Here is a very fun Vindi build for PvE

[Waffles.5632]

 

I find this build very fun for both open world solo and leading group content seamlessly. It is very flexible and has many options for customization. In the video above I just wanted to demonstrate the base build, since it can both camp legends and greatsword.

Your weapon swap is free, so you can take sword/sword for more dps, hammer for ranged, or staff for CC/support.

 

At it's core you run half berserker and half cele, so that leaves you 6 pieces of cele gear to drop if you want to min/max. Half cele is to help out everywhere. You will see it's worth in any group content. If you are more solo, or more dps, you will be able to afford to specialize with further berserker gear etc. Half Cele is what really makes the build come together though IMO. You can use any food with this build as well. It easily reaches 100% crit chance with plenty of room to min/max to one's desire.

 

You will have permanent 8 boons on you more or less. Quickness, Protection, Fury, x25 Might, Swiftness, Regen, Stability, and Vigor. All of these boons you get by just pressing buttons and dodging. Only Quickness and Stability need to be managed, the others come for free. Because of the unique nature of your dodge refreshing all boons by 1 second, you can roll over all boons into each other. This is how you can get permanent stability and quickness.

Always keep dodging. Dodge as much as you can, but remember it's a dance too.

 

I have done strikes/fractals/dungeons/bounties/open world champs/open world metas all commanding on this build. It's great. Just dodge and keep attacking, then switch over to whatever the situation calls for.

Edited February 24, 2023 by Waffles.5632

[Anonynja.3172]

It's a fun build! Thanks for sharing. Makes me wanna see what Vindicator would be like if it had no weapon swap but gave you 3 legend slots with independent cooldowns, like elementalist attunements.

[Mell.4873]

Amazing I plan on doing a similar build but I will use full Berserker and Runes of Water. It's very nice to be able to switch to healing during any difficult PvE fight with a group. 

I will run two weapons and get energy back on weapons swap. Greatsword and Hammer for a little bit of ranged damage when needed. 

[Nephalem.8921]

Please do not bring this to group content. Cele is a terrible stat on vindicator. barely any heal and no condi damage, tons of wasted stats.

Everything works in open world except de meta where i would not bring this either. Not taking forerunner of death is a massive dps loss. 5 might and 1sec boon extension are not worth 30% dmg. There are easier ways to generate might. strength sigil or incensed response in invocation for example. In group content might will always be covered by other builds.

You critcap with full berserker without runes. you can take strength runes + sigil or just scholar runes for more damage.

Do not bring this into strikes, fractals or even dragons end please. Dodge is a dps loss unless you exploit a bug with forerunner of death which doubles its dmg. Its a massive loss with vassals of the empire.

[Yasai.3549]

Might I suggest Crusader's instead of Celestial's? At the moment, your Celestial has a ton of wasted stats but Crusader can help to actually beef up your healing.

 

You may need to find more boon duration and precision elsewhere but overall, you will be able to perform both Healing and Power damage much more decently than Cele, but wouldn't totally waste stats with kitten Condi stat kitten Healing stat etc.

 

[Waffles.5632]

6 hours ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

Please do not bring this to group content. Cele is a terrible stat on vindicator. barely any heal and no condi damage, tons of wasted stats.

Everything works in open world except de meta where i would not bring this either. Not taking forerunner of death is a massive dps loss. 5 might and 1sec boon extension are not worth 30% dmg. There are easier ways to generate might. strength sigil or incensed response in invocation for example. In group content might will always be covered by other builds.

You critcap with full berserker without runes. you can take strength runes + sigil or just scholar runes for more damage.

Do not bring this into strikes, fractals or even dragons end please. Dodge is a dps loss unless you exploit a bug with forerunner of death which doubles its dmg. Its a massive loss with vassals of the empire.

This isn't a pure dps build. I have done a ton of vindi solo testing a lot. Like... Yes.. If you want straight dps, then you're just taking dps stats+traits and nothing else. This isn't that build.

Please read and watch before posting because you're just asserting things that have nothing to do with the build or the video. Not everything just works in open world, that is such a flawed and archaic mindset and it's lazy thinking as well. Open world is huge part of gw2 and dismissing it with a one off sentence like that always shows a lack of perspective.

 

As I said in my OP, I have not only done, I have lead tons of group content with this build. I have also solo'd several bounties, all HoT HP champs and more. That is actual experience with actual feedback. The build is already proven, this isn't theory crafting.

Never have I gotten any negative feedback about my dps or my value. In fact, quite the opposite. I get a lot of positive comments and thank you's because I have done clutch things with this build. Things I could not have done on a pure dps build.

 

I have done all strikes except lions. I do not imagine this build would fail that either though. It gives a good base and opportunity to explore the class and then ease into more specialized stats at one's leisure once you learn the mechanics of a fight, which is the most important thing, learning the fight, not dps.

 

 

I want to appreciate your feedback, but it very much reads like you watched 30secs, made up your mind, and then blurted out "dpsdpsdpsdps" without considering literally anything else. Like if I wanted to talk about pure dps vindi I would have just linked the one on snowcrows and called it a day lol.

Edited February 25, 2023 by Waffles.5632

[Waffles.5632]

6 hours ago, Yasai.3549 said:

Might I suggest Crusader's instead of Celestial's? At the moment, your Celestial has a ton of wasted stats but Crusader can help to actually beef up your healing.

 

You may need to find more boon duration and precision elsewhere but overall, you will be able to perform both Healing and Power damage much more decently than Cele, but wouldn't totally waste stats with kitten Condi stat kitten Healing stat etc.

 

Thank you.

I have tried crusaders for more specialization, but it performed worse over all. Remember this is for solo and then slipping into groups, this is where Cele shines because it can do both jobs very well. Crusaders might help more in one area, but it will fail equally in the other IMO.

 

Also remember the trick about Cele stats, for instance:

Crusaders amulet = 133 power/133 toughness + 71 Ferocity/71 Healing power | Cele Amulet = +72 all stats

So I would actually end up with more ferocity and healing power with cele over crusader, plus all the other stats so boon duration/expertise/etc.

I would lose out on power, but this build already has nearly 3.3k power. I don't think going from 3.3k power to 4k power even would make that much of a difference, especially at the cost of everything else but I'd be interested to test just exactly how much dps that would bring.

I've tried a lot of stat combo's using my accessories, with my armor/weapon always being full zerkers so I'd be interested in trying out more, especially ones that push power closer to 4k. (something about having 4k+ power just appeals to me lmfao)

But that is also why Cele is a good starting point IMO. Once you're half Cele, if you want more dps, go more dps, if you want more tankiness, go tankiness, etc etc.

 

It's a lot of flexibility to see where your playstyle leads you. I tend to be more aggressive so I'm testing out flipping 1-2 pieces of cele for a little bit more damage. The main thing Cele helps with most though is the boon duration as w/o vassals and w/o concentration, you can't reliably have all those boons permanently, which leads to noticeably less dps.

 

I still think starting off, cele is the best bet, but like you said, if you want to specialize, then you can, and I hope you don't take this as "crusader's wrong" rather, crusader's just didn't work for me when I was play testing those stats.

Edited February 25, 2023 by Waffles.5632

[Yasai.3549]

6 hours ago, Waffles.5632 said:

But that is also why Cele is a good starting point IMO. Once you're half Cele, if you want more dps, go more dps, if you want more tankiness, go tankiness, etc etc.

Let's hope one of the EoD post expansion content releases some stats friendly for Heal + Power. That would certainly help Vindicator fulfil the true DPS/Heal hybrid it wants to be. Something like Power Ferocity | Precision Healing would be amazing for both PvE and WvW. 

In your gameplay tbh, I don't ever see a point in time where you even needed to heavily heal, mainly because the dodging of big hits factor into significant survival increase. You could have probably done just as well if not better with Diviners + Berserker for the boon uptime. 

Checking the skills of the heals available in your build, aside from Jalis heal, everything else scales pretty poorly with Healing Power. 

Edited February 25, 2023 by Yasai.3549

[Parpage.9867]

7 hours ago, Waffles.5632 said:

This isn't a pure dps build. I have done a ton of vindi solo testing a lot. Like... Yes.. If you want straight dps, then you're just taking dps stats+traits and nothing else. This isn't that build.

Please read and watch before posting because you're just asserting things that have nothing to do with the build or the video. Not everything just works in open world, that is such a flawed and archaic mindset and it's lazy thinking as well. Open world is huge part of gw2 and dismissing it with a one off sentence like that always shows a lack of perspective.

 

As I said in my OP, I have not only done, I have lead tons of group content with this build. I have also solo'd several bounties, all HoT HP champs and more. That is actual experience with actual feedback. The build is already proven, this isn't theory crafting.

Never have I gotten any negative feedback about my dps or my value. In fact, quite the opposite. I get a lot of positive comments and thank you's because I have done clutch things with this build. Things I could not have done on a pure dps build.

 

I have done all strikes except lions. I do not imagine this build would fail that either though. It gives a good base and opportunity to explore the class and then ease into more specialized stats at one's leisure once you learn the mechanics of a fight, which is the most important thing, learning the fight, not dps.

 

 

I want to appreciate your feedback, but it very much reads like you watched 30secs, made up your mind, and then blurted out "dpsdpsdpsdps" without considering literally anything else. Like if I wanted to talk about pure dps vindi I would have just linked the one on snowcrows and called it a day lol.

Why are you getting so defensive? His point was that if it's for openworld it's whatever everything works there, but for fractals/strikes it's utterly terrible lmao

[Ashford.8540]

1 hour ago, Parpage.9867 said:

Why are you getting so defensive? His point was that if it's for openworld it's whatever everything works there, but for fractals/strikes it's utterly terrible lmao

No that's just vindicator in general in dungeons/fractals, the celestial stats are fine because you are not going to find gear that has power/precision/ferocity if you want toughness/healing for open world, it's a one size fits all sort of build

If anything I would prefer a vindicator have these sort of stats because they wont have an excuse to switch to a Herald cause the Herald weapons are cheap and that Herald can do support stuff

Edited February 25, 2023 by Ashford.8540

[Waffles.5632]

2 hours ago, Yasai.3549 said:

Let's hope one of the EoD post expansion content releases some stats friendly for Heal + Power. That would certainly help Vindicator fulfil the true DPS/Heal hybrid it wants to be. Something like Power Ferocity | Precision Healing would be amazing for both PvE and WvW. 

In your gameplay tbh, I don't ever see a point in time where you even needed to heavily heal, mainly because the dodging of big hits factor into significant survival increase. You could have probably done just as well if not better with Diviners + Berserker for the boon uptime. 

Checking the skills of the heals available in your build, aside from Jalis heal, everything else scales pretty poorly with Healing Power. 

Yeah I want more stat choices as well. Ultimately I'd just like to choose my own stats tbh, instead of pre-determined stat choices.

As for Diviners I tried that, but then I ended up missing the toughness and vit which you can feel in harder encounters. Ultimately no matter which set I tried, Cele had the most stats that I wanted. Vit/tough/ferocity/power/crit/expertise/conc, and then it gave even more stats as bonus, but again just preference.

 

I also disagree with Cele being wasted on Vindi as I feel every stat gets use on Vindi's kit. To me wasting cele stats is like, warrior greatsword, which has no condi on it. With Vindi tho, especially solo, you're spamming scavenger burst, so the burning is pretty much constant. It's won't make or break the build for sure, but it's not getting wasted either.

However that is just preference. If others prefer to drop the condi and other cele stats for more specialized ones, go for it!

And you may be right, in that I wouldn't need cele stats because I defended pretty well with the kit of Vindi, but that is not always the case. On a full dps vindi build, fighting that eye of zhaitan I can get one shotted with that shotgun AOE he does, but on half cele it only ends up taking like ~80% of my hp if I face tank it. To me that's the difference. Full dps offers little room for error, while cele offers a more chill playstyle. I am not saying half cele is the top vindi build, just that it works for the majority of the time, and it works well.

 

Edit: Also in the first part of my video with that bounty's AOE, you can see several people go down but I manage to stay around 50% hp rather comfortably and with a heal still available. I feel like if I were full dps in that scenario I would be downed as well. Situations like that were what really pushed me to go half cele, but again, still trying out combos!

I've been experimenting with rune of fireworks and runes of the pack as well as some others too. It's pretty cool how a lot of things work pretty well on Vindi tbh. My first build when Vindi had one dodge used fireworks+death drop for instance.

 

 

 

Edited February 25, 2023 by Waffles.5632

[Nephalem.8921]

Ok lets look at numbers:

Your build: https://optimizer.discretize.eu/build/?m=raids&v=2&data=XQAAAAKyAAAAAAAAAABuAACjvLVE6Wmg81NIQBNL4yMox6gV4488AP8nWLSYg4r_YQ2uxprdaPQ75YpCZB3019Lprzrpi5wlGPy1amT7Yz5G7-KWCB0XHUq3fZmjOdhnPgTl0MKVwjjUuPFstSh6dwoka1r9QijmXrdr42kIKtmhrI-cSKDmSMt0AiGy4YeLc7WGeS4-FYlonc-rmXI_5KAREuMxmJ2rOnqB3ZnK_-_h-AA

Optimiser expected dps: 23651

Normal dps build without impact: 37028 in optimiser

So your build does 63.9% of the normal dps version just with taking a few cele pieces and the 2 different traits. Or in other words you could do at least 57% more if you use the normal build. In real world this difference is much bigger because the optimiser does not calculate dmg loss from losing death drop. It only calculates the raw stat difference from mods and gear. It would be closer to 65-70%.

It is fine if you use it in open world events except DE but do not bring this into group content and if you do expect to get kicked unless you are the commander and can not get kicked like the op.

[Waffles.5632]

40 minutes ago, Nephalem.8921 said:

Ok lets look at numbers:

Your build: https://optimizer.discretize.eu/build/?m=raids&v=2&data=XQAAAAKyAAAAAAAAAABuAACjvLVE6Wmg81NIQBNL4yMox6gV4488AP8nWLSYg4r_YQ2uxprdaPQ75YpCZB3019Lprzrpi5wlGPy1amT7Yz5G7-KWCB0XHUq3fZmjOdhnPgTl0MKVwjjUuPFstSh6dwoka1r9QijmXrdr42kIKtmhrI-cSKDmSMt0AiGy4YeLc7WGeS4-FYlonc-rmXI_5KAREuMxmJ2rOnqB3ZnK_-_h-AA

Optimiser expected dps: 23651

Normal dps build without impact: 37028 in optimiser

So your build does 63.9% of the normal dps version just with taking a few cele pieces and the 2 different traits. Or in other words you could do at least 57% more if you use the normal build. In real world this difference is much bigger because the optimiser does not calculate dmg loss from losing death drop. It only calculates the raw stat difference from mods and gear. It would be closer to 65-70%.

It is fine if you use it in open world events except DE but do not bring this into group content and if you do expect to get kicked unless you are the commander and can not get kicked like the op.

Thankfully, not only are you wrong, but I also do not have to listen to you. 😁

The build works fine. Next time read please.

It's a shame you let an optimizer tell you what to do instead of playing the game and figuring out what works best and is fun.

Edit: When in doubt, spam confused emoji face to win all arguments. I see you lol.

Edited February 25, 2023 by Waffles.5632

[Parpage.9867]

21 minutes ago, Waffles.5632 said:

When in doubt, spam confused emoji face to win all arguments. I see you lol.

Or maybe that's because you are not making any sense at all? I guess that math is for toxic elitist but let me say it again even tho you will disregard it: it's fine for open world, you can go and have fun with whatever you want literally nobody is telling you otherwise, the problem lies when you also advertise it stating that "oh but it's also fine for fractals/strikes" because it's not lol

[Waffles.5632]

18 minutes ago, Parpage.9867 said:

Or maybe that's because you are not making any sense at all? I guess that math is for toxic elitist but let me say it again even tho you will disregard it: it's fine for open world, you can go and have fun with whatever you want literally nobody is telling you otherwise, the problem lies when you also advertise it stating that "oh but it's also fine for fractals/strikes" because it's not lol

Man you guys love your own words way too much.

 

Here you go:

Quote

 

I find this build very fun for both open world solo and leading group content seamlessly. It is very flexible and has many options for customization. In the video above I just wanted to demonstrate the base build, since it can both camp legends and greatsword.

 

 

Quote

At it's core you run half berserker and half cele, so that leaves you 6 pieces of cele gear to drop if you want to min/max. Half cele is to help out everywhere. You will see it's worth in any group content. If you are more solo, or more dps, you will be able to afford to specialize with further berserker gear etc. Half Cele is what really makes the build come together though IMO. You can use any food with this build as well. It easily reaches 100% crit chance with plenty of room to min/max to one's desire.

 

Both quotes are from my OP. I put the important parts in bold just in case.

 

It is fine for strikes and fracs because... it is fine! If you're learning fracs/strikes and are jumping in, this is a great build to ease you into that content. Ofc at the harder end, like CM fracs/strikes, with a specialized group you will see better results with specialized gear. But that isn't this build.

 

You guys are really saying this build can't do fracs and it's like, I mean... I did all of the content I advertised lol. So you're both wrong. It's not "terrible" and it is more than fine for strikes and fracs. You wouldn't use this build and sign up as dps anyways, but the hilarious part is at the end of my video I even say you can swap 2 traits to become "dps" just for such occasions, like if your group doesn't need the protection or might.

 

So, please, tell me where you are confused again? Did you at least watch the video even?

 

 

Edited February 25, 2023 by Waffles.5632

[Parpage.9867]

32 minutes ago, Waffles.5632 said:

Both quotes are from my OP. I put the important parts in bold just in case.

"Basically you should swap to an entire different build for end-game content but i will also make a post adverting it as good and fine because i've found a party tolerant enough to not kick me".
 

 

32 minutes ago, Waffles.5632 said:

It's not "terrible"

It is tho, and that's just a fact. But i guess that math is for toxic elitist.

Let me say it again, nobody cares about what you play in open world go bonkers and have fun, but don't advertise stuff for fractals/strikes when they aren't good that's the issue that people have with your statement but since you will disregard it anyways why do i even bother lol

Edited February 25, 2023 by Parpage.9867

[Nephalem.8921]

25 minutes ago, Waffles.5632 said:

Man you guys love your own words way too much.

 

Here you go:

 

 

Both quotes are from my OP. I put the important parts in bold just in case.

 

It is fine for strikes and fracs because... it is fine! If you're learning fracs/strikes and are jumping in, this is a great build to ease you into that content. Ofc at the harder end, like CM fracs/strikes, with a specialized group you will see better results with specialized gear. But that isn't this build.

 

You guys are really saying this build can't do fracs and it's like, I mean... I did all of the content I advertised lol. So you're both wrong. It's not "terrible" and it is more than fine for strikes and fracs. You wouldn't use this build and sign up as dps anyways, but the hilarious part is at the end of my video I even say you can swap 2 traits to become "dps" just for such occasions, like if your group doesn't need the protection or might.

 

So, please, tell me where you are confused again? Did you at least watch the video even?

 

 

You underestimate how much sigils, runes and stats are worth. Just taking your sigil and rune choice with full berserker results already in 32.5k instead of the 37k with the scholar force impact setup.

Now if you use cele on top its 28348 vs the normal 37k. So no, just swapping the 2 traits wont turn you into dps. If you are learning strikes why would you apply a 30% handicap to yourself?

Your group cleared the strikes. There are always 2-4 people doing most of the work and builds like this are the reason why they have to do it. Solo bounties with it but please do not bring this into group content.

 

You wont sign up as a dps then what do you sign up for? For sure not heal, not alac, not quickness. Dps is the onyl thing this build can do in group content.

[Infusion.7149]

I am struggling to understand why you would run cele vindicator over cele (or ritualist) renegade, especially for openworld. I will leave it at that.

[Waffles.5632]

4 minutes ago, Parpage.9867 said:

"Basically you should swap to an entire different build for end-game content but i will also make a post adverting it as good and fine because i've found a party tolerant enough to not kick me".
 

 

It is tho, and that's just a fact. But i guess that math is for toxic elitist.

Let me say it again, nobody cares about what you play in open world go bonkers and have fun, but don't advertise stuff for fractals/strikes when they aren't good that's the issue that people have with your statement but since you will disregard it anyways why do i even bother lol

There's only 2 ppl who have any issue and both of them have made it up. It's you and @Nephalem.8921

Now, even though I have addressed your made up points, you're doubling down and literally putting words in mouth because that is not what I said at all.

Literally no one else has any issue or is confused on the matter. The video is pretty straight forward, and I have been as well. It's you two who have been mucking up the thread with "mah fractals! mah strikes!! hissss!!!!!"

 

Just now, Nephalem.8921 said:

You underestimate how much sigils, runes and stats are worth. Just taking your sigil and rune choice with full berserker results already in 32.5k instead of the 37k with the scholar force impact setup.

Now if you use cele on top its 28348 vs the normal 37k. So no, just swapping the 2 traits wont turn you into dps. If you are learning strikes why would you apply a 30% handicap to yourself?

Your group cleared the strikes. There are always 2-4 people doing most of the work and builds like this are the reason why they have to do it. Solo bounties with it but please do not bring this into group content.

 

You wont sign up as a dps then what do you sign up for? For sure not heal, not alac, not quickness. Dps is the onyl thing this build can do in group content.

 

You never factored in x25 might to four ppl. If we are to assume that in your dps scenario, you are getting x25might from someone else because you're dps, then in my scenario, I am giving x25 might to four allies. How much combined dps is x25might to four allies? Am I still doing less than pure dps vindi now?  Or does only your scenario count? I'm confused on the rules here because you keep changing them to make a point with an issue that was never an issue to begin with.

 

Secondly, PUG strikes are PUG strikes for a reason. You never know what you're going to get and you also don't always need a perfect set up or the "meta" build. Your closed minded view of "only these roles can do strikes/fracs" just that, close minded.

Notice however though, nowhere did I say this build was meta, or could compete with meta, or anything of the sort. All I said was it was cleared for strikes, and that you could specialize more if you wanted. Somehow that triggered both of you into confused emoji fiesta alongside making up issues out of nowhere.

 

It's whatever though, the build is good for strikes and fractals! LOL. 😂

 

 

 

[Waffles.5632]

14 minutes ago, Infusion.7149 said:

I am struggling to understand why you would run cele vindicator over cele (or ritualist) renegade, especially for openworld. I will leave it at that.

I am struggling to understand why you would feel the need to post this comment when the thread title literally had the word fun in it. I will leave it at that.

Edit: Remember guys, the more confused emojis you throw at me, the more power you give my posts. Who knew half cele in fracs and strikes was such a triggering statement. 😂 anyways I'm out, I find thread derailments like this to be pretty obnoxious tbh but sometimes your biggest fans are gonna be haters so it's all good.

 

 

Edited February 25, 2023 by Waffles.5632

[Eekasqueak.7850]

I kinda like mixing in just diviner's for extra boon uptime for solo vindi so I can keep myself topped up with full might, quickness etc

[Buran.3796]

5 hours ago, Parpage.9867 said:

 His point was that if it's for openworld it's whatever everything works there, but for fractals/strikes it's utterly terrible lmao

   That's not true.

   Dragonhunter is hot gartbage in OW.

   Deadeye is miserable if you need to deal with tons of foes in OW.

   Harbinger is also mediocre at OW.

   Holosmith requieres x5 the effort to rival Merchanist in OW.

   Virtuoso has similar problems as the DE: amazing single target damage, terrible while dealing with large groups.

     Most of the meta builds for instanced content are a phenomenal ticked to a wipe if you try to solo HPs/Bounties/Meta Events, since those builds doesn't provide the theoretical potential dps outside groups which deliver the permanenrt roster of boons + max vuln stacks, and that's doesn't even count that the dps ranks are extracted from  "a fight" vs a passive golem. In other words: full berserker + scholar runes deliver mediocre damage over time when soloing dangerous foes, and that even if you maneage to survive.

 

   @Waffles: nice build. The gear seems a blend ofHizen's power and condi Vindicator builds. Celestial works great with the condi variant, which is essentially immortal. For power I run gs + swords with Alliance + Shiro, fireworks runes (hate normal pace). Aside from the Assassin ear rings to cap crit chance I mostly stick to marauder, since I think that 3 stats gear provide low value. I refuse to play Jalis since the nerfs, outside Renebow builds:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmjAEZlxQmMP6k1RpMOClRSqMCqkn1kfsF-zRhYbBhJGVcCwBROHUwZkpUoCVgiPEjJ9DoeYJC4to/oFUB-e

  The condi variant is way more tankier and chill (requires less inputs) but the power is more visceral and engaging (despite the dps is low in both).  But I agree with you:  who cares if takes a bit more, it gets the work done.

   After the nerfs to the Mantras, I now slighly prefer Vindi over Mirage as the best OW spec (WB kills faster but is tricky to play).

[Nephalem.8921]

I compare it to a dps build because it is a dps build and not hybrid. Hybrid builds provide 2 or more things simultaneously.

Cele fb for example can heal, dps and give quickness. Cele fb would also do substantially more damage than this. Power builds just suffer too hard from going hybrid. Power builds need 3 stats to function properly, condi only 2.

For cele to work you need a build that benefits from most stats. Vindi does close to 0 condi damage so the expertise and condi dmg on it are wasted. Healing power is also wasted.

Marauder diviner or just marauder dragon/valk mix could achieve the same survivability with much better damage. Your 5 might on dodge are not worth more than 20% of your damage. Or just play cele ren which does everything better.

If you are ever in a situation where you really need aoe might swap to herald. providing some might and prot wont qualify for a hybrid support.

48 minutes ago, Buran.3796 said:

   That's not true.

   Dragonhunter is hot gartbage in OW.

Why? It has litany, aoe block and can pewpew tag from 1200 range.

48 minutes ago, Buran.3796 said:

   Deadeye is miserable if you need to deal with tons of foes in OW.

   Harbinger is also mediocre at OW.

   Holosmith requieres x5 the effort to rival Merchanist in OW.

Holosmith barrier caps with one forge 3 activation and has enough blasts and leaps to fullheal in a single ht combo. Despite that scrapper beats both in ow.

48 minutes ago, Buran.3796 said:

   Virtuoso has similar problems as the DE: amazing single target damage, terrible while dealing with large groups.

     Most of the meta builds for instanced content are a phenomenal ticked to a wipe if you try to solo HPs/Bounties/Meta Events, since those builds doesn't provide the theoretical potential dps outside groups which deliver the permanenrt roster of boons + max vuln stacks, and that's doesn't even count that the dps ranks are extracted from  "a fight" vs a passive golem. In other words: full berserker + scholar runes deliver mediocre damage over time when soloing dangerous foes, and that even if you maneage to survive.

Outside of bounty solos all of this is wrong. Jadebot protocols supply you with all the boons and people have soloed fractals and champions in full glass for a long time now even if Hizen tries very hard to convince the casuals that you need 50 sources of passive damage mitigations at all times.

You can solo the balthazar hp in full glass on pretty much every build with jadebot buffs now. Takes like 20sec.

[Waffles.5632]

3 hours ago, Buran.3796 said:

   That's not true.

   Dragonhunter is hot gartbage in OW.

   Deadeye is miserable if you need to deal with tons of foes in OW.

   Harbinger is also mediocre at OW.

   Holosmith requieres x5 the effort to rival Merchanist in OW.

   Virtuoso has similar problems as the DE: amazing single target damage, terrible while dealing with large groups.

     Most of the meta builds for instanced content are a phenomenal ticked to a wipe if you try to solo HPs/Bounties/Meta Events, since those builds doesn't provide the theoretical potential dps outside groups which deliver the permanenrt roster of boons + max vuln stacks, and that's doesn't even count that the dps ranks are extracted from  "a fight" vs a passive golem. In other words: full berserker + scholar runes deliver mediocre damage over time when soloing dangerous foes, and that even if you maneage to survive.

 

   @Waffles: nice build. The gear seems a blend ofHizen's power and condi Vindicator builds. Celestial works great with the condi variant, which is essentially immortal. For power I run gs + swords with Alliance + Shiro, fireworks runes (hate normal pace). Aside from the Assassin ear rings to cap crit chance I mostly stick to marauder, since I think that 3 stats gear provide low value. I refuse to play Jalis since the nerfs, outside Renebow builds:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?PmjAEZlxQmMP6k1RpMOClRSqMCqkn1kfsF-zRhYbBhJGVcCwBROHUwZkpUoCVgiPEjJ9DoeYJC4to/oFUB-e

  The condi variant is way more tankier and chill (requires less inputs) but the power is more visceral and engaging (despite the dps is low in both).  But I agree with you:  who cares if takes a bit more, it gets the work done.

   After the nerfs to the Mantras, I now slighly prefer Vindi over Mirage as the best OW spec (WB kills faster but is tricky to play).

Ty! Speaking my language!

Yeah I don't get why some people shove meta builds down everyone's throats as if that's the only way to play. I agree, meta builds only really shine in meta team comps. Outside of that heavily supported environment they can fail rather easily, coupled with the fact that they are so specialized that they lose almost all flexibility! I'd much rather have more chill builds that can handle different situations, because not only is that more fun, but it removes this pressure that everyone has to be doing within 5% dps of the meta builds like who wants to play a game like that lol. Not me!

If a Meta group can clear a boss in 5mins and a non-meta group takes 7mins, just like you said! Who cares! The work is still done!

And yes! It is a bit of hybrid from Hizen's build. I was originally going to try my own take on a condi version as well, but I just love greatsword too much. However I do agree, the condi variant from hizen is both basically immortal and very chill to play! I mean that solo he did of mushroom queen said it all for me. Wow. That build is something else.

For me tho, it's like you said, that visceral feeling of greatsword just too good. The hits feel heavy, I love using GS5 all the time, and I love when the spear hits for 20k+ damage. Condi just doesn't give you that same sense of weight and power.

 

It's super funny too because I have been preferring Vindi over Mirage as well, especially for OW content. I have not tried out WB yet but that has been on my radar, hahahahaha because you're right again, it is very tricky to play, so I have been staying away from it. 😅

I have a feeling it will be a very solid pick soon though because of the most recent buffs to it's virtues no longer overwriting each other.

 

My old vindi build ran fireworks too! My top 3 sets are fireworks/pack/eagle just because of how Vindi can interact with those runes. I've found it hard to choose other sets but I do want to try out a vindi build with leadership runes like Hizen, because that looked like a pretty cool synergy.

Right now I like the eagle runes because it's a lot of damage and secures me with 100% crit, however eagle runes are kinda like scholar, they're just so boring. I tend to like interactive rune set ups more but that's just my preference.

 

Edit: Someone spammed confused face emoji on like 4 of my posts here just now. lmfaooo keep 'em coming guys! I am sorry half cele builds confuse you but there are other ways to play than meta dps!

Edited February 26, 2023 by Waffles.5632

[Obtena.7952]

Hi @Waffles.5632

Thanks for sharing your build and expressing your views on how to play the game. Please continue to play how you want. It's how the game was meant to be played. It's nice to see people talking about using builds that DON'T push a meta position. 

Edited February 26, 2023 by Obtena.7952