Jump to content
  • Sign Up

[Elite Suggestion] Occultist/Warlock


Regon Phoenix.8215
 Share

Recommended Posts

Theme/story: some time a group of Asura (and several humans) scientists experimented with new type of teleportation technology. However, it didn't work as intended and actually tore a rift between time, space and all sorts of different dimensions. From that rifts several Margonite necromancers crossed into this reality. These demonic necromancers were captured and interrogated, all information they possessed and all information about them was compiled into one big document. Margonites were worshipers of Abaddon, but after his defeat they become imprisoned in a timeless dimension where slumbered before a rift was opened.However, during experiments and tests of the property of the rift an attack was made on research facility. An elite strike force attacked researchers and Margonite captives. All research documents were stolen and research facility was destroyed thus closing the rift for good. Nevertheless, in southern areas of discovered world new type of necromancers started popping out - Occultists/Warlocks. These necromancers practice toxic demonic magic which corrupts and twists everything around the caster and caster itself, and it spreads like a plague. Every time an Occultist use his crafts he is risking on turning into demon himself. And while this demonic magic is no longer tied to any particular entity, but its use hold a great danger - bringing Abaddon back into existence. After all, he is the father of this toxic magic.

Main builds:1) Melee condition build (Mace+warhorn or Mace+Dagger)2) Anti-support condition build (Mace+mace or Mace+focus)3) Raiding power build (Axe+Mace)



Adept Minor Trait (Cultist)Unlock Mace for your main-hand and off-hand and allow you to use Agony abilities.Replace "Death Shroud" with Demon's Shroud. Life force does not drain passively while you are in Demon's Shroud, but damage reduction while in shroud is reduced to 33%.

Adept Major Trait LineMajor Trait 1 (Toxic Ideas)Poison you inflict will last 10% longer and deal 10% more damage.Major Trait 2 (Corruptor of Blessings)Inflict 1 stack of poison for 5 sec whenever you corrupt or steal a boon from an enemy.Major Trait 3 (Oppressive Power)Deal 30 (scales with power) damage to any enemy you inflict vulnerability on.

-

Master Minor Trait (Plagued Step)Inflict 1 stack of poison for 6 sec to nearby enemies when you dodge. Radius: 450.

Master Major Trait LineMajor Trait 4 (Demon's Skin)Every 10 sec block next incoming attack and inflict 3 stacks of poison for 5 sec on the attacker. Only works in combat.Major Trait 5 (Deeper Corruption)When attacking with your mace an enemy with 4 or more boons, then corrupt 1 boon on that target. Cooldown: 10 sec.Major Trait 6 (Demon's Might)Gain 1 stack of might for 15 sec when you inflict vulnerability. Cooldown: 3 sec

-

Grandmaster Minor Trait (Weakening Plague)Inflict 1 stack of vulnerability for 6 sec whenever you inflict an enemy with poison. Cooldown: 1 sec.

Grandmaster Major Trait LineMajor Trait 7 (Corroding Whispers)Conditions inflicted on enemies within range threshold (450 units) will last 20% longer.Major Trait 8 (Suffer in Agony)Enemies affected by one of your Agony abilities lose 80 power, condition damage and healing power. This effect does not stack.Major Trait 9 (Mighty Demon)Gain 10 bonus ferocity for every stack of might on you.



Mace 1 (Agony Smash)First hit of three hit chain. Hit your target and poison it.

  • Casting time: 1/2 sec
  • Range: 130
  • Damage: 200 (scale with power)
  • Poison: 1 stack for 4 sec
  • Life force: 2%

-

Mace 1 (Agony Slam)Second hit of three hit chain. Hit your target and poison it

  • Casting time: 1/2
  • Range: 130
  • Damage: 250 (scales with power)
  • Poison: 1 stack for 4 sec
  • Life force: 2%

-

Mace 1 (Toxic Eruption)Third hit of three hit chain. Hit your target and deal bonus damage for every stack of poison on your target.

  • Casting time: 3/4 sec
  • Range: 130
  • Damage: 300 (scales with power)
  • Bonus damage per stack of poison: 100 (scales with power)
  • Life force: 4%

-

Mace 2 (Wandering Plague)Release toxic energy at your target inflicting damage, poison and vulnerability. This energy will chain between enemies and can hit some target more than once.

  • Casting time: 3/4 sec
  • Cooldown: 12 sec
  • Range: 600
  • Damage: 200 (scales with power)
  • Poison: 1 stack for 8 sec
  • Vulnerability: 1 stack for 8 sec
  • Chain range: 450
  • Maximum number of hits: 5

-

Mace 3 (Demonic Burst)Blast your target with demonic energies and inflict torment and vulnerability. Crippled and weakened enemies are immobilized as well.

  • Casting time: 1/2 sec
  • Cooldown: 18 sec
  • Range: 600
  • Damage: 400 (scales with power)
  • Torment: 2 stacks for 8 sec
  • Vulnerability: 2 stacks for 10 sec
  • Immobilize: 2 sec

-

Mace 4 (Corrupted Blessing)Curse your target to suffer damage whenever it receives a boon.

  • Casting time: 1 sec
  • Cooldown: 20 sec
  • Range: 600
  • Duration: 4 sec
  • Damage: 300 (scales with power)
  • Damage cooldown: 1/2 sec
  • Life fore every time this ability deals damage: 2%

-

Mace 5 (Demonic Rift)Target an area. After short delay a demonic rift will open at that area dealing heavy damage to all enemies inside. This ability have bonus critical strike chance on any enemy with vulnerability per stack of vulnerability.

  • Casting time: 1/4 sec
  • Cooldown: 12 sec
  • Range: 600
  • Radius: 180
  • Delay: 3 sec
  • Damage: 1600 (scales with power)
  • Critical strike chance per stack of vulnerability: 3%


F1 (Demon's Shroud)Enter into shroud.

  • Casting time: instant
  • Cooldown: 20 sec

-

Shroud 1 (Abaddon's Swipe)First hit of two hit chain. Slash your target and nearby enemies dealing damage and inflict poison.

  • Casting time: 1/2 sec
  • Range: 130
  • Targets hit: up to 3
  • Damage: 400 (scales with power)
  • Poison: 1 stack for 4 sec

-

Shroud 1 (Abaddon's Slam)Second hit of two hit chain. Smash your target and nearby enemies dealing damage and extend duration of all stacks of poison on your target.

  • Casting time: 3/4 sec
  • Range: 130
  • Targets hit: up to 3
  • Damage: 600 (scales with power)
  • Duration extension: 1 sec

-

Shroud 2 (Demon's Flight)Jump into targeted location dealing damage to all nearby enemies and poison them.

  • Casting time: 3/4 sec
  • Cooldown: 8 sec
  • Range: 600
  • Radius: 180
  • Targets hit: up to 5
  • Damage: 500 (scales with power)
  • Poison: 2 stacks for 6 sec

-

Shroud 3 (Demon's Pain)Gather energy gaining resistance. You can consume this effect to release explosion of toxic energies poisoning and fearing nearby enemies.

  • Casting time: instant
  • Cooldown: 30 sec
  • Resistance: 5 sec
  • Radius: 450
  • Poison: 2 stacks for 8 sec
  • Fear: 1 and 1/2 sec

-

Shroud 4 (Aura of Anguish)Engulf yourself with demonic energies poisoning and tormenting nearby enemies every second.

  • Casting time: instant
  • Cooldown: 20 sec
  • Duration: 6 sec
  • Pulses: 6
  • Radius: 450
  • Poison per pulse: 1 stack for 3 sec
  • Torment per pulse: 1 stack for 4 sec

-

Shroud 5 (The Darkest Form)Take on demonic form increasing all your stats and pulse vulnerability, poison and torment on nearby enemies. Reactive this ability to cancel it. This ability drains life force while it is active.

  • Casting time: instant
  • Cooldown: 20 sec
  • Stat boost: 5%
  • Life force cost per sec: 6%
  • Pulse: every 3 sec
  • Radius: 450
  • Vulnerability per pulse: 1 stack for 12 sec
  • Poison per pulse: 1 stack for 6 sec
  • Torment per pulse: 1 stack for 3 sec


Healing Agony (Living Agony)Heal yourself and curse your target for a short duration. Percentage of healing taken by the cursed enemy is transferred to you.

  • Casting time: 3/4 sec
  • Cooldown: 40 sec
  • Range: 600
  • Healing: 4000 (scales with healing power)
  • Duration: 3 sec
  • Healing transferred: 20%

-

Utility Agony 1 (Agony of the Blessed)Curse your target for a short duration. Steal all boons the cursed enemy receives.

  • Casting time: 1/2 sec
  • Cooldown: 50 sec
  • Range: 600
  • Duration: 4 sec

-

Utility Agony 2 (Agony of Actions)Curse your target for a short duration. Every time cursed enemy use and ability he/she will be poisoned.

  • Casting time: 1/2 sec
  • Cooldown: 40 sec
  • Range: 600
  • Duration: 5 sec
  • Poison: 1 stack for 5 sec

-

Utility Agony 3 (Agony of Futility)Curse your target for a short duration. Cursed enemy takes more direct damage from you.

  • Casting time: 1/2 sec
  • Cooldown: 30 sec
  • Range: 600
  • Duration: 5 sec
  • Damage increase: 10%

-

Utility Agony 4 (Agony of Impending Doom)Curse your target for a short duration. This curse will copy all damage you inflict on cursed enemy and will inflict percentage of damage collected when it expires.

  • Casting time: 1/2 sec
  • Cooldown: 25 sec
  • Range: 600
  • Duration: 3 sec
  • Damage: 15% of collected damage
  • Unblockable

-

Elite Agony (Agony of the Weak)Curse your target for a short duration. Cursed enemy takes damage over time, and enemy player can't active their elite ability. This curse counts as a poison effect.

  • Casting time: 3/4 sec
  • Cooldown: 80 sec
  • Range: 600
  • Duration: 4 sec
  • Damage (4x): 1000 (scales with power and condition damage)
Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Regon Phoenix.8215 said:Strange, i thought demon themed necromancer would get more attention. Looks like WoW warlock left a bad taste in everyone's mouths.

I think you mistake people not caring about your idea, because ANet are not going to, for people thinking it is bad. Sorry. Like, champ, there is totally nothing wrong with your idea. The idea is fine.

It just doesn't matter at all because ANet are not gonna pick up a random forum idea and use it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Regon Phoenix.8215 said:Strange, i thought demon themed necromancer would get more attention. Looks like WoW warlock left a bad taste in everyone's mouths.

a demon-necro elite is the most common suggestion there is. if i had to guess it's poor timing, poor execution or poor reputation (we can only speculate). but i'll entertain you:

  • your backstory doesn't work with current lore (as an example: abaddon is dead, for good.), and explains barely anything about the spec (only their origin and not their weapon, what/why their utilities are what they are).

  • thematically it's to similar to demon stance rev. a simple solution would be to take a different type of demon. there's imps, fleshreavers or ,if you want to go completely of the wall, take the species of Samarog/deimos or a new type of demon we haven't seen yet. so many options and you still went whit the one that's already taken.

i'm not gonna go deep into balance but a few pointers:

  • all utilities and mace 4 apply unique debuffs. that's generally a realm you want to thread lightly since they're so incredibly difficult to balance

  • you gave a trait that activate on boon corrupt/steal (Corruptor of Blessings) but the only boon corrupt in this spec is in another trait (Deeper Corruption) that activates when using a weapon on a enemy with +4 boons and only one skill has boon steal (Agony of the Blessed). that's a little to niche for a trait (and elite spec traits shouldn't rely on core skills/traits for basic functionality and most boon corrupt is on scourge and core necro has no boon steal).

i also think it lacks the identity expected of an elite spec. maybe the shroud makes up for it but it looks like a melee bruiser which is reaper's shtick

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@derd.6413 said:a demon-necro elite is the most common suggestion there is.

Have seen it done only once in this forum.

@derd.6413 said:if i had to guess it's poor timing, poor execution or poor reputation (we can only speculate)

Your reputation? Reputation of warlock theme?

@derd.6413 said:

  • your backstory doesn't work with current lore (as an example: abaddon is dead, for good.), and explains barely anything about the spec (only their origin and not their weapon, what/why their utilities are what they are).

And all legends employed be revenant are of dead creatures. So, that's not a valid reason.

@derd.6413 said:

  • thematically it's to similar to demon stance rev. a simple solution would be to take a different type of demon. there's imps, fleshreavers or ,if you want to go completely of the wall, take the species of Samarog/deimos or a new type of demon we haven't seen yet. so many options and you still went whit the one that's already taken.

How? What is similar between these two?

@derd.6413 said:

  • all utilities and mace 4 apply unique debuffs. that's generally a realm you want to thread lightly since they're so incredibly difficult to balance

Meh, still not a valid reason to dismiss something. Hard to balance =/= bad.

@derd.6413 said:

  • you gave a trait that activate on boon corrupt/steal (Corruptor of Blessings) but the only boon corrupt in this spec is in another trait (Deeper Corruption) that activates when using a weapon on a enemy with +4 boons and only one skill has boon steal (Agony of the Blessed). that's a little to niche for a trait (and elite spec traits shouldn't rely on core skills/traits for basic functionality and most boon corrupt is on scourge and core necro has no boon steal).

To this i can answer only like this:Unholy FeastDark PactPutrid CurseEnfeebling BloodSpinal ShiversWell of CorruptionCorrupt BoonChill of DeathSpiteful SpiritPath of CorruptionWeakening Shroud

These abilities and traits already provide tons of boon corrupt. And do you even understand what you are saying? Elite SHOULD rely on core and improve many aspects of the core class. Reaper improved upon chills, bleed and sustain. Scourge improved upon burning, torment and boon corruption. This elite improves upon poison, vulnerability and boon corruption.Nearly 100% of elites improve on several aspects of core classes.

@derd.6413 said:i also think it lacks the identity expected of an elite spec. maybe the shroud makes up for it but it looks like a melee bruiser which is reaper's shtick

Except that reaper is melee physical fighter, while mine is melee condition fighter. Reaper is more focused on sustain and tanking, while mine is more focused on damage.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Regon Phoenix.8215 said:

@derd.6413 said:a demon-necro elite is the most common suggestion there is.

Have seen it done only once in this forum.

@derd.6413 said:if i had to guess it's poor timing, poor execution or poor reputation (we can only speculate)

Your reputation? Reputation of warlock theme?

  • your backstory doesn't work with current lore (as an example: abaddon is dead, for good.), and explains barely anything about the spec (only their origin and not their weapon, what/why their utilities are what they are).

And all legends employed be revenant are of dead creatures. So, that's not a valid reason.

actually rev calls upon echoes of legendary ppl. not dead ppl. similar to how fractals are echoes and not the actual events that happened. also you're dodging my critisism. your backstory doesn't explain the elite only it's origin. (what type of necro would use this? why a mace? why torment skills?)

  • thematically it's to similar to demon stance rev. a simple solution would be to take a different type of demon. there's imps, fleshreavers or ,if you want to go completely of the wall, take the species of Samarog/deimos or a new type of demon we haven't seen yet. so many options and you still went whit the one that's already taken.

How? What is similar between these two?

they're both marganite themed.

  • all utilities and mace 4 apply unique debuffs. that's generally a realm you want to thread lightly since they're so incredibly difficult to balance

Meh, still not a valid reason to dismiss something. Hard to balance =/= bad.

but it does mean you should be more cautious with it. something that clearly didn't happen here.

  • you gave a trait that activate on boon corrupt/steal (Corruptor of Blessings) but the only boon corrupt in this spec is in another trait (Deeper Corruption) that activates when using a weapon on a enemy with +4 boons and only one skill has boon steal (Agony of the Blessed). that's a little to niche for a trait (and elite spec traits shouldn't rely on core skills/traits for basic functionality and most boon corrupt is on scourge and core necro has no boon steal).

To this i can answer only like this:Unholy FeastDark PactPutrid CurseEnfeebling BloodSpinal ShiversWell of CorruptionCorrupt BoonChill of DeathSpiteful SpiritPath of CorruptionWeakening Shroud

These abilities and traits already provide tons of boon corrupt. And do you even understand what you are saying? Elite SHOULD rely on core and improve many aspects of the core class. Reaper improved upon chills, bleed and sustain. Scourge improved upon burning, torment and boon corruption. This elite improves upon poison, vulnerability and boon corruption.Nearly 100% of elites improve on several aspects of core classes.

greatsword auto and 5 applies chill, a utility and the elite aplly chill, shroud 5 is an ice field (applying chill) a minor trait turns fear into a chill (causing shroud 3 to also aply chill)

similarly all utilities of scourge have boon corrupt

both have 6 skills that has their traitable "mechanic" without relying on core necro (scourge has 7 when traited properly)yours has 1 (6 when traited properly 5 of which only happen under certain circumstances and have an internal cooldown)

it doesn't improve corruption from core it relies on the corruption of core.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@derd.6413 said:actually rev calls upon echoes of legendary ppl. not dead ppl. similar to how fractals are echoes and not the actual events that happened. also you're dodging my critisism. your backstory doesn't explain the elite only it's origin. (what type of necro would use this? why a mace? why torment skills?)

Nah, my endurance is full.Also, looks like you also do the exact same thing. In my short description i did state that Abaddon is already dead. Warlocks don't use HIS power, they just use their own magic they LEARNED from Abaddon. So, while concerning what is more grounded: copying someone else > echoes > using souls of dead people.Also, do you expect me to explain everything? There is such thing as imagination.Why mace? Revenant condition build use mace, so it seems fitting.Why torment skills? Because all demon related stuff usually is tightly connected to torment (realm of torment, torment condition, etc).What type of necromancer would use this? Clearly the one who is interested in demonic powers.

@derd.6413 said:they're both marganite themed.

So, that's all? If that all similarities between the two, then i am safe.

@derd.6413 said:but it does mean you should be more cautious with it. something that clearly didn't happen here.

Meh, still not a valid reason to dismiss something.

@derd.6413 said:greatsword auto and 5 applies chill, a utility and the elite aplly chill, shroud 5 is an ice field (applying chill) a minor trait turns fear into a chill (causing shroud 3 to also aply chill)similarly all utilities of scourge have boon corruptboth have 6 skills that has their traitable "mechanic" without relying on core necro (scourge has 7 when traited properly)yours has 1 (6 when traited properly 5 of which only happen under certain circumstances and have an internal cooldown)it doesn't improve corruption from core it relies on the corruption of core.

Did it? Or did you skip that:Mace 4 deal damage whenever target receives a boon + Utility Agony 1 steal all boons target receive + Major Trait 2 poison whenever you steal a boon = provide unique, but still thematically necromancer esq, type of boon manipulation as it transfers boons to you, damage your target and poison it. No other necromancer build can accomplish this, and this combination does not rely on any existing necromancer core trait or ability (but it can be greatly improved by those). Unlike other necromancer builds, this one can essentially shut down a boon-bot support in pvp conditions, so this necromancer can do something that no other necromancer can, but it also synergyse greatly with core stuff.But let me you ask this: Do you even understand that you argue that an elite should NOT synergyse with core traits/abilities?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

-> Lore wise, your elite isn't really fine.

Margonites were worshipers of Abaddon, but after his defeat they become imprisoned in a timeless dimension where slumbered before a rift was opened.

Nope! The whole sentence is pretty far from GW's lore. Even Margonites being worshipers of Abaddon isn't something that can be proved true. They might have been led by abaddon but worshiping him/it? I doubt it. There are even case of margonites betraying abaddon without any consequences to the power they hold which can be a proof that their fate isn't directly tied to abaddon.

These necromancers practice toxic demonic magic which corrupts and twists everything around the caster and caster itself, and it spreads like a plague.

"Toxicity" can undoubtly fit the necromancer thematic, but "demonic" cannot. Necromancers primarily deal with "life" (life force, residual life from nearby death) not some kind of esotheric energy.

Every time an Occultist use his crafts he is risking on turning into demon himself.

interresting twist but unrealistic in a game like gw2. And as far as I can see there is no such dangerous thing in your concept.

And while this demonic magic is no longer tied to any particular entity, but its use hold a great danger - bringing Abaddon back into existence. After all, he is the father of this toxic magic.

Beside the fact that abaddon is the god of water and secret with no connection with poison, I don't feel like you ever played GW - nightfall. I've captured quite a few elite skills on margonites and "demons", yet I also killed the big guy at the end of the game. Also I'm pretty sure that none of the margonite necromancer's skills were "exclusive" (I might be wrong for the elite). Beside, margonites necromancers weren't especially poison focused and more all rounders like the current necromancer.

The only "exclusive" skills that were directly tied on abaddon were classified as "monster skill" and could be found on the margonites on the "non elite areas" which are situated in a timeline which is before abaddon's death. While the margonites on the elite area (which is in a timeline supposedly post abaddon death) do not have those skills.

Abaddon is dead for good and it's power have been seized by kormir leading to her ascension to godhood. Even if abaddon was still alive and necromancer were ready to commit themselves into worshiping gods, their priority would go to grenth. As for "demonic" transformation, this is the way margonites "reproduce" in the lore. It can only be a one way thing and can't be dispelled which would be awkward for a necromancer. While on the opposite, accepting temporary power from another entity is the area of expertise of revenants.

-> E-spec:

  • My personal stance on weapons is that there should only be one weapon per e-spec even if warrior's spellbreaker spec created a precedent.
  • The traitlines feel odd. Upper traitline feel poison centered until the grandmaster's trait which seem to apply on all conditions. Middle traitline feel like a coruption traitline until the grandmaster trait which is totally unrelated. Down traitline feel like centered on vulnerability until the grandmaster trait which focus on might.
  • "Curses" from your utilities and mace off hand skill are varied and without any obvious counter play. They also lead one to wonder whether they are stackable in duration or intensity or even if 2 (or more) different necromancers can benefit from using the same curse on the same target at the same time.
  • The way the shroud work is unclear (at least for me). Also, why does it have a 20 second cool down? It hurt quite a few core traits as well as the necromancer's survivability in an e-spec with an already low inbuilt survivability.
  • A thing that also feel out of place in a necromancer e-spec is this trait with a "block" effect every 10 seconds in combat ( demon skin )

All in all, I feel like there is a lot of things to work on in order to make such an e-spec "balanced". The "curses" are not defined well enough. The spec's gameplay is intended in the melee range and suffer from poor defensive ability, slow attack speed and a lack of gap closer. As for the lore, while the asura thing is totally realistic, everything else is at odd with gw's lore.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Dadnir.5038 said:Nope! The whole sentence is pretty far from GW's lore. Even Margonites being worshipers of Abaddon isn't something that can be proved true. They might have been led by abaddon but worshiping him/it? I doubt it. There are even case of margonites betraying abaddon without any consequences to the power they hold which can be a proof that their fate isn't directly tied to abaddon.

The Margonites are the primary demonic servants of Abaddon...Before the Exodus of the Gods, the Margonites were humans that Abaddon later transformed into ethereal demons...Before the Exodus of the Gods, the Margonites were a seafaring people who chose to worship Abaddon exclusively...Since that time their constant exposure to Abaddon's power has transformed them into the demons encountered in Elona...

Oh look, looks like i can prove it is true.And it can't be easier, i just opened wiki and copy-paste what is written there.And yeah, some of them betrayed him, but other remained loyal. And they disappeared when Abaddon was destroyed, thus meaning that they both are closely linked together.

@Dadnir.5038 said:"Toxicity" can undoubtly fit the necromancer thematic, but "demonic" cannot. Necromancers primarily deal with "life" (life force, residual life from nearby death) not some kind of esotheric energy.

Let me guess: you will give 0 reasons why necromancer can't use demonic energies even margonites (demons) had necromancers among them who used demonic powers alongside of necromancy.

@Dadnir.5038 said:interresting twist but unrealistic in a game like gw2. And as far as I can see there is no such dangerous thing in your concept.

Shroud, shroud all the way.

@Dadnir.5038 said:Beside the fact that abaddon is the god of water and secret with no connection with poison, I don't feel like you ever played GW - nightfall. I've captured quite a few elite skills on margonites and "demons", yet I also killed the big guy at the end of the game. Also I'm pretty sure that none of the margonite necromancer's skills were "exclusive" (I might be wrong for the elite). Beside, margonites necromancers weren't especially poison focused and more all rounders like the current necromancer.

Then by all means, tell us all which status effect is the most closely connected to water and how an elite could focus around it.I chose poison, because only poison can spread and harm people in the water.

@Dadnir.5038 said:

  • The traitlines feel odd. Upper traitline feel poison centered until the grandmaster's trait which seem to apply on all conditions. Middle traitline feel like a coruption traitline until the grandmaster trait which is totally unrelated. Down traitline feel like centered on vulnerability until the grandmaster trait which focus on might.

No class con focus only on one conditions, because it falls flat instantly against anything which remove 1-2 conditions rapidly. There is reason who firebrand was given bleed as secondary damaging condition for condition builds.Middle traitline is anti-support traitline. It is designed to weaken boon-spamming and sustaining through long fights. It is anti-bruiser traitline, but looks like you skipped all that.

@Dadnir.5038 said:

  • "Curses" from your utilities and mace off hand skill are varied and without any obvious counter play.

It can't be more simple: don't spam boons.

@Dadnir.5038 said:

  • The way the shroud work is unclear (at least for me). Also, why does it have a 20 second cool down? It hurt quite a few core traits as well as the necromancer's survivability in an e-spec with an already low inbuilt survivability.

Because this shroud does not drain life force passively. If you aren't taking damage, then you can stay in shroud for unlimited period of time, that is why. (P.S. demonic transformation and what not, just like i said)

@Dadnir.5038 said:

  • A thing that also feel out of place in a necromancer e-spec is this trait with a "block" effect every 10 seconds in combat ( demon skin )

Don't you think necromancer needs blocks? Every other class have and every other post on necromancer forum ask for better defensive tools.

@Dadnir.5038 said:and suffer from poor defensive ability

Didn't you just complain i added block as a trait????

@Dadnir.5038 said:everything else is at odd with gw's lore.

Except it isn't.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Regon Phoenix.8215" said:The Margonites are the primary demonic servants of Abaddon...Before the Exodus of the Gods, the Margonites were humans that Abaddon later transformed into ethereal demons...Before the Exodus of the Gods, the Margonites were a seafaring people who chose to worship Abaddon exclusively...Since that time their constant exposure to Abaddon's power has transformed them into the demons encountered in Elona...

Oh look, looks like i can prove it is true.And it can't be easier, i just opened wiki and copy-paste what is written there.And yeah, some of them betrayed him, but other remained loyal. And they disappeared when Abaddon was destroyed, thus meaning that they both are closely linked together.

So you take the part that you like: "before the exodus..." and ignore the part that my argument point out which prove that margonite can part from abaddon without consequences...

As for the one that remain loyal, a few hundred years passed since abaddon's death, they lost the power blessing of abaddon and there were fights in the torment realm against them (elite area). Objectively one can expect that margonites that supported abaddon are almost extinct at this point.

But again, they lost the power that abaddon gave them. This is clear just by looking at the skills of the margonites pre abaddon death and post abaddon death.

Let me guess: you will give 0 reasons why necromancer can't use demonic energies even margonites (demons) had necromancers among them who used demonic powers alongside of necromancy.

Demonic energy and life force are different things, that is enough of a reason especially if you push the manifestation of demonic energy into the shroud and keep the shroud dependant on life force.

@Dadnir.5038 said:interresting twist but unrealistic in a game like gw2. And as far as I can see there is no such dangerous thing in your concept.

Shroud, shroud all the way.

Shroud is not a "dangerous thing" for the necromancer integrity.

@Dadnir.5038 said:Beside the fact that abaddon is the god of water and secret with no connection with poison, I don't feel like you ever played GW - nightfall. I've captured quite a few elite skills on margonites and "demons", yet I also killed the big guy at the end of the game. Also I'm pretty sure that none of the margonite necromancer's skills were "exclusive" (I might be wrong for the elite). Beside, margonites necromancers weren't especially poison focused and more all rounders like the current necromancer.

Then by all means, tell us all which status effect is the most closely connected to water and how an elite could focus around it.I chose poison, because only poison can spread and harm people in the water.

The most realistic connection would be darkness for such a god since it can flow like water and shroud things in mystery. Poison have a meaning which is close to death due to it's "lethality" and "debilitating" effects which is a domain that belong to the dark green god of death and ice: Grenth.

  • The traitlines feel odd. Upper traitline feel poison centered until the grandmaster's trait which seem to apply on all conditions. Middle traitline feel like a coruption traitline until the grandmaster trait which is totally unrelated. Down traitline feel like centered on vulnerability until the grandmaster trait which focus on might.

No class con focus only on one conditions, because it falls flat instantly against anything which remove 1-2 conditions rapidly. There is reason who firebrand was given bleed as secondary damaging condition for condition builds.Middle traitline is anti-support traitline. It is designed to weaken boon-spamming and sustaining through long fights. It is anti-bruiser traitline, but looks like you skipped all that.

  • "Curses" from your utilities and mace off hand skill are varied and without any obvious counter play.

It can't be more simple: don't spam boons.

You shall read your curses again, they are not all related to boons. Beside, this is not what one can qualify as a valid way to "counterplay". There is no way to remove the curse or to prevent the curse from affecting you.

Still, you did not comment on how curses work with more than one character applying them on a single target which is also very problematic.

  • The way the shroud work is unclear (at least for me). Also, why does it have a 20 second cool down? It hurt quite a few core traits as well as the necromancer's survivability in an e-spec with an already low inbuilt survivability.

Because this shroud does not drain life force passively. If you aren't taking damage, then you can stay in shroud for unlimited period of time, that is why. (P.S. demonic transformation and what not, just like i said)

Do you even play necromancer? The shroud is both a boon and a curse for the necromancer. Staying in shroud do no good to anyone. It lock the necromancer out of it's utilities, it prevent the necromancer from using it's potential.

And again "demonic transformation" have nothing to do with life force.

  • A thing that also feel out of place in a necromancer e-spec is this trait with a "block" effect every 10 seconds in combat (
    demon skin
    )

Don't you think necromancer needs blocks? Every other class have and every other post on necromancer forum ask for better defensive tools.

So for you a passive block on a 10 second cool down if you are in combat is a "good" defensive tool?The main issue however that I point out here is that "block" do not fit the necromancer thematic which heavily revolve around conditions. The necromancer's defensive ability are adapted to deal with condition damage not power damage. That's why it's shroud or barrier and not invincibility or block. That said invincibility would be closer to what a necromancer should be able to do as a "better defensive tool". But again, a defensive tool on which you have absolutely no control is, at best, a poor defensive tool.

@Dadnir.5038 said:and suffer from poor defensive ability

Didn't you just complain i added block as a trait????

Indeed: poor .

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Dadnir.5038 said:So you take the part that you like: "before the exodus..." and ignore the part that my argument point out which prove that margonite can part from abaddon without consequences...

Some knowledge regarding the Margonites was lost when Abaddon was erased from history, which in turn caused confusion between the two sea-faring people.Nah, i just chose to not address factual incorrect things. Like you said that margonites didn't worship Abaddon.

@Dadnir.5038 said:As for the one that remain loyal, a few hundred years passed since abaddon's death, they lost the power blessing of abaddon and there were fights in the torment realm against them (elite area). Objectively one can expect that margonites that supported abaddon are almost extinct at this point.

Yeah, that is why i went with the route of whole "right between worlds" thing.

@Dadnir.5038 said:But again, they lost the power that abaddon gave them. This is clear just by looking at the skills of the margonites pre abaddon death and post abaddon death.

Prove it.

@Dadnir.5038 said:Demonic energy and life force are different things

True.

@Dadnir.5038 said:that is enough of a reason especially if you push the manifestation of demonic energy into the shroud and keep the shroud dependant on life force.

False. That isn't even a valid reason, not to mention even a good reason. Necromancers are obsessed in prolonging their own lives, demonic energies extend life of those who are possessed, just like margonites live for hundreds of years after turning into demons.

@Dadnir.5038 said:Shroud is not a "dangerous thing" for the necromancer integrity.

Yet, it is a transformation and a breath between two different existences. So, shroud all the way.

@Dadnir.5038 said:The most realistic connection would be darkness for such a god since it can flow like water and shroud things in mystery. Poison have a meaning which is close to death due to it's "lethality" and "debilitating" effects which is a domain that belong to the dark green god of death and ice: Grenth.

Darkness can flow like water? :D that's just silly.

@Dadnir.5038 said:Still, you did not comment on how curses work with more than one character applying them on a single target which is also very problematic.

Just like any other similar unique effect, they do not stack and do not overwrite each others, but stacking them doesn't really work, does it?For example: Utility Agony 1 (Agony of the Blessed) - if one necromancer steals the boon, then other necromancer have nothing to steal anymore, so even if both of them put this one on the same target, then the older one will steal the boons and newer one will not.Not even mentioning how most of agony abilities only work in connection to your damage and things you do.

@Dadnir.5038 said:Do you even play necromancer? The shroud is both a boon and a curse for the necromancer. Staying in shroud do no good to anyone. It lock the necromancer out of it's utilities, it prevent the necromancer from using it's potential.

Do you even play necromancer? You can build that you can have all of your utilities in shroud (minions and signets, for example). Not even mentioning how much power shroud provides through shroud related traits like:Reaper's MightDeadly StrengthUnyielding BlastDhuumfire -> infinite burn spammingDeath Perception -> infinite 1000 bonus precision

And you say it would do no good.... Have you ever participated in any Raid? Imagine having 1000 bonus precision through out whole fight as a power build.

@Dadnir.5038 said:So for you a passive block on a 10 second cool down if you are in combat is a "good" defensive tool?

Name a better block tool currently in necromancer's kit. I will be waiting.

@Dadnir.5038 said:The main issue however that I point out here is that "block" do not fit the necromancer thematic which heavily revolve around conditions. The necromancer's defensive ability are adapted to deal with condition damage not power damage.

Reaper? Isn't reaper supposed to be a power build? Nah, must be my imagination.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@"Regon Phoenix.8215" said:Strange, i thought demon themed necromancer would get more attention. Looks like WoW warlock left a bad taste in everyone's mouths.

yeah... what makes GW franchise unique is their classes doesnt follow the same old traditional fantasy blueprints other MMOs

and what made the game even unique is in GW1 is the secondary class system, which let you fiddle around with skill combination from every single class.

good try anyway... take a look some of the build crafts from GW1 https://gwpvx.gamepedia.com/Special:PrefixIndex/Build:N/ for some ideas to bring back lost mechanics from GW1as a former GW1 player, my favourites were the SS necro and corpse bomber

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@crepuscular.9047 said:

@"Regon Phoenix.8215" said:Strange, i thought demon themed necromancer would get more attention. Looks like WoW warlock left a bad taste in everyone's mouths.

yeah... what makes GW franchise unique is their classes doesnt follow the same old traditional fantasy blueprints other MMOs

and what made the game even unique is in GW1 is the secondary class system, which let you fiddle around with skill combination from every single class.

good try anyway... take a look some of the build crafts from GW1
for some ideas to bring back lost mechanics from GW1as a former GW1 player, my favourites were the SS necro and corpse bomber

Well, some of those build look pretty nice, though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...