Next Vindicator nerf

[Angesombre.4630]

And then we're not even talking about mass changes that will bring other nerfs to a skill, which was occasionally useful with CC but has a huge flaw in that it lags behind when mobs are on the edge of a platform. Because it won't know which skill they're nerfing, it'll be another on the axe or mace, that's for sure.

[arazoth.7290]

Well that's 1 way to be pessimistic and giving up already, can't say more about that

[Angesombre.4630]

Just realistic after all these years of being on GW2. And just look at what's happening. 

Edited January 15 by Angesombre.4630

[Sobx.1758]

On 1/15/2024 at 1:20 AM, Buran.3796 said:

Fun thing: off hand sword is currently worse that Willbender's one despite that last one was born as a copycat from ours. Shackling Wave only roots for 1 second across all game modes whereas Advancing Strike roots for 2 seconds and slows for 3 seconds in both WvW and PvP.

Because 12 stacks of vuln and shorter cooldown doesn't count. It's always fun to see players trying to single out one skill fact while disregarding anything else it does for the sake of claiming "theirs is totally worse".

On 1/15/2024 at 5:35 AM, Angesombre.4630 said:

The Sceptre will either be very good at first and nerfed to death later on

Not really, but you sure will claim it's "nerfed to death" if it will receive any nerf at all because overreacting is just what some people on this forum love.

On 1/15/2024 at 6:24 AM, Angesombre.4630 said:

Just realistic

Nope.

[Buran.3796]

5 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Because 12 stacks of vuln and shorter cooldown doesn't count. It's always fun to see players trying to single out one skill fact while disregarding anything else it does for the sake of claiming "theirs is totally worse".

    Cooldown is 15 s + 10 energy vs 20 s. I don't think the vuln stacks have much impact since in PvE at groups the foes oftenly have 25 permanent stacks (in solo a frailty sigil grants you the same) and in PvP/WvW what truly  matters is the duration of the root.

   I instantly would trade Rev's off hand sword with WB off hand sword even if you keep 20 s cd with 10 energy cost and no vuln stacks since the 2s root + slow is much stronger at setting burst. And I would say the same about Ranger's greatsword: better mobility, better block and a useful stun + daze cc instead of the randomly delivered AoE which ends hitting nothing. In fact, I use WB swords at WvW and PvP whereas I run Revenant's off hand sword at 0 game modes across 3 Revs characters in use.

[Sobx.1758]

8 minutes ago, Buran.3796 said:

Cooldown is 15 s + 10 energy vs 20 s. I don't think the vuln stacks have much impact since in PvE at groups the foes oftenly have 25 permanent stacks (in solo a frailty sigil grants you the same) and in PvP/WvW what truly  matters is the duration of the root.

You discount vuln based on group pve and then move to pvp/wvw while still not counting vuln.

Edited January 17 by Sobx.1758

[Angesombre.4630]

1 hour ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Because 12 stacks of vuln and shorter cooldown doesn't count. It's always fun to see players trying to single out one skill fact while disregarding anything else it does for the sake of claiming "theirs is totally worse".

Not really, but you sure will claim it's "nerfed to death" if it will receive any nerf at all because overreacting is just what some people on this forum love.

Nope.

I'd just like to say that only time will tell if I was wrong or not.

[arazoth.7290]

2 hours ago, Buran.3796 said:

    Cooldown is 15 s + 10 energy vs 20 s. I don't think the vuln stacks have much impact since in PvE at groups the foes oftenly have 25 permanent stacks (in solo a frailty sigil grants you the same) and in PvP/WvW what truly  matters is the duration of the root.

   I instantly would trade Rev's off hand sword with WB off hand sword even if you keep 20 s cd with 10 energy cost and no vuln stacks since the 2s root + slow is much stronger at setting burst. And I would say the same about Ranger's greatsword: better mobility, better block and a useful stun + daze cc instead of the randomly delivered AoE which ends hitting nothing. In fact, I use WB swords at WvW and PvP whereas I run Revenant's off hand sword at 0 game modes across 3 Revs characters in use.

OH sword on rev is better. Because the synergy with shiro is better.

Also greatsword aoe hits aren't random and end up hitting what is in targetted area of it.

Edited January 17 by arazoth.7290

[Buran.3796]

5 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

You discount vuln based on group pve and then move to pvp/wvw while still not counting vuln.

  That's a fair and valid argument.

  In practical terms, tho, when I play Willbender (not oftenly) I do use off hand sword because the 2 seconds root + 3 seconds slow has  very strong follow ups as Whirling Light or Whirling Wrath which are fast heavy hitters with  multiple hits proccing burns. When I play Rev (much more oftenly) I don't use off hand sword because I usually  already have mobility enough and the 1 second root essentially faded out while I'm casting the animation of my next attack/burst. You can barely secure Sevenshot or Mist Unleashed. Axe's Temporal Rift affects more targets and its cc last longer and has more impact in teamfights (yet not as much as Advancing Strike).

[arazoth.7290]

On 1/15/2024 at 4:58 AM, arazoth.7290 said:

That's why Scepter needs some improvements on mechanical level, which it lacks atm!!!

The stronger the foundation it's build, the better it works and it will still be more then fine if barrier might get some slight nerfs 

Following changes are for PvP, WvW and PvE.

•Solution for Scepter biggest problem:

- Tether upkeep should auto generate 1 stack/second when applied to the target.(ally/enemy)  Auto attacks can still fasten up the progress.

- Tether consume should have aoe damage too when you pull the targeted enemy.

The enemy you try to pull gets damaged around himself with 300 aoe radius, 5 targets max .

Tether consume on allies has a worthwhile effect but the effect vs enemies has no damage as counterpart. So that's why it needs this change for also delivering aoe damage.

 

•Solution Scepter lesser problems finetuning:

- Auto attack: Barrier shouldn't be granted only 3rd chain sequence. Spread the barrier numbers on 3 chain auto attacks, evenly. Example if 3rd chain hit currently gives 1k barrier, it should give on each auto 333,33... instead. And a blast finisher on 3rd chain with more targets hit for aoe.

1st auto chain attack => x barrier + x damage

2nd auto chain attack => x barrier + x damage + x might

3rd auto chain attack => x barrier + x damage + x might + combo blast finisher. And hits 5 targets instead.

- 2nd skill Blossoming Aura: 

-10 energy cost => 5 energy cost

-Increase baseline pulsing damage.

-Increase baseline final hit.

-The final hit should be 5 target aoe and combo blast finisher.

- 3rd skill Outwordly Bond (tether):

To make this all sync together. 

-Tether upkeep on enemy: around you and target a fire combo field is active as long upkeep is there.

-Tether upkeep on ally: Around you and target a light combo field is active as long upkeep is there.

many confused reactions.

I guess everyone preferes an unfinished weapon and complaining on release that it is cluncky to use 👌🤝

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

9 hours ago, Buran.3796 said:

  You can barely secure Sevenshot or Mist Unleashed. Axe's

Not sure why you need to secure either of those off of Shackling Wave when you can secure Deathstrike, Chilling Isolation, or a Utility skill

[Wolf.1972]

I feel like most of the F2 complaining is coming from PvE because this was a net buff in PvP and I love it! The middle trait that gives back energy on F2 is pretty much mandatory but a godsend to have on Vindi. So just a little FYI PvErs there are other game modes so try not to complain too much 😀

[arazoth.7290]

1 hour ago, Wolf.1972 said:

I feel like most of the F2 complaining is coming from PvE because this was a net buff in PvP and I love it! The middle trait that gives back energy on F2 is pretty much mandatory but a godsend to have on Vindi. So just a little FYI PvErs there are other game modes so try not to complain too much 😀

Overall the direction they're going with it is good. It only needs some fine tuning. And some focus on the animation of Energy Meld, that would be nice too.

My thoughts =>

•In general: Baseline cd should be 20 seconds in WvW/pvp too and not only pve. And cast time removed in all content.

• Reaver's Curse: Should strengthen the entire effectiveness of the chosen grandmaster trait going along with it when activated. Like I described for the following 3 traits when Energy Meld gets pressed.

- Death drop  Gives increased vulnerability stacks and outgoing damage%. The instant dodge damage increase probably becomes little lower in reaver's curse, but better overall this is.

- Imperial impact Would be able to give also higher increased boon duration by it for atleast 3 seconds extra.

- Saint's Shield Should also give more increased outgoing healing % ontop of this.

 

•Angsiyan's Trust is overall good choice now, they shouldn't temper with that one. 

 

• Song of Arboreum:  

The vigor duration for pvp is perfectly fine, but should be higher in WvW/pve mode so that uptime becomes higher again like it used to be. 

 

It also would be better if it would be pulsing vigor/endurance to you/allies each second with total 6 seconds.

Instead of instant appliance like it is currently. Just like Order from Above is pulsing too when you can still move ofc.

==> Argument why:

• Giving direct endurance(not vigor part): If you or allies have close to full endurance bar, it's more likely to have wasted this high amount of instant endurance gain. Because it was full or almost, if you do it overtime it's less likely to happen.

• Giving vigor: When this get removed by corruption/boon rip from you/allies, you have wasted a long cd. If it would be done overtime, it can still be reapplied more likely and still have some effect. 

2nd reason why, you can affect more allies by it because it's pulsing while you are still moving to maybe another place bc reasons. 

•Animation wise:

- This is really important too !!

- Such things make an ability more appealing for the eyes of the caster to press and more recognizable for enemy too.

- Each of these middle traits should affect the animation Energy meld does. Because animation wise energy meld is really lackluster 😢

[Buran.3796]

19 hours ago, LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

Not sure why you need to secure either of those off of Shackling Wave when you can secure Deathstrike, Chilling Isolation, or a Utility skill

  Regarding Chilling Isolation, Mist Uleashed does more damage vs multiple targets and Sevenshot does more against single target (unless they clean the condition, but then you're forcing them to spent resources, which is not bad). Deathstrike is stronger, but again Whirling Wrath/Whirling Light are even stronger so my point remains: off hand sword in Willbender has entirely outclased Rev's off hand sword (better teleport range, much stronger root and better follow ups against the rooted target(s) ). I should add also that I'm not using/feel forced to take that weapon since I feel that greatsword gives more versatility (mobility + block + damage) and short bow provides the ranged pressure so much needed in most situations (like when you have a Necro sitting in Spectral Ring and a pure mele Rev has no answers against it).

 

   Edit: By the way, given that the 30th January patch won't have any impact in Rev's PvP builds, so what is now available is what will remain until late Feb including the MATat the next weekend, how much do you think Rev builds will "progress" at the January MAT? I don't see any build entering in semis...

Edited January 19 by Buran.3796