Jump to content
  • Sign Up

"Your Soul Is Mine!" on 16s CD...


Recommended Posts

You could say the same about:

  • Elementalist Arcane brillance/Ether renewal
  • Warrior's Mending/Healing signet (who still both have CD reduction traits)
  • Necromancer's summon blood fiend
  • Thief's signet of malice
  • Engineer's bandage self (associated to the med kit on top of that)
  • Mesmer's mirror/mantra of recovery
  • Revenant can basically use a healing skill every 15s because it always got 2 (up to 3 with legendary alliance)

All in all, I think we can safely say that "Your soul is mine!" on 16s CD isn't something exceptional within the current game.

  • Like 5
  • Confused 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

You have seen it lads, comparing LF generating, low cd, high HPS (and relatively short cast time) being compared with such garbage as ER/AB/blood fiend/SIGNET OF MALICE LUL/MoR...

(not really surprised, the same person called `rampage/lich` a trash elites a while ago)

  • Like 3
  • Haha 2
  • Confused 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, semak.7481 said:

You have seen it lads, comparing LF generating, low cd, high HPS (and relatively short cast time) being compared with such garbage as ER/AB/blood fiend/SIGNET OF MALICE LUL/MoR...

(not really surprised, the same person called `rampage/lich` a trash elites a while ago)

Granted that all those skills have equally high HP/s and low CD. I'm just being objective and not subjective.

And, yes, I do call all elite transformation skills "trash elites" (I do include Tornado in the list as well as engineer elixir X). I've not called them trash since only "a while ago" but since the vanilla game era, 10 years ago (also, given the choice I would have rather had Lich form removed than Plague form but both would have been fine as well).

  • Confused 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

Granted that all those skills have equally high HP/s and low CD. I'm just being objective and not subjective.

shout -> 6174 16s cd 0.75s cast - ~368.59 hps.
AB - base heal 3560 - 15scd 0.75 cast ~226 hps, lets be generous and you always hit 1 person(4271) - 271 hps 

ER - 5300 heal over 2.25s (if you magically dont get interrupted), 15s cd - 307 hps 

healing signet 20s cd (1.25s cast time lul) - 230hps if ur not using it, 109hps if you do.

Signet of malice - 1.25s cast time 12s cd - 247 hps

Summon blood fiend - 16s cd 1.5s cast time and extra 0.75 to consume it(over 2s of a cast time  for ~4k heal) ~222hps (ofc I'm not counting as if it would leech some hp before you ate it, just as if it would die before you could heal yourself which makes it even worse in that case)

MoR -  3275 on initial cast (2.25s - if you manage to finish its cast), 1640 x2 (1s cd) - overall 6555 heal that you get for charging it from unprepared state if you spam it - 359hps (glhf calculating its actual HPS)

tldr: 6200 posts checks out

  • Like 2
  • Confused 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 hours ago, semak.7481 said:

shout -> 6174 16s cd 0.75s cast - ~368.59 hps.
AB - base heal 3560 - 15scd 0.75 cast ~226 hps, lets be generous and you always hit 1 person(4271) - 271 hps 

ER - 5300 heal over 2.25s (if you magically dont get interrupted), 15s cd - 307 hps 

healing signet 20s cd (1.25s cast time lul) - 230hps if ur not using it, 109hps if you do.

Signet of malice - 1.25s cast time 12s cd - 247 hps

Summon blood fiend - 16s cd 1.5s cast time and extra 0.75 to consume it(over 2s of a cast time  for ~4k heal) ~222hps (ofc I'm not counting as if it would leech some hp before you ate it, just as if it would die before you could heal yourself which makes it even worse in that case)

MoR -  3275 on initial cast (2.25s - if you manage to finish its cast), 1640 x2 (1s cd) - overall 6555 heal that you get for charging it from unprepared state if you spam it - 359hps (glhf calculating its actual HPS)

tldr: 6200 posts checks out

 

"YSIM!": Best case scenario, traited, without healing power you can push this skill to around 500 hps. (530 hps if you take soul reaping's vital persistence, as well as vampiric and vampiric presence and hit 5 targets within 240 radius. And yes, 40% LF because necromancer do need to collecte some ressource for it's main mechanic while some other professions simply don't need such thing)

AB: You do forget the blast in the water field to which elementalist do have access and, at the end of the day you can still hit 5 targets with it. The trait reduce it's CD to 12s. This is a healing skill that can be pushed to around 600 hps without healing power (blast in water field not even being taken into account).

 

 

  • Like 2
  • Confused 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

 

"YSIM!": Best case scenario, traited, without healing power you can push this skill to around 500 hps. (530 hps if you take soul reaping's vital persistence, as well as vampiric and vampiric presence and hit 5 targets within 240 radius. And yes, 40% LF because necromancer do need to collecte some ressource for it's main mechanic while some other professions simply don't need such thing)

AB: You do forget the blast in the water field to which elementalist do have access and, at the end of the day you can still hit 5 targets with it. The trait reduce it's CD to 12s. This is a healing skill that can be pushed to around 600 hps without healing power (blast in water field not even being taken into account).

 

 

Turns out both the 6.2k and the 291 checked out as expected 🤣

  • Confused 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Dadnir.5038 said:

 

"YSIM!": Best case scenario, traited, without healing power you can push this skill to around 500 hps. (530 hps if you take soul reaping's vital persistence, as well as vampiric and vampiric presence and hit 5 targets within 240 radius. And yes, 40% LF because necromancer do need to collecte some ressource for it's main mechanic while some other professions simply don't need such thing)

AB: You do forget the blast in the water field to which elementalist do have access and, at the end of the day you can still hit 5 targets with it. The trait reduce it's CD to 12s. This is a healing skill that can be pushed to around 600 hps without healing power (blast in water field not even being taken into account).

I didnt forget, I simply didnt want to calculate for rare scenarios (especially AB, if that would be the case, healing mantra would always be the meta on mesmer but it was meh pre nerf and post nerf), didnt include any traits for any, pretty fair to me.

You said all these heals have EQUAL OR HIGHER HPS, its simply not true. (Especially poor Signet of malice/healing signet)

4 hours ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Turns out both the 6.2k and the 291 checked out as expected 🤣

🤡

  • Like 1
  • Confused 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

58 minutes ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

If only they could cover their health bar with a second health bar that came with 50% damage reduction and an optional extra 20% reduction and frost aura on top of that.

The same healthbar that doubles as their DPS resource, locks them out of utility skills and stunbreaks, that you can deny by focusing them, stunlocking them, and/or bursting them out of it? 

 

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

49 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

The same healthbar that doubles as their DPS resource, locks them out of utility skills and stunbreaks, that you can deny by focusing them, stunlocking them, and/or bursting them out of it? 

 

Never been a problem for me on my Reaper. That same healthbar also comes with stability, mobility, CC, and counter pressure, and can also be traited to shed condis, build might, build toughness, inflict weakness, passively heal the Reaper, actively heal the Reaper, and/or gain protection. Yes you can't take all of that, but you can take a lot of that along for the ride. Reapers are only weak sitting duck ragdolls if the player lets them be that way. I may main Warrior, but I play Reaper heavily on the side, and that spec only has weak sustain if you actively go out of your way to do so.

Edited by Lan Deathrider.5910
  • Like 2
  • Confused 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Reaper reminds is weird, reminds me of a delayed explosion. Always dancing along the outside to poke at someone with their axe, but if the enemy team is half health, God have mercy on your soul for when they start lunging into the center once everyone's on cooldown. 

Class takes a lot of patience, but the reward is pretty kitten satisfying. Outside of that though, I really don't see the worry of a 16s heal that is not strong by any means. Necro never really had good heal skills unless they are consistently siphoning off of someone. Even then I'm pretty sure Vampiric got nerfed at some point, so even more so than usual.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Dreams.3128 said:

Reaper reminds is weird, reminds me of a delayed explosion. Always dancing along the outside to poke at someone with their axe, but if the enemy team is half health, God have mercy on your soul for when they start lunging into the center once everyone's on cooldown. 

Class takes a lot of patience, but the reward is pretty kitten satisfying. Outside of that though, I really don't see the worry of a 16s heal that is not strong by any means. Necro never really had good heal skills unless they are consistently siphoning off of someone. Even then I'm pretty sure Vampiric got nerfed at some point, so even more so than usual.

The old trait was kinda better 35% cd reduction if you hit the targets, which you will since everyone is up your kitten anyway, I think it was 12 seconds cd and it aligned perfectly into heal shroud heal, now they average it to 16 since you would get that most of the time, but now you have to wait for the heal after the shroud some time.

@Lan Deathrider.5910 The sustain on Reaper might be way too well balanced even after the bumps here and there. It is probably one the few professions that are left that require support to do its work properly, this is also the trouble since there is no reason to pick it up in organized pvp groups cause something with the same general output but without of need of babysitting and extra attention based on the shroud would fare better. The whole shroud mechanic might be annoying to people, but it is cloth profession trying to do melee warrior things, it also is just HP management which makes it obvious to counter since HP is the default defense in all games, it is pretty vanilla profession if we think about it, people also can affect the sustain with their actions while on other professions when someone goes invlun you just wait.
Quite frankly I worry about the game cause it moved away from HP management and most professions are on a egg timer defenses these days and it is all about waiting for people to do their PVE defense rotation, it feels like you have 30 second delay till you start the actual fight with some professions and when it repeats several times over vs different people it gets tedious.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Vancho.8750 said:

@Lan Deathrider.5910 The sustain on Reaper might be way too well balanced even after the bumps here and there. It is probably one the few professions that are left that require support to do its work properly, this is also the trouble since there is no reason to pick it up in organized pvp groups cause something with the same general output but without of need of babysitting and extra attention based on the shroud would fare better. The whole shroud mechanic might be annoying to people, but it is cloth profession trying to do melee warrior things, it also is just HP management which makes it obvious to counter since HP is the default defense in all games, it is pretty vanilla profession if we think about it, people also can affect the sustain with their actions while on other professions when someone goes invlun you just wait.
Quite frankly I worry about the game cause it moved away from HP management and most professions are on a egg timer defenses these days and it is all about waiting for people to do their PVE defense rotation, it feels like you have 30 second delay till you start the actual fight with some professions and when it repeats several times over vs different people it gets tedious.

Shroud is a potent defense tool. It's the whole reason that Necro doesn't have more blocks, evades, or invulns. Maybe it's because I play my reaper differently than others, but I've never felt like a helpless ragdoll with it. I know what you mean on that egg timer defense, but shroud can be built to be just as much an egg timer defense as the rest.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

Shroud is a potent defense tool. It's the whole reason that Necro doesn't have more blocks, evades, or invulns. Maybe it's because I play my reaper differently than others, but I've never felt like a helpless ragdoll with it. I know what you mean on that egg timer defense, but shroud can be built to be just as much an egg timer defense as the rest.

If you go the defensive rout it just does not have enough punch In PVP, which is a good thing, if you are tanking or just  poking from the side might as well pick harbinger or core. Reaper has the good enough sustain a spec like it should have at the damage it does, but for organized play it does not have the proper sustain that the more mobile burst oriented playstyle of coordinated teams have, it becomes liability since even though the shroud is potent defense it can't handle getting focused without help, which is actually good design for the game, but many builds ignore that and that makes Reaper not being able to compete on its designated role since there is no need for it if some other build can dish out the same AoE damage while also not needing to commit on taking damage.
Also it can get rag dolled, but only if the team is not committing to the fight with the Reaper, and start doing this egg timery hit and run even though The Reaper is like a battering ram and just needs some peeling to get ahead.  It is very average spec by itself, but it is very strong if the team uses it to its role properly. 
If you think about it Reaper is the only proper damage teamfight spec left around and it kinda needs good sustain to do what it does, the rest of the teamfight specs kind of trail of doing multiple things.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, Vancho.8750 said:

If you go the defensive rout it just does not have enough punch In PVP, which is a good thing, if you are tanking or just  poking from the side might as well pick harbinger or core. Reaper has the good enough sustain a spec like it should have at the damage it does, but for organized play it does not have the proper sustain that the more mobile burst oriented playstyle of coordinated teams have, it becomes liability since even though the shroud is potent defense it can't handle getting focused without help, which is actually good design for the game, but many builds ignore that and that makes Reaper not being able to compete on its designated role since there is no need for it if some other build can dish out the same AoE damage while also not needing to commit on taking damage.
 

That just points to certain other specs needing to be brought down though does it not? Certainly not the implication of this thread though.

  • Confused 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...