(PVP) Tempest: why it was good, why it's sucks and some general buff ideas

[LazySummer.2568]

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@LazySummer.2568 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@LazySummer.2568 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@LazySummer.2568 said:I don't get all these posts about tempest not needing buffs. All tempest does is provide heals. Its defense & sustain for itself are awful and die super fast when focused, especially right after they've burned their focus earth 5. Not enough condi clenses against either scourges or condi mirages; not enough stunbreaks against holos/spellbreakers/thiefs/mirages that run dazes, not to mention all interrupts hard counter tempests.

If you've watched carefully in the mist challenger tourny where USA team B ran a meme staff tempest, you'll see how tempest was literally useless the whole time -- standing off node casting some cc aoes and 1k damage proc meme shower and only existed for the arcane rez trait, getting carried AND SUPPORTED by their fb and scourge.

Even scrapper supports and sustains better than tempest.

Fire has a trait line that removes condi on aura share... its practically impossible to condi kill anyone with a tempest running this build in the team fight. Fire/water build that is.

Combine that with a bunch of passive fire auras and you got yourself 25 perma might... also that will include passive condi removals and heals.

Add in some damage multiplyers, boost ferocity via air and next thing you know you got yourself a decent celestial build that hits quite hard, brings great utility support and superior movement for quick decaps if you run D/D, has enough tools, damage and sustain to be a side noder too.

ALOT of people forget that thier overloads ARE stunbreaks, we got 4 packed into our kit just from being a Tempest... You can also take the trait for stab on overloads, helps a lot for side noding on fire/air lightning rod build when fighting SB or Holo.

Nobody forgot overloads are stunbreaks. They are just the worst stunbreak in the whole game. You have to camp attunement and not use that overload just for the stunbreak, doesn't evade/displace you like most stunbreaks so you immediately take pressure, only give 1 stack of stab WHEN TRAITED (unless you're overloading earth, which doesn't even need the additional stack of stab) so you can just get cced again, which happens all the time in the current game where ccs gets spammed constantly, and locks that particular attunement on a long cd just for you to break a single stun. Even "Eye of the Storm" is a better stunbreak than overloads because it at least give you superspeed to kite/make u immune to soft ccs, and that skill is already a pretty bad stunbreak.

and i dont know why you're quoting some comment made long time ago before the aura and fire trait changes but it still doesn't matter, tempest is still in the same useless spot as meme spec that gets carried by their team.

You dont have to camp an attunement, just flow with the battle and know your enemy set ups that involve CC... Basic stuff to me and I thought for others too but guess not.

I assume people forget about stun break because they keep saying tempest has no stun breaks... pretty easy to come to that conclusion for anyone and shouldnt even need to be explained.

If you get carried when you play tempest, so be it....

If its so useless, why did Team USA rage at me for destroying thier ranger all game on side nodes? Why is it that im the one going 20/0 most games?Youre just saying that those people are worse than trash.

ok, maybe you should consider joining tournaments and carry your team to first place as well as get rank1 every season as tempest prove yourself as some sort of god instead of telling people on the forums about it.

I want to do tournaments but they are for Americans and the Unemployed...

If you want to insult the build I use thats fine but youre only insulting every player I beat while simultaneously inflating my ego ?

As far as im concerned too, not all of us bandwagon in order to be effective, some of us actually stuck with our classes through thick and thin and worked around the meta.Put some work and effort into it, something thats lost with recent gens.

That's some sort of excuse you got there. As far as I know, a lot of well known players who got top places in tournaments are neither American nor unemployed. It's not about bandwagoning, it's simply some builds are just flat out better than others in this game because it's an MMO, and it's pretty wrong to have a single class in a competitive game mode that neither has a single build with similar level of effectiveness as other classes nor have a special niche that other classes cant do as well on. That class also happens to be one of the harder ones to play, and despite all this, ANet continues to nerf it.

What I got out of your comment is that you're saying you can win a race on foot with just a pair of running shoes while everyone else is riding a horse or even driving a car because it doesn't matter, hard work always wins.

[ThiBash.5634]

@LazySummer.2568 said:What I got out of your comment is that you're saying you can win a race on foot with just a pair of running shoes while everyone else is riding a horse or even driving a car because it doesn't matter, hard work always wins.The thing is: likely, you're both right. Statistically, if you play Tempest, you start out with a disadvantage. Practically, if you play Tempest long enough, you can get better with it, to a point where you can beat players with meta builds sometimes. It then comes down to the respective skill levels of the Tempest and meta players, that determines whether they will win or lose. Your discussion basically amounts to 'Tempest is 100% playable' vs 'Tempest beats all', when the truth is likely somewhere in the middle.

[sephiroth.4217]

@ThiBash.5634 said:

@"LazySummer.2568" said:What I got out of your comment is that you're saying you can win a race on foot with just a pair of running shoes while everyone else is riding a horse or even driving a car because it doesn't matter, hard work always wins.The thing is: likely, you're both right. Statistically, if you play Tempest, you start out with a disadvantage. Practically, if you play Tempest long enough, you can get better with it, to a point where you can beat players with meta builds sometimes. It then comes down to the respective skill levels of the Tempest and meta players, that determines whether they will win or lose. Your discussion basically amounts to 'Tempest is 100% playable' vs 'Tempest beats all', when the truth is likely somewhere in the middle.

all im reading from him is "tempest is trash"...

You obviously get what I mean though as your first post was right on the money..Im more pointing out that if he wants to call something trash and attempt to be a downright fuck wipe then by rights everything it beats is also trash, which wouldnt make sense as some of the players ive beaten are known to be top players... basically saying his attempt to be a jerk is wasted on me.

[sephiroth.4217]

@LazySummer.2568 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@LazySummer.2568 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@LazySummer.2568 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@LazySummer.2568 said:I don't get all these posts about tempest not needing buffs. All tempest does is provide heals. Its defense & sustain for itself are awful and die super fast when focused, especially right after they've burned their focus earth 5. Not enough condi clenses against either scourges or condi mirages; not enough stunbreaks against holos/spellbreakers/thiefs/mirages that run dazes, not to mention all interrupts hard counter tempests.

If you've watched carefully in the mist challenger tourny where USA team B ran a meme staff tempest, you'll see how tempest was literally useless the whole time -- standing off node casting some cc aoes and 1k damage proc meme shower and only existed for the arcane rez trait, getting carried AND SUPPORTED by their fb and scourge.

Even scrapper supports and sustains better than tempest.

Fire has a trait line that removes condi on aura share... its practically impossible to condi kill anyone with a tempest running this build in the team fight. Fire/water build that is.

Combine that with a bunch of passive fire auras and you got yourself 25 perma might... also that will include passive condi removals and heals.

Add in some damage multiplyers, boost ferocity via air and next thing you know you got yourself a decent celestial build that hits quite hard, brings great utility support and superior movement for quick decaps if you run D/D, has enough tools, damage and sustain to be a side noder too.

ALOT of people forget that thier overloads ARE stunbreaks, we got 4 packed into our kit just from being a Tempest... You can also take the trait for stab on overloads, helps a lot for side noding on fire/air lightning rod build when fighting SB or Holo.

Nobody forgot overloads are stunbreaks. They are just the worst stunbreak in the whole game. You have to camp attunement and not use that overload just for the stunbreak, doesn't evade/displace you like most stunbreaks so you immediately take pressure, only give 1 stack of stab WHEN TRAITED (unless you're overloading earth, which doesn't even need the additional stack of stab) so you can just get cced again, which happens all the time in the current game where ccs gets spammed constantly, and locks that particular attunement on a long cd just for you to break a single stun. Even "Eye of the Storm" is a better stunbreak than overloads because it at least give you superspeed to kite/make u immune to soft ccs, and that skill is already a pretty bad stunbreak.

and i dont know why you're quoting some comment made long time ago before the aura and fire trait changes but it still doesn't matter, tempest is still in the same useless spot as meme spec that gets carried by their team.

You dont have to camp an attunement, just flow with the battle and know your enemy set ups that involve CC... Basic stuff to me and I thought for others too but guess not.

I assume people forget about stun break because they keep saying tempest has no stun breaks... pretty easy to come to that conclusion for anyone and shouldnt even need to be explained.

If you get carried when you play tempest, so be it....

If its so useless, why did Team USA rage at me for destroying thier ranger all game on side nodes? Why is it that im the one going 20/0 most games?Youre just saying that those people are worse than trash.

ok, maybe you should consider joining tournaments and carry your team to first place as well as get rank1 every season as tempest prove yourself as some sort of god instead of telling people on the forums about it.

I want to do tournaments but they are for Americans and the Unemployed...

If you want to insult the build I use thats fine but youre only insulting every player I beat while simultaneously inflating my ego ?

As far as im concerned too, not all of us bandwagon in order to be effective, some of us actually stuck with our classes through thick and thin and worked around the meta.Put some work and effort into it, something thats lost with recent gens.

That's some sort of excuse you got there. As far as I know, a lot of well known players who got top places in tournaments are neither American nor unemployed. It's not about bandwagoning, it's simply some builds are just flat out better than others in this game because it's an MMO, and it's pretty wrong to have a single class in a competitive game mode that neither has a single build with similar level of effectiveness as other classes nor have a special niche that other classes cant do as well on. That class also happens to be one of the harder ones to play, and despite all this, ANet continues to nerf it.

What I got out of your comment is that you're saying you can win a race on foot with just a pair of running shoes while everyone else is riding a horse or even driving a car because it doesn't matter, hard work always wins.

What I got out of your comment was purple elephants and somehow that proves why nikes are better than horses...We can all ignore whats being said and take it our own special way...

Luckily I read this comment and your tone has changed drastically, it almost sounds as if you want the class buffed due to not being as strong as the meta... this I agree, its not as strong as meta BUT it DOES have a place if played right.It does win quite a few 1v1s, it brings great utility support via static and magnetic aura while also relieving pressure off the local FB whos stressing about condi clears, heals and boons.

As a side noder build it has superior movement with RTL and ML...

Its a very versatile class.

As for why I commented in this thread to answer your earlier question, I went against a decent thief last night and his name was GodLike, I thought it was the guy from this thread and while checking I saw some comments...This thief last night was fun to fight, he was a DD with D/P build using PI traits and I was hoping to set up some 1v1s, its been a long time since I had a decent fight vs a thief, most of them are ranged now days or explode to Lightning rod traits but this thief was actually decent, each engagement we were both adjusting based off our last encounters... it was good fun to fight him but I was locked into a full support build and im keen to have rematches with him while I run a different build.

I dunno if you get what I mean by this... but 6 years of playing a class, it feels good to fight someone who feels like theyve had 6 years experience on thier class too.