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Swim Infusion Changes


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So there is a new swim infusion called "Account Swim Infusion" that you buy per character. Under it are upgrades that increases the effectiveness of all your account swim infusions as a whole. However, the upgrades are another heavy ectoplasm sink instead of just being a swimming infusion sink. Why?

 

Update: So the ecto isn't even the problem. It's just that the number of the swim infusions is still completely absurd. At least you only need one of each for all your characters to benefit.

I've opened 924 chests since the system came out. Mastery diver tracked them (132 times completed), so originally 7 chests a rotation I think. I have enough to get the +20 upgrade and only 3 more +20s. You need 32 of those to get a +25 made.

You need to open about 9,800 chests to make a single +25. 32 times that to make the +30.

These are awful numbers. This is actually worse to make than a Jormag infusion!

Edited by Eloc Freidon.5692
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I'm desperately trying to understand the concept of an 'account wide' infusion that is not something you buy 'once', and all your characters can use. Hoping to come across some clarification on that.

Update: Okay, I think I figured it out. All my characters have 15 infusions now (that are 80). I can use extractors to pull out the 15, then spend 10 ectos and that 15 to get a special 'account' one. After I do that for all my characters, I can start upgrading, and each time I do, anyone that has one of the new account swim speed infusions will automatically get the upgrades "when I upgrade one time"? Does that sound right? 🤔

Edited by notebene.3190
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23 minutes ago, notebene.3190 said:

I'm desperately trying to understand the concept of an 'account wide' infusion that is not something you buy 'once', and all your characters can use. Hoping to come across some clarification on that.

You buy 1 of the "account wide" infusion on each character. Then you can buy the upgrades that will affect all of the account wide infusions in your account. The thing is you can't just aim for the +30 upgrade. You need to make and spend each of the previous ones, making it more than insanely expensive than it already was. If you got over half a million gold to spare for this... go ahead. Otherwise I'd just get the lowest thing on my mains and forget this is a thing.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Kronos.3695 said:

The fact that you need 1.048.576 +10 infusions in order to get the +30 is just insane.
I think that the number need to be revisited after this change.

The person who originally designed this system doesn't understand compounding math. It should have been 32 to make a fifteen, 24 fifteens to make a twenty, 16 twenties to make a twenty-five, and 8 twenty-fives to make a 30.

Edited by Eloc Freidon.5692
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3 hours ago, notebene.3190 said:

I'm desperately trying to understand the concept of an 'account wide' infusion that is not something you buy 'once', and all your characters can use. Hoping to come across some clarification on that.

Update: Okay, I think I figured it out. All my characters have 15 infusions now (that are 80). I can use extractors to pull out the 15, then spend 10 ectos and that 15 to get a special 'account' one. After I do that for all my characters, I can start upgrading, and each time I do, anyone that has one of the new account swim speed infusions will automatically get the upgrades "when I upgrade one time"? Does that sound right? 🤔

Yes your characters all benefit from the account upgrade boost as long as they are equipped with an account infusion.

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3 hours ago, notebene.3190 said:

I'm desperately trying to understand the concept of an 'account wide' infusion

It's "account", not "account-wide". The "account" part refers to the bonus boosts you apply -- those are applied to all the new +15% infusions.

(Edit: Though the boost upgrades are currently bugged and don't show.)

Edited by Ashantara.8731
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18 minutes ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

It's "account", not "account-wide". The "account" part refers to the bonus boosts you apply -- those are applied to all the new +15% infusions.

So if I buy the new 15% account boost item (which is effectively swapping out my old 15s + 10 ectos) and put that on all my other characters, as I buy the new boost item, a one time purchase of, say, the 20% boost will now make all those 15s into 20s and so on?

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2 minutes ago, notebene.3190 said:

So if I buy the new 15% account boost item (which is effectively swapping out my old 15s + 10 ectos) and put that on all my other characters, as I buy the new boost item, a one time purchase of, say, the 20% boost will now make all those 15s into 20s and so on?

That's how it's supposed to work, yes. But it needs a bug fix first.

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3 hours ago, Kronos.3695 said:

The fact that you need 1.048.576 +10 infusions in order to get the +30 is just insane.
I think that the number need to be revisited after this change.

They realized that something needed to be done to make under water more enjoyable.  Then locked that behind a huge gold (and or time) sink as discouragement.  

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Might be a bit unrelated to the topic, but I'd like to remind that there'll be a Sunken Treasure Event starting next week. At least it's showing in the event calendar. Not sure what the reward will be, but it could be something that arrived at that vendor today, maybe even one of those new account infusions. I'd recommend to wait with buying something until that event starts.

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I imagine that the Janthir region will offer alternate ways to gather swim speed infusions.  I could be wrong of course.  It won't hurt to wait and see. 

Unless the event Bizgurk mentioned is the only alternate source of swim infusions planned.

  We may want to participate in this sunken treasure event just in case...

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7 hours ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

Yep. Precisely. "account wide" is not something you buy "per each character". It's just obfuscating what's really going on.

It's called "account infusion", not "account-wide infusion", because it has a bonus that is supposed to increase when you buy the account-wide boost upgrades (+20%, +25%, +30%).

Unfortunately, it currently does not do what it's supposed to do...

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1 hour ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

It's called "account infusion", not "account-wide infusion", because it has a bonus that is supposed to increase when you buy the account-wide boost upgrades (+20%, +25%, +30%).

An "account infusion" would be an infusion for the account, not for a character, just as "account bound" is something that is bound to the account and not to a character.

In the German translation it is even more misleading, because it is called "Swimming speed infusion for account" ("Schwimmgeschwindigkeit-Infusion für Account").

The names are completely misleading for the functionality that you buy an "Account Swim Speed Infusion" for each character, and only then do these characters receive the additionally purchased "Account Swim Speed Boost". It would have been better and clearer if Anet had thought up a fantasy name for it without the "account" part of the name. Or something like "boostable swim-speed infusion"

 

Edited by Zok.4956
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3 hours ago, Zok.4956 said:

An "account infusion" would be an infusion for the account, not for a character, just as "account bound" is something that is bound to the account and not to a character. 

Don't argue with me, I did not pick the name. 😂

Fact is that its upgrades are account-wide, and so they choose to confuse their playerbase by calling it "account infusion" because it holds account-wide bonuses.

Edited by Ashantara.8731
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13 hours ago, suialthor.7164 said:

They realized that something needed to be done to make under water more enjoyable.

 

12 hours ago, Bizgurk.5639 said:

Might be a bit unrelated to the topic, but I'd like to remind that there'll be a Sunken Treasure Event starting next week.

These swim infusion things and next week's event, combined with the "something's coming out of the water" tagline on the teaser a couple weeks ago, and the idea of using the "aquatic" weapon everywhere...this all combines to make me suspect that some significant part of the new JW story will be underwater.

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1 hour ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

Don't argue with me, I did not pick the name. 😂

But you try to argue that name makes sense, even when clearly it does not.

And infusion that needs to be bought separately for each character does not deserve to be called an account infusion. Simple as that.

Edited by Astralporing.1957
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48 minutes ago, Teknomancer.4895 said:

These swim infusion things and next week's event, combined with the "something's coming out of the water" tagline on the teaser a couple weeks ago, and the idea of using the "aquatic" weapon everywhere...this all combines to make me suspect that some significant part of the new JW story will be underwater.

Back before EoD, when the swim speed infusions were introduced into the game, before there was any more information about EoD, many players thought that EoD would have more underwater content and that the expansion could be about "bubbles" (Deep Sea Dragon). The expansion was about bubbles (aka Soo Won) but not about underwater content and the swim speed infusions had nothing to do with EoD but were apparently just a filler until the expansion.

Maybe you're right in your assumption, but maybe it's again just another event to bridge the time in summer.

 

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The execution on this was terrible. Exponential material sink (well over 20 thousand in both swim infusions and in gold) and it's not in the legendary armory? It's already account-bound and freely removable from equipment, so there's no reason to have to play pass-around. In the least, make the account-bound item free after the first purchase so we don't have to buy it per character. 

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This does seem like another step away from traditional legendaries, like the leggy relic. This one is even more confusing than that one was. In addition to the issues already raised in this thread, I've also been wondering if swim-speed infusions are worth it, even at their old prices, let alone their new ones. As far as I can tell from this chart superspeed provides as much, or far more, underwater speed as swim-speed infusions, even the most expensive one.

Atm, the only place where underwater speed is important to me is at the Bay garri on the two Alpine Borderland maps in WvW. Two or three times a month, the losing side in capping or defending those garris will jump into the water, trying to escape. So underwater speed is helpful in catching or escaping from enemies players in that specific situation. My scrapper has several sources of superspeed. Granted that superspeed doesn't have a permanent uptime. The bursts of superspeed are enough for catching or escaping as needed. If there is expanded underwater content in Janthir Wilds, yhose swim-speed infusions with their permanent movement boost may be more useful We'll see.

 

On 6/25/2024 at 6:04 PM, Bizgurk.5639 said:

Might be a bit unrelated to the topic, but I'd like to remind that there'll be a Sunken Treasure Event starting next week. At least it's showing in the event calendar. Not sure what the reward will be, but it could be something that arrived at that vendor today, maybe even one of those new account infusions. I'd recommend to wait with buying something until that event starts.

Also, as Bizgurk points out, the Sunken Treasure Event starts next week As we don't know what the rewards will be, it sounds like a good idea to me to hold off on buying any of those infusions right now. It seems at least possible that buying a +15 or +20 swim-speed infusion may be in the Wizard Vault's special section during that event.

Edited by Chichimec.9364
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6 hours ago, Chichimec.9364 said:

If there is expanded underwater content in Janthir Wilds, yhose swim-speed infusions with their permanent movement boost may be more useful We'll see.

Maybe. But since the Skimmer can move faster underwater than a +20 swim speed infusion (and probably faster than a +30, but some testing is inconclusive), the swim speed infusion only makes sense in the open world when you're fighting underwater and can't use your mount and if you don't have a source of superspeed. And of course in fractals and WvW, because you can't use the Skimmer there either.

Since their introduction, swim speed infusions have been a sink of time and gold with very limited usefulness. The last update on Tuesday has not improved anything so far.

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