Scourge is too strong

[Vag.5682]

I told you barrier is 5-6k every15 sec or a 2k every 5sec while scourge has no active evades , blocks , mobility or stealth. So that's nothing scourges solo or in radom pvp are useless and die too fast.

Only ones who have problems with scourges are low rank pvpers running glass cannon builds without cleanse and without support. Which sadly 90? of games is like that nowdays.

Expecting to get into an aoe with no support and no cleances and survive is idiotic yet people are doing it and then complain about it .

Is like my scourge go melee vs a warrior get owned and then complain about it

High tier pvp has no issues with scourges rather with mesmers atm

[Subli.8217]

@Tzozef.9841 said:barrier (..) mitigates all damage, can't debuff it, and can be used consistently while dishing out condi dmg.

...that's the idea.shroud is no different, even stronger and scourge doesn't have it. also other classes have even better options like invulnerability buffs or converting dmg to health - you cant debuff it and they mitigate all damage as well WHILE dishing out dmg.

[vicious.5683]

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@"Crazy.6029" said:Scourge is not op after the recent nerfs, it really comes down to a couple of things to counter. Out range them, or don't stand next to them or in their shades. That's really it, after that it comes down to the player/opponents ability.

I can't tell if people who keep saying this are just delusional and don't want to admit their build is broken or legitimately dumb as rocks.

No. A build making every single melee weapon in the game worthless is not OK. Melee needs to exist for balance in a tab-targetting game or else all matches devolve into "who can spam more ranged DPS".

This really, really, should not be a thing that has to be explained. It should be obvious. Stop needing obvious kitten explained to you. Stop being bad.

Maybe you should stop being bad, after all, you are the one crying for nerfs to other classes.Besides, Scourge doesn't make melee weapons worthless, you have 2 weapon sets, just don't use the melee one when fighting a scourge. Is that so difficult to understand?Again, stay away from shades range.

[Anchoku.8142]

People who do not play Necro very much forget that Life Force requires constant charging by dealing damage with certain skills.

They cannot see an opponent's LF so they assume it is always full and shroud skills are always available. They do not understand why Necro's may, for example, swap scepter for staff when at short range.

[Master Ketsu.4569]

@vicious.5683 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@"Crazy.6029" said:Scourge is not op after the recent nerfs, it really comes down to a couple of things to counter. Out range them, or don't stand next to them or in their shades. That's really it, after that it comes down to the player/opponents ability.

I can't tell if people who keep saying this are just delusional and don't want to admit their build is broken or legitimately dumb as rocks.

No. A build making every single melee weapon in the game worthless is not OK. Melee needs to exist for balance in a tab-targetting game or else all matches devolve into "who can spam more ranged DPS".

This really, really, should not be a thing that has to be explained. It should be obvious. Stop needing obvious kitten explained to you. Stop being bad.

Maybe you should stop being bad, after all, you are the one crying for nerfs to other classes.Besides, Scourge doesn't make melee weapons worthless, you have 2 weapon sets, just don't use the melee one when fighting a scourge. Is that so difficult to understand?Again, stay away from shades range.You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Scourge is the only spec I am calling for a nerf, because it currently dominates the entire meta of ranked. I was in platinum last season and every single match boiled down to A ) Which team had better scourges B ) Which team had better support for their scourges C ) Which team could cover rotations faster for their scourges. D ) Which team could kill the enemy scourges first. And that's scourges with an S at the end because often it was 2 scourges both teams. Do you have any idea how many high ranked games I won by playing ventari rev and simply making my tablet a pocket healer for my teams scourges? Any fucking idea? It's a lot.ATs? pretty much the same thing.

Every time a brainless spec that requires zero skill to play comes out, there is always someone like you going "hurr durr yer just bad". No. If that was true it would be dominating the lower ranks, not the higher ones. Scourge is actually the opposite, it gets pooped on in lower ranks because people don't know how to zone. Because here is the thing: In upper ranked, people actually know teamwork. We peel for each other. Cover each others weaknesses. You think you are going to "outrange" the scourge when he has a support cockblocking you? Maybe in bronzie land, but not up here.

If you didn't notice this then that means either you do not play ranked, or were not high enough ranked to notice this problem. Either case, you need to stop talking about something you clearly do not understand.

[vicious.5683]

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@vicious.5683 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@"Crazy.6029" said:Scourge is not op after the recent nerfs, it really comes down to a couple of things to counter. Out range them, or don't stand next to them or in their shades. That's really it, after that it comes down to the player/opponents ability.

I can't tell if people who keep saying this are just delusional and don't want to admit their build is broken or legitimately dumb as rocks.

No. A build making every single melee weapon in the game worthless is not OK. Melee needs to exist for balance in a tab-targetting game or else all matches devolve into "who can spam more ranged DPS".

This really, really, should not be a thing that has to be explained. It should be obvious. Stop needing obvious kitten explained to you. Stop being bad.

Maybe you should stop being bad, after all, you are the one crying for nerfs to other classes.Besides, Scourge doesn't make melee weapons worthless, you have 2 weapon sets, just don't use the melee one when fighting a scourge. Is that so difficult to understand?Again, stay away from shades range.You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Scourge is the only spec I am calling for a nerf, because it currently dominates the entire meta of ranked. I was in platinum last season and every single match boiled down to A ) Which team had better scourges B ) Which team had better support for their scourges C ) Which team could cover rotations faster for their scourges. D ) Which team could kill the enemy scourges first. And that's scourges with an S at the end because often it was 2 scourges both teams. Do you have any idea how many high ranked games I won by playing ventari rev and simply making my tablet a pocket healer for my teams scourges?

Any kitten idea?

It's a lot.ATs? pretty much the same thing.

Every time a brainless spec that requires zero skill to play comes out, there is always someone like you going "hurr durr yer just bad". No. If that was true it would be dominating the lower ranks, not the higher ones. Scourge is actually the opposite, it gets pooped on in lower ranks because people don't know how to zone. Because here is the thing: In upper ranked, people actually know teamwork. We peel for each other. Cover each others weaknesses. You think you are going to "outrange" the scourge when he has a support cockblocking you? Maybe in bronzie land, but not up here.

If you didn't notice this then that means either you do not play ranked, or were not high enough ranked to notice this problem. Either case, you need to stop talking about something you clearly do not understand.

You say scourge needs "zero skill to play" but then you say "scourge works only in high level pvp", do you see the contradiction here? Or maybe you are implying it takes zero skill to reach high level pvp.

Anyway, when a class works best with team work, it's called synergy and it's a good thing to have. I'm sure you'd be happy 1v1'ing every single opponent, but that would be a boring design.

[Crinn.7864]

@vicious.5683 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@vicious.5683 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@"Crazy.6029" said:Scourge is not op after the recent nerfs, it really comes down to a couple of things to counter. Out range them, or don't stand next to them or in their shades. That's really it, after that it comes down to the player/opponents ability.

I can't tell if people who keep saying this are just delusional and don't want to admit their build is broken or legitimately dumb as rocks.

No. A build making every single melee weapon in the game worthless is not OK. Melee needs to exist for balance in a tab-targetting game or else all matches devolve into "who can spam more ranged DPS".

This really, really, should not be a thing that has to be explained. It should be obvious. Stop needing obvious kitten explained to you. Stop being bad.

Maybe you should stop being bad, after all, you are the one crying for nerfs to other classes.Besides, Scourge doesn't make melee weapons worthless, you have 2 weapon sets, just don't use the melee one when fighting a scourge. Is that so difficult to understand?Again, stay away from shades range.You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Scourge is the only spec I am calling for a nerf, because it currently dominates the entire meta of ranked. I was in platinum last season and every single match boiled down to A ) Which team had better scourges B ) Which team had better support for their scourges C ) Which team could cover rotations faster for their scourges. D ) Which team could kill the enemy scourges first. And that's scourges with an S at the end because often it was 2 scourges both teams. Do you have any idea how many high ranked games I won by playing ventari rev and simply making my tablet a pocket healer for my teams scourges?

Any kitten idea?

It's a lot.ATs? pretty much the same thing.

Every time a brainless spec that requires zero skill to play comes out, there is always someone like you going "hurr durr yer just bad". No. If that was true it would be dominating the lower ranks, not the higher ones. Scourge is actually the opposite, it gets pooped on in lower ranks because people don't know how to zone. Because here is the thing: In upper ranked, people actually know teamwork. We peel for each other. Cover each others weaknesses. You think you are going to "outrange" the scourge when he has a support cockblocking you? Maybe in bronzie land, but not up here.

If you didn't notice this then that means either you do not play ranked, or were not high enough ranked to notice this problem. Either case, you need to stop talking about something you clearly do not understand.

Anyway, when a class works best with team work, it's called synergy and it's a good thing to have. I'm sure you'd be happy 1v1'ing every single opponent, but that would be a boring design.

Reaper works best with teamwork too, and was quite effective. Yet Scourge is a 100% upgrade in every category over Reaper.

Scourge's power level is totally uncalled for. There is no justification for Scourge's F2 to be applying at least 5 unique condis every 6.5 seconds in a giant 300 radius area. There is no justification for that 300 radius shade nuke to also be able to be casted at 900 range, and there is no justification for Ghastly Breach to be a total upgrade over plaguelands while also having half the cooldown and a lower cast time.

[Master Ketsu.4569]

@"vicious.5683" said:

You say scourge needs "zero skill to play" but then you say "scourge works only in high level pvp", do you see the contradiction here? Or maybe you are implying it takes zero skill to reach high level pvp.

Skill floor and ceiling are not contradictory concepts.

https://www.monolithmagazine.org/single-post/2017/11/07/Skill-Floor-Skill-Ceiling-The-Competitive-Scene

Anyway, when a class works best with team work, it's called synergy and it's a good thing to have. I'm sure you'd be happy 1v1'ing every single opponent, but that would be a boring design.

I literally explained that this is one of the very big reasons why they are broken in higher ranked. Scourge is the easiest class in the game to carry. I can slap protective solace on a scourge and unless that player is an invalid among invalids he is not going to die and is going to be dishing mad damage.

[Shadowcat.2680]

@vicious.5683 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@"Crazy.6029" said:Scourge is not op after the recent nerfs, it really comes down to a couple of things to counter. Out range them, or don't stand next to them or in their shades. That's really it, after that it comes down to the player/opponents ability.

I can't tell if people who keep saying this are just delusional and don't want to admit their build is broken or legitimately dumb as rocks.

No. A build making every single melee weapon in the game worthless is not OK. Melee needs to exist for balance in a tab-targetting game or else all matches devolve into "who can spam more ranged DPS".

This really, really, should not be a thing that has to be explained. It should be obvious. Stop needing obvious kitten explained to you. Stop being bad.

Maybe you should stop being bad, after all, you are the one crying for nerfs to other classes.Besides, Scourge doesn't make melee weapons worthless, you have 2 weapon sets, just don't use the melee one when fighting a scourge. Is that so difficult to understand?Again, stay away from shades range.

Not all professions have a second weapon set. Try telling an ele or engi to swap to ranged while in combat.

[vicious.5683]

@Crinn.7864 said:

@vicious.5683 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@vicious.5683 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@"Crazy.6029" said:Scourge is not op after the recent nerfs, it really comes down to a couple of things to counter. Out range them, or don't stand next to them or in their shades. That's really it, after that it comes down to the player/opponents ability.

I can't tell if people who keep saying this are just delusional and don't want to admit their build is broken or legitimately dumb as rocks.

No. A build making every single melee weapon in the game worthless is not OK. Melee needs to exist for balance in a tab-targetting game or else all matches devolve into "who can spam more ranged DPS".

This really, really, should not be a thing that has to be explained. It should be obvious. Stop needing obvious kitten explained to you. Stop being bad.

Maybe you should stop being bad, after all, you are the one crying for nerfs to other classes.Besides, Scourge doesn't make melee weapons worthless, you have 2 weapon sets, just don't use the melee one when fighting a scourge. Is that so difficult to understand?Again, stay away from shades range.You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Scourge is the only spec I am calling for a nerf, because it currently dominates the entire meta of ranked. I was in platinum last season and every single match boiled down to A ) Which team had better scourges B ) Which team had better support for their scourges C ) Which team could cover rotations faster for their scourges. D ) Which team could kill the enemy scourges first. And that's scourges with an S at the end because often it was 2 scourges both teams. Do you have any idea how many high ranked games I won by playing ventari rev and simply making my tablet a pocket healer for my teams scourges?

Any kitten idea?

It's a lot.ATs? pretty much the same thing.

Every time a brainless spec that requires zero skill to play comes out, there is always someone like you going "hurr durr yer just bad". No. If that was true it would be dominating the lower ranks, not the higher ones. Scourge is actually the opposite, it gets pooped on in lower ranks because people don't know how to zone. Because here is the thing: In upper ranked, people actually know teamwork. We peel for each other. Cover each others weaknesses. You think you are going to "outrange" the scourge when he has a support cockblocking you? Maybe in bronzie land, but not up here.

If you didn't notice this then that means either you do not play ranked, or were not high enough ranked to notice this problem. Either case, you need to stop talking about something you clearly do not understand.

Anyway, when a class works best with team work, it's called synergy and it's a good thing to have. I'm sure you'd be happy 1v1'ing every single opponent, but that would be a boring design.

Reaper works best with teamwork too, and was quite effective. Yet Scourge is a 100% upgrade in every category over Reaper.

Scourge's power level is totally uncalled for. There is no justification for Scourge's F2 to be applying at least 5 unique condis every 6.5 seconds in a giant 300 radius area. There is no justification for that 300 radius shade nuke to also be able to be casted at 900 range, and there is no justification for Ghastly Breach to be a total upgrade over plaguelands while also having half the cooldown and a lower cast time.

Well, Plaguelands is plain bad. Is wasn't that hard for Anet to come up with a better elite skill.

[Drarnor Kunoram.5180]

@Shadowcat.2680 said:

@vicious.5683 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@"Crazy.6029" said:Scourge is not op after the recent nerfs, it really comes down to a couple of things to counter. Out range them, or don't stand next to them or in their shades. That's really it, after that it comes down to the player/opponents ability.

I can't tell if people who keep saying this are just delusional and don't want to admit their build is broken or legitimately dumb as rocks.

No. A build making every single melee weapon in the game worthless is not OK. Melee needs to exist for balance in a tab-targetting game or else all matches devolve into "who can spam more ranged DPS".

This really, really, should not be a thing that has to be explained. It should be obvious. Stop needing obvious kitten explained to you. Stop being bad.

Maybe you should stop being bad, after all, you are the one crying for nerfs to other classes.Besides, Scourge doesn't make melee weapons worthless, you have 2 weapon sets, just don't use the melee one when fighting a scourge. Is that so difficult to understand?Again, stay away from shades range.

Not all professions have a second weapon set. Try telling an ele or engi to swap to ranged while in combat.

Engis do it all the time, but you have a point on eles.

[Crinn.7864]

@vicious.5683 said:

@Crinn.7864 said:

@vicious.5683 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@vicious.5683 said:

@Master Ketsu.4569 said:

@"Crazy.6029" said:Scourge is not op after the recent nerfs, it really comes down to a couple of things to counter. Out range them, or don't stand next to them or in their shades. That's really it, after that it comes down to the player/opponents ability.

I can't tell if people who keep saying this are just delusional and don't want to admit their build is broken or legitimately dumb as rocks.

No. A build making every single melee weapon in the game worthless is not OK. Melee needs to exist for balance in a tab-targetting game or else all matches devolve into "who can spam more ranged DPS".

This really, really, should not be a thing that has to be explained. It should be obvious. Stop needing obvious kitten explained to you. Stop being bad.

Maybe you should stop being bad, after all, you are the one crying for nerfs to other classes.Besides, Scourge doesn't make melee weapons worthless, you have 2 weapon sets, just don't use the melee one when fighting a scourge. Is that so difficult to understand?Again, stay away from shades range.You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Scourge is the only spec I am calling for a nerf, because it currently dominates the entire meta of ranked. I was in platinum last season and every single match boiled down to A ) Which team had better scourges B ) Which team had better support for their scourges C ) Which team could cover rotations faster for their scourges. D ) Which team could kill the enemy scourges first. And that's scourges with an S at the end because often it was 2 scourges both teams. Do you have any idea how many high ranked games I won by playing ventari rev and simply making my tablet a pocket healer for my teams scourges?

Any kitten idea?

It's a lot.ATs? pretty much the same thing.

Every time a brainless spec that requires zero skill to play comes out, there is always someone like you going "hurr durr yer just bad". No. If that was true it would be dominating the lower ranks, not the higher ones. Scourge is actually the opposite, it gets pooped on in lower ranks because people don't know how to zone. Because here is the thing: In upper ranked, people actually know teamwork. We peel for each other. Cover each others weaknesses. You think you are going to "outrange" the scourge when he has a support cockblocking you? Maybe in bronzie land, but not up here.

If you didn't notice this then that means either you do not play ranked, or were not high enough ranked to notice this problem. Either case, you need to stop talking about something you clearly do not understand.

Anyway, when a class works best with team work, it's called synergy and it's a good thing to have. I'm sure you'd be happy 1v1'ing every single opponent, but that would be a boring design.

Reaper works best with teamwork too, and was quite effective. Yet Scourge is a 100% upgrade in every category over Reaper.

Scourge's power level is totally uncalled for. There is no justification for Scourge's F2 to be applying at least 5 unique condis every 6.5 seconds in a giant 300 radius area. There is no justification for that 300 radius shade nuke to also be able to be casted at 900 range, and there is no justification for Ghastly Breach to be a total upgrade over plaguelands while also having half the cooldown and a lower cast time.

Well, Plaguelands is plain bad. Is wasn't that hard for Anet to come up with a better elite skill.

Plaguelands was used in tournaments pre-scourge.In terms of function and role, Scourge is literally HoT era condi reaper, but with massive across the board power creep. It's better in every category by large margins.

[Vag.5682]

Not a heavy PVP player, but dueled with a guildie maining Scourge for a good three hours or so, both in an empty hotjoin and in the FFA arena in the PVP lobby. Just did so for fun... At first. The way he was traited made him impossible to defeat, no matter what build I tried on him. He was defeated only when another Scourge entered the arena.I understand that as a ranger, regardless of whether I used core, druid, or soulbeast, I was at a major disadvantage. I couldn't clear his condis quickly enough or kite away for that matter. At any given time, I had multiple stacks of ten condis on me. Ten! (I took the time to count because I couldn't kite regardless, lol.)Slight rant aside, I do know now why there's an uproar about Scourges. And there needs to be a Nerf. I don't play Necro, so I can't specify, but let's at least make PVP enjoyable again.

@Titan.3472 said:I just rerolled a scourge to test in pvp : F2 F4 Heal kitten this class is IWIN button everywhere... carried by a totaly broken game balance looool

Those are the shitposts scourges deal everyday.

full of bs from noobs who cant play for shit , unfounded claims with no back up or any real info.

A ranger who cant kite a scourge having 300 range more and be more mobile and someone who thinks barrier heals ...

[Patrick.2987]

I think heal was meaning healing utility and saying f2 and f4 give barrier is even more dumb?