Zefrost.3425 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 They are basically all trash garbage now that Alchemical Tinctures was removed for really il-thought reasons. Either put it back where it was or add it onto HGH itself. I don't care what mess the other traits are in, I just want Alchemical Tinctures back and my elixirs useful again.And the trait adaptive armor where it decreases incoming condition damage by 20% also does absolutely nothing now btw. How often do you have barrier? Yeah never.
Sylvari.2953 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 I agree. If we don't get Alchemical Tinctures back, I'm gonna turn my Engi main into a banker character.
mov.1246 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 I personally dont like the changes to alchemy traitline and adaptive armor. Inventions were good changes.I dont like lesser elixier C, its a nerf to the previous trait.I dont like that change to alchemical tinctures, its a nerf. The amount of healing we got isnt even noticeable.HGH is IMO still necessary, because you have so many elixir traits and skills. Lesser elixir B, lesser elixier C, auto elixir S, E-gun skills, they all benefit from HGH. And I never used a pvp/wvw build without at least 1 elixier in slot. Purity of purpose and new iron blooded are good changes, but still outshined by HGH.I like the barrier from adaptive armor, but it sucks that the 20% condi damage are just active when barrier is up, you literally never have a long lasting barrier.Other changes to scrapper are very nice.All changes to intentions are pretty nice and have good synergies.
Blackfish.7349 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 I agree with the above statements:Changes to invention trait line are good. Reconstruction enclosure and anticorrosion plating allow you to spec into a support condi cleanse role (medic gyro must for this role). If you plan to play more solo just change plating to bunker down for more damage and sustain. Changes to alchemy trait line are...in general a big mess. The new transmute is worse than the previous one, the 60 second CD make totally inoperative, specially because you have brutally nerfed alchemical tinctures. Now our own and allies (we dont have own capability now) cleansing capabilities totally depend on the healing skill (turret or gyro) and its CD. So now we are a group cleansing machine once every 25 secs (reconstruction field) . But in the meantime we are overexposed to conditions and everyone who has played some time in wvw/pvp nows that you are dead if you can only cleanse depending on your healing skill, specially if you play solo. Purity of purpose is a good elite tier but with so timegated (every 20-25s) cleansing capability it remains inoperative during to much seconds. Iron blooded got buffed but it seems a contradiction that you have to choose between a trait that gives you sustain as much as you have boons (iron blooded) and another one that converts cleansed conditions into boons (purity of purpose). Those two traits have sinergy but are exclusive. So most of the scrapper will stick to HGH when solo and POP when zerging test.Changes to the scrapper line are not as good as they seem at first sight. Decisive renown: gain a barrier when you revive or finish...It would make more sense to gain a barrier WHILE I revive or finish an enemy, thats when I would be recieving a toon of damage on myself. Once I have revived him or finished him I already have my skills available to survive, I need the barrier BEFORE. Impact savant, barrier stronger...This is totally a steal of a trait for FREE. Why? Because this trait is a minor trait so is a must if you go scrapper and if doing so and you think barriers are too weak why you just make them 15% stronger??? This kind of traits for making certain skills or abilities stronger must be a choice or put into another traitline so I have to sacrifice something to make my barriers stronger...what you have done now is just steal us the previous trait that was a very good trait (less impaired time, and more duration for our impairing effects). Give us back our stealed trait please. The elite trait adaptive armor. 20% condi damage reduction while I have a barrier? Giving that our own cleanse capability has been totally nerfed (alchemical tinctures nerf) I would expect to have this trait as it was before (20% reduction all time) to compensate the nerf to tinctures....but NO, you just nerfed this trait also without thinking in the global spec. Please, ANET make a zoom out, look at the whole scrapper now. It is even more imbalanced than before. With this patch you wanted to make it more viable for tanking purposes so we might consider to spec zerg frontliners....you just cant be of any help with a group cleanse every 25secs and so weak barriers. Other classes continue to do the job better. So we, scrappers stick to roam, havoc play and we find that without alchemical tinctures and perma 20% condi reduction as it was, our cleanse capability reduced drastically so we are more vulnerable to conditions now in an open environment.I understand that the big change and attention for this patch was given to mesmer. But you drastically changed scrapper and it seems that it did not received the same attention. I hope that future patches will address that and that this patch its just the first try of a series of iterations that will make finally scrapper viable for both zerging and roaming so everybody enjoys it.
ukuni.8745 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 @mov.1246 said:I personally dont like the changes to alchemy traitline and adaptive armor. Inventions were good changes.I dont like lesser elixier C, its a nerf to the previous trait.I dont like that change to alchemical tinctures, its a nerf. The amount of healing we got isnt even noticeable.HGH is IMO still necessary, because you have so many elixir traits and skills. Lesser elixir B, lesser elixier C, auto elixir S, E-gun skills, they all benefit from HGH. And I never used a pvp/wvw build without at least 1 elixier in slot. Purity of purpose and new iron blooded are good changes, but still outshined by HGH.I like the barrier from adaptive armor, but it sucks that the 20% condi damage are just active when barrier is up, you literally never have a long lasting barrier.Other changes to scrapper are very nice.All changes to intentions are pretty nice and have good synergies.Lesser elixir c is actually better transmute only stopped an incoming conditions this new one removes conditions currently on you which means it has atleast potential to remove a stack of damageing conditions.Hgh and purity of purpose are for two totally different setups and from some of my own testing i can tell ya purity of purpose is pritty insane in the right setup fpr spvp atleast wvw not so much.
Gwii.5972 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 @ukuni.8745 said:Lesser elixir c is actually better transmute only stopped an incoming conditions this new one removes conditions currently on you which means it has atleast potential to remove a stack of damageing conditions.But the cooldown is so long most of the time I will be dead before the trait actually triggers... Besides it takes 3 conditions to trigger the trait, yet more often than not I find myself troubled by 1 or 2 fast-stacking conditions.I don't like the new minor traits either. However, I guess fully reverting them would somewhat overtune engi's max cleansing potential.I do really hope at least one of them is undone though, or maybe lower the threshold of lesser elixir c to 2 conditions and lower its cooldown.
ukuni.8745 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 @Gwii.5972 said:@ukuni.8745 said:Lesser elixir c is actually better transmute only stopped an incoming conditions this new one removes conditions currently on you which means it has atleast potential to remove a stack of damageing conditions.But the cooldown is so long most of the time I will be dead before the trait actually triggers... Besides it takes 3 conditions to trigger the trait, yet more often than not I find myself troubled by 1 or 2 fast-stacking conditions.I don't like the new minor traits either. However, I guess fully reverting them would somewhat overtune engi's max cleansing potential.I do really hope at least one of them is undone though, or maybe lower the threshold of lesser elixir c to 2 conditions and lower its cooldown.did you mean to say youll be dead befor the trait retriggers? its allways genna trigger at the start of a fight and remove more condis then transmute would and transmute was allways worthless after the initiation, mostly it was only good for when your enemys opener was a fear or immob other then that tho it generally never helped at all, the new trait however will be handy as fuck versus a condi guardians opener if we ever see one of them again lol.One thing i dont think alotta people have realized tho is having to much packed into alchemy would have been bad if our next elite spec was to be a support based spec which incase ya didnt know is what most engineers want according to a poll recently done on these forums with these changes it makes getting a good and well balanced support spec a very real thing.
Gwii.5972 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 @ukuni.8745 said:One thing i dont think alotta people have realized tho is having to much packed into alchemy would have been bad if our next elite spec was to be a support based spec which incase ya didnt know is what most engineers want according to a poll recently done on these forums with these changes it makes getting a good and well balanced support spec a very real thing.Eh heh I personally would rather see a golem/minion based spec or a condi damage spec considering how condi core engi is off meta right now. ANet had chance to make engi supportive and yet look at med kit and scrapper minor traits... (I'm talking from a PvE solo/group standpoint though; no idea about how they work in PvP/WvW)
Ivantreil.3092 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 Indeed with everyone.The removal of Alchemical Tintctures simply killed my Drunk Engi build, ill simply have to play something new, every other change was fine and great, if they only not removed AT...
mov.1246 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 I very liked to play drunk engi in wvw, but I still havnt tried it after the patch.It would be sad if this build is destroyed...Maybe if you go inventions instead tools with anticorrison plate and heal gyro could be enough for condi clearing? Heal gyro removes 2. Heal toolbelt removes 5. Protection injection removes 1. And the Lesser elixir C trait 2. Plus runes or sigilsOr just use elixir C instead S
ukuni.8745 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 @Gwii.5972 said:@ukuni.8745 said:One thing i dont think alotta people have realized tho is having to much packed into alchemy would have been bad if our next elite spec was to be a support based spec which incase ya didnt know is what most engineers want according to a poll recently done on these forums with these changes it makes getting a good and well balanced support spec a very real thing.Eh heh I personally would rather see a golem/minion based spec or a condi damage spec considering how condi core engi is off meta right now. ANet had chance to make engi supportive and yet look at med kit and scrapper minor traits... (I'm talking from a PvE solo/group standpoint though; no idea about how they work in PvP/WvW)engi can be pretty supporty in pvp now but not so much as druid or ele i think, pve support spec is a pipe dream for the people who want one atleast even if they made one whats it going to do that support specs dont already do and if it does what other builds do then it only makes them redundant and i doubt anet is going to pull a sorry other class your not wanted anymore situation, but we do atleast have oppertunity from the balance chages to put a core support engi in a decent spot and i think it would have to come from changing certian shit in tools that synergizes with either or both alchemy/inventions and various utility's, tools is basically the dirty love child of explosives alchemy and inventions at the moment anyway give it some more character.
Blackfish.7349 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 @"ukuni.8745" said:Lesser elixir c is actually better transmute only stopped an incoming conditions this new one removes conditions currently on you which means it has atleast potential to remove a stack of damageing conditions.As stated in the patch notes from 2015, transmute already cleansed all stacks from a condition:"Transmute: Updated this trait to use the standard conversion list for conditions into boons and to affect all stacks of a condition."I don't know Ukuni why you keep saying all around that transmute only cleared one of a stack of conditions. Was the trait bugged or so?
coro.3176 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 Ultimately, I think it's good that they did this. Engi was too reliant on Alchemy+Elixirs for condi clear. Hopefully when/if they give us back condi clear options, they will be part of heal skills, or a bit more spread out through the rest of the traitlines.The game in general probably needs a bit less condi clear, given that they want to make condi longer-lasting DoTs rather than the condi burst it used to be.
coglin.1496 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 @"Zefrost.3425" said:And the trait adaptive armor where it decreases incoming condition damage by 20% also does absolutely nothing now btw. How often do you have barrier? Yeah never. almost always when I have the trait equipped. Adaptive armor now synergizes and function very well with iron blooded. it is a nerf to the elixirs themselves. It is a buff to almost every other build option that everyone was running in all three game modes though.Well, now we are not pressured to run elixirs just for condition removal. Because their functionality otherwise was abysmal. half of the elixirs functionality was in "throw elixirs" which make all of the skills reflectable ground target required skills which were extremely slow, easily interrupted and countered and inconvenient to use.Now though any build is not pressured to use the horribly functioning, random effects, slow, reflectable elixirs, and can get equivalent or better condition clears, or condition to boon conversions, by just one of the two trait lines. there is no denying that just one trait line is better then what was available before for any player who did not want to be pigeonholed to give up a utility, healing, or elite skill to slot a poorly functioning, RNG, elixir skill.I am celebrating the build diversity the rest of the community has been opened up to. We no longer need the RNG skills that are elixirs. You have to admit it greatly opened up options for Holosmith and Scrapper, as well as allowing core engineers to be free of being pigeonholed into using RNG heal, utility, or elite skills just to cleanse a condition.@Gwii.5972 said:Eh heh I personally would rather see a golem/minion based spec or a condi damage spec considering how condi core engi is off meta right now. ANet had chance to make engi supportive and yet look at med kit and scrapper minor traits... (I'm talking from a PvE solo/group standpoint though; no idea about how they work in PvP/WvW)You lost all your credit the instant you try to genuinely claim you think the community would be better off with a minion based spec. I could agree with you on the condition viability of the core engineer, but it is a tough battle considering how against more conditions the PvP/WvW community is right now. Are you struggling with condition damage with P/P, bomb kit, EG, MK, and Grenades right now?@Ivantreil.3092 said:Indeed with everyone.The removal of Alchemical Tintctures simply killed my Drunk Engi build, ill simply have to play something new, every other change was fine and great, if they only not removed AT...You mean the weak build almost no one used? Sure it is a nerf to the elixirs themselves. It is a buff to almost every other build option that everyone was running in all three game modes though. I admit I will miss the value of that trait in relation to the elixir gun, otherwise, I doubt you could show much evidence that people enjoyed stacking poorly functioning RNG elixirs into builds just for condition cleanses.
Zefrost.3425 Posted February 9, 2018 Author Posted February 9, 2018 Do you even play engi? At high skill cap? Why do you keep referring to elixirs as RNG effects? Elixir B happens at 75% health (which realistically no one pays attention to so this is the only "RNG" one)Elixir S trait activates at 25% health which any engineer can utilize to secure a stomp. If you don't realize you're 25% health then that's a problem on your end, that's not RNG. The stunbreak elixir is not RNG, that's activated when you are stunned or taking heavy damage from a condition such as burn. Elixir gun 5 is not RNG - you activate that when you need to cleanse conditions, very obvious. Elixir Gun 4 is usually blasted in the light field from Elixir Gun 5 to cleanse more conditions or to create a gap.Do the math. The condition removal is NOT better now. Seriously, do the math. It is simply WORSE. Even with runes of durability (which are now 100% mandatory for engi in WvW - nice build diversity) your condition removal is worse. You can't even kitten activate conditions removal when you need it. NOW IT'S RNG. Protection from runes of durability - RNG. The trait changes would ONLY be good they didn't remove alchemical tinctures. Seriously, if I or someone else made a thread, say, 2 months ago, saying, "Let's change alchemical tinctures from causing elixirs to remove 1 condition to heal 38 health instead" what do you think people would say? The thread would be so flamed that it would be deleted and everyone would be perma-banned from the forums and even in the game itself for even entertaining the idea at all.The only condition removal engineers have now is by gaining/granting protection. "Use elixir C tho!" Stunbreaker elixir that also cures 1 condition > elixir C. You need to take at least 1 kit as an engineer and 2 if you want to be useful (PvP/WvW). So if you use toolkit, elixir c and some other crud that isn't elixir gun, your stunbreakers are trash and you might as well delete your engi.
Ten.2617 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 The changes on Inventions and Alchemy was good. I'd think!Just add Protection and Swiftness to current effect, that HGH will be fine.And(or) plz, remove those random effects of Elixirs H, B, U and X.
Ivantreil.3092 Posted February 9, 2018 Posted February 9, 2018 The removal of Alchemical Tintctures simply killed my Drunk Engi build, ill simply have to play something new, every other change was fine and great, if they only not removed AT...You mean the weak build almost no one used? Sure it is a nerf to the elixirs themselves. It is a buff to almost every other build option that everyone was running in all three game modes though. I admit I will miss the value of that trait in relation to the elixir gun, otherwise, I doubt you could show much evidence that people enjoyed stacking poorly functioning RNG elixirs into builds just for condition cleanses. Dude.... DUUUUDE, THE BUILD GOT ME AT TOP 100 LAST SEASON!Saying it was weak is being blind, it wasnt a bursty build, but ingore the build and you payed it hard, it was capable of cleansing a full corrupted bar, thats why the build had success even when it was in a meta plagued of Scourges man, get your facts before saying that...![season 9 Results](https://i.imgur.com/Mp5vvqy.png '''')
coglin.1496 Posted February 10, 2018 Posted February 10, 2018 @Ivantreil.3092 said:Dude.... DUUUUDE, THE BUILD GOT ME AT TOP 100 LAST SEASON!I guess that is why you capped out at top 100 and I was 9th overall.
Gwii.5972 Posted February 10, 2018 Posted February 10, 2018 @"coglin.1496" said:You lost all your credit the instant you try to genuinely claim you think the community would be better off with a minion based spec.LOL I didn't even mention how I'd like the spec to work and you automatically assume it's something like a necro or ranger?Well, now we are not pressured to run elixirs just for condition removal.... Except now we are pressured to run Inventions and locked with traits and skill picks just for condition removal.Because their functionality otherwise was abysmal. half of the elixirs functionality was in "throw elixirs" which make all of the skills reflectable ground target required skills which were extremely slow, easily interrupted and countered and inconvenient to use.I am speechless on the "abysmal functionality" part. But anyways, you say that like you usually toss elixir towards somewhere rather than right under yourself.I am celebrating the build diversity the rest of the community has been opened up to. We no longer need the RNG skills that are elixirs. You have to admit it greatly opened up options for Holosmith and Scrapper, as well as allowing core engineers to be free of being pigeonholed into using RNG heal, utility, or elite skills just to cleanse a condition.Wow... just wow. You lost all your credit the instant you try to genuinely claim you think core engis benefit from this. With a shield you lose offhand pistol and when using a shield you most likely either waste a cleanse or waste a block/reflect (BTW it's hilarious how 2 full seconds of protection is wasted in blocking duration). Without a shield you need... an unmoving short-ranged low-utility long-cooldown thumper turret that locks up 2 trait choices just for 1 condi cleanse per 10 sec? Gimme a break...
coglin.1496 Posted February 10, 2018 Posted February 10, 2018 @Gwii.5972 said:@"coglin.1496" said:You lost all your credit the instant you try to genuinely claim you think the community would be better off with a minion based spec.LOL I didn't even mention how I'd like the spec to work and you automatically assume it's something like a necro or ranger?Can you quote the portion of my post in which I even mentioned necro or ranger please?Well, now we are not pressured to run elixirs just for condition removal.... Except now we are pressured to run Inventions and locked with traits and skill picks just for condition removal.Actually, we are optioned to run a dedicated cleansing skill like elixir C or inventions or alchemy. If you feel that pressured to inventions to survive, I feel it is a learn to play issue. Because their functionality otherwise was abysmal. half of the elixirs functionality was in "throw elixirs" which make all of the skills reflectable ground target required skills which were extremely slow, easily interrupted and countered and inconvenient to use.I am speechless on the "abysmal functionality" part. But anyways, you say that like you usually toss elixir towards somewhere rather than right under yourself.You are speechless that players do not like RnG skills? Why I am speechless. Can you list the benefits to the skills being thrown projectiles with an unnecessarily long animation that triples the interruption frames and can be reflected?I am celebrating the build diversity the rest of the community has been opened up to. We no longer need the RNG skills that are elixirs. You have to admit it greatly opened up options for Holosmith and Scrapper, as well as allowing core engineers to be free of being pigeonholed into using RNG heal, utility, or elite skills just to cleanse a condition.Wow... just wow. You lost all your credit the instant you try to genuinely claim you think core engis benefit from this. With a shield you lose offhand pistol and when using a shield you most likely either waste a cleanse or waste a block/reflect (BTW it's hilarious how 2 full seconds of protection is wasted in blocking duration).Can you quote the portion of my post in which I claimed core engineer purely benefits? Why would you lose off-hand pistol? you work under a great many poor assumptions. It adds value to P/S builds but takes zero value from P/P builds. Without a shield you need... an unmoving short-ranged low-utility long-cooldown thumper turret that locks up 2 trait choices just for 1 condi cleanse per 10 sec? Gimme a break...I guess, or you could just cast elixir C like a rational person?
ukuni.8745 Posted February 10, 2018 Posted February 10, 2018 @Blackfish.7349 said:@"ukuni.8745" said:Lesser elixir c is actually better transmute only stopped an incoming conditions this new one removes conditions currently on you which means it has atleast potential to remove a stack of damageing conditions.As stated in the patch notes from 2015, transmute already cleansed all stacks from a condition:"Transmute: Updated this trait to use the standard conversion list for conditions into boons and to affect all stacks of a condition."I don't know Ukuni why you keep saying all around that transmute only cleared one of a stack of conditions. Was the trait bugged or so?Im guessing it was bugged ive never seen transmute clear a stack of conditions only seen immume pop up and the condition from that attack hasnt applied ive literally watched this happen all the time.To add to this last night a group of people went to bomb me on point, got immobed and vunlrability first it flipped to resistance and protection then that protection flipped another condi into alacrity used sword 3 got quickness popped my hard light area and went to town on 3 people and killed them when a single team mate came along, couldnt get lucky shit like that with transmute lol at best wouldn't have gotten immobed and would have been hit like a truck by the necro.
ukuni.8745 Posted February 10, 2018 Posted February 10, 2018 @Blackfish.7349 said:@"ukuni.8745" said:Lesser elixir c is actually better transmute only stopped an incoming conditions this new one removes conditions currently on you which means it has atleast potential to remove a stack of damageing conditions.As stated in the patch notes from 2015, transmute already cleansed all stacks from a condition:"Transmute: Updated this trait to use the standard conversion list for conditions into boons and to affect all stacks of a condition."I don't know Ukuni why you keep saying all around that transmute only cleared one of a stack of conditions. Was the trait bugged or so?I went and read the changes for when transmute was released and i works exactly the way i said its not bugged your wrong but not 100% wrong if the attack has day 3 stacks of burn attatched to it then it will clear those 3 stacks from the attack but not the stacks of burning you allready had on you
Gwii.5972 Posted February 10, 2018 Posted February 10, 2018 @coglin.1496 said:snipSigh... because as any spec, core/holo/scrapper, when necessary, we used to be able to take Alchemy trait line and have a certain level of condi cleansing ability and got to pick which elixir and which traits to use without affecting that level of condi cleansing ability and acquire different offensive or defensive utility. After the update, to reach that level of condi cleansing ability I feel much, much more restricted. My point was, it's not end of the world but it is a nerf to core and holo (holo much less so) (and scrapper overall got buffed not really because of the Alchemy/Inventions change but because of the change of scrapper line itself and the existing fitness of scrapper with Inventions and Alchemy). L2P or falling back to less useful abilities (thumper or elixir c or w/e) does not change the fact that it is a nerf. I guess you hate RNG that much so you disagree with that but I don't so oh well.
coglin.1496 Posted February 10, 2018 Posted February 10, 2018 @"Gwii.5972" said:Sigh... because as any spec, core/holo/scrapper, when necessary, we used to be able to take Alchemy trait line and have a certain level of condi cleansing ability and got to pick which elixir and which traits to use without affecting that level of condi cleansing ability and acquire different offensive or defensive utility. After the update, to reach that level of condi cleansing ability I feel much, much more restricted. The issue is you confuse your subjective feelings with that of actual objective facts. My point was, it's not end of the world but it is a nerf to core and holo (holo much less so)Not certain what math you are using but it is an easily provable and objective fact that Holo condition cleanse potential was greatly increased. (and scrapper overall got buffed not really because of the Alchemy/Inventions change but because of the change of scrapper line itself and the existing fitness of scrapper with Inventions and Alchemy). Not sure what you are going on about. Scrapper received an objective buff to survivability with the same damage output. That is called a definitive buff. That is regardless of anything that occurred on the Alchemy or Inventions line. Although utilizing either or both of those lines does significantly support and benefit the elite spec.L2P or falling back to less useful abilities (thumper or elixir c or w/e) does not change the fact that it is a nerf. I guess you hate RNG that much so you disagree with that but I don't so oh well.Sure, I disliked RnG. WHo do you know who doesn't? I mean the real issue here is the folks posting as if full elixir builds were particularly popular or disingenuously suggest it was a particularly strong build. If you think elixir C is a "less useful condition cleanse" then I do not know what to tell you. It is the single ability, with the most cleanse/conversion per use. No one is suggesting the change is not a nerf to core engineer, I am simply suggesting the complaints that it is a direct nerf to Scrapper or Holo is dishonest because it is false.
Deniara Devious.3948 Posted February 11, 2018 Posted February 11, 2018 I agree that RNG of elixirs is bad design and I never liked the random aspect, but the fact remains: Elixirs got gutted is this so called "balance" update. Now many elixir skills are trash category. Nerfing 7 skills + their toolbelt skills + elixir gun + mortar = nerfs to 15 skills in total = massive negative change for engineer.Making one trait line pretty much mandatory instead of another (inventions now over alchemy) isn't increasing build diversity. In fact build diversity got worse for the core engineer. Now core engineer is forced to use pistol/shield and inventions + alchemy to get good condition removal. There are no viable rifle and pistol/pistol core builds with decent condition removal any more.
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