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All these recent "removed aftercast" changes are bad design


Paradoxoglanis.1904

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We have already seen what happened to gameplay when quickness and alacrity became baseline in nearly every type of content. Removing aftercasts from all these skills is doing exactly the same thing. Its just making combat even more spammy. Hardly any skills have weight to them anymore since you can just go through your rotation regardless of what the enemies are doing.

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3 hours ago, Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

We have already seen what happened to gameplay when quickness and alacrity became baseline in nearly every type of content. Removing aftercasts from all these skills is doing exactly the same thing. Its just making combat even more spammy. Hardly any skills have weight to them anymore since you can just go through your rotation regardless of what the enemies are doing.

Anything that's possible due to the reduction of aftercasts was already possible for players who used weapon stow to cancel aftercasts. This just normalises that behaviour for everyone. Personally, I think it probably would have been better if they'd found a way to enforce the aftercasts despite weapon stow and balancing accordingly, but they're apparently unwilling or unable to do that.

Edited by draxynnic.3719
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2 hours ago, draxynnic.3719 said:

Anything that's possible due to the reduction of aftercasts was already possible for players who used weapon stow to cancel aftercasts. This just normalises that behaviour for everyone. Personally, I think it probably would have been better if they'd found a way to enforce the aftercasts despite weapon stow and balancing accordingly, but they're apparently unwilling or unable to do that.

Pretty much.  Removing aftercasts feels like the lazy solution because stow is kind of a bad mechanic for cancelling.

Aftercasts existing is a good thing.  A free mechanic to cancel them is not.  To cancel, you should have to chain skills together or dodge roll to interrupt the behavior, burning resources prematurely.

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Hard agree with this thread.

Stow should have its own aftercast, a fairly long one. That way it can't be used to cancel abilities.

Functionally, you rarely need to use stow anyway, and most people who would want to do would do it with the intent of not attacking anyway. That's kind of the whole point.

Honestly, this is yet another example of the devs going in completely the wrong direction to "balance" things. Instead of adding targeted restrictions on problem issues, they are just sweepingly eradicating entire features of espec and combat design to jerk off to their DPS brrrr, PvP on-demand fantasies.

It's really awful. It is pushing the game more and more toward empty rotation hammering. This overarching vision frankly sucks and is why I'm not playing the game anymore currently.

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You mean the three skills they tweaked on guardian that we've been asking them to fix for years? Greatsword feels much more fluid now, and I no longer have to tell people to  "move after the symbol appears" for a ~2-3% dps increase. While they could have gone the opposite direction and forced the longer cast times, I always felt that those three skills didn't flow as well as the rest, and skipping the aftercasts helped to alleviate that.

As for the weapon stow "mechanic", I think it's fine. You've always been able to cancel channeled ability casts with the escape key, but the inability to rebind it (and the fact that it opens the menu if you mash it) lead to people using (misusing) the stow bind instead. Its ability to fake people out in PvP contributes to the "mind games" factor, creating an extra layer of depth beyond mechanical execution.

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15 hours ago, ZenDrake.8316 said:

It's definitely a good thing that the weapon stow "mechanic" is no longer required to achieve the best dps numbers. I am not really a fan of aftercasts, but if they decided to keep them in the game, the weapon stow bs had to go.

The game is easy enough that no one needs to stow during their rotation. If you are skilled enough to pull off a rotation with stow weapon then you are already skilled enough to easily do all content in the game. For most people removing aftercasts just means they have to spam more skills.

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On 7/20/2023 at 5:49 AM, Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:

The game is easy enough that no one needs to stow during their rotation. If you are skilled enough to pull off a rotation with stow weapon then you are already skilled enough to easily do all content in the game. For most people removing aftercasts just means they have to spam more skills.

That and it just ruins any sort of tempo that gives these classes feel and flavor.

But they've been doing this for quite some time anyway. I remember being kind of put out when they reworked Druid skills and now Seed of Life is so spammy compared to the very satisfying burst animation it used to have.

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