The new chapter is just 1h of story?

[Freya.9075]

1 minute ago, DarcShriek.5829 said:

How many episodes did you pay for?  There was no guarantee.  You only assumed something more would be included.  Therefore, do did not pay for these.  These are free, and you are not entitled to this or any other episodes for purchasing EoD.

I did not expect "free episodes" nor do I feel there is a guarantee or expect a certain amount of episodes with eod purchase. I do not assume something more will be added either. I would have no issue paying for these episodes like I paid for most living world episodes since I am not a veteran player. I simply stated what Anet has told about future episode releases and expansions.

Which means if you do buy an expansion (starting with eod) the content between the expansions will be included in the purchase. Whatever that is. Which means you already paid for said content. And that was the point. This is a change they added after eod was released. So I wouldn't know if someone expected anything when buying it. I certainly did not.

With living world being free on release before, some players may have expected it to be free anyway, but with their change, new players do not have to pay extra for these episodes in the future. Which is a nice change for these players.

[DarcShriek.5829]

1 hour ago, Freya.9075 said:

I did not expect "free episodes" nor do I feel there is a guarantee or expect a certain amount of episodes with eod purchase. I do not assume something more will be added either. I would have no issue paying for these episodes like I paid for most living world episodes since I am not a veteran player. I simply stated what Anet has told about future episode releases and expansions.

Which means if you do buy an expansion (starting with eod) the content between the expansions will be included in the purchase. Whatever that is. Which means you already paid for said content. And that was the point. This is a change they added after eod was released. So I wouldn't know if someone expected anything when buying it. I certainly did not.

With living world being free on release before, some players may have expected it to be free anyway, but with their change, new players do not have to pay extra for these episodes in the future. Which is a nice change for these players.

So despite the fact that Anet has never promised you would get this for your purchased of EoD, you feel it was.  Hey, if your willing to pay for things you may or may not receive, is there anything I can sell you?  I like to sell things to people that don't expect anything for their money.

[Ashantara.8731]

The chapter starts out well: your interest is being peaked, then you have a really nice build-up of suspense... but once you head into the cave system, it is being rushed into a completely anticlimatic direction with a likewise anticlimatic fight.

Can we get proper story-telling again for a change? Like in Season 4?

And perhaps with achievements that are not bugged and make you lose interest to spend time on the content?
 

Edited March 4, 2023 by Ashantara.8731

[Freya.9075]

1 hour ago, DarcShriek.5829 said:

So despite the fact that Anet has never promised you would get this for your purchased of EoD, you feel it was.  Hey, if your willing to pay for things you may or may not receive, is there anything I can sell you?  I like to sell things to people that don't expect anything for their money.

Not sure why you think this has anything to do with what I said. If they release new content, I got no issues paying for it. When did I say I would pay before it’s released and not knowing if or when it would be? 

Edited March 4, 2023 by Freya.9075

[Holgarf.6581]

3 hours ago, DarcShriek.5829 said:

How many episodes did you pay for?  There was no guarantee.  You only assumed something more would be included.  Therefore, do did not pay for these.  These are free, and you are not entitled to this or any other episodes for purchasing EoD.

This is bizarre biased reasoning stemming from a love for a company that makes the game you've sunk thousands of hours into - naturally you're going to defend it because to not do so would invite ridicule by others who've done the same and doing that would conflict with the time and money you've spent on it. People do this with everything... it's a very primitive defensive trait (and an annoying one too) and it blinds people - blind bias is a terrible thing. These people can't invest in something and have rational opinions at the same time, or at least see from another's point of view, which you'd expect most people to be capable of, but no.

When I hear people complain about the excessive monetisation (and I've been one of them in the past), the excuse/argument from the community was always: it's paying staff wages and supporting content development for the game. So... we've passed that point now? Now we're just being entitled? If people have to wait an excessive amount of time for 1 hour of content, you can't honestly - with a straight face - back a company that is raking in a lot of money, working at the pace they do, to deliver said 1 hour worth of content and then use the excuses you do on behalf of ArenaNet. It's this kind of silly behaviour why games companies fall down the pan, because there's far too many people defending them for questionable practices that it eventually becomes the norm.

Look at prior content to what is delivered now on the the timescale it has been worked on, and tell me that that is perfectly reasonable? But I'm in the echo chamber (the circle j.....) so it's like throwing reason at the indoctrinated - and that never works, with any topic or discussion. You can expect better from a company you're giving money to, it's not going to harm you. You also get nothing for fighting on their behalf.

I expected some kind of LW or Episodic content at a reasonable timescale... since we're "supporting" ArenaNet with our purchases, that shouldn't stop once we've forked out £50-70 for End of Dragons, which, dare I say it, was hugely underwhelming, very short, the maps were dire and unpopulated and recycled an awful lot of prior ideas, the world events are boring, and after a couple of months most of the maps were abandoned entirely for anything but the timed metas. Also, the living world  / filler events in said maps are short, unvaried, repetitive and cycle too soon because there is a lack of variety in other areas.

Now, I expected more for my purchase, and while I understand outside of the (short) expansion, to expect more for nothing is a a bonus, that said, there's a reason there is a gem store and a lot of people dumping huge amounts of money into the game, otherwise at this point Anet may as well get rid of their development team and move the rest to skin designs for the store, if we're not entitled to anything else for supposedly *supporting* them - pocket backfilling and server maintenance only? And if you do happen to get anything extra, you best be grateful *points menacingly* because your money apparently didn't mean kitten for future story/episodic creation.

That's a bit much to ask isn't it? Monetise everything around you, hide behind the guise of *optional* purchases and change the reasoning of every argument to spin it in a certain way to defend a company that has done relatively little with the time and resources it has.

Feel free to hit the laugh reactions >

[vares.8457]

I actually think shorter stories are good. Story missions are never challenging or interesting content, they are a chore. There is no good storytelling in video games, read a book if you want a good story. 

[Holgarf.6581]

25 minutes ago, vares.8457 said:

I actually think shorter stories are good. Story missions are never challenging or interesting content, they are a chore. There is no good storytelling in video games, read a book if you want a good story. 

My mind is spinning right now at this comment. Guild Wars should have just been a bunch of open maps with no lore then. K.

Longer stories and other content are good because people don't have to rush them. You can do it bit by bit. People can do more of it and still feel content, or less if they have less time and come back. If it's only very short stories and tiny chunks of content, it's a win for a very select few and a disappointment for those who run out. Think logically.

Edit: How can you be "confused". Good grief. A, B, C, D, E F, G... come on guys, it's not difficult to get your head around.

Edited March 4, 2023 by Holgarf.6581
People are confused over simple things.

[vares.8457]

24 minutes ago, Holgarf.6581 said:

Guild Wars should have just been a bunch of open maps with no lore then.

I did not write that. But it’s just wrong to expect good stories in video games. And not everyone likes doing story missions, because they are mostly pretty boring and not really a challenge. So for me a short story is a good story, then I have more time to do the stuff I like. 

[Freya.9075]

50 minutes ago, Holgarf.6581 said:

This is bizarre biased reasoning stemming from a love for a company that makes the game you've sunk thousands of hours into - naturally you're going to defend it because to not do so would invite ridicule by others who've done the same and doing that would conflict with the time and money you've spent on it. People do this with everything... it's a very primitive defensive trait (and an annoying one too) and it blinds people - blind bias is a terrible thing. These people can't invest in something and have rational opinions at the same time, or at least see from another's point of view, which you'd expect most people to be capable of, but no.

When I hear people complain about the excessive monetisation (and I've been one of them in the past), the excuse/argument from the community was always: it's paying staff wages and supporting content development for the game. So... we've passed that point now? Now we're just being entitled? If people have to wait an excessive amount of time for 1 hour of content, you can't honestly - with a straight face - back a company that is raking in a lot of money, working at the pace they do, to deliver said 1 hour worth of content and then use the excuses you do on behalf of ArenaNet. It's this kind of silly behaviour why games companies fall down the pan, because there's far too many people defending them for questionable practices that it eventually becomes the norm.

Look at prior content to what is delivered now on the the timescale it has been worked on, and tell me that that is perfectly reasonable? But I'm in the echo chamber (the circle j.....) so it's like throwing reason at the indoctrinated - and that never works, with any topic or discussion. You can expect better from a company you're giving money to, it's not going to harm you. You also get nothing for fighting on their behalf.

I expected some kind of LW or Episodic content at a reasonable timescale... since we're "supporting" ArenaNet with our purchases, that shouldn't stop once we've forked out £50-70 for End of Dragons, which, dare I say it, was hugely underwhelming, very short, the maps were dire and unpopulated and recycled an awful lot of prior ideas, the world events are boring, and after a couple of months most of the maps were abandoned entirely for anything but the timed metas. Also, the living world  / filler events in said maps are short, unvaried, repetitive and cycle too soon because there is a lack of variety in other areas.

Now, I expected more for my purchase, and while I understand outside of the (short) expansion, to expect more for nothing is a a bonus, that said, there's a reason there is a gem store and a lot of people dumping huge amounts of money into the game, otherwise at this point Anet may as well get rid of their development team and move the rest to skin designs for the store, if we're not entitled to anything else for supposedly *supporting* them - pocket backfilling and server maintenance only? And if you do happen to get anything extra, you best be grateful *points menacingly* because your money apparently didn't mean kitten for future story/episodic creation.

That's a bit much to ask isn't it? Monetise everything around you, hide behind the guise of *optional* purchases and change the reasoning of every argument to spin it in a certain way to defend a company that has done relatively little with the time and resources it has.

Feel free to hit the laugh reactions >

I’m curious. Do you have knowledge about anets profit after all the expenses are paid? Do you expect a business to not make money from their work? 
 

Accepting a game for what it is and enjoy it for what it is, is different than blindly say you love everything about the game and that everything is fine and nothing should be changed and blah blah. I rarely see anyone here do the latter. I see players talking about their opinions and discuss many topics. In good and bad ways. And most of the forum users that defend certain topics  also criticize the game and suggest changes they would want to see. That’s not blindly following a company. It’s being realistic. And main part, all forum users have feelings towards the game. The people who criticize the game wants the game to be better because they love the game. Same goes for people who defend the game when they feel the criticism is unwarranted. 
 

The way you talk about anets business model and players seeing things differently then you is quite ironic. You’re free to feel however you feel about the game, but so are all the other people here.

[Holgarf.6581]

15 minutes ago, vares.8457 said:

I did not write that. But it’s just wrong to expect good stories in video games. And not everyone likes doing story missions, because they are mostly pretty boring and not really a challenge. So for me a short story is a good story, then I have more time to do the stuff I like. 

I know, but that's what it sounded like. I'd prefer more LW stuff over story missions but you need some story in there. We're basically going to be paying for Living World updates now with their new release schedule and since it'll be, more frequent and at a "slightly reduced price" to expansions, it makes a lot more money for ArenaNet. GW2 is turning into a lot of other games in that frequent updates mean you get no in-between so it's 100% GW2 and you can't do kitten all else with your time (especially if you're working). I don't like that. Lmao wouldn't be surprised if a year from now they release a battle pass. A far cry from the wonders of GW1. I might have to go revisit GW1 before they get any funny ideas.

[Einsof.1457]

5 hours ago, Ruisenior.6342 said:

For me the peak of gw2 was hot in terms of story, maps and gameplay/mechanics. And i have to add that i hated the new specs because they outshined core classes by a mile. As much as it hurts me, i think eod will be my last purchase.

Don't take it seriously and it's more fun 

[Holgarf.6581]

59 minutes ago, Freya.9075 said:

I’m curious. Do you have knowledge about anets profit after all the expenses are paid? Do you expect a business to not make money from their work? 
 

Accepting a game for what it is and enjoy it for what it is, is different than blindly say you love everything about the game and that everything is fine and nothing should be changed and blah blah. I rarely see anyone here do the latter. I see players talking about their opinions and discuss many topics. In good and bad ways. And most of the forum users that defend certain topics  also criticize the game and suggest changes they would want to see. That’s not blindly following a company. It’s being realistic. And main part, all forum users have feelings towards the game. The people who criticize the game wants the game to be better because they love the game. Same goes for people who defend the game when they feel the criticism is unwarranted. 
 

The way you talk about anets business model and players seeing things differently then you is quite ironic. You’re free to feel however you feel about the game, but so are all the other people here.

I read the first line or so and switched off and ignored the rest - sorry, but there are too many people who blindly follow a company and defend every decision they make - the gaming scene has always been like that. Yes, ArenaNet and other businesses make money and businesses are allowed to, within reason, but when they're making plenty of profit (you can see what they make - you have a search function on your browser dear) you'd expect more for what you're apparently supporting, unless that support just meant more skin development, which is an unending loop of mediocrity for elevated cost and no way for other players to disable the visual eye-sores without bottoming out NPCs too. For some people here, additional purchases which ArenaNet thanks as support is now considered ENTITLEMENT if any content falls outside of an official expansion release window, and you'd best be happy with it, while others say regardless of how much Anet make that's not enough and you should be grateful otherwise you'll be fought by others.

You watch this mess unfold with the more frequent smaller updates at a "slightly reduced cost" to the consumer, which actually earns them even more while costing us more and giving us less. But cool cool, businesses are entitled to make as much money as they want, you're right of course.

I'm still waiting for 100s of bug fixes (the only rival to ArenaNet for lack of bug fixes is Bethesda) and not the silly excuses like "who plays old content?" as a justification for old Tyrian content not being fixed and thus completely missing the point, still waiting for a significant increase of free QoL that has been lacking significantly over a decade now, a DX11 bloom bug fix, colour-blind support, better UI (namely text) scaling, finishing SAB, and not requiring the need to make several builds per game mode per character for each and every variant of content: raids, fractals, dungeons, metas, WvW, farming, strike missions, raids, etc. It's far too excessive and absurd and it's done to encourage build and equipment slots sales, gold sales for TP trades (for those who're time limited or reasonably impatient since you can't traditionally farm like in other MMOs), etc, etc, yada, yada, yada. All WvW content should be set stats, as sPVP is and it might actually encourage more people to play the kitten thing. A contribution meter, like in HoT, added to every map? A reason to contribute to Living World and open map events. Tackling the rampant bot problem? I could go on and on...  every avenue of this game is not about experience but the best possible way of extracting as much money out as possible without being associated with the behaviours and tactics of other MMO companies... but, people are beginning to notice.

I'd quite happily pay £20 - £30 a month for a MMO experience with no store, bug fixes, polish, and fewer content updates even, but this is fantasy land and that era of earning reasonable money and providing a service is long gone. In most games, especially GW2 people spend £17 on a skin or RNG crates and watch as Anet scratch their backsides and release a slither of content 6-12 months later and that's supposed to be perfectly acceptable? "Thanks for your support" *?* This is excluding actual content releases with their own price tags. Multiply this by the playerbase. Sometimes Fashion Wars 2 as endgame is really not enough. The endgame may as well be stuffing as much disposable income into the backpocket of ArenaNet bosses as possible if that is the case.

Remember the 1600 bot skin that appears for 2s? Just a little hint of where this company is headed. Should GW3 ever come to exist you can say goodbye to what you think you know about ArenaNet and how the GW2 experience is compared to it's rivals because it will be a completely different thirsty experience.

I look forward to some more bug fixes and QoL in the next decade. That's where my support money went.

Oh one other thing: nerfing every class into the ground (save a few) to shuffle people towards EoD is such a kitten move. I really don't want a game to consist of 50%+ EoD Specs or penalising those who don't. I've put enough money into this game and while my main is a Guardian Firebrand, a Core Guardian is still very fun to play and like a lot of people, I still wanted Guardian Hammer to be a thing. It should be an even playing field across specs with minor advantages, not sweeping ones.

Good day to you all. I will not be returning to this thread.

Edited March 4, 2023 by Holgarf.6581
Added a bit of wall. Enjoy not reading it.

[Freya.9075]

40 minutes ago, Holgarf.6581 said:

Yes, ArenaNet and other businesses make money and businesses are allowed to, within reason, but when they're making plenty of profit (you can see what they make - you have a search function on your browser dear) you'd expect more for what you're apparently supporting, unless that support just meant more skin development, which is an unending loop of mediocrity for elevated cost and no way for other players to disable the visual eye-sores without bottoming out NPCs too. 

 

Edit: I decided to give you a chance and read your first paragraph. You are incorrect. You can see their revenue, however this is not profit. I asked you if you know Anets expenses because of this. Expenses are deducted from a company's revenue to arrive at its Profit or Net Income. Which is more accurate when it comes to resources they have to make new content and how much they actually make from the game.

That's all I got to say about this as the rest of your post seems a bit like a word salad. 

 

Edited March 4, 2023 by Freya.9075

[Ashen.2907]

1 hour ago, Freya.9075 said:

 

Edit: I decided to give you a chance and read your first paragraph. You are incorrect. You can see their revenue, however this is not profit. I asked you if you know Anets expenses because of this. Expenses are deducted from a company's revenue to arrive at its Profit or Net Income. Which is more accurate when it comes to resources they have to make new content and how much they actually make from the game.

That's all I got to say about this as the rest of your post seems a bit like a word salad. 

 

This.

ANet is likely spending north of 31 million dollars a year, potentially considerably north, in payroll alone based on average pay, cost to employ, etc for their area. Add in all of the myriad other expenses, taxes, etc and the reported quarterly revenue is not as excessive as some people like to argue. I am not defending ANet here, just reminding people that there is a significant difference between revenue and profit.

[Shade.8971]

If anet expects me to pay for content like this 😂

[mythical.6315]

On 3/1/2023 at 11:36 AM, Hasmadad.4293 said:

At first I thought that Sleuthing a Solution was a timegate, that the chapter would continue after a few hours or something. But apparently this is all we're getting until the next chapter. Is this some sort of an out of season April Fools joke? ONE HOUR of story every few MONTHS? Even the earlier split maps like Drizzle or Björa had a full story arc and far more content... And to top it off, outside the "story" we have once per day Dragon's Stand with rewards that are worth less than the keys to get them? 

 

Please someone tell me this is just a bad joke.

An hour is being generous unless you're counting all of the open world filler that doesn't add much to the story.

[Blude.6812]

On 3/3/2023 at 3:33 AM, DarcShriek.5829 said:

You obviously paid too much for your free content.  You should request your $0.00 back.

For free, or if you pay, it really doesn't matter. Bad is still bad regardless of the price.

[Stx.4857]

I was kind of shocked at how small this update was.  Maybe I misunderstood what this was going to be…   I kind of thought this was going to be like one chapter from a living world season, with its own map.  Kind of like season 3 a crack in the ice…

 

The story stops on a dime.   I legit thought that there was something I needed to do to progress like finish the meta event or meet someone somewhere…. But no it just randomly ends lol. 
 

I hope this isn’t what the new standard is going to be.  I’m hoping this is just a little something to get us by until the next expansion comes out.  

[Butterfly Kingdom.8349]

We've seen some of you asking about the instructions at the end of "Sleuthing a Solution". Gorrik will provide updates periodically in the form of audio logs, beginning next week--so be sure to check back starting March 14!

[Ray Koopa.2354]

Dear lord. And I fumed about waiting 3 months for another half-story elsewhere. I stand corrected then.

Why did nobody in-game or here on the forum clearly knew about March 14th though?

[Randulf.7614]

57 minutes ago, Ray Koopa.2354 said:

Dear lord. And I fumed about waiting 3 months for another half-story elsewhere. I stand corrected then.

Why did nobody in-game or here on the forum clearly knew about March 14th though?

Why did no player know did you mean? Anet chose to withhold the info until today when they clarified when the first audio log will hit.

[Ashantara.8731]

On 3/4/2023 at 12:36 PM, vares.8457 said:

Story missions are never challenging or interesting content, they are a chore.

That is not true. GW2 has quite a few story missions that I thoroughly enjoyed challenge- and/or story-wise.

On 3/4/2023 at 12:36 PM, vares.8457 said:

There is no good storytelling in video games

Now, that's just plain ridiculous. Neverwinter Nights 1, Dragon Age: Origins, Max Payne 2, The Vanishing of Ethan Carter, The Raven, The Talos Principle, and many, many more come to mind.
 

Edited March 8, 2023 by Ashantara.8731

[Randulf.7614]

11 minutes ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

That is not true. GW2 has quite a few story missions that I thoroughly enjoyed challenge- and/or story-wise.

Now, that's just plain ridiculous. Neverwinter Nights 1, Dragon Age: Origins, Max Payne 2, The Vanishing of Ethan Carter, The Raven, The Talos Principle, and many, many more come to mind.
 

Agreed. As a heavy reader and playing a lot of rpg games at the moment (just finished Xenoblade Chronicles 3 as an example), there are indeed great stories in games. Plus storytelling is more than just the instanced narrative. At their peak, Anet knew how to deliver outstanding passive, ambient storytelling through their maps, using events and hearts rather than relying on npc exposition.

Game storytelling is different from book storytelling, which is different from comic storytelling, which is different from film storytelling, which is different from TV storytelling, which is different from radio storytelling and so forth. People need to get out of their heads one is better than the other. They’re just different mediums.

[patton the great.7126]

Welcome to maintenance mode. Be sure to buy more gems and continue to enjoy the bi yearly WvW beta weekend for whatever the new alliance mode is!

 

Buy gems please!

[SnackParty.3178]

Earlier chapters, are usually short, don't let out a whole lot of detail of what's going on, and not, very over the top. Finales, usually have a ton more going on, and way longer.