State of WvW - a sing-along

[Luranni.9470]

 

[Burial.1958]

Okei this is a real Masterpiece XD That is like a Manifesto xD

Edited November 17 by Burial.1958

[Chips.7968]

It's a documentary. 

[Riba.3271]

First GW2 video on YT that was actually good 👍

Edited November 18 by Riba.3271

[Lorelei.3918]

"Don't buy the Xpacs, you will get Fk'd" Has been Guild Wars core business model since the very beginning of GW1. It's not just that Xpacs add power creep, they add a piece of a power creep puzzle. A particular skill, or mechanic, that is BIS, and you need to collect all the Xpacs to have all the BIS skills, gear and mechanics.

The worst part about this is in GW2, a lot of the newer profession specializations are bad from a gameplay perspective. Yes, they are OP, but in a boring face roll kind of way. So even if you have the Xpacs, you don't really want to run the new profs until your guild leader demands that you do. 

[ArchonWing.9480]

Ah, this feels like a musical adaptation of my forum posts. I am no longer needed here because we have reached peak WvW in this video.

Approved++

Edited November 20 by ArchonWing.9480

[adammantium.8031]

Oh what genius 🙂

[TheGrimm.5624]

5 hours ago, ArchonWing.9480 said:

Ah, this feels like a musical adaptation of my forum posts. I am no longer needed here because we have reached peak WvW in this video.

Approved++

lol, Luranni makes me miss weekends in Warhammer where we all could cross time zones and could hit that sweet spot where we could have a ton of time zones on together and have a blast as we mixed it up. 

Except for Slacker: Slacker, confused me. No one, and I mean no one, should stay up that long after hitting that many pubs over night and then should try and lead a WvW dungeon while defending from incoming invading WvW players that have retaken the zone of control and try explaining a dungeon mechanic while we are fighting 4 v1. Love you man lol!

[Aeolus.3615]

On 11/19/2023 at 7:08 PM, Lorelei.3918 said:

"Don't buy the Xpacs, you will get Fk'd" Has been Guild Wars core business model since the very beginning of GW1. It's not just that Xpacs add power creep, they add a piece of a power creep puzzle. A particular skill, or mechanic, that is BIS, and you need to collect all the Xpacs to have all the BIS skills, gear and mechanics.

The worst part about this is in GW2, a lot of the newer profession specializations are bad from a gameplay perspective. Yes, they are OP, but in a boring face roll kind of way. So even if you have the Xpacs, you don't really want to run the new profs until your guild leader demands that you do. 

if that would happens Anet devs would make expacts so broken that u would leave the game or would be forced to get them, way more than they tend to be.

It is sad that this lamers promise horizontal progression on elite specs but elite specs tend to be more vertical sometimes than  even  some other old elite specs, and that should not happen.

Edited November 20 by Aeolus.3615

[Thomas.2564]

What's the msg in this vid? That roamers are pissed that they cant kill blob's with with thief's and mesmers? And by trying to cloud em? Since this is a gandi vid, im gonna assume that's  the case. And they think the boons are to blame for it? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Other then that it was great vid 👍

Edited November 23 by Thomas.2564

[TheGrimm.5624]

19 minutes ago, Thomas.2564 said:

What's the msg in this vid? That roamers are pissed that they cant kill blob's with with thief's and mesmers? And by trying to cloud em? Since this is a gandi vid, im gonna assume that's  the case. And they think the boons are to blame for it? 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Other then that it was great vid 👍

Can't answer your question, but are there just 2 sides to this issue? Boons versus roamers? What about boons versus corrupts and strips? How would you judge the balance in boons versus counter boon currently? And no, I am NA so no server relations at the time of the question. Trying to see where players see the balance in the sides at personally.

[Thomas.2564]

10 minutes ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

Can't answer your question, but are there just 2 sides to this issue? Boons versus roamers? What about boons versus corrupts and strips? How would you judge the balance in boons versus counter boon currently? And no, I am NA so no server relations at the time of the question. Trying to see where players see the balance in the sides at personally.

Boons vs roamers? What the hell dos that mean? If ur roaming ur roaming.. YOU choose what u want to play. Rather it be a boon sustain build with little dmg or a dps build with little sustain. I also feel like the boons are to much atm, I think everyone dos. Specially cele, when we are talking about roaming, is very busted. Im not counter arguing that at all.

As u said ur from NA, so not understanding the point im making is understandable. So let me give u a little insight, into the world of gandarra. Plz note this i my view of them, from the passed 8 years or so. Probably gonna get some comments from gandi. But again, looking from my point of view. 

Gandi is basically a server consisting of NOTHING but ppl playing thief's or mesmers. They dont have any tags to speak of, at least not from what im aware of. So, when u choose to go there bl, be it as a roamer, or with a zerg/blob. U get sorrounded by 20 to 30 thief's, mesmers or any type of free casting build u can think of. Which is fine, that's how they choose to play and defend. And it works for them, mostly!

Now, here is where the issue is. Yes u can cloud blobs this way, IF the blob is bad, and disorganised. But if the blob is good and tight. Trying to wipe them with thief's, mesmer's and freecasting, aint gonna cut it. Boons or NO boons. Hence my first comment. 

[TheGrimm.5624]

4 minutes ago, Thomas.2564 said:

Boons vs roamers? What the hell dos that mean?

I don't know, you said it it, " That roamers are pissed that they cant kill blob's", what were you talking about?

4 minutes ago, Thomas.2564 said:

If ur roaming ur roaming.. YOU choose what u want to play.

Again you brought Roamers into the conversation.

4 minutes ago, Thomas.2564 said:

Rather it be a boon sustain build with little dmg or a dps build with little sustain. I also feel like the boons are to much atm, I think everyone dos. Specially cele, when we are talking about roaming, is very busted. Im not counter arguing that at all.

Maybe this is part of the difference, not sure where I read in roamer in the video.

4 minutes ago, Thomas.2564 said:

As u said ur from NA, so not understanding the point im making is understandable. So let me give u a little insight, into the world of gandarra. Plz note this i my view of them, from the passed 8 years or so. Probably gonna get some comments from gandi. But again, looking from my point of view. 

This I can understand, don't have any side in this part of the conversation nor any point of reference outside of points made about roamers versus boonballs. I do understand our mileage varies there and can appreciate there.

4 minutes ago, Thomas.2564 said:

Gandi is basically a server consisting of NOTHING but ppl playing thief's or mesmers. They dont have any tags to speak of, at least not from what im aware of. So, when u choose to go there bl, be it as a roamer, or with a zerg/blob. U get sorrounded by 20 to 30 thief's, mesmers or any type of free casting build u can think of. Which is fine, that's how they choose to play and defend. And it works for them, mostly!

Now, here is where the issue is. Yes u can cloud blobs this way, IF the blob is bad, and disorganised. But if the blob is good and tight. Trying to wipe them with thief's, mesmer's and freecasting, aint gonna cut it. Boons or NO boons. Hence my first comment. 

On the NA side this is Mag. I admit as a Roamer/Havoc I like fighting Mag but get a lot of players that may be more group orientated may not. So that makes sense.

I appreciate the reply to better understand the what/why/where. 

[Thomas.2564]

2 minutes ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

I don't know, you said it it, " That roamers are pissed that they cant kill blob's", what were you talking about?

What i mean is, that this vid is basically based on the premise, that gandi cant kill the blobs on their bl, cause they all play roaming classes. Thief's and mesmers mostly. And giving these classes a bit more boonstrip or reducing the amount of boons in huge groups, aint gonna change the outcome for gandi. When they wont organised them self. But just contiue to play the same way, they have been for the last decate or so. Their inhability to adapt to way the games is played now, is hardly anet's fault. And making a vid about the fact that u cant kill blobs with thief's, is hilarious 🤭

[TheGrimm.5624]

8 minutes ago, Thomas.2564 said:

What i mean is, that this vid is basically based on the premise, that gandi cant kill the blobs on their bl, cause they all play roaming classes. Thief's and mesmers mostly. And giving these classes a bit more boonstrip or reducing the amount of boons in huge groups, aint gonna change the outcome for gandi. When they wont organised them self. But just contiue to play the same way, they have been for the last decate or so. Their inhability to adapt to way the games is played now, is hardly anet's fault. And making a vid about the fact that u cant kill blobs with thief's, is hilarious 🤭

Appreciate the detail. Not sure if you were a Warhammer player. Luranni and I were, though on different servers and I think different regions. Sometimes it required the melee DPS to dive in to get the tanks and healers and ranged DPS in motions. This translates in GW2 to Roamers and Havocs engaging before others will do so in GW2. So at times when players comment about group versus Roamer or Havoc play it makes some of us take notice lol. So again, I appreciate the detail since its not the same thing as you were talking about. Old habits and roles.... 🙂 

[Sandzibar.5134]

BRAVO!

Magnifique! bellissimo! Encore! Encore!

 

 

[Conner.4702]

Aww crap guess my  core ranger is just a thief with a pet.

[Thomas.2564]

1 hour ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

Appreciate the detail. Not sure if you were a Warhammer player. Luranni and I were, though on different servers and I think different regions. Sometimes it required the melee DPS to dive in to get the tanks and healers and ranged DPS in motions. This translates in GW2 to Roamers and Havocs engaging before others will do so in GW2. So at times when players comment about group versus Roamer or Havoc play it makes some of us take notice lol. So again, I appreciate the detail since its not the same thing as you were talking about. Old habits and roles.... 🙂 

No worries, loosing homebl to some braindead ppt blob. Not because of skill, but purely cause they have more players, is very frustrating. And the boon spamming is out of control atm. And I dont see them fixing it anytime soon. And just adding more and more corrupts and strips aint gonna solve the issue. 

[Zepoolpe.9217]

Now take that vid and put it next to the "high quality" weapon previews Anet has released these past days and compare...

[Dagger.2035]

Great video and it speaks true to the state of the game.  It seems like the balance decisions in the past two years may either be from increasing TTK to make GvG fights more enjoyable, or to promote a melee meta to increase build diversity.  I'm hoping it is for GvG balance since that makes sense even if it causes smaller groups to dodge fights in WvW.  The melee meta will never succeed since the side with greater numbers will benefit the most from melee engagements.

Some of us tried to warn people that this would happen when they began nerfing strips and AOE damage in early 2022.  Yet some people kept trying to argue strips and damage benefit blobs just as much as the cloud.  It should be clear now that clouds benefit more from higher damage, CC, and strips.  Clouds can easily attack the blob from all sides while the blob can't focus their damage on spread out targets.  I'm sure someone will give me a hypothetic scenario where the blob is smart and splits their damage evenly to argue against this.

Prior to all of these changes there did exist some blob guilds which only had sustain and non-existent damage and CC (I usually always see a couple ANet tags in one of them).  I can't name guilds or servers, but these guilds were basically free bags for pug clouds.  Even some of them had such low damage that they could be melee-ed solo on a full glass build.  All of this means they were just bad at the game since they didn't realize damage must always be more effective than healing.  If this was ever reversed people would be unkillable.  Now these groups can just stand in red circles and win.  People no longer fight back due to the state of the game since it is impossible to finish downs when a blob isn't forced to reposition themselves to avoid damage.

[Dagger.2035]

The extra cherry on top is that support builds now get better kill credit and bags than damage builds.  If you are able to win fights playing support why switch to damage when you have far less chance of dying since you have a ton of access to condi clears, boons, stun breaks, and strong healing.  It seems as though people are aware of this now since I've been in 30+ squads where I do more than 50% of the damage.  People need to play damage so that we have a chance of getting bags.

They've also been reducing the skill ceiling of both support and damage builds which hurts the open link servers.  You are surrounded by low rank pugs which don't contribute at all.  No damage and no heals or support.  I'm not sure what they are running.  Also, a large chunk of the pugs don't chase orange swords so people that want fights on reset night are perpetually outnumbered even though maps are queued.  No amount of balance can fix this, but the recent balance patches made it worse.  This is why we need world restructuring.  These players need to be spread more evenly across the teams.

[TheGrimm.5624]

14 hours ago, Dagger.2035 said:

You are surrounded by low rank pugs which don't contribute at all.  No damage and no heals or support.  I'm not sure what they are running.  Also, a large chunk of the pugs don't chase orange swords so people that want fights on reset night are perpetually outnumbered even though maps are queued.

Sorry, you caught my eye and so I have questions. Low rank....didn't we all start that way? Where does rank in WvW mean a player knows their toon and rotation? Could not a sPvP player step in WvW and do well? I try and not assume rank means much more than time in the mode. And even then since rank is account bound it doesn't mean that the other player isn't on a toon that is only an hour old. Chasing OJs is conditional, it can good and bad depending on too many factors. 

I really can't tell which direction you were headed, else I would have left the post alone. Want to try and refine that if you have time?

[Dagger.2035]

6 hours ago, TheGrimm.5624 said:

Sorry, you caught my eye and so I have questions. Low rank....didn't we all start that way? Where does rank in WvW mean a player knows their toon and rotation? Could not a sPvP player step in WvW and do well? I try and not assume rank means much more than time in the mode. And even then since rank is account bound it doesn't mean that the other player isn't on a toon that is only an hour old. Chasing OJs is conditional, it can good and bad depending on too many factors. 

I really can't tell which direction you were headed, else I would have left the post alone. Want to try and refine that if you have time?

Of course, there are exceptions to people with low rank and I appreciate the people who make an effort to win fights.

Lowering the skill ceiling to reduce what is possible on some builds is what you have to do to balance the game.  I was trying to imply the other side effect is that it is way more difficult to carry bad players.  When I refer to low rank players, I'm referring to people that are 0-100 rank or 100-200 rank and our server seems to have an endless supply of them.  Since we are an open link server, I think it is just a never-ending, revolving door of new players.  The result is that you can never go to EB on reset night since the fights are so bad.  Even if you go to a borderland, you are lucky to get 40 people on the tag on a queued map.  On off hours, five or fewer players do most of the squad's damage and we have little to no sustain.  It just means the majority are potato players running potato builds.

You guys already saw what my server did to Blackgate, the same thing will happen once we are linked with Maguuma.  I was hoping for a Maguuma link since I'm betting that we can drop them out of T1 after a few weeks.

[TheGrimm.5624]

1 hour ago, Dagger.2035 said:

Of course, there are exceptions to people with low rank and I appreciate the people who make an effort to win fights.

Lowering the skill ceiling to reduce what is possible on some builds is what you have to do to balance the game.  I was trying to imply the other side effect is that it is way more difficult to carry bad players.  When I refer to low rank players, I'm referring to people that are 0-100 rank or 100-200 rank and our server seems to have an endless supply of them.  Since we are an open link server, I think it is just a never-ending, revolving door of new players.  The result is that you can never go to EB on reset night since the fights are so bad.  Even if you go to a borderland, you are lucky to get 40 people on the tag on a queued map.  On off hours, five or fewer players do most of the squad's damage and we have little to no sustain.  It just means the majority are potato players running potato builds.

You guys already saw what my server did to Blackgate, the same thing will happen once we are linked with Maguuma.  I was hoping for a Maguuma link since I'm betting that we can drop them out of T1 after a few weeks.

Appreciate the reply. Yours points raise some interesting questions on how new players might be seeing world selection currently. I admit I ran into what I think was a player that never entered WvW before last night based on the questions they asked and how long they let me ramble at them. They also made me ask some questions myself after logging off that I will be curious to look into tonight. This also raises a point on how new players will be assigned under the upcoming WR project and if they are planning on leaving open a intro tier that will be used to house new players that are entering the mode without a Guild and/or without a Guild that was selected as their WvW guild prior to the last sorting.