WvW Players - What are your thoughts on Boon Strips for WvW?

[Xenesis.6389]

Good people, who have travelled from villages, near and far...

Lend me your ears....

In the upcoming patch we will witness yet again, changes to boon strips and corruption skills in a less than positive light. Some of us, have been fighting these changes for years, and have been mocked for going against the tide. Every patch boon ball meta becomes stronger and stronger, with the continued buffs to boons and support classes, and continued nerfs to boon strips over many classes, from mesmers, necromancers, and warriors. Eight months ago Anet announced they would look into the relations of boon applications and removals, and it would seem we have their final answer with this next patch.

I will put up this poll to gather your thoughts on this subject, let your voices be heard, let this be the final answer from the players in the forums.

As a final form of protest I will be removing boon strips from my builds, lend me your support and do the same if you wish(I'm sure many necros will), it's obvious boon strips are not wanted or appreciated by many, especially by those running under the cover of their boon spam. If groups want boon strips, then bring their own, otherwise bring your dps and tag for bags. Let those small and mid tier groups feel the pain fighting the big groups. If that patch goes through there is no point to protest or complain after.

Sometimes you don't know what you have until it's gone.

[Gotejjeken.1267]

"Getting boon stripped at range is not fun"

~ A Dev

[Bunbury.8472]

well, let's see if anyone at all approves of this weak kitten patch.

cos right now it seems like the Devs couldn't be more out of touch.

[ArchonWing.9480]

1 hour ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

"Getting boon stripped at range is not fun"

~ A Dev

They also got pulled off the wall a few too many times apparently.

Edited June 10, 2023 by ArchonWing.9480

[oscuro.9720]

I think the reason they nerfed WOD is a legitimate statement; that people won’t push into bubbles and try to get out as soon as possible.

I think nerfing WOD because of that is stupid, at least if we are talking pug Zergs. People just don’t push bubbles. They already don’t push most of the time, but if there’s a bubble up, regardless of what it does, they won’t push it. If WOD were a ground AoE, I feel like more people would push it because it’s not a scary bubble.

Then again I’m horrible at large scale gameplay so someone who knows what’s going on pls tell me if my observations are accurate. 

Assuming they are, we might as well make WOD an aoe attack that applies disenchantment for 4 seconds with the previous effects (no more boons applied). Because I’m like 70% sure people just don’t want to go into scary bubbles. 

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

Obviously the complaints about boon balls were all coming from players who were losing to boon balls.  Therefore, by reducing the amount of boon strip available and increasing access to boons, this will make balling a lot easier, thus solving the complaints that players have about it.  

[Gotejjeken.1267]

8 hours ago, oscuro.9720 said:

I think the reason they nerfed WOD is a legitimate statement; that people won’t push into bubbles and try to get out as soon as possible.

I think nerfing WOD because of that is stupid, at least if we are talking pug Zergs. People just don’t push bubbles. They already don’t push most of the time, but if there’s a bubble up, regardless of what it does, they won’t push it. If WOD were a ground AoE, I feel like more people would push it because it’s not a scary bubble.

Then again I’m horrible at large scale gameplay so someone who knows what’s going on pls tell me if my observations are accurate. 

Assuming they are, we might as well make WOD an aoe attack that applies disenchantment for 4 seconds with the previous effects (no more boons applied). Because I’m like 70% sure people just don’t want to go into scary bubbles. 

I mean pretty much.  You can throw a Siege Turtle bubble up and people run.  

[Luranni.9470]

35 minutes ago, Gotejjeken.1267 said:

I mean pretty much.  You can throw a Siege Turtle bubble up and people run.  

To be fair, you could throw a pie and people would run.

[Dawdler.8521]

17 minutes ago, Luranni.9470 said:

To be fair, you could throw a pie and people would run.

I dont expect the average WvWer to make good pie so that's understandable.

[Axl.8924]

personally i voted need more boon strips extreme it keeps boonballs in place.Too much brainless spam of Boons and invuln.

 

Boon rips/boon corrupts keep the meta in check.

Edited June 11, 2023 by Axl.8924

[Megastorm.6219]

I don't see anyone interested in changing the squad size to 25 instead of 50 to help with the issues. 

Anet, please consider changing the squad size to 25 for alliance rewards. 

No, I'm not saying it has to be everywhere and all the time. 

I think there is room for alliance solo, parties, and squads to handle the daily, weekly, or monthly achievements. 

Fifty is really sixty-plus if you count all of the tag-along pugs unwilling or unable to join a squad but will silently play alongside one to get the easy mode rewards.  Please make multiple map achievements with smaller size squads.  This would incentivize groups to move maps and chase goals the groups want to do together.  These could be activated like guild missions.  Constantly I see complaining about boon spam and boon rip spam being an issue, but you don't think your zerg of 60 is the issue huh? OK! IT IS! You're too kitten big yo! Break that squad up into two groups instead of kitten along forcing ONE TAG to chase achievements for individuals in the squad that say the typical " keep next" because they clearly need a daily keep and want the commander to take the zerglings to the nearest one next.  Get over yourselves and make more teams on more maps that can ACTUALLY move maps because they're not the size of a map queue.  Gamers.  We need MORE tags on more maps, and more groups not one uberzerg forced to react to every callout without any backup tags, and frustrated when they cannot move maps because they are too big.  

Edited June 11, 2023 by Megastorm.6219

[connor.2180]

I'm glad the overwhelming majority on this poll are in agreement that boon strips need to be buffed. Boon application has been buffed hugely over the past couple of years and I personally thought boon strips were lacking before I read the abomination that is the recent patch note. 

Personally I think the current balance team is focusing too much on the 50v50 aspect of wvw. They want to prolong these fights to create big epic battles that last a long time, I get it. But, consider how often in WvW you actually see 50/50 squads, 2 hours a day maximum maybe? The real concern I have is the off-peak hours, when some servers have boon balls running and some don't. Have you tried stopping a 20 man boon ball at 9am when you've only got a handful of pugs by your side? Even if you have even numbers its near impossible as it is. More nerfs to boon strip is only going to increase the disparity. Its the only counter to the boon ball. 
It's either an oversight on the part of anet as they tunnelvision on one aspect of wvw, or they are they are trying to force everyone into blobby boon ball gameplay which not everyone wants or partakes in. 

Let's hope the feedback gets to anet and they reconsider this patch. Though I doubt it, boon balls are the future. Join one or get left behind. 
 

Edited June 11, 2023 by connor.2180
Plaintext

[Grand Marshal.4098]

Can't wait for 5 minstrels per party and Chinese meta

[Axl.8924]

Nerfing corrupts and strips is the worst idea ever terrible.Its going to create a meta where people spam boons for immunity and bop people. boon corrupt countered classes like it had to, same with strips.Warriors with their 2nd  elite was made to strip boons.

Edited June 11, 2023 by Axl.8924

[Dawdler.8521]

1 hour ago, Megastorm.6219 said:

I don't see anyone interested in changing the squad size to 25 instead of 50 to help with the issues. 

People would just make 2 squads and then stack all 50 onto the common commander anyway.

[Player.2475]

Anet has made the entire game balance revolve around having 100% uptime of every single boon in the game, and created new elite specializations that can do that in a matter of seconds. It allows some specs to outsustain and damage every other spec in the game because every other player is his own boonball.

Clear counterplay:  Skills that remove boons. Too bad your average boon strip only removes 1-2 of the 10 boons every EoD spec can apply every 10 seconds.

Anet's response: Clearly we need to nerf boon strips even more.

[blp.3489]

2 hours ago, Megastorm.6219 said:

Anet, please consider changing the squad size to 25 for alliance rewards.

What are alliance rewards?

These are questions not a suggestions: if you want smaller squads can't you stop accepting members once you reach the size you want?  Can you then send your map change announcements to squad chat if you want to move maps without queueing?  Limiting everyone to 25 player squads doesn't seem like a good solution.

[Xenesis.6389]

3 hours ago, Megastorm.6219 said:

I don't see anyone interested in changing the squad size to 25 instead of 50 to help with the issues. 

Anet, please consider changing the squad size to 25 for alliance rewards. 

No, I'm not saying it has to be everywhere and all the time. 

I think there is room for alliance solo, parties, and squads to handle the daily, weekly, or monthly achievements. 

Probably because we've already had those discussions.

First of all what alliance rewards?

Second, breaking a squad of 50 into two 25's isn't going to do anything, they will still stack on each other, the only change is there is maybe a second squad leader getting the bonus of additional pips. Boons will still hit 5 targets and their party first, they will still have 50 people to absorb 5 target aoes easily.

You need better tools to handle those numbers, they have nerfed aoe targets to 5, they have nerfed aoes damage to low amounts, they have repeatedly nerfed boon strips in targets, cooldowns, and removal counts. Funny how they haven't limited loot from an enemy to 5 though.

Now you also want to add another set of carrots for squads to chase with under 25? with another set of daily weekly monthly achievements? In theory it could work, if they are forced be 25 to the end of those periods, but what is the checklist and rewards going to be? If it's going to be another set of weeklies handing out 8 gold but can actually get it done in 4 hours of the week, it's not much to keep those groups running under 25 for long. Which again is pointless with stacking.

In the end it doesn't stop another squad or randoms from running along with that squad. They would have to implement more hard locked restrictions to force players to run under 25, like only up to 25 can get credit for a capture, or only up to 25 can get credit from tagging an enemy, but again doesn't stop others from stacking over them. The real problem though, is the developers themselves who want these big groups around, they want to force everyone to run 50 squad boon balls to get longer fights.

I don't really have a problem with big fights, I love them, but I have a problem with the increased limitation of tools to counter them. Apparently anet only wants 50 v 50 banging heads in melee range in a mega battle of attrition. Kitten at this point they might as well undo the obsidian sanctum nerfs and let everyone do the boring ultimate dominator farm again.

This is the future of wvw, minus conditions.

 

Edited June 11, 2023 by Xenesis.6389

[A Hamster.2580]

Won't organized groups just run twice the amount of scourges to compensate? If that happens, I wonder if Anet will double down and remove boon strips altogether.

 

I'm trying to imagine a world where there is no boon strips. You would really need to sync a spike to kill someone with full boons so RIP to the clouders in a clouders vs organized zerg fight.

Edited June 11, 2023 by A Hamster.2580

[Kayowin.9217]

48 minutes ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

 

This is the future of wvw, minus conditions.

Winner determined by whose fingers cramp first.   

[Kayowin.9217]

1 hour ago, Xenesis.6389 said:

 

I don't really have a problem with big fights, I love them, but I have a problem with the increased limitation of tools to counter them. Apparently anet only wants 50 v 50 banging heads in melee range in a mega battle of attrition. Kitten at this point they might as well undo the obsidian sanctum nerfs and let everyone do the boring ultimate dominator farm again.

This is the future of wvw, minus conditions.

 

And not only the winner determined by whose fingers cramp first, but this is the reason Boon Ballers don't fight each other as much and the normal mode of operations is to go find PUGS to farm at Garri lord.  

[Xenesis.6389]

25 minutes ago, A Hamster.2580 said:

Won't organized groups just run twice the amount of scourges to compensate? If that happens, I wonder if Anet will double down and remove boon strips altogether.

 

I'm trying to imagine a world where there is no boon strips. You would really need to sync a spike to kill someone with full boons so RIP to the clouders in a clouders vs organized zerg fight.

Which class are you going to remove from your comp to add more scourges? who were already bottom tier support and now losing dps as well. Boon spam vastly outpaces boon strips(which are getting nerfed again), you're better off adding another actual support instead, because in the long run it'll be better to get through spikes with and outlasting your opponents.

[cyberzombie.7348]

Ever since Spellbreaker and Scourge got nerfed boon balls have been on ez mode, yet they think nerfing anti-supports further and giving out more boons will make it more balanced? I just don't get whom are they appealing to with the upcoming changes other than wannabe raiders, and players scared to pvp.

 

I rarely expect Anet to do put logic into their balance but wtf... I miss the HoT years when everything felt like an arms race, nowadays pvp & wvw feels like a Geneva Convention. 

Edited June 11, 2023 by cyberzombie.7348
grammar

[MedievalThings.5417]

It's pretty easy to see, Anet does NOT want people to defend.  Every "adjustment" is in favor of boonballs and to the detriment of defenders and the game mode in general.

So, I am going to translate what Anet has been saying this whole time about boons.

"We understand boon application is a problem" - Anet

Translation:

"We are sorry you have to reapply boons, so we are making them as permanent as we can and removing every strip/corrupt in the game so you don't have to reapply them" - Also Anet

[Kayowin.9217]

10 minutes ago, Ubi.4136 said:

 

"We understand boon application is a problem" - Anet

Translation:

"We are sorry you have to reapply boons, so we are making them as permanent as we can and removing every strip/corrupt in the game so you don't have to reapply them" - Also Anet

Cant sum it up better than that!  xD