what weapon is best for open world solo herald

[ohoren.5278]

what is the best weapon to use for solo open world...

[UncreativeGreen.2019]

1 hour ago, ohoren.5278 said:

what is the best weapon to use for solo open world...

What stats do you plan to play with? because there are weapons that go better with power and others that go better with condi... though the condi ones also fill the hybrid role on rev quite well. But over all for OW, its about finding a espec and weapons you like, and then making stats and traits support your preference.

[ohoren.5278]

celestial gs or celes mace and axe,is there any diffrents?or should i just stick to power gs or mace axe herald,can power herald solo open world?

Edited October 12, 2023 by ohoren.5278

[UncreativeGreen.2019]

for power herald... Sword, offSword, and Greatsword will synergize best for damage. offAxe will be a middle point for damage/cc even on a power build. And if you like the weapons you can look at offShield or staff as utility weapons to help with sustain and cc if you need a bit of extra survivability. If you want ranged damage I'd use Shortbow over hammer, even in a pure power build, hammer is just in a rough place for OW. Mace is more of a condi/hybrid weapon, so I wouldn't use it in a pure power build.

[arazoth.7290]

celestial stats + shortbow and mace/axe.

 

You can make tough builds with it for doing all kind of content and same time doing pretty good damage because hybrid

[ohoren.5278]

can a celes gs and celes sbow work for open world??

[arazoth.7290]

3 hours ago, ohoren.5278 said:

can a celes gs and celes sbow work for open world??

yes, depends stats how effective. Greatsword is a power weapon, the small amount of chills doesn't gives much torment if traited. So greatsword and short bow with power stats. SB can be condi, hybrid or power

[Buran.3796]

14 hours ago, ohoren.5278 said:

can a celes gs and celes sbow work for open world??

   Will work. You will have the same vitality and ferocity as with  marauder stats, but will lose damage with the greatsword because is mostly a power weapon and you will have less power and precission, but on the other hand your short bow will deliver roughly the same damage as with marauder stats, since you get condition damage and expertise and the sb is a fully hybrid weapon. Finally, you get extra armor and boon duration for free, so your sustain will be higher.

   Typically a celestial or condition based Revenant build will run Mallyx legend with mace & axe as main weapons to maximize damage, so your weapons of choice (gs and sb) will deliver lower damage (specially the greatsword for the reasons explained), but will work? Absolutely. The only problem is that in this build the gs will be mostly a replacement of the staff: a weapon for blocks and some mobility, since most of your damage will come from conditions from the bow and/or legend, and the greatsword won't deliver impressive numbers with Requiem or other one-shoot hits.

   IF you want a build with gs + short bow in which the gs really is the protagonist then you will need to move to (at least) marauder stats: with marauder will also be entirely viable for OW solo and you'll hit large numbers with your burst and the gs will one shoot most of regular mobs, BUT soloing some bounties will be way harder because you'll lose damage mitigation (thoughness), self sustain (healing power and boon duration) and because by nature when a power build gets crowd controled or even when tries to avoid damage it oftenly does 0 damage, whereas condi builds can easily defend and deliver damage and there's always condi procs ticking.

[Elricht Kaltwind.8796]

I like sword and shield the best, with either staff (for good heals and CC) or greatsword (awesome damage)

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

59 minutes ago, Buran.3796 said:

  sb is a fully hybrid weapon. 

Pleaseeee stop spreading this misinformation. It is not a “fully hybrid weapon.” It’s is VERY MUCH first and foremost a Condi Weapon that happens to have “okay” power scaling. This idea that it’s “pure hybrid” and works “equally well on a power build” is completely false. It only works “well on a power build” because there are no other even close to viable options.

I’d encourage you to go run tests with “Only Shortbow” on the golem in full berserker gear with power traits and then run tests with Viper/Celestial/etc with Condi traits “Only Shortbow.” You’ll notice the disparity between the builds immediately and realize the truth that it’s a Condi weapon with “okay” power scaling. 

[Buran.3796]

25 minutes ago, LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

Pleaseeee stop spreading this misinformation. It is not a “fully hybrid weapon.” It’s is VERY MUCH first and foremost a Condi Weapon that happens to have “okay” power scaling. This idea that it’s “pure hybrid” and works “equally well on a power build” is completely false. It only works “well on a power build” because there are no other even close to viable options.

   It does better damage than hammer in any gear stat combination. If your ranged "condi weapon" does better with berserker stats than your ranged "power weapon" (hammer) then you have to accept that is a hybrid weapon.

   I think that made it clear that the celestial version would work better than the power version, for the reasons given. But also explained what to expect about the performance of a power version (in which the gratsword and not the short bow would be the star).

   Finally, I think that the golem test is entirely irrelevant to measure OW performance. I've soleoed/tried to almost every bounty/legendary bounty in the game (which is arguably the worrst case scenario/peak difficulty for solo OW) with condi and power builds and I'm well aware of the handicaps the power Rev builds carry compared to the condi/celestial ones.

[Sobx.1758]

47 minutes ago, LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

Pleaseeee stop spreading this misinformation. It is not a “fully hybrid weapon.” It’s is VERY MUCH first and foremost a Condi Weapon that happens to have “okay” power scaling. This idea that it’s “pure hybrid” and works “equally well on a power build” is completely false. It only works “well on a power build” because there are no other even close to viable options.

I’d encourage you to go run tests with “Only Shortbow” on the golem in full berserker gear with power traits and then run tests with Viper/Celestial/etc with Condi traits “Only Shortbow.” You’ll notice the disparity between the builds immediately and realize the truth that it’s a Condi weapon with “okay” power scaling. 

Well, that might be a bit of a grey area, considering when you go full condi, you're still really runing hybrid stats. The fact is even going full power on rev, shortbow will be easly enough for ow. So "full hybrid" aside, it will simply work well anyways.

Edited October 14, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[arazoth.7290]

Try to stay on topic and help OP, instead of argueing about this aint helping OP 😅

[Buran.3796]

17 minutes ago, arazoth.7290 said:

Try to stay on topic and help OP, instead of argueing about this aint helping OP 😅

  But you already answered in the fourth line. Was the second qeustion from Oheroen what opened the theme to some nuances.

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

23 minutes ago, Buran.3796 said:

   It does better damage than hammer in any gear stat combination. If your ranged "condi weapon" does better with berserker stats than your ranged "power weapon" (hammer) then you have to accept that is a hybrid weapon.

   I think that made it clear that the celestial version would work better than the power version, for the reasons given. But also explained what to expect about the performance of a power version (in which the gratsword and not the short bow would be the star).

   Finally, I think that the golem test is entirely irrelevant to measure OW performance. I've soleoed/tried to almost every bounty/legendary bounty in the game (which is arguably the worrst case scenario/peak difficulty for solo OW) with condi and power builds and I'm well aware of the handicaps the power Rev builds carry compared to the condi/celestial ones.

It only does better than hammer since hammer is woefully undertuned. Has little to do with SB being “fully hybrid” or not. Celestial works better than Marauder on SB simply because SB IS a condi weapon first and foremost and celestial stats are effectively stronger for Condi than Power. Golem test isn’t irrelevant since it shows you how much DPS a weapon can do in a vacuum with different types of stats. Ofc Condi weapons are better for soloing legendaries; has nothing to do with SB being Fully Hybrid or not. 
 

20 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Well, that might be a bit of a grey area, considering when you go full condi, you're still really runing hybrid stats. The fact is even going full power on rev, shortbow will be easly enough for ow. So "full hybrid" aside, it will simply work well anyways.

Yes, SB works fine in Open World with any stat type. Still doesn’t make it a fully hybrid weapon which is the only thing I was commenting on.

Vipers isn’t really a hybrid stat. Sure, it has power and precision but it’s missing ferocity entirely. SB in a vacuum under Vipers is only doing 15-20% of its damage from power, the rest is all Condi. cRen with vipers is doing 10-15% of its total damage from power. Not really a hybrid stat. 

And this is why SB is NOT a fully hybrid weapon; it’s very clearly meant for full Condi stats it just happens to also perform *okay* in berserker due to *okay,* not good, power scaling. Given than Rev has no other ranged choice that’s better than it, it ends up being the best choice for both power and Condi at range, but that doesn’t make it a “full hybrid weapon.”

[Buran.3796]

18 minutes ago, LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

 Golem test isn’t irrelevant since it shows you how much DPS a weapon can do in a vacuum with different types of stats. Ofc Condi weapons are better for soloing legendaries; has nothing to do with SB being Fully Hybrid or not. 

  That last part is not mandatory true. Power Bladesworn has stronger build variants for OW than celestial Willbender, because deals more damage and has better sustain tools, at the cost of being harder to use. Celestial Mirage does at least 50% more damage (~22k) than celestial Vindicator and is clearly faster killing less demanding bosses, and yet against the hardest ones is weaker due its lower self sustain and tankyness.

   So the performance not always favours condi builds and the highest dps is not necesarely the strongest overall choice. On top of that, gameplay, ease of use and tastes are more important than just making the "optimal" choice.  For example, after playing extensively power Bladesworn, cele Spellbreaker, power Spellbreaker and cele Berserker the last 15 days I wopuld say that in terms of power I would rank them power BS > cele Zerk > cele SB but in terms of fun to me is cele Zerk > power BS > cele SB. So if a newcomers asks me "which Warrior spec to unlock first?" my answer would be "go berserker". In the case of Revenat my answer would be Vindicator, by the way.

[draxynnic.3719]

This argument is basically just demonstrating what a hybrid weapon is. Hybrid weapons used with condi stats are naturally going to do mostly condi damage, but they also have good enough power coefficients that they're competitive on power builds once the little bit of extra damage from conditions is taken out.

Power shortbow's main strength is that it comes a lot closer to gaining full benefit from Shiro-related effects (Impossible Odds, Battle Scars, possibly Facet of Nature: Shiro). Power shortbow's real heyday was before Battle Scars was nerfed, but the combination still boosts it up to a respectable output - not a default part of a max DPS rotation like it is for condi builds, but certainly something that can be taken for a ranged option and a bit of extra CC. And in solo play, having a ranged option is sometimes important, and when you don't need range, greatsword or sword/sword both do enough damage when camped that you're not losing much if you take something else in the swap.