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Why guild wars 2 is dead


Kstyle.5829

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The people who run this game only care about money.  There is no passion left among the developers and they lack any knowledge about how PVP works.  If you listen to their "balance" videos you can see how clueless they are.  They pretend to be excited talking about "bunkers" and "supports" when in reality, besides tempest nobody has played anything except power DPS for well over a year.  The meta is stale and boring and although the fix is very obvious, ANET either doesn't recognize or doesn't care about presenting a solution.

 

I have tried making bunker builds just for the heck of it, going full vitality and toughness.  And it literally makes no difference.  I made a 3k armor 20k health scrapper and die in 1 hit to a single weaver.  No I'm not exaggerating.  Not one second, not 2 or 3 hits. Just 1 hit hit.  As in the duration of 0.01 seconds I go from full health to zero.  I fought this guy on warrior bunker and it took him 2 hits to kill me.

 

All the top players have come to a very logical conclusion.  If you' re going to die in 1 hit regardless of playing a bunker, support, or condi duelist, you may as well be able to kill people in one hit yourself.  If you can't beat em, join em.  So that's the meta we have.  5 one shot power classes vs 5 one shot power classes.  It's not like it's fast paced and exciting and requires skill to play, it's just BORING.  I find myself falling asleep when I try to play this game.  Either I mash some keys and get the jump on someone or they mash the keys and get the jump on me.   If the requirement is to have twitchy reflexes of a 14 year old kid on adderall then I guess it's just not the game for me.  But I would guess that your target audience is mostly people in their late 20s by this point and that they don't either.

 

If you get to even gold and look at the leaderboards you will see you place in the top 100 now.   Now the whole time I've played this game I was a slightly above average player and was in gold.  So if I'm in gold now and around top 100, that means this game has MAYBE 200 or 300 active players in PVP.  In otherwords you are lying to your community when you say we have millions and millions of players.  And you would have to be really stupid to believe that, because it's pretty obvious that you only fight the same 40 people or so every single day in 5v5.  

 

I've stayed with this game for 10 years, but I see I'm just wasting my time now.  You're not going to fix it.  You don't care, and god knows the community doesn't care either.  Any time someone says they are quitting the community says "can I have your stuff" or "don't let the door hit you on the way out".   You guys are just encouraging your own game to die faster, congratulations.  It will be your fault as well as the devs for driving the playerbase away.  

Edited by Kstyle.5829
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22 minutes ago, Kstyle.5829 said:

The people who run this game only care about money.  There is no passion left among the developers and they lack any knowledge about how PVP works.  If you listen to their "balance" videos you can see how clueless they are.  They pretend to be excited talking about "bunkers" and "supports" when in reality, besides tempest nobody has played anything except power DPS for well over a year.  The meta is stale and boring and although the fix is very obvious, ANET either doesn't recognize or doesn't care about presenting a solution.

 

I have tried making bunker builds just for the heck of it, going full vitality and toughness.  And it literally makes no difference.  I made a 3k armor 20k health scrapper and die in 1 hit to a single weaver.  No I'm not exaggerating.  Not one second, not 2 or 3 hits. Just 1 hit hit.  As in the duration of 0.01 seconds I go from full health to zero.  I fought this guy on warrior bunker and it took him 2 hits to kill me.

 

All the top players have come to a very logical conclusion.  If you' re going to die in 1 hit regardless of playing a bunker, support, or condi duelist, you may as well be able to kill people in one hit yourself.  If you can't beat em, join em.  So that's the meta we have.  5 one shot power classes vs 5 one shot power classes.  It's not like it's fast paced and exciting and requires skill to play, it's just BORING.  I find myself falling asleep when I try to play this game.  Either I mash some keys and get the jump on someone or they mash the keys and get the jump on me.   If the requirement is to have twitchy reflexes of a 14 year old kid on adderall then I guess it's just not the game for me.  But I would guess that your target audience is mostly people in their late 20s by this point and that they don't either.

 

If you get to even gold and look at the leaderboards you will see you place in the top 100 now.   Now the whole time I've played this game I was a slightly above average player and was in gold.  So if I'm in gold now and around top 100, that means this game has MAYBE 200 or 300 active players in PVP.  In otherwords you are lying to your community when you say we have millions and millions of players.  And you would have to be really stupid to believe that, because it's pretty obvious that you only fight the same 40 people or so every single day in 5v5.  

 

I've stayed with this game for 10 years, but I see I'm just wasting my time now.  You're not going to fix it.  You don't care, and god knows the community doesn't care either.  Any time someone says they are quitting the community says "can I have your stuff" or "don't let the door hit you on the way out".   You guys are just encouraging your own game to die faster, congratulations.  It will be your fault as well as the devs for driving the playerbase away.  

Did you get hit by the remove this class weaver?  That guys got a wicked burst

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I think the population drop started when Arenanet made the seasons shorter, the duo queue thing and the rework on the ranked system, where everyone starts somewhere around g 1 or g2 and they reduced the brackets.
The Bell curve kitten doesn't work on this game and pushing new players vs leaderboard duos doesn't work as well as having arbitrary hidden MMR that basically punishes you for playing, while forcing you to "Carry" stack of noobs vs said legend duo. Being just a counter weight is not a enjoyable experience, I can't be responsible for the noobs or leaderboard duos fun, this is probably one of the big reasons there are kitten all people between gold 1 and legend.  

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18 minutes ago, Stand The Wall.6987 said:

20k hp 3k armor and you died in one hit huh? i doubt that. what skill killed you and do you have an idea of the build the weaver was running?

Rofl, all this dude's post are clearly frustration posts followed by explanations of someone clearly new to the game that doesn't understanding what is happening

 

All his posts are like "this game sucks cuz i think i should be winning way more than im actually do"

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OP is correct, though is being dramatic about it.

 

Power creep has reached the point where a build can have enough damage to kill someone twice in a burst window (in terms of raw damage). You can spend defensive cooldowns to live through it, but power creep has given burst builds defenses and extreme mobility. If the burst fails, they just run away for 10 or 20 seconds and repeat. And don't even bother if two of them focus you. Plus power creep has given these burst builds a similar level of full damage mitigation abilities to sustain or bunker builds.

 

Anything which isn't mobile burst DPS simply isn't viable. If you play support or anything focused on sustain and live through a burst, you don't have the tools to catch up to the mobility of the burst build or they just use defenses until their burst comes back. Meanwhile you're out of defenses for the next burst.

 

In a burst meta, it seems whoever gets the jump on their opponent or preemptively reacts is the winner. That's fun for some, but for people who don't enjoy that, there's nothing left. The game started with team support, defensive side nodes, burst, mobility, decap, etc. Now we have burst mobility and everything else is gone. All because of power creep.

 

And it's never going to be fixed. The developers are oblivious or are in too deep. The most recent patch added power to practically everything. In order to fix the power creep, you'd need to do massive nerfs, and that would upset the PvE crowd who are the majority of the game.

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58 minutes ago, Exedore.6320 said:

OP is correct, though is being dramatic about it.

 

Power creep has reached the point where a build can have enough damage to kill someone twice in a burst window (in terms of raw damage). You can spend defensive cooldowns to live through it, but power creep has given burst builds defenses and extreme mobility. If the burst fails, they just run away for 10 or 20 seconds and repeat. And don't even bother if two of them focus you. Plus power creep has given these burst builds a similar level of full damage mitigation abilities to sustain or bunker builds.

 

Anything which isn't mobile burst DPS simply isn't viable. If you play support or anything focused on sustain and live through a burst, you don't have the tools to catch up to the mobility of the burst build or they just use defenses until their burst comes back. Meanwhile you're out of defenses for the next burst.

 

In a burst meta, it seems whoever gets the jump on their opponent or preemptively reacts is the winner. That's fun for some, but for people who don't enjoy that, there's nothing left. The game started with team support, defensive side nodes, burst, mobility, decap, etc. Now we have burst mobility and everything else is gone. All because of power creep.

 

And it's never going to be fixed. The developers are oblivious or are in too deep. The most recent patch added power to practically everything. In order to fix the power creep, you'd need to do massive nerfs, and that would upset the PvE crowd who are the majority of the game.

Very well said!!

 

The Op is a veteran and speak truth.

Unless you heal the root of a problem, the pain will not go away. You can hide from it, but the problem stays until you dig deep.

 

 

Edited by Burnfall.9573
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5 hours ago, Khalisto.5780 said:

Rofl, all this dude's post are clearly frustration posts followed by explanations of someone clearly new to the game that doesn't understanding what is happening

 

All his posts are like "this game sucks cuz i think i should be winning way more than im actually do"

Played for 10 years continuously and been in top 100 almost every season with every class except ele and rev.   Scrapper having 15.9k hp and being called a bunker is a joke.  Literally dying in one hit with demo amulet is a joke.  Yeah I'm frustrated, because this game sucks.  And I'm wasting my time arguing on the forums because the majority of people here only play 1 class and have no idea what they are talking about. 

They removed quickness because of 1 flamethrower build and scrapper damage is balanced around 100% quickness uptime.  So if you just go vitality, you can't be a bunker since your damage is to low to force people off point.  I'll come back when they give us 20k base health and quickness back.  Otherwise it's a waste of time to play a glass cannon grenade meme spec when every other power classes can do it better.  The only people losing to scrapper are silver ranked players who stand on the point in the middle of shredder gyro and lightning field for the entire duration.  

Just go tank your elo down and then get up to plat on scrapper see how that goes.  After 3 days of experience on untamed I was able to play it to higher elo than my main class.. so it shouldn't take you much longer for you since you're such a pro.  

Edited by Kstyle.5829
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6 hours ago, shion.2084 said:

Kstyle, try running demolished and dolyak if you want to do a little more survival.  That with bulwark gyro and stealth should let you disengage from most things after getting burst.  You can also try fighter rune as an alternate to dolyak 

Tried every combination in the game I already know the best build man.  It's full glass explosives tools scrapper zerker amulet and scholar or chronomancer rune.  It doesn't matter how tanky you build scrapper.  If you go bunker your damage is so bad good players just ignore you, and you can't force people off point.  And you only live maybe 0.25 seconds longer.  Good players in duos just run double power builds and attack you at the exact same time.  When 2 classes can do 60k damage in a second, it doesn't matter how you build a class with 16k base health.  You just can't get your health pool high enough.  

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2 hours ago, Exedore.6320 said:

OP is correct, though is being dramatic about it.

 

Power creep has reached the point where a build can have enough damage to kill someone twice in a burst window (in terms of raw damage). You can spend defensive cooldowns to live through it, but power creep has given burst builds defenses and extreme mobility. If the burst fails, they just run away for 10 or 20 seconds and repeat. And don't even bother if two of them focus you. Plus power creep has given these burst builds a similar level of full damage mitigation abilities to sustain or bunker builds.

 

Anything which isn't mobile burst DPS simply isn't viable. If you play support or anything focused on sustain and live through a burst, you don't have the tools to catch up to the mobility of the burst build or they just use defenses until their burst comes back. Meanwhile you're out of defenses for the next burst.

 

In a burst meta, it seems whoever gets the jump on their opponent or preemptively reacts is the winner. That's fun for some, but for people who don't enjoy that, there's nothing left. The game started with team support, defensive side nodes, burst, mobility, decap, etc. Now we have burst mobility and everything else is gone. All because of power creep.

 

And it's never going to be fixed. The developers are oblivious or are in too deep. The most recent patch added power to practically everything. In order to fix the power creep, you'd need to do massive nerfs, and that would upset the PvE crowd who are the majority of the game.

There's two sides to this. One is as you said. Power creep is real. 

The other, ironically, stems from the complete opposite. DPS and roamers are the two most popular playstyles in PvP. It's what the majority of people like. These same people will complain relentlessly if something exists which denies them a quick/easy kill. 

Supports, specialised duelists, bunkers, bruisers... Each have been hit with the nerf bat. 

For Supports, we've seen Heal Warrior, FB, Scourge, and Heal Scrapper nerfed completely out of the meta. 

For Duelists/bunkers, not only do these get with nerfs the fastest, but we've removed toughness/vitality amulets from PvP to ensure that these builds don't have a favorable stat type to rely on.

The end result... a DPS/Roamer dominated meta. Not only has power gone up, we've seen a steady shifting of that power towards these burst heavy playstyles. 

The solution to this goes beyond nerfing DPS. Anet needs to go back on the things they've smiter's booned out of the meta and figure out how to make them viable again without making them unhealthy. 

It's a difficult task with no easy/obvious answers, and there's a lot of work to be done, but... we do seem to be making some progress with their recent attempts to breathe life into underpowered/underused weapons, traits, and utilities. Bringing back damage on CCs and removing 300 sec cooldowns were also good steps in the right direction. 

If PvP ever gets amulets back, that would REALLY help diversify the meta again. 

To briefly elaborate on that...

Let people take the most optimal stat type for their build. Then BALANCE THE BUILDS AROUND THOSE STATS. 

This is crucial because amulets are what allow builds to specialize into one thing or another. If a bunker is forced to run a sustain amulet because toughness doesn't exist, then you balance them to be tanky without toughness amulets... No one should be surpised when a bunker is too tanky AND sustains too much. 

It would be better to make them run a toughness amulet to be just as tanky. This means they won't have as much healing power, which means they sustain less. 

 

Edited by Kuma.1503
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46 minutes ago, Kstyle.5829 said:

Played for 10 years continuously and been in top 100 almost every season with every class except ele and rev.   Scrapper having 15.9k hp and being called a bunker is a joke.  Literally dying in one hit with demo amulet is a joke. 

You say you been playing for 10 years and yet you say you got killed by a single hit in 15.9 or 20k hp, anyone playing game for this long knows this skill just doesnt exist, even if the attacker has 25 might and the other guy has 25 vul stacks I think the most powerful skill in the game will still hit aroud 13k-14k. Sometimes i see 11k hits, but I gotta say 13k hit is a rare sight

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1 hour ago, Khalisto.5780 said:

You say you been playing for 10 years and yet you say you got killed by a single hit in 15.9 or 20k hp, anyone playing game for this long knows this skill just doesnt exist, even if the attacker has 25 might and the other guy has 25 vul stacks I think the most powerful skill in the game will still hit aroud 13k-14k. Sometimes i see 11k hits, but I gotta say 13k hit is a rare sight

It's a figure of speech. I mean I died in the time it takes for 1 attack to hit you.  Weaver hit me with casted and instant attack at the exact same time.  So even though its maybe 2 or 3 hits, it's within the span of 0.1 seconds.  So it's functionally the same.  You're just being one of those technical grammar nazis

And btw in case you're new and don't know, there are attacks that can do well over 16k damage.  Soulbeast popping sic em and rapid fire with quickness up hits 20-25k damage.  But yeah it takes  almost a half second.   A chronomancer with quickness up doing 3 illusion shatter - mirror image - shatter can be done in a tenth of a second though and hits well over 20k damage.  There are barely attacks that even exist in the game that are not multi-hitting in nature.  So you should know that by default.  Anyways I'm done arguing with clueless forum posters it's a waste of my time.  

Edited by Kstyle.5829
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Sahne once writ me this…

 

Its the 0815 Freshairweaver.

He can fire of so many skills from diffrent attunements, cuz the second he crits, his air attunement is refreshed, allowing him to quickly swap to air and back to another attunement.

That is the combo that he is doing: Rockbarrier,Earthensynergy,Arcaneblast to root, swap fire,fracturingstrike,swap air, plasmabeam,swap air, lightningstrike.

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15 hours ago, Kstyle.5829 said:

If I have 3k armor and 18k hp and die in literally 1 hit to weaver, exactly how would being more skilled help?  I mean if you can get to top 100 in this game and you're too bad to play it, how good do you need to be to enjoy it. top 20?  top 10 only? That explains why nobody plays anymore.

I've played 10 years.  Reacting to .25 second cast or getting one shot is not a matter of skill.  It's just reflexes.  If you're not genetically blessed with those reflexes like less than 1% of the population is, then you can't do anything about it.

This didn't used to be a reflex based fighting game.  Over 95% of the population has quit already..  Any new player is instantly turned off by a game that requires genetically blessed reflexes to play at the lowest level.    I've tried to get many people to play and they all said the same thing.  You die to fast.  No amount of practice will alow me to become skilled at this game, because it doesn't require that. Just twitch reflexes.

You can defend the game but you're just objectively wrong.  If a bunker or healer or condi class gest one shot by a power class then there's no reason to play those classes. And a game with only 1 PvP role is bad.  And that's not an opinion.  ANET intends to have these class roles exist and yet they don't so they are failing their own perogative.  And their game is bad by their own standards.    

 

I have to see this 1 hit death.  I have I think 24k HP and 2.5k armor as a Druid and have never been one shot.  Been close tho to nade engi, but that was more like 2-3 hits and I was at really critical HP.  

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22 hours ago, shion.2084 said:

Did you get hit by the remove this class weaver?  That guys got a wicked burst

It's a burst covered with invuln, blocks, and ammo blinds.

It's not a fit for the game.

Zero risk build that does outrageous burst (whole health bars deleted from range no risk).

 

Mattias knows we are talking about him.

 

Edit: the unblockable knockdown that allows it all to delete you is beyond insane

Edited by Crab Fear.8623
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I mean Anet does have passion, they just don't have passion for this gamemode. They don't know how to fix it and they honestly don't pretend that they do. Is what it is. It isn't dead, but it sure as heck feels dead on the PvP only side of things. But, to be fair, I keep forgetting that people ONLY pvp and that's it.

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Builds would be easier to make and use successfully if they would just put back all the  amulets they removed, the only amulet types we currently have are damage damage more damage and some damage with a little tiny bit of vitality, tough or heal. Thats why everyone is 1 shot builds these days, it's pretty much the only option ,and it's not very fun. 

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