DO NOT BUFF SWIPE WITH STEAL

[Sinister.5792]

Keep swipe as is!!!!  Its not good for this will get rid of core thief builds in game if everyone has access to normal steal as daredevil... 

Keep swipe as is!

[Kodama.6453]

Really don't understand all the back paddling when it comes to elite spec trade offs.

Their point was to make core different from the elite specs, so you still have a reason to play core. If we remove all these trade offs, as anet seems to intent to do, then there is just no more reason to ever play core because it will just be worse than the elite specs.

[ollbirtan.2915]

2 hours ago, Kodama.6453 said:

Really don't understand all the back paddling when it comes to elite spec trade offs.

Their point was to make core different from the elite specs, so you still have a reason to play core. If we remove all these trade offs, as anet seems to intent to do, then there is just no more reason to ever play core because it will just be worse than the elite specs.

Because omega "balance philosophy" 😆

[apharma.3741]

Remember when elite specs were sold to us as side grades not upgrades?

[Avatar.3568]

isn'T swipe better? i mean you can interrupt literaly every rez utility

[Vancho.8750]

I think they should just redesign the Daredevil special skills (since there is steal and the stolen item) to something completely different. The problem is that they have to decide what the kitten is Daredevil  and what it is supposed to do instead of being just Thief +.

[Dr Meta.3158]

14 minutes ago, Vancho.8750 said:

I think they should just redesign the Daredevil special skills (since there is steal and the stolen item) to something completely different. The problem is that they have to decide what the kitten is Daredevil  and what it is supposed to do instead of being just Thief +.

I imagine daredevil was supposed to be the brawler variant of thief but instead became a powercrept thief in so far as how scourge was supposed to be the support variant of necromancer but instead became the dps God of necro.

[Vancho.8750]

5 minutes ago, Dr Meta.3158 said:

I imagine daredevil was supposed to be the brawler variant of thief but instead became a powercrept thief in so far as how scourge was supposed to be the support variant of necromancer but instead became the dps God of necro.

It is always the same for some unknown reason. Always putting stuff in the elites to do multiple stuff instead of specializing into something. For example the EOD specs have condi damage , power damage and support options which dilutes them, we have 3 elite specs currently there is plenty of space to focus them into something. To that point I think the hybrid power/condi specs like Soulbeast are Berserker are fine as an idea but become a problem when you add another power/condi hybrid spec when you already have one like it is in the case of mesmer.

As for Daredevil it is just acrobatics but upgraded. Idk why it bothers me so much but Unhindered Combat does the same thing in one as Expeditious Dodger and Don't Stop like no one even bothered to look if Thief could already do that. 

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

On 2/5/2023 at 8:05 AM, Avatar.3568 said:

isn'T swipe better? i mean you can interrupt literaly every rez utility

All 5 of them? Dang. So versatile compared to just blowing someone up by instantly teleporting up three flights of stairs. Barely see situations where you can do that. 

The people who were mad their one block got put on CD while they were channeling it were whining. 

Quote

As for Daredevil it is just acrobatics but upgraded. Idk why it bothers me so much but Unhindered Combat does the same thing in one as Expeditious Dodger and Don't Stop like no one even bothered to look if Thief could already do that. 

They don't care (or don't know what they want thieves to do). (Or do know what they want thieves to do, and only focus on things thieves actually play. )

Edited February 6 by Azure The Heartless.3261

[Shao.7236]

Seeing this being a thing it's no wonder they made Vindicator a straight upgrade to Core Rev. Don't think there's any hope for this game PvP.

@Avatar.3568Swipe allow thieves to be more aggressive against real blocks. Steal is already strong with the boon steal trait because it priortizes Aegis then Stability all the time. You just can't prevent a Steal with Buffs while Swipe could also penetrate actual blocks but at least it was close range which fits the design of being good at close combat.

Edited February 6 by Shao.7236

[RedAvenged.5217]

On 2/5/2023 at 9:05 AM, Avatar.3568 said:

isn'T swipe better? i mean you can interrupt literaly every rez utility

No swipe makes s/d barely playable and d/p uncomfortable 

On 2/5/2023 at 11:19 AM, Vancho.8750 said:

It is always the same for some unknown reason. Always putting stuff in the elites to do multiple stuff instead of specializing into something. For example the EOD specs have condi damage , power damage and support options which dilutes them, we have 3 elite specs currently there is plenty of space to focus them into something. To that point I think the hybrid power/condi specs like Soulbeast are Berserker are fine as an idea but become a problem when you add another power/condi hybrid spec when you already have one like it is in the case of mesmer.

As for Daredevil it is just acrobatics but upgraded. Idk why it bothers me so much but Unhindered Combat does the same thing in one as Expeditious Dodger and Don't Stop like no one even bothered to look if Thief could already do that. 

anet actually somehow managed to make the new acro worse than the one they gutted.

 

it’s at the point where I think acro will never come back, simply because they replaced traits with such utter garbage 

[Shao.7236]

7 minutes ago, RedAvenged.5217 said:

it’s at the point where I think acro will never come back, simply because they replaced traits with such utter garbage

Here's a pattern that I've noticed with my spec, they gut or entirely remove things to re-add them back in elites. Imperiald Guard is one of the most obvious, given it literally does what I've said it should do if they re-introduced Duelist Preparation.

Devs do read forums, only discretly.

Edited February 6 by Shao.7236

[RedAvenged.5217]

6 minutes ago, Shao.7236 said:

Here's a pattern that I've noticed with my spec, they gut or entirely remove things to re-add them back in elites. Imperiald Guard is one of the most obvious, given it literally does what I've said it should do if they re-introduced Duelist Preparation.

Devs do read forums, only discretly.

Only there is no elite even with a cd even close to the skill-

the only way you could use that skill is with. The daredevil elite which is still really useless.

 

note: I’m not saying it wrong just pointing out the insanity of the skill rework

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

4 hours ago, RedAvenged.5217 said:

 

anet actually somehow managed to make the new acro worse than the one they gutted.

 

I try not to think about this.

 

Quote

it’s at the point where I think acro will never come back, simply because they replaced traits with such utter garbage 

 

Probably not. Core traitlines gradually becoming more and more useless because players dislike interacting with you [up close], [far away], or [for any reason that doesn't swiftly result in your death] seems kind of Thief's thing.  

[RedAvenged.5217]

23 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said:

 

I try not to think about this.

 

 

Probably not. Core traitlines gradually becoming more and more useless because players dislike interacting with you [up close], [far away], or [for any reason that doesn't swiftly result in your death] seems kind of Thief's thing.  

Well believe it.

 

they literally changed the dodge passive to be- you get 1.5 seconds of dodge when you click dagger storm, which gives 3 seconds of dodge btw.

 

it is utterly useless.

 

garbage that is worse that the garbage they feed us

[cyberzombie.7348]

Better idea, just give it 900 range like people suggested way back.

[Leonidrex.5649]

On 2/5/2023 at 4:29 PM, Vancho.8750 said:

I think they should just redesign the Daredevil special skills (since there is steal and the stolen item) to something completely different. The problem is that they have to decide what the kitten is Daredevil  and what it is supposed to do instead of being just Thief +.

daredevil was supposed to be evasive melee brawler, but after years they realised that if thief is capable of brawling people 1v1 then the game is unplayable for all other classes due to superior mobility, now its a thief + 

[Master Ketsu.4569]

Wait...people who don't understand that Swipe is better than Steal exist?

[Bazsi.2734]

There is absolutely no logic to this. Thief changes aren't even pointing in a direction I like or dislike, they seem to just be random flailing.
Some insignificant buffs to unused PvE damage and support aspects(rifle will never be the DPS weapon set pick, specter will never be support unless it's fully upgraded to 5 man like everything else)... and then just randomly nerfing/bleaching out aspects of the e-specs in PvP. Why? Thief was already falling behind lately. Without mentioning of incoming reworks/buffs/changes to its counters, this just seems like kicking something thats already down.


 

[RedAvenged.5217]

54 minutes ago, Master Ketsu.4569 said:

Wait...people who don't understand that Swipe is better than Steal exist?

Swipe isn’t better than steal.

 

it is near impossible to play anything correctly on daredevil besides stealthy dp or a bunker staff build.

 

swipe absolutely destroys builds like s/d and only reason it worked for the s/p build was because that was basically a bunker.

 

bursty d/p builds will benefit too

[Sahne.6950]

8 hours ago, RedAvenged.5217 said:

it is near impossible to play anything correctly on daredevil besides stealthy dp or a bunker staff build.

But is it because swipe is bad? Because currenty it is 100% impossible to competetivly play anything that has steal. 

8 hours ago, RedAvenged.5217 said:

Swipe isn’t better than steal.

for s/d thief.... steal is better.

for anything else.... swipe is better.

we are in a heavy block/invuln/stabi meta.... having a "unblockable, Block interrupting, stabilitystealing skill" is HUGE.

having a 1200 range targetedteleport.... in this mobilitybloated meta..... not too impressive.

Edited February 9 by Sahne.6950

[Leonidrex.5649]

steal > swipe untill you have to interrupt block during +1
which is more or less 100% of the time you +1 😄

[RedAvenged.5217]

6 hours ago, Sahne.6950 said:

But is it because swipe is bad? Because currenty it is 100% impossible to competetivly play anything that has steal. 

for s/d thief.... steal is better.

for anything else.... swipe is better.

we are in a heavy block/invuln/stabi meta.... having a "unblockable, Block interrupting, stabilitystealing skill" is HUGE.

having a 1200 range targetedteleport.... in this mobilitybloated meta..... not too impressive.

core thief isn’t playable rn because it doesn’t have dash. You just end up dying all the time and don’t do much damage at all.

 

also there is no good 3rd trait line after acro was killed and shadow arts nerfed just enough.

 

go ask sinderner or something- I have never seen a top teir thief player say swipe is better

[Sahne.6950]

43 minutes ago, RedAvenged.5217 said:

core thief isn’t playable rn because it doesn’t have dash. You just end up dying all the time and don’t do much damage at all.

 

also there is no good 3rd trait line after acro was killed and shadow arts nerfed just enough.

 

go ask sinderner or something- I have never seen a top teir thief player say swipe is better

Mister sindrener started this thread... asking to not change it.... because it will Eliminate the last reason why one would run core... (atleast im pretty sure thats one of his Accounts)

Id say there is no clear winner between the two. Both have reasons whey they could be better than the other one. 

But them giving DrD normal steal completly eradicates core builds, which i dont like. 

Personally i prefer swipe, because you can get people out of their blocks, and it ignores aegis. 

Edited February 9 by Sahne.6950

[RedAvenged.5217]

2 minutes ago, Sahne.6950 said:

Mister sindrener started this thread... asking to not change it.... because it will Eliminate the last reason why one would run core...

Id say there is no clear winner between the two. Both have reasons whey they could be better than the other one. 

But them giving DrD normal steal completly eradicates core builds, which i dont like.

I have no idea if that’s sinderner.

 

there is also a thief player from eu named “sinister” that I can assure you is a different person. Don’t know if it’s the same person.

 

the thread says reverting swipe is a buff…

 

so how is that proof to you that it’s worse….

 

also it’s clearly a meme thread, trying to point out that it’s actually a buff not a nerf (like most ppl that don’t play theif claim)