Discover the Wonders within the Wizard’s Vault in Guild Wars 2: Secrets of the Obscure

[Brave Mallyki.1563]

17 hours ago, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

I've been keeping an eye on the discussion and can clarify a couple more things quickly. The Wizard's Vault is not a 1:1 exact copy of the existing system. Our goal is for the Wizard's Vault to build upon the current rewards system, offering you more flexibility when choosing your rewards, and a wide variety of rewards earned through gameplay.

You'll be able to experience it firsthand in less than a week--we're almost there!

Y'all should have shown the rewards section of the vault. This was a useless blog post. It didn't really say anything different than when it was announced at the end of June. The only meaningful addition was a screenshot of the Weekly tab. There should have been much more information with such a big overhaul to a fundamental component of the game. We should have been shown what the new Dailies tab and the all new Special tab will look like. We should have been yolf how many Daily tasks will we be given to choose from, and how many do we need to complete in a day to max out the Astral Acclaim for the day. We should have been told if the Daily tasks have the same rewards as they do now, such as Sips of Liquid Karma, Writs of Experience, Badges of Honor, Potions of WvW Reward, Mist-Hardened Lockboxes, Potions of PvP Reward, Shards of Glory, etc., or if those rewards have been completely replaced with Astral Acclaim. We should have been told how the Wizard’s Vault Daily Completionist achievement is different from the current Daily Completionist achievement. We know we will still get the 10 AP if not capped, but what about the 2 gold? We should also have been told how many Special tasks will there be at one time, and how often will they be refreshed. We know that logging in will award 5 Astral Acclaim, and now know that the Wizard's Vault is not a one for one copy. So, during a 28 day cycle for logging in we are given: 20 Mystic Coins, 35 Laurels, 2000 Luck, 10 Tomes of Knowledge, 4 Gem Store items, 3 Transmutation charges, Several crafting materials, 1 Account Bound piece of Equipment of Exotic Rarity, 1 Celebration Booster, 1 Chest of Loyalty (choice between 8 Obsidian Shards and 7 Mystic Clovers, 20 Laurels, 6 Tomes of Knowledge, or random Ascended crafting material) , and 2% permanent increase to account gold find, what from that list can we expect to be able to obtain with 140 Astral Acclaim?

It would be nice if y'all decide to do a live stream showing this new system. Y'all were all about some live streams with End of Dragons, but with this expansions y'all want to hold your cards so close to your chests y'all can't even see what you're doing.

[Acheron.1580]

4 hours ago, Cuks.8241 said:

I think Anet can balance gains of MCs quite easily because there are limited supplies so it will happen as Anet will want it to happen in the long run (with likely market shocks at the release).

If I assume that you will be able to buy the same amount of coins and clovers per month as you get now from daily logins (and rare forger daily) thats just a big plus for me. Because there are not many daily rewards I care for so I can work towards those I like. This also means I dont have to login every day, which I already don't, so my gains will only increase. Again this is under assumption the monthly pool stays the same. 

I think in the end the price of coins will be in the 1g range (after potential Anet adjustments) and it will be easier to get them for most players because they won't have to actually login every single day for it but will just prioritize it with vault purchases. We might even see the opposite, that even many casual players that only login for the weekend will be able to get a lot more of them than they do now. Also these legendary starter packs might eliminate some requirements for MCs and will also drive the price down. Let's see in general I see this as very positive for majority of the player base.

The strength behind it being a "seasons pass" style is they can actually manipulate the market a bit by having things more or less accessible between seasons. They probably wouldn't for MC because they are required in large numbers already but if it does feel like the numbers produced are too low they can bring it up next season.

[Sparky.6284]

I like this change. I was never a fan of people having 100 alts to log in for mystic coins and other stuff. I mean you still can but you have to play the game a little bit. And that benefits everyone.

[Acheron.1580]

14 minutes ago, Brave Mallyki.1563 said:

Y'all should have shown the rewards section of the vault. This was a useless blog post.

That's pretty much each announcement in a nutshell, was the same with the relic system. We got a sample of 3 or 4 relics at best. Since they haven't elaborated any further on this, with less than a week to go for launch this is probably the information we get until then.

But if you think you are going to get the same amount of rewards just for logging in you are going to be very disappointed. As for the karma and other things for actually doing dailies, anybody's guess.

Edited August 16, 2023 by Acheron.1580

[Brave Mallyki.1563]

24 minutes ago, Acheron.1580 said:

That's pretty much each announcement in a nutshell, was the same with the relic system. We got a sample of 3 or 4 relics at best. Since they haven't elaborated any further on this, with less than a week to go for launch this is probably the information we get until then.

But if you think you are going to get the same amount of rewards just for logging in you are going to be very disappointed. As for the karma and other things for actually doing dailies, anybody's guess.

I don't think it will be the same. I want them to come out and tell us straight up what we will be losing with this new system, and for them to stop tiptoeing around this change to something that has been in the game for almost 9 years. 

[Acheron.1580]

1 minute ago, Brave Mallyki.1563 said:

I don't think it will be the same. I want them to come out and tell us straight up what we will be losing with this new system, and for them to stop tiptoeing around this change to something that has been in the game for almost 9 years. 

There's a lot of parallels here with the legendary runes and relics discussion in terms of how vague it is. Considering how that "ended", the answer is simply wait and see. My assumption is that I will be disappointed with the execution based on everything else Anet has done for a long time now. Expect the worst, hope for the best.

[Astralporing.1957]

8 minutes ago, Brave Mallyki.1563 said:

I don't think it will be the same. I want them to come out and tell us straight up what we will be losing with this new system, and for them to stop tiptoeing around this change to something that has been in the game for almost 9 years. 

They probably didn't want too much negative info to be included in articles about SotO. Sure, that might mean players will be more disappointed later, but that would be later, not today.

[jahaan.1405]

Completely lost.......So, until we save up this new "currency", no mystic coins or laurels? Not worried about clovers, you can get them from WvW reward tracks, that is if one can advance in WvW anymore because of the extreme imbalance.

[Acheron.1580]

6 minutes ago, jahaan.1405 said:

Completely lost.......So, until we save up this new "currency", no mystic coins or laurels? Not worried about clovers, you can get them from WvW reward tracks, that is if one can advance in WvW anymore because of the extreme imbalance.

The good thing about wvw reward tracks is you don't have to be good, just present to advance them. As far as the purchasing yea it's going to be weird. There will be dry spells of not getting stuff since you will probably be saving up to get the things you want most first, so in general you probably won't see returns early in the season.

[WRay.2391]

1 hour ago, Sparky.6284 said:

I like this change. I was never a fan of people having 100 alts to log in for mystic coins and other stuff. I mean you still can but you have to play the game a little bit. And that benefits everyone.

I was never fan of ppl who are jealous because other ppl do something within ToS.

[WRay.2391]

21 hours ago, vrauns.3215 said:

And my point is still this, they didn't have to give us a free battlepass and yet they did and all they are asking for us is to grind a little to get astral acclaim.

"they are asking for us is to grind a little" - this is always a slippery slope in my experience. GW2 grind level was good IMO, now most probably this will change, and will continue to be worse every expansion.

[Sjentra.3409]

Alt accounts was the ONLY way to even remotely farm mystic coins. And when you have items that require 77 clovers + 250 coins there's no way you're not buying MC's that came from alts unless you've been around since the beginning when MCs were in the pennies. Since EOD came out; I've gone through 4,252 mystic coins to craft 1,286 clovers.

Now if that changes to where i can farm them via the WV; that would be nice; but based so far on their track record, i don't have high hopes (far from it based on the prices that they chose for the WvW weekly vendor).

[Acheron.1580]

The grind a little is basically what people were doing before by playing and doing the daily stuff. The impact of this is mostly affecting people with "passive income" farms. Even if it falls within ToS, the fact Anet is addressing it in this way should suggest what they think about it. 

I can tag drakkar and afk my way to loot. I can do the same to Soo-Wan, or Choya pinata, or Auric Basin, or just afk farms. They all fall within ToS, but you aren't going to see anyone stand up for people affected by a change that would remove them other than people who were abusing them. It isn't jealousy, it's the idea that people, in real life and in games, don't like systems being abused to benefit people who quite frankly don't deserve it. You can say paying real money means you deserve the right to generate infinite gold without doing anything to earn it, but you'll be hard pressed to argue how such a system improved the game as a whole, and as a result it's hard to defend how removing a system like that harms the game.

[idpersona.3810]

2 hours ago, Brave Mallyki.1563 said:

Y'all should have shown the rewards section of the vault. This was a useless blog post. It didn't really say anything different than when it was announced at the end of June. The only meaningful addition was a screenshot of the Weekly tab. There should have been much more information with such a big overhaul to a fundamental component of the game. We should have been shown what the new Dailies tab and the all new Special tab will look like. We should have been yolf how many Daily tasks will we be given to choose from, and how many do we need to complete in a day to max out the Astral Acclaim for the day. We should have been told if the Daily tasks have the same rewards as they do now, such as Sips of Liquid Karma, Writs of Experience, Badges of Honor, Potions of WvW Reward, Mist-Hardened Lockboxes, Potions of PvP Reward, Shards of Glory, etc., or if those rewards have been completely replaced with Astral Acclaim. We should have been told how the Wizard’s Vault Daily Completionist achievement is different from the current Daily Completionist achievement. We know we will still get the 10 AP if not capped, but what about the 2 gold? We should also have been told how many Special tasks will there be at one time, and how often will they be refreshed. We know that logging in will award 5 Astral Acclaim, and now know that the Wizard's Vault is not a one for one copy. So, during a 28 day cycle for logging in we are given: 20 Mystic Coins, 35 Laurels, 2000 Luck, 10 Tomes of Knowledge, 4 Gem Store items, 3 Transmutation charges, Several crafting materials, 1 Account Bound piece of Equipment of Exotic Rarity, 1 Celebration Booster, 1 Chest of Loyalty (choice between 8 Obsidian Shards and 7 Mystic Clovers, 20 Laurels, 6 Tomes of Knowledge, or random Ascended crafting material) , and 2% permanent increase to account gold find, what from that list can we expect to be able to obtain with 140 Astral Acclaim?

It would be nice if y'all decide to do a live stream showing this new system. Y'all were all about some live streams with End of Dragons, but with this expansions y'all want to hold your cards so close to your chests y'all can't even see what you're doing.

All of this.

It's extremely frustrating that we don't have more information on a core system overhaul that comes out in 1 week. That last clarification update from Rubi didn't clarify anything. The fact that we have little idea what you can get with AA and no idea what anything will cost is aggravating.
I have never been so underhyped about an expansion coming out.

Edited August 16, 2023 by idpersona.3810

[Ashen.2907]

26 minutes ago, Acheron.1580 said:

generate infinite gold without doing anything to earn it,

Paying the real world money that ANet accepts and then uses to continue development of the game is doing something to earn it.

....and there is no such thing as infinite gold.

Edited August 16, 2023 by Ashen.2907

[WRay.2391]

19 minutes ago, Acheron.1580 said:

The grind a little is basically what people were doing before by playing and doing the daily stuff. The impact of this is mostly affecting people with "passive income" farms. Even if it falls within ToS, the fact Anet is addressing it in this way should suggest what they think about it. 

I can tag drakkar and afk my way to loot. I can do the same to Soo-Wan, or Choya pinata, or Auric Basin, or just afk farms. They all fall within ToS, but you aren't going to see anyone stand up for people affected by a change that would remove them other than people who were abusing them. It isn't jealousy, it's the idea that people, in real life and in games, don't like systems being abused to benefit people who quite frankly don't deserve it. You can say paying real money means you deserve the right to generate infinite gold without doing anything to earn it, but you'll be hard pressed to argue how such a system improved the game as a whole, and as a result it's hard to defend how removing a system like that harms the game.

The only intention here is to force credit card swipe more often for gems. Anet probably understands that a lot of alt owners are ppl who has no time to grind, but potentially have money. So they made alt useless in hopes to get more money. So same ppl who "don't deserve it" will just pay more or will concentrate on real life. If you see this a win, good for you.

[Chichimec.9364]

25 minutes ago, Acheron.1580 said:

...You can say paying real money means you deserve the right to generate infinite gold without doing anything to earn it, but you'll be hard pressed to argue how such a system improved the game as a whole, and as a result it's hard to defend how removing a system like that harms the game.

Hmm, as I said earlier in this thread, I have one main account and four alt accounts. For all five accounts I bought the HoT/PoF bundle, the EoD expansion, as well as such QOL items as the 3 permanent salvage kits, the home portal stone, the Recharging Portal to Friend, a set of permanent gathering tools, and the share inventory slots to hold those QOL items. All that was added income for Anet, which benefited both the company and everyone of us who enjoys playing the game. I've put a lot more money into my main account of course, including pre-purchasing SotO but clearly there are some positives to people having alt accounts.

Edited August 16, 2023 by Chichimec.9364

[Acheron.1580]

1 minute ago, WRay.2391 said:

The only intention here is to force credit card swipe more often for gems. Anet probably understands that a lot of alt owners are ppl who has no time to grind, but potentially have money. So they made alt useless in hopes to get more money. So same ppl who "don't deserve it" will just pay more or will concentrate on real life. If you see this a win, good for you.

You are absolutely right. I'm not debating that at all. It goes back to my early comment that exploits get fixed when it is costing Anet money down the line.

[Acheron.1580]

2 minutes ago, Chichimec.9364 said:

Hmm, as I said earlier in this thread, I have one main account and four alt accounts. For all five accounts I bought the HoT/PoF bundle, the EoD expansion, as well as such QOL items as the 3 permanent salvage kits, the home portal stone, the Recharging Portal to Friend, a set of permanent gathering tools, and the share inventory slots to hold those QOL items. All that was added income for Anet, which benefited both the company and everyone of us who enjoys playing the game. I've put a lot more money into my main account of course, including pre-purchasing SotO but clearly there were some positives to people having alt accounts.

I think 4-5 is reasonable. Assuming daily stuff takes 5-15 mins and the rewards for participating are even more than before I see this as a win for you too. For people with 20-40 accounts, I have no sympathy (and in those cases I really doubt they have invested anything into them beyond being able to log in).

[WRay.2391]

Just now, Acheron.1580 said:

You are absolutely right. I'm not debating that at all. It goes back to my early comment that exploits get fixed when it is costing Anet money down the line.

Well, for future active players I would start worrying about prices of MCs, after majority of supply will be washed off the market, not Anet income.

[Acheron.1580]

1 minute ago, WRay.2391 said:

Well, for future active players I would start worrying about prices of MCs, after majority of supply will be washed off the market, not Anet income.

Not an unreasonable concern but we may see a decrease in price if MCs are easier to get for the individual, or the legendary starter kits (while maybe not useful to people who have the legendary already in terms of value) might be a big swing for those players. We just don't know yet.

[WRay.2391]

1 minute ago, Acheron.1580 said:

I think 4-5 is reasonable. Assuming daily stuff takes 5-15 mins and the rewards for participating are even more than before I see this as a win for you too. For people with 20-40 accounts, I have no sympathy (and in those cases I really doubt they have invested anything into them beyond being able to log in).

If you have 2 hours a day to play, even 15 mins for 5 alts will make you stop playing at this point. You do not understand time limitation some players have.

[idpersona.3810]

8 minutes ago, WRay.2391 said:

If you have 2 hours a day to play, even 15 mins for 5 alts will make you stop playing at this point. You do not understand time limitation some players have.

100%

I would also add that I think the majority of players likely don't have a solid 2 hours a day to play. I've known plenty of players who do log-ins during the week and that's it, and only play for a 2-4 hour block 1 or 2 days on the weekend.

[Acheron.1580]

15 minutes ago, Ashen.2907 said:

Paying the real world money that ANet accepts and then uses to continue development of the game is doing something to earn it.

....and there is no such thing as infinite gold.

Let's just assume you are some kitten streamer who bought 40 accounts and then brags about how you make 2K gold a month doing nothing. And then other people start doing it too. And you spent what $400-$500 buying those accounts? But now you make so much gold each month that you never have to spend a dime buying gems ever again. Guess where Anet probably makes most of their money. So early yea they are thrilled you spent so much buying their game (although you just did it when it was on a discount but hey). And now they won't see a dime of revenue from you again. You did nothing to earn it, you threw money at an exploit, which was publicly announced, and of course was going to be closed off at some point.

And yes, the gold is infinite. The resources you are getting literally come from thin air, you have to do nothing but show up to get it.

[Acheron.1580]

15 minutes ago, WRay.2391 said:

If you have 2 hours a day to play, even 15 mins for 5 alts will make you stop playing at this point. You do not understand time limitation some players have.

It took me something like 4 years to finish HoT. I do understand time limitations very well, my job left me no room for person enjoyment but I got in what I could. Still wouldn't have done passive gold farming even back then.