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Can we stop the cc spamming? (warriors)


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Never 👺

CC is CmC's reward to the faithful. A boon bestowed to ensure the feckless DuoQs and balance enthusiasts that ruined this game are delivered unto judgement, and they shall forget what it means to touch their keyboards.

Use it and abuse it. There is no respite. There is no forgiveness. There is only CC. 🙏

 

EDIT: Your confused reactions only make me stronger. I was going to stunlock you out of playing the game to begin with, now I am only affirmed in my belief at your playground antics. 𝕽𝖊𝖕𝖊𝖓𝖙!

Edited by Multicolorhipster.9751
CmC whispered to me in my dreams
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If you don't want to be in the ground the whole time because you:

1.) failed to dodge the obvious windup from a class that needs to be near you to do anything

2.) Didn't have a button to correct your mistake

Then the obvious windup should just hit you for half your health.

Pick one. Either you get punished for not dodging and allowing a warrior to get in melee range of you by losing HP very fast, or you get punished for not dodging -and- not managing your stunbreaks by not being allowed to play the game. I prefer the latter personally, because it prevents people for making weasely claims that "X hits too hard" "y hits too hard" until they've essentially padded warrior interactions into uselessness, and instead focuses any of their complaints on their inability to dodge. 

Edited by Azure The Heartless.3261
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On 1/23/2023 at 12:02 AM, Damocles.4908 said:

The Warr cc is strong but very predictable...I mean just watch for the pattern.

War CC can be chained, it being on low CD on several skills....the word "predictable" should be used when CC is on a 30s+ ..not on a 12s CD on average on 3-4 skills . I am not even here to ask for nerfs or buffs....I just despise the victimhood of the warrior community. 

 

Edited by Arheundel.6451
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4 hours ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

War CC can be chained, it being on low CD on several skills....the word "predictable" should be used when CC is on a 30s+ ..not on a 12s CD on average on 3-4 skills . I am not even here to ask for nerfs or buffs....I just despise the victimhood of the warrior community. 

Highly telegraphed animations with such a short range that they can be avoided by simply walking backwards. Staggering Blow and Backbreaker have a range of 130. Staggering Blow even knocks you out of Warrior's melee range. Full Counter needs to DC reduction bug to be fixed, but anything else would be too much.

And being forced into melee ranged to do literally anything meaningful, Warrior are forced to walk into the swamp of AoE vomit that's caked everywhere and they are at the mercy of the highly mobile ranged opponents.

Warrior literally has the simplest tools and most downsides of all the professions. People simply aren't used to playing against half-way decent Warriors and refuse to learn.

Maybe you should start with learning about the inherent shortcomings of the professions you apparently have issues with and how to adapt and how to play against them, before blaming on "victimhood" on someone.

 

Edited by Fueki.4753
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2 hours ago, Fueki.4753 said:

And being forced into melee ranged to do literally anything meaningful, Warrior are forced to walk into the swamp of AoE vomit that's caked everywhere and they are at the mercy of the highly mobile ranged opponents.

Warrior literally has the simplest tools and most downsides of all the professions.

You were replying to someone who was calling out the victimhood of the warrior community..... and even for that one comment you wanted to use to refute that, you couldn't help but falling back into victimhood. That's actually amazing.

Spellbreaker is extremely strong right now. No, it's not just "people not being used to fighting a good warrior". It is overtuned right now, simple as that.

And it's also a fact that the extreme CC spam it has is ruining the fun for many players, especially new players. Other builds got nerfed in the past for being not fun for new players to face. Hammer spellbreaker with it's ability to literally keeping an enemy knocked down permanently is one of the least fun experiences for new players this game has ever seen.

Hammer is a terribly designed weapon. Too much emphasis on CC, all the damage loaded on one single ability that nukes CCed enemies hard. A weapon should not be designed around the concept of completely forbidding the enemy to play the game.

Edited by Kodama.6453
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55 minutes ago, Kodama.6453 said:

Hammer is a terribly designed weapon. Too much emphasis on CC, all the damage loaded on one single ability that nukes CCed enemies hard. A weapon should not be designed around the concept of completely forbidding the enemy to play the game.

You can blame the failed CC deal no damage balance philosophy on that one though. They removed damage from half the weapon and had to put some somewhere for it to be used. I'd accept a Fierce Blow damage reduction if the same amount of removed damage were put onto Backbreaker or Staggering Blow.

But hey, if things not being fun to play against is enough justification to nerf things, can we nerf the classes that can blind spam please?

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2 hours ago, Kodama.6453 said:

Spellbreaker is extremely strong right now.

As I wrote, they need to fix the Full Counter bug. That's literally all that needs to be done to make Spellbreaker bearable.

Literally no other part of Warrior is an "issue", so it only make sense to exclusively tackle to one part causing the "issue".

2 hours ago, Kodama.6453 said:

And it's also a fact that the extreme CC spam it has is ruining the fun for many players, especially new players. Other builds got nerfed in the past for being not fun for new players to face.

Warrior far from the only CC user. It's not even close to being in the "top" 3.

In my opinion, Immobilize Rangers are far worse in this regard. Chronomancers with ranged stuns and Well of Gravity are worse as well. Guardian's Shield bubble and CC traps are annoying as well. Harmbinger's float is annoying as well. And unlike those, as I already mentioned, Warrior's CC is highly telegraphed and mostly in pitiful 130 range.

If  you don't want to get CC'd by a Warrior, outrange their attacks, CC them first and/or vomit conditions on them. Warrior has counters that can be used.

And unlike other professions, Warriors need the CC to keep enemies in range, because they have no other viable tools for that and only melee as viable weapons.

If you want Warrior to lose CC, there needs to be done something so they can reliable hit. If Warrior gets a 200 to 250 melee range due to not having viable ranged weapons, I wouldn't be opposed to Arenanet disabling CC in sPvP. But that'd have to be all CCs, not just Warrior.

1 hour ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

But hey, if things not being fun to play against is enough justification to nerf things, can we nerf the classes that can blind spam please?

And let's not forget stealth spam, target loss, ranged damage, condition damage, AoE vomit, other professions' CC...

If Warrior needs to get nerfed due to not being fun to play against, all of those need to get obliterated as well.

Edited by Fueki.4753
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14 minutes ago, Fueki.4753 said:

And let's not forget stealth spam, target loss, ranged damage, condition damage, AoE vomit, other professions' CC...

If Warrior needs to get nerfed due to not being fun to play against, all of those need to get obliterated as well.

Which is why we shouldn't be balancing based on that metric to begin with. 

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On 1/21/2023 at 6:25 PM, Peter.3901 said:

Like, seriously, i got that its because warriors "cant land a hit", but cmon Anet, this doesn't mean that my character need to be in the ground every kitten second until he kills me, and i'm not just saying about spellbreaker, even berserker is doing that kitten now.

 

Otherwise, give shortbow perma cc too, 60% of the time the damage is "obstructed" or "out of range".

Complaining about Warrior CC spam EVEN about berserker's, if you're getting bullied by a berserker my dude, you deserver that.

I get that you're mad on Defense Spellbreaker, i get it, just stop pretending that warrior is the only CC spammer class.

Complaining about CC spam but just on warrior, while having a druid icon L M A O.

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4 hours ago, Kodama.6453 said:

Hammer is a terribly designed weapon. Too much emphasis on CC, all the damage loaded on one single ability that nukes CCed enemies hard. A weapon should not be designed around the concept of completely forbidding the enemy to play the game.

I need to stop you right there, hammer is one of the few most well designed weapons in the game, i has 3 CCs, 1 is small, 1 has a highly telegraphed animation and the other is its ONLY profession mechanic as core warrior (F1, and still looses a LOT of potential if this dissapears, which is the reason on why this weapon sucks on Bladesworn), i can say almost the same thing with double maces, it doesnt gives magic things like guardian hammer 5, its chains or as unique as hammer rev is with ranged AoE, warrior's hammer is what it should be, a good weapon for a bruiser that provides CC and good damage, you can't give any other treatment to that weapon for a warrior.

I get that you're tired about Defense Spellbreaker abusing it, like its F1 resets. Don't say that it's a terribly designed weapon just because of Defense Spellbreaker abuse, warrior hammer is fine by itself and it's what it should be.

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So real talk. I played shout sworn and it was a super broken baby build before it got nerfed a little. I got in the top 250 because it was so broken and easy. Guys its ok to admit its a broken and dumb and you are having fun with it. Lets not act like everyone became good out of nowhere with the massive buffs. These are the wow death knights when they came out and people acted like it was not the super broken class helping them. Its ok to admit you are playing something that is fun and broken. You dont have to act all high and mighty about it. I like my top 250 title, but i dont claim its because im a super gladiator. I played a basic baby spec.

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21 minutes ago, timetopat.7921 said:

So real talk. I played shout sworn and it was a super broken baby build before it got nerfed a little. I got in the top 250 because it was so broken and easy. Guys its ok to admit its a broken and dumb and you are having fun with it. Lets not act like everyone became good out of nowhere with the massive buffs. 

 

You playing a super broken baby build to top 250 doesn't mean you understand the entirety of warrior.

 

The same warriors that are here making fun of people being upset that theyre getting crit for 7 damage after running out of stunbreaks were here making fun of people pressing every shout button they could to keep their HP at 100% when Bladesworn first dropped into the game. 

 

Getting bonked by CC, not being able to respond to either the CC before or after it hits you, then getting punished by taking damage is not in the same category as what carried you to top 250. 

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Please note that literally nobody here with a grievance about the CC is offering any solution that:

 

  • A.) alleviates the frustration of getting repeatedly stunlocked by a hammer warrior
  • B.) also makes warrior interactions with their class fair and rewarding for the warrior landing any skill.

 

If I am wrong, please correct me by offering a solution as to what you would like warrior to do instead, that makes it worth playing warrior. It sounds like people are just specifically mad about getting stunlocked, without any consideration given to how they managed to get there, how the warrior managed to put them there, and what combat route if any, they'd like the warrior to take that would result in fairly winning the engagement if played well.

If you all just want warrior to lose to you, say it, or propose something else.

Edited by Azure The Heartless.3261
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12 hours ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

War CC can be chained, it being on low CD on several skills....the word "predictable" should be used when CC is on a 30s+ ..not on a 12s CD on average on 3-4 skills . I am not even here to ask for nerfs or buffs....I just despise the victimhood of the warrior community. 

 

Yes but break the chain,  do something out of the book, I'm am running dual sword and rifle core warrior and can handle them relative easily. What class are you playing for my interest 

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6 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

Please note that literally nobody here with a grievance about the CC is offering any solution that:

 

  • A.) alleviates the frustration of getting repeatedly stunlocked by a hammer warrior
  • B.) also makes warrior interactions with their class fair and rewarding for the warrior landing any skill.

 

If I am wrong, please correct me by offering a solution as to what you would like warrior to do instead, that makes it worth playing warrior. It sounds like people are just specifically mad about getting stunlocked, without any consideration given to how they managed to get there, how the warrior managed to put them there, and what combat route if any, they'd like the warrior to take that would result in fairly winning the engagement if played well.

If you all just want warrior to lose to you, say it, or propose something else.

This. Each class has an identity which informs their playstyle. Complaining about warrior CC, asking for them to be culled after their damage was already culled, and not offering up any other means for warrior to compete fairly is like asking for thief to have their shadowsteps halved, or for guardian to lose half their Aegis access for no reason other than "they're annoying."

Like I said earlier, if warrior CC gets reduced, then Anet will need to either reduce warrior cast times so that the CC is no longer needed, or they'll need to increase warrior damage elsewhere. I'd happily give up 25% of the CC durations if large swaths of the warrior cast times and precasts were reduced by the same amount, but I don't think the people complaining about warrior CC would be happy about sub 2s 100Blade or WWA cast times after quickness further reduces the cast times.

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12 hours ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

War CC can be chained, it being on low CD on several skills....the word "predictable" should be used when CC is on a 30s+ ..not on a 12s CD on average on 3-4 skills . I am not even here to ask for nerfs or buffs....I just despise the victimhood of the warrior community. 

 

You're still experiencing the 'victimhood of the warrior community' because the class has been in a state of neglect for years while having to deal with people blowing it up from across the map, and from the moment it got rewarded for closing that gap there has been no shortage of people crawling onto the forums with the sole intent of getting this new obstacle to what was originally an ez clap removed. 

 

Be annoyed by it all you want but it's for good reason. The warriors should be allowed to play the game too. If you ever feel there's a better/less annoying/more effective way to get that done, I'm all ears. 

Edited by Azure The Heartless.3261
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On 1/22/2023 at 7:04 PM, Multicolorhipster.9751 said:

Never 👺

CC is CmC's reward to the faithful. A boon bestowed to ensure the feckless DuoQs and balance enthusiasts that ruined this game are delivered unto judgement, and they shall forget what it means to touch their keyboards.

Use it and abuse it. There is no respite. There is no forgiveness. There is only CC. 🙏

 

EDIT: Your confused reactions only make me stronger. I was going to stunlock you out of playing the game to begin with, now I am only affirmed in my belief at your playground antics. 𝕽𝖊𝖕𝖊𝖓𝖙!

 

I can't believe Multicolorhipster turned the 'praise cmc' meme into canon

2023 is wild

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34 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

 

You playing a super broken baby build to top 250 doesn't mean you understand the entirety of warrior.

 

The same warriors that are here making fun of people being upset that theyre getting crit for 7 damage after running out of stunbreaks were here making fun of people pressing every shout button they could to keep their HP at 100% when Bladesworn first dropped into the game. 

 

Getting bonked by CC, not being able to respond to either the CC before or after it hits you, then getting punished by taking damage is not in the same category as what carried you to top 250. 

 

I dont claim to know the entirety of warrior, but i do claim to know what looks and feels OP and basic. Its ok to like it. People like mechanist for what it is. It will eventually get nerfed and people will move onto a new FOTM spec and claim that its the darksouls of pvp and how its sacred.  Notice how its just 3 warrior mains jerking each other off with how nobody gets how hard it is to be a warrior. 

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37 minutes ago, timetopat.7921 said:

 

I dont claim to know the entirety of warrior, but i do claim to know what looks and feels OP and basic.


Irrelevant. Don't argue on aesthetics. 

It doesn't matter if something looks and feels OP/Basic to get hit by, if the way to avoid it is the most basic evasion mechanic in the game or a stunbreak, and you are afforded ample opportunity to use either.

The only thing that matters is if it is objectively overpowered/cannot be reasonably prepared for and responded to, not how badly it hurts someone's feelings after they squandered any opportunity to escape.

If it ends up getting nerfed, it will be because as skilled as people claim to be, they have fundamental hangups with dodging and managing stunbreaks and decided warrior should not capitalize on that. 

Again, if you have a better idea for what should happen to you when a warrior hits you with earthshaker, please explain. 

 

 

Edited by Azure The Heartless.3261
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17 hours ago, Arheundel.6451 said:

War CC can be chained, it being on low CD on several skills....the word "predictable" should be used when CC is on a 30s+ ..not on a 12s CD on average on 3-4 skills . I am not even here to ask for nerfs or buffs....I just despise the victimhood of the warrior community. 

 

I haven't had much to complain about since they fixed defense. Sure there's still some stuff that could be revisted fixed and what not but overall it's kept me mostly content since there's a functioning traitline now, most of the belly aching now is from the other end now that warriors aren't much of a push over anymore. Though trying to out victimhood on the warrior community is rich considering ranger, ele, and engi community in perspective are the shining beacons of victimhood, and maybe even worse at times. I don't want to hear it.  
 

4 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

 

Question for you. What would make it feel less OP and Basic, while retaining effectiveness? 
 

 

 

 

I could tell you how, but that would also require undoing the No damage CC Philosophy :] 

Edited by Lucentfir.7430
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3 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

I can't believe Multicolorhipster turned the 'praise cmc' meme into canon

2023 is wild

Faith, kin. Faith. Doubt not to the strength of Warrior whilst it prevails. 🙏

Anyone who played the Civ series and seen how Gandhi acts in those games; hoarding all the nuclear weapons under the friendly guise of 'peace', will have known exactly where this was going from the get-go.

Heed not the whispers of the faithless. Even attempting to understand them or their frustrations weakens the will to act. Hasten the damned to their reward with what they hate most: CC. And may CmC protect you, always.

2 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

*William Wallace scream*

He raised all that fuss despite being born in a time before 70-100+ second stunbreak cooldowns. See how the faithless are drawn to treachery.

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6 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

:] 
do it.

free me.

Considering if people want to actually cull the frequency of getting hammer CC'd, instead of outright just removing it but still rewarding the warrior for landing its skills. 

-Undo the 7 damage CC Philosophy for warrior giving hammer CCs damage but not over the top numbers like old bulls charge, just some respectable damage.  
-Fierce Blow, lower the damage coefficient on both the normal portion and against controlled foes and increase the CD (6s-8s),(considering this is where all the damage is basically loaded on hammer, spread it around to other skills)
-Hammer Smash (last hit on AA) - Reduces Hammer abilities by 1s for each foe hit( The target limit is 3, earthshaker is excluded)
-Increase the CDs (Unsplit it to match the PVE CD) of Staggering Blow(15s->20s), and Backbreaker(20s->25s)
-Staggering Blow - This skill does more damage to crippled foes
-Backbreaker - if the struck foe has the weakness or is controlled(CC'd) apply 20 Vulnerability in addition to its current effects. Remove the longer knockdown on weakened foes and keep it at 3s.

Basically changing it in this way no longer makes it entirely hinging on CC -> Fierce Blow chain to get anything done since hammer kit as a whole will do some damage and if someone is drowning in stability it isn't just immunity.  Cooldowns brought up means a longer grace period to do something before you have the capability of eating a stun lock that you made a mistake in getting caught in without any tools. People that have a ire towards CC are weird, CC is what nets kills on over confident/reckless plays, especially with all the mobility and get out of bad position skills in the game.
 

Edited by Lucentfir.7430
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