Sahne.6950 Posted January 2 Posted January 2 (edited) make it stop. Reflects on Aegis is clearly a bug. Essentially the game treats aegis the same way it does treat a regular skillblock.... it doesnt see a difference in that... and thats causing this issue. And to make matters worse.... because the projectile is not hitting the aegis, and is rather coded to be deflected BEFORE the hit happens, it doesnt even consume the aegis, like any other hit would. You can tank a whole rapid fire with a single aegis for example. Aegis wont vanish, unless you get in a meelehit. And thats just a straight bug and you cant tell me otherwise. There is two bugs overlapping on eachother producing what we call "Bladesworn". Are you lazy over there, and dont care about fixing this bug? cuz its been a few months by now..... or do you really dont know how to tell your gameengine the difference between a block caused by a channeled ability... and aegis.... Because i am conviced its the second option... How about you recycle existing and actually working mechanics and change that trait to: "Magnetic shield" Whenever you channel a block ability you gain 2 or 3 seconds of Magaura. Problem solved. Trait wont trigger on Aegis anymore. And Warriors even get something ontop, because they can now tap the block and instantly stop blocking, but still keep magaura up for the next few seconds... so it adds flexibiltiy.. .and the superduper EXTRA shiny cherry ontop... ->you dont even need to learn how to code your own game.<- 💯💥 isnt that brilliant? If you really cant do it... please just recycle things that are already there and actually work, but please spare us with this nonsense that shieldmaster currently is. Edited January 2 by Sahne.6950 7 2
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 2 Posted January 2 (edited) *Quietly stirring tea in the corner* Okay, but you're nerfing power zerker again. Either make my shield not have a 30 second CD or improve power zerker's damage dealing in pvp, then we can adjust this. Edited January 2 by Azure The Heartless.3261 1 3
Shagie.7612 Posted January 2 Posted January 2 (edited) I don't think it's a bug, honestly. I think it's a complete oversight and nobody thought the change through when they gave warrior more aegis, something it had literally zero access to until EoD. And since then, uhh... nobody really participates in pvp modes to the degree where they'd notice it. It's pretty stupid though and you're basically immune to projectiles without any thought invested into it even though you'd probably outsustain half of em anyways without it. Edited January 2 by Shagie.7612 3
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 11 minutes ago, Shagie.7612 said: complete oversight nobody thought the change through nobody really participates in pvp modes to the degree where they'd notice it. Imagine this but it's only annoying to the people playing warrior and not collaterally annoying to people fighting warrior, and youd understand what the warrior players have been dealing with for years. 1
Shagie.7612 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 Just now, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: Imagine this but it's only annoying to the people playing warrior and not collaterally annoying to people fighting warrior, and youd understand what the warrior players have been dealing with for years. Aw man my poor offmeta build is offmeta and bad nobody else has ever been in this situation before I literally only played condi zerk for like 2 years before they reworked it and the defense traitline, when it was one of, if not the actual worst spec in the entire game. Flaming Flurry couldn't even track a moving target. Warrior players have the biggest victim complex I've ever seen. It's not late-PoF anymore bud. 1
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Shagie.7612 said: Aw man my poor offmeta build is offmeta and bad nobody else has ever been in this situation before I literally only played condi zerk for like 2 years before they reworked it and the defense traitline, when it was one of, if not the actual worst spec in the entire game. Flaming Flurry couldn't even track a moving target. Warrior players have the biggest victim complex I've ever seen. It's not late-PoF anymore bud. The entire power side of warrior is off meta right now, and condi zerk is carried by akeem. Are you complacent? Wouldn't be talking about it if it was fixed. Power Zerk (and most power warrior variants, at that) being bad a long time doesn't somehow make it not bad or less important by reason of seniority. If they fix it, I stop pointing at it. Edited January 3 by Azure The Heartless.3261 1
Shagie.7612 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 12 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: The entire power side of warrior is off meta right now Offmeta, yes. But of them, the only one close to bad is power zerk, the rest are all at least decent since the Def rework. Spb and Bladesworn really aren't that bad. They just all cover the exact same niche. 12 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: condi zerk is carried by akeem. It was causing havoc prior to relics tho Akeem just made it even worse. No other class has so many people convinced it's actually really bad BUT x exists Anyways, it's a dumb trait no matter what, and power zerk being bad regardless of whether or not it exists changes nothing. 1
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Shagie.7612 said: Offmeta, yes. But of them, the only one close to bad is power zerk, the rest are all at least decent since the Def rework. Spb and Bladesworn really aren't that bad. They just all cover the exact same niche. ᴵ ʲᵘˢᵗ ʷᵃⁿⁿᵃ ᵖˡᵃʸ ᵖᵒʷᵉʳ ᶻᵉʳᵏᵉʳ ᶻᵃᵐⁿ Quote It was causing havoc prior to relics tho Akeem just made it even worse. True! It actually saw tournament presence before that, and there was even a brief condi spellbreaker run that did the same, iirc. Quote No other class has so many people convinced it's actually really bad BUT x exists Anyways, it's a dumb trait no matter what, and power zerk being bad regardless of whether or not it exists changes nothing. I have glanced enough decapitates to be really bitter about any nerfing that just fixes issues -other- people have with trying to hit the class, without addressing any issues that the class has with hitting other people. We can do both. Anyhow, derailing. Yeah, adjust shield master. Also fix power zerker, AND bladesworn, as it will surely implode by not being bubble wrapped due to its design. Edited January 3 by Azure The Heartless.3261 1
Myror.7521 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 @Azure The Heartless.3261 Power warr all in all is not bad actually. BUT power Berserker is. Cause of multiple reasons. First and biggest one is..... it does compete with Bladesworn and Condi zerker ..... both are hard spaming blocks/aegis and gain some decent self healing Ressources. You most of the time hit into Aegis, Block, Power DMG immunity cause you gain no real way to counter those stuff with AoEs or unblockables. Second one is ..... Axe Burst does too low dmg. It does hit up to 5k dmg only while been a dmg focused weapon, meanwhile Dagger (a mainly boonstrip weapon) does only like 500 lower dmg plus is unblockable and a boonremove skill. So in the end it is axes burst skill holding the Classic Axe Shield/X back in this weird Situation but also this last Point: Relic of Isgarren proc with dodge. While this mechanic might Work in comb with Spellbraker pretty well and also somewhat good on core warr with might makes right it is complete useless for Berserker. So the build itself have like 10% less dmg output by not beeing able to proc this relic constantly.
Sahne.6950 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 (edited) 13 hours ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: *Quietly stirring tea in the corner* Okay, but you're nerfing power zerker again. Either make my shield not have a 30 second CD or improve power zerker's damage dealing in pvp, then we can adjust this. but.... but.... magaura on demand? like.... bro.... thats SO stronk 😄 when running shield, the skill riposte alone is LITERALLY granting you the same magaura uptime that Cata currently has. If you would run mace ontop, which you probably wont...BUT STILL! you are already surpassing cata in terms of reflects. Thats not a nerf at all 😄 it will keep all the oomph, but the bug is fixed, making the reflects more active, rather than " hahaha you cant hit me cuz i am mashing buttons" Edited January 3 by Sahne.6950 1
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 (edited) 1 hour ago, Sahne.6950 said: but.... but.... magaura on demand? like.... bro.... thats SO stronk 😄 when running shield, the skill riposte alone is LITERALLY granting you the same magaura uptime that Cata currently has. If you would run mace ontop, which you probably wont...BUT STILL! you are already surpassing cata in terms of reflects. Thats not a nerf at all 😄 it will keep all the oomph, but the bug is fixed, making the reflects more active, rather than " hahaha you can hit me cuz i am mashing buttons" I don't want it because warriors will run mainhand mace, offhand sword, and take the place of bladesworn, because now the healing from blood reckoning will also be bolstered by whatever projectiles people are trying to throw at a zerker about to cast skull grinder. Especially with staff coming in. You're making condi zerker stronger because bladesworn is mildly annoying, and power zerker still has to telegraph to land middling damage. And given Anet's track record on balancing with a cudgel, it will end up with those skills having significant CDs once they figure out they made condi zerk stronger, to fix a problem that should have just been solved by making the cooldowns for the skills appropriate in the first place. It's not about the reflects. It's about the constant running in circles to not address the core issue with the specs, which is a large part of why the warriors you have annoyances with choose to play that way to begin with. Just make the cooldowns for warrior's blocks appropriate, adjust the damage power zerker deals so it can compete, adjust the damage delivery for bladesworn so it can compete (why are we shipping charge classes in a game where everyone can move in 3d space), then you can take the silly little shield master interaction. They don't need to introduce even recycled functionality, they'll panic nerf it one week out. Edited January 3 by Azure The Heartless.3261
Sahne.6950 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 (edited) I dont really think they need to do any of that stuff before fixing this bug.... because if we are honest.... Shieldmaster is bugged and it needs to be fixed. normally.... this should happen without any compensation or adjustments at all.... because well.... its a bug. And warrior is top of the foodchain right now anyways. BSW and CZerker are the topdogs right now, and its fuelled by a straight bug. -> that bug needs to go. end of the story. in a fair world, they should just fix this trait and call it a day... but i know warriormains are very sensitive when it comes to any forms of nerfs or even bugfixes (see riot after they fixed Fullcounter, and the doomsaying of multiple war mains that SPB will be completly dead)... because any form of nerfs makes the spicy memorys come back... and war mains have alot of spicy memorys from half a decade of being irrelevant... maybe compensating was wrong on my part from the very get go... They should just fix it actually. We need to put that "PZerker" thing to the side for now tho.... thats the same as if i would have blabbered in every "nerf cata thread" about "my poor Lightningrod Weaver"..... Its not about PZerker... its about BSW having more reflects than Catalyst ever had XD Lets bring up PZerker in a seperate thread, because i would agree on buffs to it, and that its unfair that every CZerker nerf is trickling over to it. But right now... its profiting from a bug. If they fix that bug, Pzerker will suffer from it...... but it shouldnt have been profiting at all from that bug to begin with... because well... its a bug. sry dont want to sound rude. i luv u ❤️ Edited January 3 by Sahne.6950 2
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 (edited) 50 minutes ago, Sahne.6950 said: Shieldmaster is bugged and it needs to be fixed. normally.... this should happen without any compensation at all.... because well.... its a bug. Fix my classsssssssssssssss Quote And warrior is top of the foodchain right now anyways. Be specific so you can see the context. It's only condi zerker because they added Akeem, and Bladesworn -because- of that interaction (and in the latter case, barely, because their changes to dragon trigger boost and unyielding dragon butchered the bladesworn functionality) If I don't want to play condi zerker, and this change goes through, what food chain are we top of? Fix the claaaaaaaaass. I want to play the gaaame, not be on top of some food chain. Look more than just one step ahead. Quote How would you go about it? Aegis reflects one projectile and is consumed. Shield Stance and Savage instinct uptime/cooldown adjustments Sundering leap returns to its 15 second cooldown and also grants a single stack of stability , or has its functionality adapted to reflect projectiles during the cast time. Triggerguard down to 15 or 20 seconds from 40. Gunstinger down to 15 seconds from 18. Damage improvements and cast time reductions to Blooming Fire. Monitoring for bladesworn performance and further adjustments to aegis procs as needed. It's going to be difficult to make that class work in a way that is not wretchedly underperforming or annoyingly overperforming, so they should focus on making aegis coverage for dragon slash available. If they continue to have trouble, some key skills should reflect or block projectiles outright, or conditionally. Quote Cuz this clearly needs to happen one way or the other. Given what they did to bladesworn instead of fixing it, I don't agree, but there's no point in arguing about this tbh 50 minutes ago, Sahne.6950 said: We need to put that "PZerker" thing to the side for now tho.... No, it's affected by the proposed changes, and they changed functionality around the interaction instead of changing the interaction itself (for example, by increasing the cooldown of sundering leap instead of doing anything about shield master's interaction with it. It's important. I know its really annoying to keep bringing up and asking for it to be considered in tandem, but it keeps being affected by this flailing to fix oversights with no compensation given. It absolutely needs to remembered. Quote sry dont want to sound rude. i luv u ❤️ Didn't take it as rude, but I'm also not going to shelve the power zerker argument. The point is making the balance better, not toppling whatever is on top and dealing with whatever collateral damage happens because of it later. Do both. Edited January 3 by Azure The Heartless.3261 1
Sahne.6950 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: It's only condi zerker because they added Akeem, Its been meta BEFORE akeem relic. you seem to forget that... 46 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: f I don't want to play condi zerker, and this change goes through, what food chain are we top of? If i dont want to play Hammer Cata? what food chain was ele ever top of? You see where i am going? Cuz ele is also shoehorned into a single build.... while warrior actually has two, with SPB also being VERY viable..... but war mains still are screaming for more, because their desired build is being overshadowed by the other 3. man you would be pissed if you were a ele main. Also i hardly doubt that BSW would be dead if they fix that bug. 46 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: Bladesworn -because- of that interaction Blade sworn would be playable even without that bug. i am kitten sure. but i said that already. 46 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: Aegis reflects one projectile and is consumed. real and thats the only thing thats needed. BUT i am 100% confident, that its not a oversight, but rather a limitation of the gw2 engine. Projectiles are defelcted before the actual hit happens, thats why its not consuming the aegis in the first place. They would need to recode that from the ground up i fear. And i hardly doubt they will do that, cuz some people are cringing in the pvp section. Which is why i porposed they simply recycle a already functioning gamemechanic, being magaura. i could be wrong tho... Edited January 3 by Sahne.6950 1
Dadnir.5038 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 To be fair, shield master is a weird trait. It work with things that it shouldn't work with (Full counter don't block but absorb damage yet it work on it) and don't work with thing that it should work with (Electric fence block missile yet the trait don't work on this skill). 1
Sahne.6950 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 Just now, Dadnir.5038 said: To be fair, shield master is a weird trait. It work with things that it shouldn't work with (Full counter don't block but absorb damage yet it work on it) and don't work with thing that it should work with (Electric fence block missile yet the trait don't work on this skill). That whole trait is a mess xD
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Sahne.6950 said: If i dont want to play Hammer Cata? what food chain was ele ever top of? You see where i am going? Cuz ele is also shoehorned into a single build.... while warrior actually has two, but war mains still are screaming for more. man you would be pissed if you were a ele main. The worst thing about this is that I feel like I'm getting chided for wanting to be able to use a specific type of amulet, lmao. This is wild. And probably an excercise in futility, neat! Let me return to minding my business~ Quote Blade sworn would be playable even without that bug. i am kitten sure. ehhhhh I think a couple of bladesworns crumpling because they have to stand in place with no mitigation to do their burst damage might change people's minds really quick, especially when the payoff is like 5-6k but keep hope alive, n' all that. Quote real and thats the only thing thats needed. put the cds back that were changed as a result of the interaction, at the very least. All of them~ Quote BUT i am 100% confident, that its not a oversight, but rather a limitation of the gw2 engine. Projectiles are defelcted before the actual hit happens. They would need to recode that from the ground up i fear. Which is why i porposed they simply recycle a already functioning gamemechanic, being magaura. Condi Zerker stronger argument goes here Edited January 3 by Azure The Heartless.3261
Sahne.6950 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 (edited) 43 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: put the cds back that were changed as a result of the interaction, at the very least. All of them~ REAL. This reminds me of the time, where they butchered the whole of sceptre, because they reworked the signettrait, only to then also nerf signets themselves after that, only to then ALSO butcher the signet trait after that...... making condisceptre near unplayable... But everyone is loosing their minds when you use the words "buff" and "ele" in the same sentence.... So i am stuck with my Tempestuild being completly deleted from the game cuz of Catas sins, with exactly 0 people listening when i say its needs something to come back. i totally understand where you are coming from, is what i am saying... 43 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: I think a couple of bladesworns crumpling because they have to stand in place with no mitigation to do their burst damage might change people's minds really quick, no build should "need a bug to function". If the build truely struggles after that they can give it.... something.... if anything its a detriment to how badly designed the spec is when it needs two bugs overlapping on eachother, making it have near permareflect to function. Edited January 3 by Sahne.6950 1
Sahne.6950 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 (edited) 49 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: The worst thing about this is that I feel like I'm getting chided for wanting to be able to use a specific type of amulet, lmao. This is wild. And probably an excercise in futility, neat! Let me return to minding my business~ english to bad to grasp what you said here 😕 it sounds sad tho..... sorry if that was me. Edit: after rereading, i am quite sure it was me. i think i took the wrong mental turn.... for some reason i thought you dont want to fix that bug, because it would yet again nerf your build. idk why i thought that.... But instead you are only saying they need to revert the CD Nerfs,before doing that, because otherwise you would be in the "Signet" situation... where you suffer from a nerf that followed the rework, only for them to also nerf the reworked thing, leaving you with even less than you started with. i think i got that right now, did i? srym8 Edited January 3 by Sahne.6950 1
Azure The Heartless.3261 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 38 minutes ago, Sahne.6950 said: But insteead you are only saying they need to revert the CD Nerfs,before doing that, because otherwise you would be in the "Signet" situation... where you suffer from a nerf that followed the rework, only for them to also nerf the reworked thing, leaving you with even less than you started with. Correct. Anet has established a pattern of doing this, I would like for them to not do that. 2
Sahne.6950 Posted January 3 Author Posted January 3 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Azure The Heartless.3261 said: Correct. Anet has established a pattern of doing this, I would like for them to not do that. This EXACT thing happened to my tempest. Its a cruel World 😕 Spoiler i now know where i took the wrong turn, if you are interested! Your very first posts.... you said they nerf it again, and linked sundering leap. But i didnt know they already nerfed that trait cuz of the interaction with Shieldmaster. thats where i took the wrong turn! i literally thought you are against all of this, because PZerker has this one poopy aegis, and loosing that reflect on this one poopy aegis was enough for you to say you are again getting nerfed.... which made me baffeled... i thought you are Veto´ing the bugfix, because you want to profit from it. That made me kind of upset... because otherwise you are quite objective when speaking about things... and that was just so selfish... i was kind of lost for words. basically i was missing the context of the nerf that already happened. I thought you demand Buffs, before they bugfix... when in reality... you just wanted that they revert the nerfs... But i didnt get that because i am narrowwinded and dont read any patchnotes that dont deal with Ele/Ranger and thief, which are my 3 mains. my bad. Btw.... smash when? my Yoshi is hungry. Edited January 3 by Sahne.6950 1
BonggangKikay.9576 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 Quote Blade sworn would be playable even without that bug. i am kitten sure. but i said that already. can you explain? because that doesn't make any sense at all. its unplayable even with that bug. DT deals bad damage, easy kitten to dodge that even my grandma could dodge it because you can clearly see a delayed explosion, and roots you in place with a massive sign on your head "kill me now" with the only source of defending yourself is an aegis with 40sec cd, the dodge is even delayed when you try to use it while charging. the only good thing BW is stalling with unshakable mountain and combat stim, if you are getting killed by a bladesworn at this point then sorry you're just bad because DT is such a pitiful ability. 2
Vinny.7260 Posted January 3 Posted January 3 11 minutes ago, BonggangKikay.9576 said: can you explain? because that doesn't make any sense at all. its unplayable even with that bug. DT deals bad damage, easy kitten to dodge that even my grandma could dodge it because you can clearly see a delayed explosion, and roots you in place with a massive sign on your head "kill me now" with the only source of defending yourself is an aegis with 40sec cd, the dodge is even delayed when you try to use it while charging. the only good thing BW is stalling with unshakable mountain and combat stim, if you are getting killed by a bladesworn at this point then sorry you're just bad because DT is such a pitiful ability. Bladesworn has been a victim of Shield Master bugs as well. They went and nerfed the Aegis sources, the defensives, and even their best GM (Unyielding Dragon) got butchered. This is a result of Anet's sideways approach to not dealing with the problem and only dealing with things that 'appear' to be happening because of other things. > "Woah, Bladesworn is really popular right now." >> "We need to nerf Bladesworn right?" > "Right." >> "Should we check for any odd interactions?..." > "Are you kidding?" >> "Haha, you're right. Let's butcher this fella." Catalyst, which had a notoriously obnoxious build, caused similar things to happen but to Core Elementalist. (Signet Catalyst :>) Fix Shield Mastery, fix Bladesworn's issues... Aegis should not be a pseudo Magnetic Aura... But also don't neglect the specs that are teetering on the edge due to a bug. Maybe give those specs a little love too. 😆
CutesySylveon.8290 Posted January 4 Posted January 4 23 hours ago, Sahne.6950 said: when running shield, the skill riposte alone is LITERALLY granting you the same magaura uptime that Cata currently has. If you would run mace ontop, which you probably wont...BUT STILL! you are already surpassing cata in terms of reflects. Mag Aura is an effect that is active until its duration is finished. Warrior blocks are channeled skills, so that's not really a fair comparison. Warrior can't be on the offensive while also reflecting everything like Mag Aura allows you to be. 1
Lan Deathrider.5910 Posted January 4 Posted January 4 5 hours ago, CutesySylveon.8290 said: Mag Aura is an effect that is active until its duration is finished. Warrior blocks are channeled skills, so that's not really a fair comparison. Warrior can't be on the offensive while also reflecting everything like Mag Aura allows you to be. Yeah, but the Aegis they've been giving to Warrior is not channeled. Now, the answer to that is to hit the warrior with a non-projectile attack, or an unblockable attack, but players are allergic to taking counters to shore up their own weaknesses. 2
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