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As for dps, I have quite high dps, as I tested on Golem and tried in PVP and PVE.Condi is a very efficient and good build in dps and PVE in general. Considering it in terms of WVW and PVP, although I deal quite high damage, my defense is low.It is very fun to play. It is very bad for those who use DPS meter, third party programs do not work.Even if it works, I think they are lying. In almost every game, I encounter many players who tell me to change my build or that I am playing wrong.When they ask me to change my build, I usually stop playing with them and block them. I am told that I deal very low damage in the dps meter, like 4-5k. But even the condi damage I deal for just a second is a minimum of 12k in total.Moreover, I copied this build from one of the best players on USA servers.In Strike missions, I can even kill bosses alone that they have difficulty killing as a team.They say my weapons and armor are bad, but I use legendary and ascended items. I think better ones came out without my knowledge.I admit that I'm a failure, I think if I start doing 60k damage on auto-strike, I can show up on the DPS meters.I don't understand which door you are trying to hold against me, when you haven't even passed through the door I went through?

https://ibb.co/qj4zsMz

Edited by eriniy.8607
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1 hour ago, eriniy.8607 said:

But even the condi damage I deal for just a second is a minimum of 12k in total

If you mean here those purging flames from screenshot, the 15k number is all 6 stacks for whole 5s duration. Ring of Fire pulses one stack of those six per pulse, which means that it will take full duration of 6 seconds to apply all of them, so I will omitt the big math of trying to divulge dps impact of it while it is ongoing, but step over to the next part - it has 28s cd to use again, which means that by burning alone, it's dps impact on your build will be approximately 536 dps.

Then ontop of that there is this thing with condi stacks ownership going weird on math that I do not remember if AN has ever fixed. This is the only aspect I can think of that could mess with the ArcDps.

I will not try to comment on your build per say, because I do not know this "one of the best players in the usa", or what kind of build it was doing, but I will note, that copying the build, and being able to perform to same spec in content (not against parsing golem) are two different worlds. The build you copied may be best out there, but you may still fail to apply it in the content, even if you are capable of applying it to it's full extend against the parsing golem.

Additionally, as far as my knowledge goes, the game's built-in dps printout of the golem is flawed and does not give the full picture the arcDPS provides.

If people that are using ArcDPS are very often contacting you that your dps is low, there is a very big chance, that your dps in that particular encounter was actually kinda low.

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3 hours ago, eriniy.8607 said:

In almost every game, I encounter many players who tell me to change my build or that I am playing wrong.

If many people are telling you this, do you not think that maybe something wrong with your build and performance? You are the common denominator no?

3 hours ago, eriniy.8607 said:

In Strike missions, I can even kill bosses alone that they have difficulty killing as a team.

Which strikes are we talking about here exactly? Certain strikes this is not considered a flex.

 

 

Edit: if you actually want to assess how much damage you do/can do then I suggest using the training golem in aerodrome training area. It's the in game dps measurement which won't "lie" to you. Link below is the set up guild.

https://snowcrows.com/guides/getting-started/special-forces-area

Edited by Dibit.6259
Typos and added extea
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3 hours ago, eriniy.8607 said:

Even if it works, I think they are lying.

Let's assume for a second that this is true. DOn't you think that it would present the same kind of lie for everyone? IE if your super dps gets reported as 4-5k, don't you think other peoples' dps values would end up in the same kind of range? Why would arcdps single you out?

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5 hours ago, eriniy.8607 said:

I pray to Dwayna and Lyssa both that you're just showing your PvP build and that you aren't using the same build for PvE.

I just put my Guardian in full L80 exotic viper's gear with legendary trinkets of the recommended sinister + viper's stats, plus the recommended traits for condi willbender on the Snowcrow's build here , no food or other buffs, and my purging flames comes out with very different values than yours, even in the PvP area (like your screenshot).

Pretty sure doing damage 8x and 8 stacks of burning (>7 sec duration in PvE) with 8 pulses with 7 seconds duration with higher overall values is gonna perform MASSIVELY differently from what you got going on, especially in group PvE, and that's before actual fight performance skill and the buffs of other traits in combat gets factored in.

No Boons No Dps is right. You're being silly. Change your build. Whatever you're bringing to group PvE is potato.

 

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21 hours ago, eriniy.8607 said:

As for dps, I have quite high dps,

21 hours ago, eriniy.8607 said:

But even the condi damage I deal for just a second is a minimum of 12k in total.

I'll respond under the assumption that this isn't a troll post, though I highly suspect it to be just that. This is roughly one third of what can be achieved with multiple easy to play / low intensity builds. Seeing how you said you use legendary and ascended equipment, this leaves us with three possibilities; bad build, wrong stats on gear, poor gameplay, potentially a combination of the three. 

Over the years, there have been many forum posts regarding dps requirements for group content, said posts almost always contained accusations of "toxic elitism" but I'll go ahead and say my piece anyway. Joining a group as DPS is an implied promise that you'll do respectable damage. Now, what number constitutes respectable damage varies from group to group and content to content, and barring some very specific high-end content, tends to be arbitrary since the game is powercrept so much that everyone tends to do enough damage to complete most content. So it usually comes down to people wanting to get things done more comfortably or on a more timely manner. The exceptions to this are ofc some of the harder CM content, where the DPS you do is a lot more directly tied to the success of your team.

Having prefaced with the previous paragraph, if people are consistently unhappy with your damage, you should look into improving your performance. It isn't elitism to expect you to perform at a reasonable level as DPS. We as a playerbase have a really weird hate for DPS requirements in this game, which is weird to me because when a boon support joins the group and only provides 50% uptime on quickness or alacrity, everyone is on board that said person is not performing their role. Similarly, if a healer is not providing their boons properly, or healing sufficiently to outsustain unavoidable damage, we're again on board that said healer is not performing their role. As DPS, you often have one job, and if you're doing one third of a number that can be easily achieved on every single class in the game, you aren't earning your keep.

Edited by Passerbye.6291
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The only major limitation that dps meters like arcdps have is with tracking healing and barriers you provide to others in your group because of limitations in how the game API reports those but damage, conditions and boon reporting is very accurate.  Whatever rounding errors and issues that do exist in arcdps will effect how everyone's damage is reported; if your dps is underreported, so is everyone else's (you ain't special).   If someone in your group has a dps meter and it shows your damage is bad,  IT. IS. BAD.  

You can either deny facts or reflect on how to improve.  

Things to consider:

  • Your attacks are missing
  • You are interrupting your own abilities by not allowing them to finish casting before triggering another ability (gw2 does not queue abilities like some other games do). 
  • Your rotation is bad. 
  • You end up downed/dead a lot where you don't do any damage because you're a glass cannon with no defensives.  This is one of the reasons it is a bad idea to use a pve dps builds in spvp/wvw.
  • If you aren't stacked on tag, you may be too far away to get boons that buff other's damage.  If someone else's might, fury, quickness and alacrity uptimes are 90%+ and yours is only 50% they will be doing way, way more damage than you.
  • In pve, your lack of fight mechanics knowledge has your running around instead of attacking or attacking at the wrong times resulting in very little damage compared to what you could do.
  • In spvp and wvw, your opponents are human and they are so much smarter than pve boss AI.  They will dodge, run away from AOE's, heal, cleanse conditions, interrupt your attacks, pop aegis/reflect at the right times, and all that other stuff that straight up makes you miss or do no damage.  You cannot use a PVE rotation in SPVP/WVW and expect it to do any real damage.  Again, don't use pve dps builds or rotations in spvp/wvw.

Arcdps has logging features.  Use them.  Upload the log files to dps.reports which will parse them and give you a detailed link to a report.  Read the report output and figure out what you are doing wrong. 

From my own personal experience in strikes and raids with my guilds there are players who run nearly identical builds to mine and often beat the snot out of my dps.  I've used the logs and dps.reports to examine what they did vs what I did and I've made adjustments and closed the gap significantly.  Not an equal just yet, but very close and not really so embarrassing in the difference.

23 hours ago, eriniy.8607 said:

But even the condi damage I deal for just a second is a minimum of 12k in total

That's certainly not how to read the damage from Purging Flames.  The screenshot showed 15k condition damage over 5 seconds which is 3k per second.   Condition damage only does the full if the target does nothing defensive like move away from the AOE or cleanse the condition.  It can do way more damage than what's on the tooltip because of how conditions are re-applied by the ability, but it will do almost nothing if the target defends itself in some way. 

Edited by Tinker.6924
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and this is the reason why players need to understand that there is a huge gap between their perceived performance and their actual performance.

23 hours ago, eriniy.8607 said:

As for dps, I have quite high dps,

and the golem value you had was what exactly?

Quote

as I tested on Golem and tried in PVP and PVE.Condi is a very efficient and good build in dps and PVE in general. Considering it in terms of WVW and PVP, although I deal quite high damage, my defense is low.It is very fun to play. It is very bad for those who use DPS meter, third party programs do not work

There is a golem training area in the game which also tells you the dps you do. Incidentally it aligns with the damage meters. You not knowing about this makes me believe your "test" on the golem was useless (no, the pvp golems are useless for pve comparisons and that's not only due to you being in spvp gear and build in the spvp area).

Quote

Even if it works, I think they are lying. In almost every game, I encounter many players who tell me to change my build or that I am playing wrong.When they ask me to change my build, I usually stop playing with them and block them. I am told that I deal very low damage in the dps meter, like 4-5k. But even the condi damage I deal for just a second is a minimum of 12k in total.

It works.

No, that's about the value most players get with their custom builds before they self improve or start monitoring their performance. There is no need for others to lie.

But all of this can be cleared up very quickly:

go to the training golem in the aerodrome, set it up properly (all boons on you, all conditions on golem, average size, 4 million hp) and go kill it. The game will give you a readout in game every 20% and when killing it what dps you are doing. No damage meter needed, no other players making things up, just the game its self telling you strait up where you stand.

 

Edited by Cyninja.2954
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22 hours ago, Omega.6801 said:

They usually work, and they are not lying.

arcdps is lying about condis and the author even put that on the website:

Quote

limitations
 area is missing percent-based damage - not notified by server.
 area is missing siphon damage - not notified by server.
 area is missing healing - not notified by server.
 area is missing combo finishers - not notified by server.
 area is missing buff extension source - not notified by server.
 area condition damage uses simulated attribute building from gear, traits, and buffs, on a simulated server tick.
 area condition damage scaling in levels 1 to 79 is different from the game's scaling.
 area condition damage on-skill-use procs on animation start instead of on skill use - not notified by server.
 area breakbar damage missing on some breakbar changes initiated by damageless skills.
 area breakbar damage missing for breakbar changes that cause a breakbar to recharge (does not affect deactivate).
 area strike damage notify bubble may cause some events (eg. deimos) to be out of range - not notified by server.
 area strips ignore last-stack stability - cc and strip indistinguishable.
 area skill activation will only count skills which have animations (no shouts, no instants) - not notified by server.
 area overstack and applied do not include ignored stacks (lower than lowest existing stack) - not notified by server.

 

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4 minutes ago, VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig. said:

arcdps is lying about condis and the author even put that on the website:

 

That discrepancy is irrelevant in the context of this discussion. The value of arcdps is by far close enough to the actual value achieved.

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21 hours ago, VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig. said:

arcdps is lying about condis and the author even put that on the website:

 

Arcdps is more accurate than you think, it's not 100% but because they are limited due to the said list you just provided.

You can see how accurate ardps is by comparing the numbers on the in-game golem. The difference is only about 100-200.

Arcdps is currently the best tool we have to assess dps and boon number in combat.

Edited by Dibit.6259
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On 6/17/2024 at 4:07 PM, eriniy.8607 said:

In Strike missions, I can even kill bosses alone that they have difficulty killing as a team.

any chance you could post a video of you doing this please? I'm very intrigued 

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i think you're confusing damage spikes with damage per second, which is how dps is measured. you can do alot of burst but still have a very low dps rating! i feel like nearly every fight in the game is more about sustained damage rather than burst, except fractals, and even in fractals all of the damage-dealing players have to coordinate their burst windows or you'll still have to fall back on sustained damage for a time.

 

that said, even 10-15k is a very low burst, as a good burst is probably in the 80-120k range.

Edited by SoftFootpaws.9134
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The thing that's often lying is the numbers you're seeing on screen. When I use a greatsword and only hit 1 on my mesmer, the amount of damage I do is read as one attack, so it keeps adding the damage I'm doing, instead of resetting it. It looks like I've done 10k damage, or if the boss is big enough much more, but it's not true. Each shot is doing damage, and it's just adding the damage of the next shot onto the total. That's a bug.

Arc gives you more or less the accurate numbers.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Posted (edited)
On 6/17/2024 at 5:07 PM, eriniy.8607 said:

As for dps, I have quite high dps

No.

  • and you don't really want to do anything about it
  • you don't really understand what dps (damage per second) means
  • you even block players and still don't want to change anything
  • you don't check your dps anyway

 

On 6/17/2024 at 5:07 PM, eriniy.8607 said:

third party programs do not work

Just because you don't know how something works (you can log every fight and see how the DPS is precisely calculated, skill by skill), it doesn't mean that it doesn't work. I recommend familiarizing yourself with the subject matter before making such a statement.

Edited by Radiancee.6537
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