Pay for better servers

[RisenHowl.2419]

Seriously, fix your kitten. If we can't use skills for 20s+ there's no point in playing wvw. The draw is large scale pvp which your server limits won't allow for right now

[Arianth Moonlight.6453]

I'm pretty sure that the real culprit behind the server's processing issues is all those flashy effects, not the number of players or the Necromancer minions. However, as long as they refuse to remove them, no server will be able to handle that many useless particles.

of course, the more players there are, the more flashy effects the server has to process. That's when the skill lag happens because the server is too busy creating a supernova to efficiently process any instruction.

[Puck.3697]

56 minutes ago, RisenHowl.2419 said:

Seriously, fix your kitten. If we can't use skills for 20s+ there's no point in playing wvw. The draw is large scale pvp which your server limits won't allow for right now

With all due respect, this games servers aren't bad, this game is runs large scale pvp then WoW does lol. 

 

[SirCrankR.5216]

1 hour ago, Arianth Moonlight.6453 said:

I'm pretty sure that the real culprit behind the server's processing issues is all those flashy effects, not the number of players or the Necromancer minions. However, as long as they refuse to remove them, no server will be able to handle that many useless particles.

of course, the more players there are, the more flashy effects the server has to process. That's when the skill lag happens because the server is too busy creating a supernova to efficiently process any instruction.

Why would the server be processing the graphics? That's on each individual PC and doesn't have anything to do with the skill lag.

[MedievalThings.5417]

They are using amazon web servers, which is fine for lots of users, but not lots of gaming users.  AWS are crap, as we are witnessing every day.

[XenesisII.1540]

32 minutes ago, Puck.3697 said:

With all due respect, this games servers aren't bad, this game is runs large scale pvp then WoW does lol. 

With all due respect, this game use to run better just a year ago, so I don't think it's too much for players to expect better performance than what we have now. They keep adding new skills, new effects, new procs, more spam, and it doesn't seem like they care what it's doing to the game, are they even auditing the effects to see if everything is working as it should. It's been more than 6 months of lag, first it started with rise spam that was producing lag spikes that lasted up to 30secs, now it's a constant level of lag through blob fights.

Like do we need to start spamming the forums up with videos of every lag fight to get their attention?

Saturday night, on alpines map, in the middle of open space.

[VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.]

 

[Arianth Moonlight.6453]

40 minutes ago, SirCrankR.5216 said:

Why would the server be processing the graphics?

why would the server be processing anything? That's on each individual PC and doesn't have anything to do with the skill lag.

[Custodio.6134]

6 hours ago, Arianth Moonlight.6453 said:

why would the server be processing anything? That's on each individual PC and doesn't have anything to do with the skill lag.

that´s completely wrong. To each skill used, there are at least 2 parts to it: 

1. processing its activation and result (aka, applying effects to players, applying and calculating damage etc). This is done server-sided (the information is sent from the client, to the server, then calculated and a response sent back to the client). This is what results in either lag (if the connection is bad or the server responds delayed) or skill-lag (which is fully server-sided, as the server cannot process each skill fast enough to send a real-time response). 
2. displaying and applying the effects on the player (everything you see in your "side" of the game). this is done client-sided, and only indireclty affected by latency (the client starts displaying everything after it gets the information back from the server). This is (assuming the connection and servers are fine) completely hardware-based, or in other words: low framerate/framedrops/"FPS-lag". 

So, if you press a skill, but it doesn´t activate, it clearly is a server-sided or connection-issue (sometimes both). You can easily tell the difference when using arcdps. The metrics window has all the information you need. F: framerate (fully hardware-dependant) P: ping (the amount of time between when your client sends information to the server until it receives a response from it) and R: refresh-rate (the rate at which the "status" of the game is refreshed server-sided), in other games often referred to as "tick rate". 

In every instance of server-sided issues, server-refresh-rate drops massively low (usually anything at 17 or below) you will also experience "skill-lag". This is a different type of lag, since movement is mostly dependant on your actual ping (affected by your connection, since there is no calculation from the servers involved, it´s only a synchronization between client and server without any calculations) while skills are (since they are calculated server-sided) affected by Ping and server-refresh-rate.

[geist.4126]

Getting rid of boon spam should decrease the server load.

[Chaba.5410]

Last night in NA prime the server lag was pretty bad.  You could literally see it happening before even being in combat because everyone would start micro-rubberbanding due to the server unable to send location data consistently (looks similar to fps drops).

I suspect that Anet is trying to get away with razor thin margins on AWS networking and processing power costs so spikes are not being handled well.

[Puck.3697]

On 11/12/2023 at 4:42 AM, XenesisII.1540 said:

With all due respect, this game use to run better just a year ago, so I don't think it's too much for players to expect better performance than what we have now

Well yeah every game on the markets performance deteriates over time, its on the same servers getting more and more outdated by everything around it. 

Nothings built these days to live a decade and still run as new. Lol the issue is mmorpgs can't just swap over there servers.

And tbh I doubt gw2 has a budget to be able to fight it. The game makes peanuts compared to competitors. I doubt anet are sat there like "meh we could fix it but let's laugh at people leaving our game"

The likelyhood is. There isn't anything they can do in their budget size to fix the situation 

Confuse faces appear 😂

Guild wars 2 make 75 million in 2 years, WoW make 173million in a single quarter, dont act like this game isn't running on a 3rd of any other big mmorpg title, GW2 is ncsofts lowest earner. 

This means when ncsoft look at where to put money in, they reliese, putting money into any other game, will net them a larger income. 

I'd honestly love to see anets budget size, compared to that of its competitors, brcause given WoW devs situation, and how we know they came out regarding work enviroments / budgets / wages on that games profit margins. I can only imagine gw2s situation is 3x worse. 

If activison would gut Blizzard in terms of staff, and budget to uphold a game earning 173million a quarter, what is Ncsoft doing In terms of anet upholding a game earning 14 million a quarter. 

Edited November 16, 2023 by Puck.3697

[TheGrimm.5624]

8 minutes ago, Puck.3697 said:

Well yeah every game on the markets performance deteriates over time, its on the same servers getting more and more outdated by everything around it. 

I didn't apply the confused emoji but what do you mean same servers? The reason so many companies move to cloud servers is that they don't need to manage their server tech but pay a 3rd party for that but they have to pay based on assigned resources for that virtual server. Its not an age issue if its server side but expected and applied resources. Are they renting enough resources to host. This isn't an issue of aging servers. 

[Puck.3697]

3 minutes ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

I didn't apply the confused emoji but what do you mean same servers? The reason so many companies move to cloud servers is that they don't need to manage their server tech but pay a 3rd party for that but they have to pay based on assigned resources for that virtual server. Its not an age issue if its server side but expected and applied resources. Are they renting enough resources to host. This isn't an issue of aging servers

I'm saying the hardware in the company, will become more and more outdated,

and well yeah that comes with my second argument. 

The game prolly doesn't make enough for NCsoft to give the nod to paying into increasing the capacity. 

And the game still has a engine. Lol, which is even stated when u Google concerning this... the servers don't optimise the game, the engine does. 

Unoptimised games lag. The game runs on a modified gw1 engine, its not optimised to run on today's PCs or cores at full capacity. 

Edited November 16, 2023 by Puck.3697

[TheGrimm.5624]

Just now, Puck.3697 said:

I'm saying the hardware in the company, will become more and more outdated,

 

and well yeah that comes with my second argument. 

The game prolly doesn't make enough for NCsoft to give the nod to paying into increasing the capacity. 

They don't host their hardware. I can't speak for outside of NA but they outsource the hardware to other companies. In NA they use AWS cloud services. So the age of the hardware is not the issue its how much resources they pay to rent those services. If they underestimate the resources requirement we end up with less processing power and potentially more latency.

[Puck.3697]

4 minutes ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

They don't host their hardware. I can't speak for outside of NA but they outsource the hardware to other companies. In NA they use AWS cloud services. So the age of the hardware is not the issue its how much resources they pay to rent those services. If they underestimate the resources requirement we end up with less processing power and potentially more latency.

They have a engine, and no its optimisation can result in lag. 

And which comes at a price yes,?. If the game don't have the money to fund said price they cant rent servers for the resources required. 

Edited November 16, 2023 by Puck.3697

[TheGrimm.5624]

2 minutes ago, Puck.3697 said:

They have a engine, and no its optimisation can result in lag. 

But they don't own the hardware. AWS isn't going to leave older hardware in place since they can charge more customers more resources as needed which is what encourages them to keep upgrading and the underlining cloud hardware.

[XenesisII.1540]

28 minutes ago, Puck.3697 said:

Well yeah every game on the markets performance deteriates over time, its on the same servers getting more and more outdated by everything around it. 

Nothings built these days to live a decade and still run as new. Lol the issue is mmorpgs can't just swap over there servers.

And tbh I doubt gw2 has a budget to be able to fight it. The game makes peanuts compared to competitors. I doubt anet are sat there like "meh we could fix it but let's laugh at people leaving our game"

The likelyhood is. There isn't anything they can do in their budget size to fix the situation 

Confuse faces appear 😂

Guild wars 2 make 75 million in 2 years, WoW make 173million in a single quarter, dont act like this game isn't running on a 3rd of any other big mmorpg title, GW2 is ncsofts lowest earner. 

This means when ncsoft look at where to put money in, they reliese, putting money into any other game, will net them a larger income. 

I'd honestly love to see anets budget size, compared to that of its competitors, brcause given WoW devs situation, and how we know they came out regarding work enviroments / budgets / wages on that games profit margins. I can only imagine gw2s situation is 3x worse. 

If activison would gut Blizzard in terms of staff, and budget to uphold a game earning 173million a quarter, what is Ncsoft doing In terms of anet upholding a game earning 14 million a quarter. 

Not my confused emote either.

That's a lot of excuses. Go ahead and look at their quarterly reports, what they make hasn't dropped from a year ago when the servers were performing at a normal level for years before it. 

They use amazon servers to run the game, not their own, they made that switch years ago.

 

 

Edited November 16, 2023 by XenesisII.1540

[Puck.3697]

1 minute ago, XenesisII.1540 said:

Not my confused emote either.

That's a lot of excuses. Go ahead and look at their quarterly reports, what they make hasn't dropped from a year ago when the servers were performing at a normal level for years before it.

They use amazon servers to run the game, not their own, they made that switch years ago.

 

They make 14 million a quarter. And no, but we are in a age where inflation has happened rapidly and things since covid have gotten alot more expensive. 

Not to mention, that just proves the games been failing for years and ncsoft are likely taking resources out of gw2. 

[TheGrimm.5624]

2 minutes ago, Puck.3697 said:

They make 14 million a quarter. And no, but we are in a age where inflation has happened rapidly and things since covid have gotten alot more expensive. 

Not to mention, that just proves the games been failing for years and ncsoft are likely taking resources out of gw2. 

I think this more of a point of there is a lot that is unknown. There are a lot of unknown variables that players make assumptions on. Example, where servers are hosted, I honestly have no idea where non-US servers are managed from. 

Game been failing for years? Business managers make questionable calls since the beginning of time and everyone else questions it else there wouldn't have ever been a stock market. Why are you still playing it if its failed? Do I hedge my bets, yes as I say to them don't slack since trouble is coming and don't assume you have unlimited time. But failed? No we have full maps queues that still indicated that failed is a bit much. But failed and compliant is not the same.

Taking resources away? Maybe during the restructure but since then? No wouldn't agree there.

[Puck.3697]

3 hours ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

Why are you still playing it if its failed? Do I hedge my bets, yes as I say to them don't slack since trouble is coming and don't assume you have unlimited time. But failed? No we have full maps queues that still indicated that failed is a bit much. But failed and compliant is not the same

You can enjoy something that's unpopular and accept its unpopular. 

I play WoW and gw2. I just log on WoW if I got nothing to do in gw2. Lol

Ironically however WoW is going down hill too. But it stil prints money 😂

Edited November 16, 2023 by Puck.3697

[Chaba.5410]

6 hours ago, Puck.3697 said:

Ironically however WoW is going down hill too. But it stil prints money

Something something first to market advantage something, established IP something...

*yawn*

[Puck.3697]

1 minute ago, Chaba.5410 said:

Something something first to market advantage something, established IP something...

WIth due respect

WoW brought 12 million in its Peak.

GW2 brought 12 million in its Peak

Guild wars was also a Established IP. Lets not forget the fact this game was very much living, WoW prints money because it knows how to print money. WoW never aimed to be consumer friendly, Guild wars 2 went too far in COnsumer friendly. and because of this, WoW got a crowd of players who will Pay for entertainment, while GW2 grabbed People who would scream at the idea of game costing more then absolute bare minimum.

Its nothing to do with anything else lol, WoWs model generates More money. GW2 doesnt, its that simple,

WoW inflated its costs, and Let boosting go mad to Print money thorugh its gold buying systems, While gw2 ensured gems were Achievable by f2p players and prevented them breaking the market to the same extents the average player in WoW, wont get anyway Gold wise without buying Tokens. lol, They then make it worth 1 months sub or £10 for a £17 input. so they managed to make Subs more Expensive Lmfao.

Im sorry, but its obvious why WoW prints money, even if its lowest form. GW2s monetization is to cost the absolute bare minimum. and if u pay the bare minimum you can only expect to recieve the bare minimum. 

[Chaba.5410]

1 hour ago, Puck.3697 said:

Guild wars was also a Established IP.

Huh?

Blizzard's Warcraft IP dates back into the 90s with the Warcraft 1, 2, and 3 games.  You realize how popular and top selling those were before WoW, right?

ArenaNet was founded by some devs who left Blizzard.  The GW IP was created only in the 2000s for the first game, which wasn't a typical kind of MMO.

[geist.4126]

4 hours ago, Puck.3697 said:

WoW never aimed to be consumer friendly, Guild wars 2 went too far in COnsumer friendly

WoW was THE consumer friendly mmorpg of its time. It had less grind, less necessity to find friends to play the game and it was the only game you could "solo" to maxlevel and even do stuff on maxlevel without having to make friends or join guilds.
You have to compare it to the games which it competed with not with your 2023 experience.

And of course it always was a way bigger IP than Guild Wars. Guild Wars 1 had low to non-existent player numbers on the Western market compared to WoW and especially to Blizzard products. WoW took the fame from Warcraft 1-3, the good standing of Blizzard by fans all over the world.
They made it a cashcow in the last 6 years and with people having invested almost 20 years in a product they have a relative secure base of income.