So, you nerfed untangle and sharpening stone in PVE for no reason.

[Mell.4873]

1 hour ago, Mic.1897 said:

What are you talking about lol

Both the stun breaks are having their cooldowns reduced in PvE so that should be perfect for any Open World builds.

[Peter.3901]

So... the reason for the nerf is because no one is using it? I think the forest is affecting the Ranger community after all. 

 

Edited February 9, 2023 by Peter.3901

[Kodama.6453]

8 minutes ago, Peter.3901 said:

So... the reason for the nerf is because no one is using it? I think the forest is affecting the Ranger community after all. 

 

The contrary. Effective builds are already using these skills without the cooldown reduction.

These skills have proven to be strong enough to still get taken without the cooldown reduction, so there is no incentive to make that baseline.

Edited February 9, 2023 by Kodama.6453

[Mic.1897]

17 hours ago, Mell.4873 said:

Both the stun breaks are having their cooldowns reduced in PvE so that should be perfect for any Open World builds.

Why do you use multiple stun breaks in Open World lol

[Mell.4873]

3 hours ago, Mic.1897 said:

Why do you use multiple stun breaks in Open World lol

Have you looked at any Open World builds especially on Ranger most run either "Protect me" (the bear one) or Quickning Zephyr and sometimes both. 

The alternative is to use something like Untamed with Enhanced Impact while not Unleashed.

Other classes are in a similar boat but often have build in stun breaks or stability in their rotation. The go to is still to have one or two dedicated skills though. 

[Levetty.1279]

21 hours ago, Peter.3901 said:

So... the reason for the nerf is because no one is using it? I think the forest is affecting the Ranger community after all. 

 

Thread is full of fanboys who will blindly defend Anet no matter what they do. Watch in about a year they will reduce the CD of the skills and the same people defending the nerf will be praising Anet and saying it was always needed.

[Mic.1897]

7 hours ago, Mell.4873 said:

Have you looked at any Open World builds especially on Ranger most run either "Protect me" (the bear one) or Quickning Zephyr and sometimes both. 

The alternative is to use something like Untamed with Enhanced Impact while not Unleashed.

Other classes are in a similar boat but often have build in stun breaks or stability in their rotation. The go to is still to have one or two dedicated skills though. 

Why though

[Mell.4873]

2 hours ago, Mic.1897 said:

Why though

To break out of CC, some mechanics in the Open World heavily rely on you being stunned to make them harder. 

If you are good at this in most cases you can solo open world content. 

[Avatar.3568]

I Bet anet gonna Change the skills sooner or Kater, i think this is Not a Problem 

[Peter.3901]

On 2/10/2023 at 9:50 AM, Levetty.1279 said:

Thread is full of fanboys who will blindly defend Anet no matter what they do. Watch in about a year they will reduce the CD of the skills and the same people defending the nerf will be praising Anet and saying it was always needed.

At least I can say that I've lived long enough to see someone defending a nerf without even having a reason ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Edited February 13, 2023 by Peter.3901

[Kodama.6453]

3 hours ago, Peter.3901 said:

defending a nerf without even having a reason 

You got told the reason several times. You just chose to react by sticking your fingers in the ears and go "lalala I can't hear you, there is no reason!!!!!"

[Abyssisis.3971]

4 hours ago, Peter.3901 said:

At least I can say that I've lived long enough to see someone defending a nerf without even having a reason ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

There is a reason, the dev who decided these changes plays a different class and wanted to keep his lower cool-downs but not have to take the reduced cooldown traits due to having better alternatives traits. Then they decided to roll their big brained idea out to alllllllll the other classes. When they got to ranger, they decided to keep the status quo and pick cool down traits to change that won’t change anything in any game mode effectively adding patch notes!!!

[ThunderX.6591]

On 2/9/2023 at 4:11 PM, Kodama.6453 said:

The contrary. Effective builds are already using these skills without the cooldown reduction.

These skills have proven to be strong enough to still get taken without the cooldown reduction, so there is no incentive to make that baseline.

No, we need to use them even without the cooldown reduction because we lack valid alternative to use as alternate skills for mantain our dps at a decent level...... expecially as Condi build.

They aren't strong enough as of now, the fact is more simple, we lack alternative to substitute them so we would continue to choose them.

[Dithnir.4593]

If no 'sensible' person is using Wilderness Knowledge, surely it warrants a buff to make it more viable? Otherwise what's the point of having three options in traitlines at all?

Edited February 15, 2023 by Dithnir.4593

[Kodama.6453]

2 hours ago, Dithnir.4593 said:

If no 'sensible' person is using Wilderness Knowledge, surely it warrants a buff to make it more viable? Otherwise what's the point of having three options in traitlines at all?

It is used, but the thing is that it's situational.

Wilderness Knowledge is a condition cleanse trait (and pretty good in that niche, tbh). But how many times do you run around in PvE and think "man, I desperately need more condition cleanses"? The number of enemies there which are pumping out huge amounts of conditions which you can't a) easily side step and b) can't get ignored (an enemy putting 2 stacks of bleeding on me is no threat) is actually pretty small.

And that also just applies while walking around solo in open world. If you are in meta events with many other people around or in instanced group content like strikes or raids, then there are other players around which will keep condi cleanses in check if they are needed in the first place.

Condition cleanse traits like Wilderness Knowledge are way more valuable in competitive game modes, since conditions can be way more lethal there and are also way more common. And in that environment, the trait is used quite often as one of the best condition cleanse options ranger has.

[Zaret.1450]

Ok the trait youre all criing about ok? Wilderness knowledge, it reduced survival skills cd, gave fury when using those skills and if im not wrong removed conditions from you.

Now it just gives fury and removes conditions, while most survival skills got the cd reduction baseline, except sharpening stones, wich if im not seing wrong, already had a low cd compared to the others, and entangle that only got that cd reduction on pvp and wvw, ok to be clear, pve entangle didnt need cd reduction, its dmg is... at most secondary, be it fractals or raid i think we all used entangle as a utility for gorse and similar things.

Lets focus on sharpening stones and wilderness knowledge.

Right now, a raid build, that is optimized, doesnt use wilderness knowledge, instead it uses poison master, and the only survival skill that build uses is sharpening stones.

For reference its snow crows condi soulbeast, as untamed is a kind of special elite right now, and condi druid... well i dont think its better than soulbeast at least.

So, thats the pve build, the patch came yesterday so they didnt have time to change things, meaning even if they could take the cdr trait they didnt, so on that side theres no nerf whatsoever on dmg or on sharpening stones.

Now for wvw, if im not wrong the best roaming builds for ranger usualy employ longbow and are extremely bursty builds on soulbeast, and untamed, again, is in a strange spot as it is, now druid, i think druid did take sharpening stones and entangle, entangle did get the cdr on wvw, and while im not sure, lets say it took wilderness knowledge, so it gets nerfed on wvw, but that build, with stealth, dashes, traps, inmob, and a huge ton of condis needed a small nerf, so i dont think its anything huge, as for zerg play.... you dont usually take ranger for zergs, unless its cleanse druid, and even then you also shouldnt take condi dmg on zergs as we got tons of cleansers, and again entangle got the reduction so... nothing there again.

For pvp i cant realy say, i dont play that, so if youre main pvp condi soulbeast link the build and explain properly, thats how you should do things.

Im saying untamed is in a strange position, mostly because i use it power, be it pve or wvw, and im pretty sure it took teleport, cages, traps and stab for roaming, while zerg is more power oriented and raid builds dont take that cdr trait, also it still has FF  etc.

Also, now that trait gives NOTHING, fury and 2 condis cleanse, wich the changed empatic bond does too, so im pretty sure theyll end up changing the trait to something else entirely.

Again, pve and wvw see almost no change with sharpening stones and entangle, maybe condi druid does but thats minor, i mean its a stealth build kitten.

For pvp, link builds and explain

[Mell.4873]

9 hours ago, Dithnir.4593 said:

If no 'sensible' person is using Wilderness Knowledge, surely it warrants a buff to make it more viable? Otherwise what's the point of having three options in traitlines at all?

Its mostly used for PVP as a condition cleanse, you also have multiple other traits that are amazing like Shared Anguish for stomping players. 

Saying that maybe another boon would be amazing, Might or Swiftness maybe. 

[enkeny.6937]

On 2/15/2023 at 10:35 AM, Dithnir.4593 said:

If no 'sensible' person is using Wilderness Knowledge, surely it warrants a buff to make it more viable? Otherwise what's the point of having three options in traitlines at all?

I'm missing the word 'PvE' in this sentence.

In PvE self buffs like wilderness knowledge only useful if you solo. In group, you has fury, heal, condi cleanse, quickness. So you only need survival skills for damage. And for damage Poison master is better choice. 
Survival skills are selfish or control. Control is hardly used and the only selfish thing you need in group is damage.