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True, even if it would be by paying an insane amount of crystals and chak eggs (could even add something like 250 chak gerent eyes), at least people would have a goal if there'd be a guaranteed way to get them and have a sense of progression. Now every single time, it's another small disappointment with a feeling of "why am I still bothering with this". That being said, I doubt they'll change it, cause after all this time, even the planned Verdant Brink aura has never been added to the game (Charged Quartz Orichalcum Amulet of the Sky). No reason to hype HoT anymore so it's not getting looked after anymore. All about milking the mounts from PoF now :)

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There's a rumor said that chak necklace doesn't have drop rate, Instead you have to follow a pattern during the entire meta event. If you do everything right you will get chak necklace from boss kill reward chest.

Im not sure if this is true because orge and scar lane cannot finish too quick or you'll unable to follow the pattern.

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@Rodrick.1942 said:There's a rumor said that chak necklace doesn't have drop rate, Instead you have to follow a pattern during the entire meta event. If you do everything right you will get chak necklace from boss kill reward chest.

Im not sure if this is true because orge and scar lane cannot finish too quick or you'll unable to follow the pattern.

Released by Tekkit on 1st of April? Yeah.

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@SnowHawk.3615 said:I've done the Chak Gerent Meta event every day since the 2nd week when HoT was released. 30k Leyline crystals and 3k+ ley line sparks and still no chak necklace.I didn't get any of the HoT OW amulets either but that's not the worst part. It's not just that I didn't get it but neither did anyone else. I ran these events way more than 1000 times and I've never once seen anyone else get the drop (which says a lot given that they're usually about 100 people present).

With HoT they implemented 3 infusions with cosmetic aura (2 for OW and one for raids) and while the OW stuff is BS rare the raid one was actually implementad in a way that makes sense (it's both a rare drop and something you can buy with the respective special currency) and actually gives the player an incentive to engage with the content.

But the recent content has the exact same problems, we have a new infusion which is to rare to frarm and a new map currency which doesn't have any use once you finish the collections. It's frustrating to see that the OW devs still fail horribly at basic game design especially since meta themed cosmetic infusions are exactly the kind of unique content reward that adds replayability without having a negative impact on other content.

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@"Malediktus.9250" said:imagine if it would be a common dropThere's a difference between something being a common drop and it being so rare that there's no point in trying anymore. It not being reasonably obtainable through the associated content defeats the purpose of having it in the first place. The WvW T3 stuff is also "rare" but even tho I think level 2000 is total overkill (compared to the requirement for the legendary WvW stuff) it's at least still "obtainable". Were talking about a meta reward here, not some kind of legendary.

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@Tails.9372 said:

@"Malediktus.9250" said:imagine if it would be a common dropThere's a difference between something being a common drop and it being so rare that there's no point in trying anymore. It not being reasonably obtainable through the associated content defeats the purpose of having it in the first place. The WvW T3 stuff is also "rare" but even tho I think level 2000 is total overkill (compared to the requirement for the legendary WvW stuff) it's at least still "obtainable". Were talking about a meta reward here, not some kind of legendary.

It is a bit like winning the lottery, but that is what the game lacked for a long time. Other than precursors there were no rare drops for years.And 2000 WvW levels seems balanced to me, considering there are dozens of people who are maxed out (rank 10k)

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@Tails.9372 said:There's a difference between something being a common drop and it being so rare that there's no point in trying anymore.First, that's not the distinction anyone is making in this thread. It's the difference between common enough that it can be farmed and rare enough so that it can't be.

Second, no, we're not talking about a normal meta reward. We're talking about jackpot lucky, as a bonus for playing, not as a normal reward.

The question is whether it's good for the community to have some items so rare that only the luckiest can obtain them. I think so. It adds excitement to the anticipation before events. It's an enormous transfer of wealth between the richest players towards the other 99%. And it gives a lot of people an incentive to earn. The game already has tons of rewards that anyone can obtain and plenty that anyone dedicated enough will get. It has hardly any that can only be obtained directly through a ridiculous amount of luck.

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@Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:

bad game design.Disliking a design doesn't make it bad.

While i dislike how invisible shoes are obtained, the drop rate on all these super rare things is horrendously low. There are players who even after 6 years havent gotten a precursor drop, that alone is bad enough, and these items are rarer than those and for the vast majority of players they wont be able to afford them.

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@Tails.9372 said:

bad game design.Disliking a design doesn't make it bad.This has nothing to do with "disliking" something. As I said before if it's pretty much unobtainable through regular gameplay means then it defeats the purpose of even implementing it in the first place. Youre just dismissive about it.

On the contrary, I enjoy the fact that it's rare. I'm not dismissing your desire to see it more easily obtained; we just disagree about whether that is something that is ultimately a good or a bad thing.

There's plenty of stuff in the game that is going to drop for me eventually, or that I'll be able to afford, eventually. There are a tiny number of items, maybe a dozen, that are so rare that they are special. For me, that makes looting more fun. Otherwise, it all ends up being same old stuff.

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tl;dr getting a precursor to drop is a matter of what and how one plays; it's much less about the specific chances, because the mechanics allow people to increase the frequency at which they get to roll for one.

@Dante.1763 said:There are players who even after 6 years havent gotten a precursor drop, that alone is bad enough,On the whole, the biggest reason that some people have gotten multiple precursors while some have gotten none is how often they have had a chance to roll for one. Those who spend most of their time in fractals have very few opportunities. Those who incessantly farm mob-heavy events have tons. Those who spend most of their time on the world boss train roll rarely; those who forge every rare they get have many many more.

By far and away, the most common source of precursors on the TP is from people who forge or people who open hundreds of stacks of unidentified gear with 900% Magic Find or better. A lot of people are never going to get one simply because they don't do enough of the things that give them chances to get one.


Arguably the Invisible Footwear and Infusions are more fair, because the only way to get them is through specific events. A wealthy (in game) player can't roll more often for the look-mom-no-shoes or the brighter-than-1000-suns infusions. They can pay someone else to be lucky, but they cannot increase the odds for themselves with their wealth.


I don't mean that as an argument in favor of my point (or against yours or @Tails.9372's ideas). This post is about the statistics (and whether wealth can influence that), not about whether it's good or bad for players or whether anyone is going to like it one way or another.

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@Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:tl;dr getting a precursor to drop is a matter of what and how one plays; it's much less about the specific chances, because the mechanics allow people to increase the frequency at which they get to roll for one.

@Dante.1763 said:There are players who even after 6 years havent gotten a precursor drop, that alone is bad enough,On the whole, the biggest reason that some people have gotten multiple precursors while some have gotten none is how often they have had a chance to roll for one. Those who spend most of their time in fractals have very few opportunities. Those who incessantly farm mob-heavy events have tons. Those who spend most of their time on the world boss train roll rarely; those who forge every rare they get have many many more.

By far and away, the most common source of precursors on the TP is from people who forge or people who open hundreds of stacks of unidentified gear with 900% Magic Find or better. A lot of people are never going to get one simply because they don't do enough of the things that give them chances to get one.

Arguably the Invisible Footwear and Infusions are more fair, because the only way to get them is through specific events. A wealthy (in game) player can't roll more often for the look-mom-no-shoes or the brighter-than-1000-suns infusions. They can pay someone else to be lucky, but they cannot increase the odds for themselves with their wealth.

I don't mean that as an argument in favor of my point (or against yours or @Tails.9372's ideas). This post is about the statistics (and whether wealth can influence that), not about whether it's good or bad for players or whether anyone is going to like it one way or another.

While that may be true, i do 90% of my play time in open world doing events and after 6 years i have never seen one, or any of the rarer exotics drop from anything, and i got Zap from the mystic forge(3 months ago, when i was throwing SHIELDS into the toilet trying to get the Grinning shield.), and ive thrown alot, over 3000g worth of stuff into the mystic forge over the same amount of time. Saddly i disagree about them being fair, as there are people who have farmed the mushrooms as much as is physically possible since they got confirmed as the thing that dropped them and have not seen a drop, the RNG drop rate that Anet uses is complete garbage and always has been which is my issue with the super rare almost non existent drops they keep introducing to the game.

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An easy fix for this would be simply to hand it over to people with a thousand chak gerent events. Sure, you could get super lucky and get one early. Or you could grind for literally years and get it. There's no reason for it to be one or the other, and it would still be extremely rare because most of us won't grind a thousand chak gerent events.

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Never going to own it, fine with that fact myself personally.

I just question the following: people wanting this item so baldy, will your desire to own it remain if it was not as rare?

I feel as though a huge majority of people who want the item is due to 1 of two reasons:A.) it's one of those instant get rich itemsB.) it's super rare and people like having super rare stuff

Both of those factors are due to it's implementation. I fully understand some ones desire to be able to work towards something, but the mere fact that making it possible to work towards something already means it's value (both gold and uniqueness wise) will drop significantly.

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@Deimos.4263 said:An easy fix for this would be simply to hand it over to people with a thousand chak gerent events. Sure, you could get super lucky and get one early. Or you could grind for literally years and get it. There's no reason for it to be one or the other, and it would still be extremely rare because most of us won't grind a thousand chak gerent events.

1000 chak gerent events is nothing as a singular player, the droprate is estimated between 1 in 50k and 1 in 100k. So with 100 people present at each Chak Gerent map, you are looking at one in 500 maps dropping one infusion for a single player and the rest leaves with the regular junk.

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@"Dante.1763" said:While that may be true, i do 90% of my play time in open world doing events and after 6 years i have never seen one, or any of the rarer exotics drop from anything,Again, statistics doesn't promise you that you'll get anything special ever. It just tells if it's likely or not. Without describing in detail how much time you spend and what you're doing, it's hard to say if it's notable or not that you haven't see "any of the rarer exotics." Plus, we'd also have to define what those are. (Humans are demonstrably bad at remembering good luck; we are much much better at remembering bad.)

and i got Zap from the mystic forge(3 months ago, when i was throwing SHIELDS into the toilet trying to get the Grinning shield.), and ive thrown alot, over 3000g worth of stuff into the mystic forge over the same amount of time."3000g worth of stuff" — was that cheap rares, any rares? Exotics? Strictly L80 inputs? or a combination? Did you discount the amount by the value of the "not any of the rarer exotics" that can be sold on the TP? (As it turns out, throwing staffs or GS in has been historically much more profitable, due to the specific drop tables. For a long time, swords and daggers were similarly valuable.)

Anecdotal data isn't very useful in determining trends, partly because it's limited in scope and subject to our poor memory, but mostly because it's not representative: it's just too little data for the most part.

Saddly i disagree about them being fair, as there are people who have farmed the mushrooms as much as is physically possible since they got confirmed as the thing that dropped them and have not seen a drop,I apologize, I must not have explained what I meant by "fair." In the case of precursor drops, anyone with in-game or RL wealth can increase the number of times they roll for big loot by spending a little of their lucre. In contrast, no matter how rich you are, you cannot increase the number of times you get to play the invisible boot lottery. The only way to obtain it is via events. Thus it's more fair only in the sense that anyone has the same opportunities.

I make no claims about the fairness of drop rates or lack thereof. In fact, I'd argue that there's no such thing as a "fair" drop rate. For most people, "fair" means "I got it at least once" and "unfair" means "I never got it."

the RNG drop rate that Anet uses is complete garbage and always has been which is my issue with the super rare almost non existent drops they keep introducing to the game.On what basis are you deciding that the RNG is "complete garbage?The metric I use is: is it good for the game if some stuff is so rare that most people never get it? I think it is, because that makes the anticipation of loot more exciting for more people (although obviously not for everyone).Are you of the belief that the game would be better if there was no such thing as truly rare loot, so that everyone pretty much can expect two greens and a blue, plus the occasional exotic? What would be your ideal scenario and how do you ensure that "somewhat rare" doesn't turn into "everyone has it"?

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@Malediktus.9250 said:

@Deimos.4263 said:An easy fix for this would be simply to hand it over to people with a thousand chak gerent events. Sure, you could get super lucky and get one early. Or you could grind for literally years and get it. There's no reason for it to be one or the other, and it would still be extremely rare because most of us won't grind a thousand chak gerent events.

1000 chak gerent events is nothing as a singular player, the droprate is estimated between 1 in 50k and 1 in 100k. So with 100 people present at each Chak Gerent map, you are looking at one in 500 maps dropping one infusion for a single player and the rest leaves with the regular junk.

I'm not suggesting a drop rate. I'm suggesting a reward. It's not everytime someone does the 1000th chak gerent event. It's everytime each player hits 1000, and I don't think that's even close to often. Have you done 1000 chak gerent events? Yes, here's a thing. No? Keep on grinding see you in 3 years.

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@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:Are you of the belief that the game would be better if there was no such thing as truly rare lootIt's not about not having "truly rare stuff", it's about the way it's implemented and what replay value these items add to the content they're associated with. If they would add a new super rare infusion to ecto gambling then this would add value for those who usually engage in this kind of content and barely anyone would say anything about it. The meta drops are different however since making them super rare to the point where you can't reasonably expect to get one even if you farm it for years doesn't add anything to the associated content except for a miniscule part of the community that makes the raid one look gigantic by comparison. Like I said before meta events are not the proper place for this kind of content.

@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:"everyone has it"I wouldn't call stuff that only 1% of the playerbase owns "everyone has it" but one would still feel that way as things can seem to be rather common if you see one person in every second squad using it. So in order to shake of that "feeling" of "everyone has it" you would have to make things so rare that "not everyone has it" becomes synonymous to "pretty much no one has it" as statistically many things are alredy quite rare as they are and it's incredibly easy for one to lose perspective once one starts to take the average player out of the equation.

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@Deimos.4263 said:

@Deimos.4263 said:An easy fix for this would be simply to hand it over to people with a thousand chak gerent events. Sure, you could get super lucky and get one early. Or you could grind for literally years and get it. There's no reason for it to be one or the other, and it would still be extremely rare because most of us won't grind a thousand chak gerent events.

1000 chak gerent events is nothing as a singular player, the droprate is estimated between 1 in 50k and 1 in 100k. So with 100 people present at each Chak Gerent map, you are looking at one in 500 maps dropping one infusion for a single player and the rest leaves with the regular junk.

I'm not suggesting a drop rate. I'm suggesting a reward. It's not everytime
someone
does the 1000th chak gerent event. It's everytime
each player
hits 1000, and I don't think that's even close to often. Have
you
done 1000 chak gerent events? Yes, here's a thing. No? Keep on grinding see you in 3 years.

Doing 1000 chak event is much faster than earning 25k gold though (at least if you are not a TP baron or credit card hero)

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