it.

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2 hours ago, Alsandar.7420 said:

It’s pretty simple:

1) A lot of people transferred to Mag because they don’t want to fight Mag ever again.

2) Tier 1 servers stopped playing because Mag is basically unstoppable since anet nerfed all the support professions into oblivion

3) Tier 2 servers stopped playing because they don’t want to move into tier 1 and face Mag

4) Mag’s reputation is so prevalent that new people are hearing about it - so they’re not willing to step into WvW 

Mag is WvW. They’ve taken the game mode away from Anet. Anet’s obsession with balance in 2022 played right into Mag’s hands. 

NA wvw is a disease at this point, mag is the cure.

Its time to let it go and be free my friends

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59 minutes ago, Denver.4621 said:

if you are talking that the map is empty , yes we faced two servers and red side is legit empty 80% of time , we get even their main keep to t3 , i saw probably 5 reds the whole day , sm being taken for over 3 days and not being contested , its gonna be the same issue with population , there is legit no need for people to join wvw , no good rewards , everything is better in pve , no reason for you to win a skirm , no reason for you to win a whole match tryhardring ,   and they are actualy working on it , ijust hope they do it fast because this is not hard to impliment , i don't know whats taking so long , increase rewards , give rewards at the end a skirm , give a reward at the end of a match , reward people for roaming and defending , remove the god kitten desert map , im playing for almost a year and i still don't know where the kitten should i go on the side keeps to defend , its so confusing for new players that nobody wanna brother being there unless there is a q in ebg, and thats about it.

I probably get enough materials in WvW and the only higher end reward I'd like an increase of are ascended food ingredients. 

What's missing in WvW is the lived in and open world feel. You're right, there's no reason to win a match except to maneuver for a better slot for your population if you're not tanking it instead that week. No one seems to want anything close to open world though so I guess we'll see how it all improves somehow with Alliances. 

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42 minutes ago, kash.9213 said:

I probably get enough materials in WvW and the only higher end reward I'd like an increase of are ascended food ingredients. 

What's missing in WvW is the lived in and open world feel. You're right, there's no reason to win a match except to maneuver for a better slot for your population if you're not tanking it instead that week. No one seems to want anything close to open world though so I guess we'll see how it all improves somehow with Alliances. 

 

If you want that lived in feel, then the cannon fodder need to get some wins too.  If they never win, they stop playing.  Alliances will make that aspect of the game worse, not better.

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People keep mentioning that roamers are gone. Mag. The vast majority transferred to Mag.

 

You know all those times your blob stumbled onto roamers… and killed them.

 

Now those roamers are on Mag and they kill your blob.

 

Mag is not a server anymore. It’s a philosophy 

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4 hours ago, Arya Whitefire.8423 said:

 

If you want that lived in feel, then the cannon fodder need to get some wins too.  If they never win, they stop playing.  Alliances will make that aspect of the game worse, not better.

Ya, people need loot, but that's not going to keep WvW hot. It's stale and sparse if you don't connect with that perfect storm of a map during the right window.

I'm not digging alliances, I was being a little sarcastic. 

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3 hours ago, Alsandar.7420 said:

People keep mentioning that roamers are gone. Mag. The vast majority transferred to Mag.

 

You know all those times your blob stumbled onto roamers… and killed them.

 

Now those roamers are on Mag and they kill your blob.

 

Mag is not a server anymore. It’s a philosophy 

As a roamer it quite often makes me smile when we get posts that roaming is dead, find plenty of us and will actually leave them alone so we both hunt larger prey. Would agree about Mag bringing in more, hence why I defend them, but you have also lead a lot  down the path of the zergling by amassing enough roamers making them respond to call outs by calling out first and fighting second. The difference is the roamer fights first and calls if they fail. You are teaching your peeps to be zerglings. Not all mind you, hence why I defend your actual roamers, but you have a lot of zerglings. Might want to consider that.

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13 hours ago, Tryfan.1457 said:

You're forgetting that the metric isn't calculated by population alone, it is measured by activity in WvW, and that activity isn't measured daily either. Maguuma opened because BG kept refusing to play and the other t1 server, SoS, only plays in Maguuma downtime. The tanking got so real that Maguuma wasn't even the #1 server for activity anymore because there was so little to do for much of the day. This wasn't a new problem either. Look at the links Maguuma was getting for months. FC. IoJ. YB. Not powerhouses by any means but as far as link activity go, definitely on the upper end of the scale. If it was just "population" Maguuma would have been getting desolations like DR and SF.

 

Most of your post is provably wrong and the idea ANet took direct action to open servers just isn't necessary.

Your whole argument is based on what you think A/Net is doing where I am saying that we have no idea what system they use. The part where your argument falls down is because of these two facts:

1. We know that TC dropped 2 tiers in 2 weeks. One tier per week.

2. You claim that a ton of people transferred to Mag over a couple of weeks but the server stayed open. If the window we changed each week then it would not have stayed open for more than a week.

So, either A/Net changed something or your theory about a ton of people transferring to Mag is just false.

Finally, the population of the servers isn't taken into account, only the WvW population. We have absolutely no idea how A/Net calculates that population. Does someone going into WvW for 5 seconds trigger a WvW player or does it need 10 hours? They may even be taking into account the number of hours in WvW for each player. We have absolutely no idea and anything is just conjecture.

Edited by Graymatter.4723
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13 hours ago, Hesione.9412 said:

How does this work? Do people sitting in a large queue to get into a BG get counted as active? 

Tryfan doesn't know. He/she is just guessing and trying to make it seem like that's not the case. Only A/Net knows how WvW populations are calculated.

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No, none of your criticisms are remotely valid. The fact TC  dropped two weeks in a row means nothing. The periods that activity is tracked are not a consistent duration (population changes have happened in a few days or been delayed for two weeks, but happen en masse not on an individual basis) and clearly get triggered by something. Maguuma gained a lot of players and that is a fact, confirmed by guild tracking websites and reinforced by later events.

 

I'm sorry but you are simply wrong. There is absolutely no proof or evidence ANet changed anything and the current change in server populations is 100% explainable by things we already know about the algorithms. I use "we" generously here, because you obviously don't, but was well known to most other people (like the fact the servers are relatively rated against the activity of the #1 server).

 

Frankly, I don't give a flying fark if you believe me or not, but don't come in here claiming other people are wrong when you can't even get the timeline of when Maguuma was open right or figure out that it gained people when its blatantly obvious it did.

Edited by Tryfan.1457
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22 hours ago, Sahne.6950 said:

btw, am i the only one thinking that the population has dropped.... because the population has dropped? I know alot of people that dont set a foot in WvW anymore. Solo roaming is nonexistant in EU.

Well, you can check the overall weekly WvW activity tomorrow. If its above ~1.5 million k+d it beats what the forum has defined as a week of no one playing.

If its below... oh boy. Must be only Anet bots playing.

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3 hours ago, Min Min.9368 said:

This topic is turning hostile and it will be locked. Soon 🙃 I think only a few servers are truly full. The rest are full only when ANet said so. Yep.

Apparently the server status is determined by how many hours a collective server spends in WvW. That's rough on servers that have a lot of people afk'ing all day just to get pips for wvw tickets. Or people who just run along with ppt zergs, just to be present when capping objectives, but not really participating in combat.

It also doesn't really take into account the skill level of player, nor how they are organized, etc. etc. 

I'm on Piken Square btw, currently tier 2 and next week we'll go to tier 1. We have one of the worst KDRs of the EU zone. We lose most skirmishes and yet we're on top in the match. Why? Because overall the three sides are fairly decently matched but during night times we kill the other two servers. Not all night but some of the time. And the difference is that big, that it puts us on top of the match.

So basically we will be tier one because we stomp the other two servers when they're not active. But during the day and part of the evening we struggle a lot because we have very few commanders, are not that well-organized  and as a rule and we do have a fair number of people that are just there to get pips and don't care about WvW itself. Does that sound like a full, tier 1 server to you?

Next week we'll be tier 1 and will get stomped ourselves by Desolation (they stomp everybody in the EU zone), except it will be most of the time instead of during some night hours and as the week progresses more and more active WvW players will give up for the week. But will that change our server status of full? Probably not because as I said, we have a lot of pip hunters putting in many hours a day, to get legendaries or just to complete reward tracks for specific purposes, currency to buy off HPs in OW or even just for transmutation charges.There are many reasons why people afk/do the bare minimum in WvW and it's not to participate in WvW. 

But they do count against the total amount of hours that are played in WvW and they do cause longer queues at prime time just by being there. They have a right to be there, but it's not beneficial for WvW itself.

 

 

 

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