Jump to content
  • Sign Up

[Proposal] Rework Plan for Perfect Inscriptions, a Now Perfectly Useless Grandmaster Trait


Virtuality.8351

Recommended Posts

Let's talk about Perfect Inscriptions in Radiance trait line.

This trait simply does complete with the other two Grandmaster tier traits, Amplified Wrath and Righteous Instincts.

While the other two provide huge cDPS/pDPS boost (at least 300+ and 525 attribute point equivalent or APQ, respectively) , Perfect Inscriptions just does not bring anything sizable to the table—some underwhelming 36 attribute points bonus to what untraited Signet of Wrath or Bane Signet already provides. 

And regarding bonus to other Signets the trait offers: 

  • Signet of Judgment, the defensive option, gain 2% more damage reduction, equal to ~58 Toughness for a character with 1000 base Toughness.
  • Signet of Mercy, The support option, gets merely 30 more points.
  • Signet of Courage, the healing option, also the elite skill, allows you to heal a meager addition of ~29 hitpoints per second with 1500 healing power, and let's face the music: no serious support player would ever pick Radiance over Virtue (in PvE/WvW) or Valor (in PvP). Not to mention the skill has to compete with "Feel My Wrath!" due to role compression in PvE, Renewed Focus in PvP for personal defense, and Mantra of Liberation for group Stability in WvW to begin with.

Likewise, in Master tier, Wrath of Justice is completely outshined by Radiant Fire (300 APQ with its passive bonus alone) and Retribution (~350+ APQ).

So what can we do under the situation?

A possible solution would be to replace Perfect Inscriptions with something PvP oriented—something that does not provide just plain DPS bonus (as the other two Grandmaster traits already do) but instead opens up a short attack window and synergize with Wrath of Justice. Here I will provide an example:

  • Remove Perfect Inscriptions. The retainment of passive effect while recharging is now merged Wrath of Justice.
    Wrath of Justice (Master tier)
    Striking an enemy with the damaging effect from Virtue skill 1 casts Lesser Signet of Wrath.
    Signets continue to grant their passive bonuses while recharging.
  • Meanwhile, reduce the base recharge time fo all Signets to compensate for removing Perfect Inscriptions.
    Signet of Resolve (25 s CD)
    Bane Signe (25 s CD)
    Signet of Judgment (20 s CD; Burning increased to 3 stacks)
    Signet of Mercy (40 s CD in PvE)
    Signet of Wraith (20 s CD)
    Signet of Courage (50 s CD)
  • Add a new Grandmaster Trait.
    [New Trait Name Placeholder] (Grandmaster tier)
    Foes you immobilize or blind become vulnerable.
    Vulnerability (8 stacks for 5 s)

Together with Wrath of Justice, that would add up to 16% damage bonus for a short duration every time Guardian hit their foes with Virtue F1.

The new trait will also synergize well with the following weapons :

Meanwhile, the loss of critical chance by picking this new trait over Righteous Instincts could easily be made up with Sigil of Intelligence (PvP).

This way, I believe the new trait should provides enough burst potential for players to choose this new Grandmaster trait over the other two.

Again, all feedbacks are welcome! Let me know what do you think about this proposal!

Edited by Virtuality.8351
Typo Fixes.
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

It seems from your opening passage you forgot the part that Perfect inscription brings using the active effects to the table as you keep the passive effects while the signets are on cooldown. Being able to use extra 1200 range 3 second knockdown or keeping cleansing a condition every 4 seconds are very strong effects.

 

They should at least buff the elite signet to be able to be cast while moving and the trait might be worth it. As it is only ever ran on supports and supports already have empower available, the signet active effect just isn't necessary.

 

I like reducing signet base cooldowns but I do not like this suggestion since if you make the trait stronger and move it to master tier, it will be completely overpowered. It is undoubtedly grandmaster trait worthy as it is, just guardian signets happen to be little weak.

Edited by Riba.3271
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Riba.3271 said:

It seems from your opening passage you forgot the part that Perfect inscription brings using the active effects to the table as you keep the passive effects while the signets are on cooldown. Being able to use extra 1200 range 3 second knockdown or keeping cleansing a condition every 4 seconds are very strong effects.

(...)

just guardian signets happen to be little weak.

I am aware of that. In my proposal I too acknowledged such function, and proposed to merge it with the Master tier trait Wrath of Justice:

  • Remove Perfect Inscriptions. The retainment of passive effect while recharging is now merged Wrath of Justice.
    Wrath of Justice (Master tier)
    Striking an enemy with the damaging effect from Virtue skill 1 casts Lesser Signet of Wrath.

Is such function strong in itself? Yes, certainly. As you have pointed out, being able to retain a frequent passive cleansing function of Signet of Resolve is pretty handy.

Does it completely mitigate the need for active cleansing and save you a free Utility Skill slot? Not really.

If the environment frequently applies multiple types of conditions, including Poison or Weakness, I probably would still bring something on-demand (such as Purging Flames) to make sure that my healing skill would heal for its full effect or that my DPS would not drop during my burst rotation. On the other hand, if the environment applies little to none condition pressure, I might not need its passive effect at all and opt for another healing skill instead.

For me, the problem with the Signets and Perfect Inscriptions combination is that together they still do not resolve any situation adequately.  They are something really nice to have, yet when the circumstances demand, they come out lacking.

And on top of that, they just can not compete. Take the other example you brought up: the Bane Signet.

Being able to maintain 216 bonus Power after knocking down your enemy with its active effect is strong in itself, sure, but does it compete with Retribution (equal to ~350+ Power or Ferocity) or Righteous Instincts (equal to 525 Precision)? Numbers suggest otherwise.

In fact one would fare even better not picking Perfect Inscriptions but something else instead should they choose to activate the Bane Signet or not.

And this comes back to the final thing you brought up: "guardian signets happen to be little weak". The trait simply offers too little bonus to skills that are too situational, impractical or replaceable, and I do not think my proposal would make things anywhere near being overpowered.

Edited by Virtuality.8351
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 4/21/2023 at 7:38 AM, otto.5684 said:

We told Anet this would be kittening useless if they made the changes, but no. IMO, unless this trait is retooled towards support, it can never work.

Yeah, I felt the same frustration.

I understand that the developers intended to get rid of all special effects that grant allies bonus attributes...but doing so disregarding the fact that it would render a Grandmaster tier trait useless, while not coming up with anything to make up for it for nearly a year...is just too hard to take.

For the support part, in my opinion, vulnerability debuff on foes is sort of a group support itself for it aids allies to bring down a target collectively. Alternatives obviously include AoE Might, Fury and/or Quickness sharing (say, 240 radius of player character), which are also worth exploring.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

THis is my 1st post on this forum! woo...

anyways. i agree that the trait line is dead. its sad- i always thought that the active effect with traited Perfect inscription was something with high potential due to the fact that those active effect are not boons and you cant strip them off team mates, if tunned a bit it can be used as a support tool and offense aswell, all tho I didnt explore that offensive approach much, despite the fact that the trait line seems dps oriented over all..

regardless of the way of using the trait, I think that this applied effect was something very defining for a guard. A unique buff provided exclusively by signet guard! but no...

While the jun22 patch helped in a way with cd reduction, it took away sharing signet with allies which was a weakening move for the trait overall. If they just shaved cds off and left it the same it would been better i think. Was it abused in anyway? 

something else i think could be usefull to bring back this trait line and utility set in general is to continue to work with signet of courage. I thikn the changes are good overall . The massive full hp heal plays where fun due to the long active radius but overall it was long cd and not very interactive usage, very prone to counter and required to much of an investment in set upl. Not worth it. The rework helped i think and the usability of the skill has improved. Id like to see it taken farther and continue to look at signets of courage.

..divide the cast and active heal parts. Locking caster in place during cast of signet and pulse heal after the cast is complete over a short period of time, allowing free movement. I imagine a faster shorter heal burst after casting the signet. This would need a slight reduction in the cast time I think for playability. Cast the signet, procure the heal and boons over a decreased number of pulses, say 4, but increase heal per tick. This could be areas where to balance the skill.

Enabling a different strong group heal for guard opens up a lot of possibilities. 48sec is not a short cd, but not massive either, definitely worth a group full heal! just have to make the skill playable and not so punishing to use or rather easier to land. With the current mobility on most classes the active 600 radius can feel some what short, ppl move out of your heal even if you port directly at them, landing little value of it (in a random unorganized pvp match that is). Increase in active range for signet on Perfect inscriptions is now worth it I would say.

Changes and tune ups on signets line can create interactions with dps willbender and heal wb builds (confesion to make. if you ever runned into a support wb in pvp or wvw mightve been me) It fits with the playstyle. Go in, use couple signets, get a kill and leave, wait 20 sec or less. Thief like if played dps or a very fast mobile support with high rez capability.

Current cd on most signets its ok when traited, but cd reduction only is not enough for the trade off dps potential as mentioned. Perfect inscription needs something... radius increase radius, effectiveness % increase or ideally bring back the old version.

I think if you bring back the shared signet effect you can bring back some of the lost damage in the overall dps in this situation with signet of bane: the 216dmg increase for guard can be neglected yes, but is 216power bonus for 4 more ppls neglecable aswell? very situational still, but if Perfect Inscriptions get a proper buff it can be an alternative build. sad devs decided to get rid of this special buffs and boons since they where so characteristic of a class. They have gone back with some other things so maybe this can be reverted aswell?

wrath of justice seems very useless but can be fun for meme burn builds, thats the only way I've played with it. I wouldnt know what to do with this trait. maybe some fury to juice it up a bit? 

cheers all, hail the algorithm

 

Edited by ocommodos.7103
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
On 4/14/2023 at 11:08 PM, Virtuality.8351 said:

and let's face the music: no serious support player would ever pick Radiance over Virtue (in PvE/WvW) or Valor (in PvP). Not to mention the skill has to compete with "Feel My Wrath!" due to role compression in PvE, Renewed Focus in PvP for personal defense, and Mantra of Liberation for group Stability in WvW to begin with.

This heal spreadsheet shows why someone would use radiance on HB
According to some calculations I did, PI allows you to bring full minstrel gear (and therefore force of will) without sacrificing any boon duration. The healing output is monstrous and it just loses a utility slot to mercy signet. Even then, mercy is an effective squad dps gain if someone goes down.

Virtues (for healbrand) has taken a lot of crossfire in the last year. Tome rework removed a big one, f2/f3 cooldown reduction. The upcoming patch now removes its consecration CDR, giving radiance HB 32 second CD sanctuaries with alac.

Courage and mercy keeping their long cooldowns hurt PI HB a little, but gaining reliable sanctuaries is probably worth it.

Edited by Ostro.7359
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Perfect Inscriptions went from an absolutely godlike trait (totally meta defining in fractals, prior to June ~23rd last year) to probably one of the worst traits in the game if not the worst one. Your signets are 20% more effective (utterly useless, you get like 36 points of your stat of choice depending on the signet) and you retain the passives when using them. Woohoooo! I Wonder who cares

Edited by MagicBot.1570
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...