Silverwastes Meta too easy

[Anov.4237]

Have the meta in SW been nerfed? the bosses in lane 1-3 dont even reach phase 2.

[Zebulous.2934]

I am told that it is because of player-character power-creep.  Armor stat combinations that didn't exist at the time that silverwastes was created.  The change of skills and boons as well as conditions.  I think silverwastes predates alacrity, alacrity also didn't have so many sources when the boon itself was introduced.  The change of the torment condition so that it deals more damage to stationary targets.  Torment used to deal bonus damage to moving targets.  Bosses don't move much these days when everyone is clumped inside of a boon-ball.

If you are unfortunate enough to visit silverwastes during unpopular times you may encounter incompetent commanders or no commander tags at all.  I remember silverwastes being quite difficult when no one was organized.

Supposedly Anet has an advanced AI for mobs to use but when it was implemented the mobs were too difficult for the average player to beat.  So mobs just have very basic actions.

I don't really know how Anet is supposed to address powercreep among player characters.

 

Edited August 3 by Zebulous.2934
Autocorrupt silverwastes to silverware

[Anov.4237]

Agree..... 2. lane was always the hardest. Now its very easy. Just some stab/heal its gone down before 2. phase.

[kiroho.4738]

33 minutes ago, Anov.4237 said:

Have the meta in SW been nerfed? the bosses in lane 1-3 dont even reach phase 2.

No nerfs, no. But the Map has been released almost 10 years ago and was balanced around classes with much less dmg (like 1/5 the dmg we have now), without elite specs, without certain stats, mounts, masteries and so on. Not even heal or boon support builds existed back then. It wasn't even possible to keep up boons alone and alacrity didn't existed.

In other words: 10 years of power creep happened.

[Jin.8501]

Pitfall every long running game falls in to and eventually dies to. Unless you throw lot of money to fix the problem and silence the NEETs wanting quick farms

Edited August 3 by Jin.8501

[Anov.4237]

Have only  become aware of this within the last month. SW is almost the only open world i play and only in WvW/PvP breaks. Can it be a layer update. More people than ever and its 24/7.

[Ashen.2907]

Definitely a matter of player power creep. The bosses are all soloable now.

[Linken.6345]

3 hours ago, Anov.4237 said:

Have only  become aware of this within the last month. SW is almost the only open world i play and only in WvW/PvP breaks. Can it be a layer update. More people than ever and its 24/7.

If you have icebrood saga unlocked try drizzlewood coast metas.

[kiroho.4738]

3 hours ago, Jin.8501 said:

Pitfall every long running game falls in to and eventually dies to. Unless you throw lot of money to fix the problem and silence the NEETs wanting quick farms

Not at all. Powercreep actually keep older content alive.

With the time content get less popular.
SW at release required a full, semi organized map to be successful.
When you look at the population of SW nowadays, there wouldn't be nearly enough players for a successful event on the same difficulty as at release.
Thanks to power creep people are able to do the meta even if they are only 5 or 6 players.

It's the same for all older content. Dungeons for example. Back then you had to have 5 people for a proper run.
Exploration mode on minimum level was almost impossible, Arah was extremely hard.
Doing a dungeon with only 4 or 3 players was inconveicable. Doing a dungeon solo, almost impossible (aside from glitch abusers).
Nowadays dungeons are much less popular and it can take a long time until you find people. But thanks to the power creep it's not that hard to do dungeons alone anymore.
With two players it's easier than with a full group back then.
 

[nosleepdemon.1368]

4 hours ago, Zebulous.2934 said:

I am told that it is because of player-character power-creep.  Armor stat combinations that didn't exist at the time that silverwastes was created.  The change of skills and boons as well as conditions.  I think silverwastes predates alacrity, alacrity also didn't have so many sources when the boon itself was introduced.  The change of the torment condition so that it deals more damage to stationary targets.  Torment used to deal bonus damage to moving targets.  Bosses don't move much these days when everyone is clumped inside of a boon-ball.

If you are unfortunate enough to visit silverwastes during unpopular times you may encounter incompetent commanders or no commander tags at all.  I remember silverwastes being quite difficult when no one was organized.

Supposedly Anet has an advanced AI for mobs to use but when it was implemented the mobs were too difficult for the average player to beat.  So mobs just have very basic actions.

I don't really know how Anet is supposed to address powercreep among player characters.

 

Yup back in beta mobs would actually avoid your attacks and AoE. It was pretty smart. You also got bonuses for fighting mobs higher than your level. Unfortunately players complained because it was too hard to play the game with BOTH hands and your brain.

[Kozumi.5816]

Power creep has ruined any content pre-EoD sadly.

[Skub.8240]

Personally, I think it's okay for old and outdated content to become easy over time. If everything stayed exactly as hard as it ever was it'd feel like there was no point in doing anything else.

[Ashen.2907]

2 hours ago, kiroho.4738 said:

Not at all. Powercreep actually keep older content alive.

With the time content get less popular.
SW at release required a full, semi organized map to be successful.
When you look at the population of SW nowadays, there wouldn't be nearly enough players for a successful event on the same difficulty as at release.
Thanks to power creep people are able to do the meta even if they are only 5 or 6 players.

It's the same for all older content. Dungeons for example. Back then you had to have 5 people for a proper run.
Exploration mode on minimum level was almost impossible, Arah was extremely hard.
Doing a dungeon with only 4 or 3 players was inconveicable. Doing a dungeon solo, almost impossible (aside from glitch abusers).
Nowadays dungeons are much less popular and it can take a long time until you find people. But thanks to the power creep it's not that hard to do dungeons alone anymore.
With two players it's easier than with a full group back then.
 

That is a very interesting insight. I hadn't considered how power creep could be a good thing until reading your post. Thank you.

[HnRkLnXqZ.1870]

I revisited SW just yesterday, to help a friend power-level to 80. The map is great to teach/learn the loot system and event-mechanics. When we arrived, the map-population was about the size of the bot-lane when the content was fresh. It still was a lot of fun, despite pulverizing every 'boss' within seconds.

While I am not a huge fan of power-creep in general, for maps like SW it is good. Otherwise you could only complete the meta during certain times, with dedicated commanders like e.g. reaching Dry Top T6 or even the everlasting Tripple Trouble.

The only really annoying part of SW and the powercreep are the Legendaries. If you collect them nowadays, they have to spawn right before you. Because even they melt within seconds. No mount in the game is fast enough to get you there on time. If they spawn and you are not within a few hundred meters nearby, the boss is dead long before you reach the location. This is really annoying for new players who want to get that achievement done.

And then there is the Champion that never spawns at the wreckages of the helicopters. Why? No clue. They did not bother to fix it in 10 years.

Overall the powercreep on the map is not that bad. It keeps the map playable and enjoyable even for smaller map-populations.

[Luthan.5236]

Okay if it gets easier: Not okay if certain phases are needed to get achievements (which I think is the case here) - and they start to appear more rare or not at all anymore. Then achievement changes migh be necessary or fixed phases for the boss. (At a certain percentage of health him triggering a mechanic going in invuln. until it is done. Not randomyl after some time where you can kill it before the mechanic starts.)

[kiroho.4738]

1 hour ago, Luthan.5236 said:

Okay if it gets easier: Not okay if certain phases are needed to get achievements (which I think is the case here) - and they start to appear more rare or not at all anymore. Then achievement changes migh be necessary or fixed phases for the boss. (At a certain percentage of health him triggering a mechanic going in invuln. until it is done. Not randomyl after some time where you can kill it before the mechanic starts.)

True.
For Tequatl they added a portal after the fight for the treasure diving achievement., because the phase where the original portals spawn during the fight never happen anymore because of too much dmg.

[Randulf.7614]

Power creep has hurt it. Drizzlewood is where you want to go for similar content, but higher mob difficulty

I wouldn't object to some tweaks to improve boss integrity though. And that includes multiple meta bosses

Edited August 4 by Randulf.7614

[SuavePuppy.2809]

I think the meta is fine, but the legendaries, breach bosses, and vinewrath bosses could use a health boost. The achievements and masteries are difficult to get now due to creatures just melting, and I don't think it would hurt if they took an extra 60 seconds to take down.

[Skub.8240]

10 hours ago, SuavePuppy.2809 said:

I think the meta is fine, but the legendaries, breach bosses, and vinewrath bosses could use a health boost. The achievements and masteries are difficult to get now due to creatures just melting, and I don't think it would hurt if they took an extra 60 seconds to take down.

That's actually a good point, making the breach bosses specifically scale a bit harder wouldn't be a bad idea so they're not obnoxious on slow days but when there's a real crowd there they don't instantly melt before half the people can hit them.

[Zebulous.2934]

hmm a stalling shield?  Make them burrow, and regen some health, then pop back up and continue.  Don't spawn additional adds, just delay for... thirty seconds?  I suppose this should trigger at a health threshold.  
How many times should it trigger?
It won't make the boss more difficult but it would give people a little bit of time to reach the bosses.

[Astralporing.1957]

21 hours ago, kiroho.4738 said:

True.
For Tequatl they added a portal after the fight for the treasure diving achievement., because the phase where the original portals spawn during the fight never happen anymore because of too much dmg.

Not really because of too much damage. Remember, that the back to back defence/burn/defence approach appeared right after the megalaser "fix" very early after Tequatl release, and it's the primary reason why that event started being done. Before this (and few other nerfs that happened around the same time) it was around the same level of activity as Triple Trouble, with only rare organized attempts succeeding, and most players staying away from it.

Yes, this made the whirlpool achieve basically inaccessible for a while (until Anet created a bypass portal), but the price for that achieve being easily accessible earlier was usually the event failing. Or noone showing up for it. And all that happened well before power creep came along.

Edited August 5 by Astralporing.1957

[Tula.6021]

On 8/3/2024 at 9:36 PM, Anov.4237 said:

Have the meta in SW been nerfed? the bosses in lane 1-3 dont even reach phase 2.

Yes, with EoD release.

I'm still missing the achievement for lane 2.
Don't know if lane 3 has one.
Got lane 1 (the honey comb wall one) only because I logged in like 5 am and we only managed lane 1 barely.

I'm already glad when the Shatterer gets to a break bar phase and survives it.

[kiroho.4738]

11 hours ago, Tula.6021 said:

Yes, with EoD release.

Nope.

[Dibit.6259]

On 8/3/2024 at 9:22 PM, Anov.4237 said:

Have only  become aware of this within the last month. SW is almost the only open world i play and only in WvW/PvP breaks. Can it be a layer update. More people than ever and its 24/7.

Are you EU or NA? I believe in USA they break up for summer late may or early June so this may cause increase in playerbase during the timescale you have given.

With EU I know in the UK those in higher education tend to break up around the same time. Unsure with other EU countries.

[Mistwraithe.3106]

On 8/5/2024 at 1:58 AM, SuavePuppy.2809 said:

I think the meta is fine, but the legendaries, breach bosses, and vinewrath bosses could use a health boost. The achievements and masteries are difficult to get now due to creatures just melting, and I don't think it would hurt if they took an extra 60 seconds to take down.

I agree with this.