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Actual Feedback for Spear. Not PVE.


XECOR.2814

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1. More LF.

Power builds needs more lf. 

Add LF generation when you spend soul shards. Needs to be on the higher side.

 

2. Increase soul shard generation. and durations. 

They fall off very quickly and are generated from very unreliable skills that do not hit often.

 

3. Bigger disrupt payoff.

The daze and immob durations are very low and also are not worth the effort to land melee single target ability as a necromancer.

Would need to do 2s Daze baseline and acts as a 2s Stun on higher soul shards. Acting effectively the same as daze+immob.

 

4.  Make disrupt ability more reliable.

The skill cant hit anything on necromancers kit when u actually need it. This skill begs a larger radius to hit to be effective. I suggest 300.

 

5. Isolate needs added lockdown effect or defensive effect.

The chill on initial cast is cool and all but the follow up leaves you devastatingly vulnerable because you are on necromancers kit not a willbenders kit. 

I suggest a blind on port if we go on defensive route. If we go on a lockdown route then i suggest a (2s immob) or (Slow+chill). Either one of these two effects.

 

6. The autos needs to have some kind of effects on each skill in the chain. The payoff on third chain on melee weapon doesnt work especially on this class.

 

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good suggestions, but tbh the biggest issue in pvp is power necro just being bad to begin with. If this was a condi weapon it would probably perform well given the state of condi necro builds in pvp. They'd need to make power necro better from the ground up, make swords better etc.

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While i like the interaction which could finally make the difference between a good necro and a bad one i dislike shard mechanic. Its not cohesive and pighole us cause of lifesteal instead of a proper burst weapon like u would think of a more assasin playstyle.

Also in dont get the range thing. Why is it 130? For a spear when dagger is the same range?

Further i dont get the whole concept idea build wise. Its a melee power weapon witch we already have with the twist of chasing prey down. So its most likely designed with pvp/wvw in mind. For this specific content power necro is nearly never played except for kinda niche power reaper builds (condi reaper is much better tbh). So why do the lifesteal thing when it clearly on the cost of actual burst. And again assasin playstyle needs some kind of mitigation which spear has 0%. Like mentioned no leap finishers and so on.... just do cohesive design that fills a new niche and dont just throw new weapons into the void called necromancer class design.

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11 hours ago, Lahmia.2193 said:

That's just melee design. All the melee greatswords are the same.

Yeah but its a assasin style weapon meant to catch people offguard so give us the opportunity to actually catch them. U literally lunge forward right now. Thats the animation. And skill 2 is also 300 range. So why not make skill 3 also 300 range?

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On 6/30/2024 at 1:44 PM, Bale.3851 said:

Yeah but its a assasin style weapon meant to catch people offguard so give us the opportunity to actually catch them. U literally lunge forward right now. Thats the animation. And skill 2 is also 300 range. So why not make skill 3 also 300 range?

Oh I agree it should be longer. Just that the internal logic of the game doesn't make sense already.

But that's one of many things I would change about Necro spear (basically would redo the entire thing).

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17 hours ago, Lahmia.2193 said:

But that's one of many things I would change about Necro spear (basically would redo the entire thing).

We can agree on that i guess. I really like the interaction with cooldown reset cause u have to make decision between chasing and being in the offense or keeping your shroud up and preparing for a counter. Which is actually quite good design. Its just the rest of the skill set is such a mess. In pvp u are running around with a fork trying to catch people with swords and guns.

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Like I already wrote in the actual feedback thread. The biggest problem is, that necrom has no good power build for pvp/wvw. 

The main reason for that is, that power necro's sustain is severely lacking. 

1. Boons:

Power necro is lacking boon wise. With harbinger this issue gets somewhat covered m, but not entirely.

offensive boons:

crit capping is kinda essential for every power build. Because if you don't crit, you "wasted" all points invested in ferocity. Even with death's perception from the soulreaping trait line you need to go full marauder to reach 75% crit chance in wvw, which isn't even enough to go to 100% since fury only gives 20% in that gamemode. But then there isn't even any reliable source of fury on any power or defensive trait line (I kinda don't want to count dread in spite, because spear doesn't have a way to fear). 

Even might is kinda hard to get. And often requires you to hit an enemy. And don't even try to mention blood is power. Wasting a utility slot for 15stacks of might for 6 seconds just isn't worth it.

Defensive boons:

Even harder to get. There's no good way to self apply regeneration, even protection is not easy to come by, not to mention vigor, Aegis is scourge exclusive, and stability is another problem. You can get stability, (reaper shroud 3 - 3 seconds duration and it's in shroud; reaper elite shout - hard to hit and requires you to hit it; harbinger on shroud entry from trait - 2,5 seconds duration; harbinger elite elixir - 5s duration).

You need some defensive boons if none of your skills provide any other defensive utility like invulns or evades if you want to introduce a power melee style to necro. Sure we have shroud to protect our health, but if we are in shroud, we can't use our weapon skills.

Overall harbinger covers those weaknesses the best, but it's not amazing at it and still needs improvements for it to work as a proper power build option in competitive modes. (I know that it would probably buff cele harb in wvw, which would be a problem, but anet doesn't care about roaming builds anyways).

Especially protection on harbinger is much easier to obtain, since it's easier to build corrupters fervor (because of shroud). But at the same time it's not because for some reason, most necro power weapons don't really inflict conditions (not even vulnerability).

And last point is sustain:

Sustain can be achieved by boons. But through other mechanics as well. For necro the main form of sustain would be gaining life force and soaking damage with your shroud. The other main source would be life stealing.

But both of those forms of sustain have the same problem: they require you to hit the enemy. Which can be very hard if every other class is zooming around with their mobility skills, blocks, invulns, evades on weapon and utility skills...

Until some of those problems get fixed I don't see power necro creeping into the meta.

And especially not in wvw. Since it seems to be anets goal for everyone to run cele.

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 7/8/2024 at 3:53 PM, Nimon.7840 said:

Like I already wrote in the actual feedback thread. The biggest problem is, that necrom has no good power build for pvp/wvw. 

The main reason for that is, that power necro's sustain is severely lacking. 

1. Boons:

Power necro is lacking boon wise. With harbinger this issue gets somewhat covered m, but not entirely.

offensive boons:

crit capping is kinda essential for every power build. Because if you don't crit, you "wasted" all points invested in ferocity. Even with death's perception from the soulreaping trait line you need to go full marauder to reach 75% crit chance in wvw, which isn't even enough to go to 100% since fury only gives 20% in that gamemode. But then there isn't even any reliable source of fury on any power or defensive trait line (I kinda don't want to count dread in spite, because spear doesn't have a way to fear). 

Even might is kinda hard to get. And often requires you to hit an enemy. And don't even try to mention blood is power. Wasting a utility slot for 15stacks of might for 6 seconds just isn't worth it.

Defensive boons:

Even harder to get. There's no good way to self apply regeneration, even protection is not easy to come by, not to mention vigor, Aegis is scourge exclusive, and stability is another problem. You can get stability, (reaper shroud 3 - 3 seconds duration and it's in shroud; reaper elite shout - hard to hit and requires you to hit it; harbinger on shroud entry from trait - 2,5 seconds duration; harbinger elite elixir - 5s duration).

You need some defensive boons if none of your skills provide any other defensive utility like invulns or evades if you want to introduce a power melee style to necro. Sure we have shroud to protect our health, but if we are in shroud, we can't use our weapon skills.

Overall harbinger covers those weaknesses the best, but it's not amazing at it and still needs improvements for it to work as a proper power build option in competitive modes. (I know that it would probably buff cele harb in wvw, which would be a problem, but anet doesn't care about roaming builds anyways).

Especially protection on harbinger is much easier to obtain, since it's easier to build corrupters fervor (because of shroud). But at the same time it's not because for some reason, most necro power weapons don't really inflict conditions (not even vulnerability).

And last point is sustain:

Sustain can be achieved by boons. But through other mechanics as well. For necro the main form of sustain would be gaining life force and soaking damage with your shroud. The other main source would be life stealing.

But both of those forms of sustain have the same problem: they require you to hit the enemy. Which can be very hard if every other class is zooming around with their mobility skills, blocks, invulns, evades on weapon and utility skills...

Until some of those problems get fixed I don't see power necro creeping into the meta.

And especially not in wvw. Since it seems to be anets goal for everyone to run cele.

I feel like most power builds issue would be alleviated if they give back the crit chance on death perception to around (30%). So we can build for toughness or concentration or anything that helps the build survive instead of pigeonholed into full marauder builds that just melt because of no toughness.

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