We are getting Balthazar+GS as our next Legend, right ANET?

[lunaeclipse.6843]

@Knighthonor.4061 said:

@Ertrak.9506 said:

@"aimz.6287" said:For people who are saying it doesn’t make sense to channel Balthazar, ask yourself this when did rev ever make sense.... LETS FINALLY JUST HAVE SOMETHING COOL AND OP!!! I’m sick of rev being at the bottom barrel let’s just having something overpowered and fun as hell please anet just this once please lol

Revs always made sense though? Like, rytlock may be the first herald (yes, i mean

herald

not revenant) but he's not the first person to channel mist energies.

As far as I'm concerned, we as a character are just another person that learned how to channel mist energies, then learned to truly be a revenant come HoT events.

Sorry but revs need to stick to the lore they are already heavily based in.

So lore wise what does the lore say is a requirement for somebody to be a legend of a Revenent?

Anyone that has left a large enough "echo" in the mists, gods not withstanding. Basically anyone who effectively changed the course of history itself.

A God can't be channelled because their actions dont leave "echos" in the mists, regardless of what those actions are, which literally stems just from how gods' magic works.

It's the same reason we don't channel abbadon but instead we channel one of his demons: Mallyx.

[Knighthonor.4061]

@Ertrak.9506 said:

@Knighthonor.4061 said:

@Ertrak.9506 said:

@"aimz.6287" said:For people who are saying it doesn’t make sense to channel Balthazar, ask yourself this when did rev ever make sense.... LETS FINALLY JUST HAVE SOMETHING COOL AND OP!!! I’m sick of rev being at the bottom barrel let’s just having something overpowered and fun as hell please anet just this once please lol

Revs always made sense though? Like, rytlock may be the first herald (yes, i mean

herald

not revenant) but he's not the first person to channel mist energies.

As far as I'm concerned, we as a character are just another person that learned how to channel mist energies, then learned to truly be a revenant come HoT events.

Sorry but revs need to stick to the lore they are already heavily based in.

So lore wise what does the lore say is a requirement for somebody to be a legend of a Revenent?

Anyone that has left a large enough "echo" in the mists, gods not withstanding. Basically anyone who effectively changed the course of history itself.

A God can't be channelled because their actions dont leave "echos" in the mists, regardless of what those actions are, which literally stems just from how gods' magic works.

It's the same reason we don't channel abbadon but instead we channel one of his demons: Mallyx.

but thats the thing. Heroes also channeled his power. So if other heroes can channel his power ( talking about player characters from GW1 200 years ago), then it makes sense for Revenant to also be able to channel his enemy through the mist as well like those Heroes did.

[Raimo.4251]

Varesh Ossa + Scythe + Dervish les go

[Dace.8173]

I'm going to echo Lucian, the use of Balthazar doesn't make sense on the grounds that channeling him spoils the story plot for PoF. While we all know what happens to him there are always going to be new players who come into the game not wanting to have major plot points spoiled just from picking up a profession. There are so many better choices for Legends anyway than a dead god. I'd much rather see characters that are actually cool and interesting than ones that are picked because they looked cool. Kalla is an amazing use. Shiro is another great one. If we are going to pick a bad guy then going with someone like Mazdak or Vizier Khilbron. Mazdak could bring a touch of necromantic magic aimed at survivability. Vizier could focus on dark and forbidden magics that maybe focus on further use of Torment. Both of which are far more intriguing villains than Balthy.

[lunaeclipse.6843]

@Knighthonor.4061 said:

@Ertrak.9506 said:

@Knighthonor.4061 said:

@Ertrak.9506 said:

@"aimz.6287" said:For people who are saying it doesn’t make sense to channel Balthazar, ask yourself this when did rev ever make sense.... LETS FINALLY JUST HAVE SOMETHING COOL AND OP!!! I’m sick of rev being at the bottom barrel let’s just having something overpowered and fun as hell please anet just this once please lol

Revs always made sense though? Like, rytlock may be the first herald (yes, i mean

herald

not revenant) but he's not the first person to channel mist energies.

As far as I'm concerned, we as a character are just another person that learned how to channel mist energies, then learned to truly be a revenant come HoT events.

Sorry but revs need to stick to the lore they are already heavily based in.

So lore wise what does the lore say is a requirement for somebody to be a legend of a Revenent?

Anyone that has left a large enough "echo" in the mists, gods not withstanding. Basically anyone who effectively changed the course of history itself.

A God can't be channelled because their actions dont leave "echos" in the mists, regardless of what those actions are, which literally stems just from how gods' magic works.

It's the same reason we don't channel abbadon but instead we channel one of his demons: Mallyx.

but thats the thing. Heroes also channeled his power. So if other heroes can channel his power ( talking about player characters from GW1 200 years ago), then it makes sense for Revenant to also be able to channel his enemy through the mist as well like those Heroes did.

That's the key difference. Revenants channel the mists itself. Those heroes used the mists as conduit to gain power directly from him.

[LucianDK.8615]

@Dace.8173 said:I'm going to echo Lucian, the use of Balthazar doesn't make sense on the grounds that channeling him spoils the story plot for PoF. While we all know what happens to him there are always going to be new players who come into the game not wanting to have major plot points spoiled just from picking up a profession. There are so many better choices for Legends anyway than a dead god. I'd much rather see characters that are actually cool and interesting than ones that are picked because they looked cool. Kalla is an amazing use. Shiro is another great one. If we are going to pick a bad guy then going with someone like Mazdak or Vizier Khilbron. Mazdak could bring a touch of necromantic magic aimed at survivability. Vizier could focus on dark and forbidden magics that maybe focus on further use of Torment. Both of which are far more intriguing villains than Balthy.

That is the best argument for that it -never- could be Balthazar we get.

[Player.9621]

Joras default is a sword and shield, there wont be a Greatsword in there and they've already hammed the shield option.I like the Togo or Razah ideas but cant really think of any functionality thats not already being spammed by other classes.Going full ritualist would probably either break the game or be completely useless.I would vote for Vizier and a torment nuker aka above

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

@Dace.8173 said:I'm going to echo Lucian, the use of Balthazar doesn't make sense on the grounds that channeling him spoils the story plot for PoF. While we all know what happens to him there are always going to be new players who come into the game not wanting to have major plot points spoiled just from picking up a profession. There are so many better choices for Legends anyway than a dead god. I'd much rather see characters that are actually cool and interesting than ones that are picked because they looked cool. Kalla is an amazing use. Shiro is another great one. If we are going to pick a bad guy then going with someone like Mazdak or Vizier Khilbron. Mazdak could bring a touch of necromantic magic aimed at survivability. Vizier could focus on dark and forbidden magics that maybe focus on further use of Torment. Both of which are far more intriguing villains than Balthy.

Yessss Vizier Khilbron!! He would be such an awesome choice. He’d need scepter + focus (Binding of Ipos would go AMAZING with him) and Cataclysm of Orr based major skills (like how they adapted Jade Winds) could be sooo cool. If we got him we’d have a representative of/the villain from every gw1 campaign which would be great. I’m really glad other Revenants want him as well.

[Sarrs.4831]

Adelbern + GS imo. Super high hybrid melee damage greatsword with great Burning. If you're a non-human he talks a boatload of smack to you with extra spicy lines for Charr revs.

[Frozey.8513]

@Sarrs.4831 said:Adelbern + GS imo. Super high hybrid melee damage greatsword with great Burning. If you're a non-human he talks a boatload of smack to you with extra spicy lines for Charr revs.

Tbh while we are at it might just do same but with Rurik, he could be awesome legend too with a slightly less aggressive dialogue. Also hje could be better option since Adelbern is a ghost in Ascalonian Catacombs atm. In anycase I would be more than happy for a GW1 based legend, especially another human, instead of some makeshift Asura popping up with a scepter cause of ???, kinda like how they did come up with Kalla. And we all see how that turned out :eyes:

[Sarrs.4831]

@Frozey.8513 said:Also hje could be better option since Adelbern is a ghost in Ascalonian Catacombs atm.

That's not really an issue, you can channel things that are still 'alive'

[Frozey.8513]

@Sarrs.4831 said:

@Frozey.8513 said:Also hje could be better option since Adelbern is a ghost in Ascalonian Catacombs atm.

That's not really an issue, you can channel things that are still 'alive'

It sounds funny to me think of a 5 man Rev group running the said dungeon all channeling to Adelbern while fighting to kill him as if they are trying to destroy their source of power xD

[Dace.8173]

@LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

@Dace.8173 said:I'm going to echo Lucian, the use of Balthazar doesn't make sense on the grounds that channeling him spoils the story plot for PoF. While we all know what happens to him there are always going to be new players who come into the game not wanting to have major plot points spoiled just from picking up a profession. There are so many better choices for Legends anyway than a dead god. I'd much rather see characters that are actually cool and interesting than ones that are picked because they looked cool. Kalla is an amazing use. Shiro is another great one. If we are going to pick a bad guy then going with someone like Mazdak or Vizier Khilbron. Mazdak could bring a touch of necromantic magic aimed at survivability. Vizier could focus on dark and forbidden magics that maybe focus on further use of Torment. Both of which are far more intriguing villains than Balthy.

Yessss Vizier Khilbron!! He would be such an awesome choice. He’d need scepter + focus (Binding of Ipos would go AMAZING with him) and Cataclysm of Orr based major skills (like how they adapted Jade Winds) could be sooo cool. If we got him we’d have a representative of/the villain from every gw1 campaign which would be great. I’m really glad other Revenants want him as well.

Vizier really is a perfect fit for a Legend. He's just begging to be used.

[Klowdy.3126]

@"Kain Francois.4328" said:I'd prefer Togo + Scepter. Ritualist.

For one, we are desperately lacking a ranged 1h weapon. And we are also lacking a good Power dps spec. (Since Renegade is Condi/Support and Herald is Defense.)

Something with powerful mists magic, lightning strikes, and of course, spirits!

Yeah, I know what people are thinking. "Isn't renegade already a ritualist?" Only partially. Renegade embraces a support ritualist. Master Togo could embrace spirits more as turrets we could teleport. I'm pointing to the "Spirit Spammer" SoS rit from GW1

We are also in desperate need of a melee 2h, something that is nonexistent.

[feanor.4605]

We don’t need another condi base legend please god no, we need another insane dps class to go good with shiro or.... A GOOD Class that does decent dps but has good stances that synchronizes good with jalis maybe like Jora? Jora and jalis together bunky good dps etc that would be really cool because as of right now rev is good in pve renegade does good dps we need a class that can be relevant else where

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

@Klowdy.3126 said:

@"Kain Francois.4328" said:I'd prefer Togo + Scepter. Ritualist.

For one, we are desperately lacking a ranged 1h weapon. And we are also lacking a good Power dps spec. (Since Renegade is Condi/Support and Herald is Defense.)

Something with powerful mists magic, lightning strikes, and of course, spirits!

Yeah, I know what people are thinking. "Isn't renegade already a ritualist?" Only partially. Renegade embraces a support ritualist. Master Togo could embrace spirits more as turrets we could teleport. I'm pointing to the "Spirit Spammer" SoS rit from GW1

We are also in desperate need of a melee 2h, something that is nonexistent.

Necromancer was also “in desperate need of a melee 2h” and look how GS reaper turned out :P

But on a more serious note I don’t think we need a melee 2h as we already have a melee Power options. And we also have a 1200 range power option. So both niches are filled meaning it could go in either direction. Scepter + Focus could be great and I’m really hoping it goes in that direction instead of GS.

[Klowdy.3126]

@LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

@Klowdy.3126 said:

@"Kain Francois.4328" said:I'd prefer Togo + Scepter. Ritualist.

For one, we are desperately lacking a ranged 1h weapon. And we are also lacking a good Power dps spec. (Since Renegade is Condi/Support and Herald is Defense.)

Something with powerful mists magic, lightning strikes, and of course, spirits!

Yeah, I know what people are thinking. "Isn't renegade already a ritualist?" Only partially. Renegade embraces a support ritualist. Master Togo could embrace spirits more as turrets we could teleport. I'm pointing to the "Spirit Spammer" SoS rit from GW1

We are also in desperate need of a melee 2h, something that is nonexistent.

Necromancer was also “in desperate need of a melee 2h” and look how GS reaper turned out :P

But on a more serious note I don’t think we

need

a melee 2h as we already have a melee Power options. And we also have a 1200 range power option. So both niches are filled meaning it could go in either direction. Scepter + Focus could be great and I’m really hoping it goes in that direction instead of GS.

The same can be said about scepter/focus, we have ranged power option, and a 1h power option. We don't need anything, but what a lot of people want, myself included (since I read about revenant), is a 2h melee option. That didn't come with hammer, so we are hoping for GS. I'm not against scepter/focus, but I don't see any class getting two new weapons at once, so I'm looking to GS.

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

@"Klowdy.3126" said:The same can be said about scepter/focus, we have ranged power option, and a 1h power option. We don't need anything, but what a lot of people want, myself included (since I read about revenant), is a 2h melee option. That didn't come with hammer, so we are hoping for GS. I'm not against scepter/focus, but I don't see any class getting two new weapons at once, so I'm looking to GS.

Your first sentence is actually the entire point of my second paragraph. Both the range power and the melee power niches are filled, meaning we could get a 900 range power 1h option or a 2hander power melee option.

As for Scepter/Focus not being doable simply due to it being two weapons that's pretty easily fixed imo. Spellbreaker got two weapons so the two weapon at once precedent has been set. The next "issue" that is usually mentioned is that "spellbreaker had two of the same weapon so it's not the same." I mean, that's true, they were the same weapon, but where does that matter? It certainly doesn't matter for balance concerns meaning the only place it could potentially matter is for Specialization weapon collections and Spellbreaker didn't get two ascended daggers; it only got 1 exotic and 1 ascended despite having two weapons. The specialization weapon collection "issue" is easily fixed by giving the scepter/focus spec an exotic focus and an ascended scepter, or an exotic focus instead of the class specific armor piece.

I would be happy with GS if it's done well; I just want Scepter/Focus for either this one or the next one as there are a lot of good legends that would synergize well with Scepter/Focus and be interesting, whereas I don't really find any of the current ideas for a GS legend all that interesting.

[Dace.8173]

@LucianTheAngelic.7054 said:

@"Klowdy.3126" said:The same can be said about scepter/focus, we have ranged power option, and a 1h power option. We don't need anything, but what a lot of people want, myself included (since I read about revenant), is a 2h melee option. That didn't come with hammer, so we are hoping for GS. I'm not against scepter/focus, but I don't see any class getting two new weapons at once, so I'm looking to GS.

Your first sentence is actually the entire point of my second paragraph. Both the range power and the melee power niches are filled, meaning we could get a 900 range power 1h option or a 2hander power melee option.

As for Scepter/Focus not being doable simply due to it being two weapons that's pretty easily fixed imo. Spellbreaker got two weapons so the two weapon at once precedent has been set. The next "issue" that is usually mentioned is that "spellbreaker had two of

the same

weapon so it's not the same." I mean, that's true, they were the same weapon, but where does that matter? It certainly doesn't matter for balance concerns meaning the only place it could potentially matter is for Specialization weapon collections and Spellbreaker didn't get two ascended daggers; it only got 1 exotic and 1 ascended despite having two weapons. The specialization weapon collection "issue" is easily fixed by giving the scepter/focus spec an exotic focus and an ascended scepter, or an exotic focus instead of the class specific armor piece.

I would be happy with GS if it's done well; I just want Scepter/Focus for either this one or the next one as there are a lot of good legends that would synergize well with Scepter/Focus and be interesting, whereas I don't really find any of the current ideas for a GS legend all that interesting.

Except it does matter. The Spellbreaker example is clearly different from the proposed scepter/focus route. For starters, they would upset their customers by doing so and open up a world of complaining from people who didn't get two different weapons. The issue of ascended vs exotic is not as easily bypassed either. No matter how you side on the issue you are going to upset some of your customers. They would have to basically guess which of the two is going to make the most number of people happy. Therefore it's not an easy fix. Basically, the entire proposal is a major headache waiting to happen no matter how much you opt to dismiss the hurdles it has to overcome. They could do it, it's up to them, I just don't see it being as easy of an issue as you are positioning it. It will cause a lot of trouble both from fans of the profession (over the Ascended weapon issue) and non fans (over two different weapons).

Also Klowdy, we do have a 2h melee weapon. I'm not sure why people forget we have a staff that is pretty fun in melee combat. So if you've been wanting 2h melee since you've read about Revenant then pick up the staff. It's one of my favorite weapons to use when playing I'm toying around in open world or dungeons. There's even a Hammer/Staff build that is all kinds of 2 handed fun. Spinning your staff to deflect ranged attacks is just pure fun and looks awesome.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Staff#Revenant

[LucianDK.8615]

But staff is not a dps weapon, thats the problem.https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/39999/we-are-getting-balthazar-gs-as-our-next-legend-right-anet/p3#And I seriously dont see the problem in getting a scepter/focus combination. Not sure what you are twitching over it, makes no sense.

[LucianTheAngelic.7054]

@Dace.8173 said:Except it does matter. The Spellbreaker example is clearly different from the proposed scepter/focus route. For starters, they would upset their customers by doing so and open up a world of complaining from people who didn't get two different weapons. The issue of ascended vs exotic is not as easily bypassed either. No matter how you side on the issue you are going to upset some of your customers. They would have to basically guess which of the two is going to make the most number of people happy. Therefore it's not an easy fix. Basically, the entire proposal is a major headache waiting to happen no matter how much you opt to dismiss the hurdles it has to overcome. They could do it, it's up to them, I just don't see it being as easy of an issue as you are positioning it. It will cause a lot of trouble both from fans of the profession (over the Ascended weapon issue) and non fans (over two different weapons).

I read your other comment about this idea the other day and I know you’ve said the situations aren’t the same and that it will cause an uproar of some sort, but I honestly think they’re very similar/the same situations overall if you analyze it deeper. I also think the uproar would be nonexistent/insignificant just from how previous situations have played out.

The spellbreaker situation vs the scepter/focus situation is pretty much identical for two major reasons. The first reason is that while yes, two daggers are the same weapon they’re also not the same weapon since one is a mainhand and one is an offhand. Functionally the mainhand and offhand weapons are different weapons regardless of the type of weapon they are. This is due to the fact that weapons are really just glorified skills. Scepter/Focus share this mainhand/offhand distinction with dagger/dagger. D/D is 3+2 skills and Sc/F is 3+2 skills.

The next is the way the spellbreaker daggers handle their specialization collections. As I mentioned above the spellbreaker gets an exotic version and an ascended version, just like other elite specs, like say Daredevil, which gets an exotic staff and an ascended staff. Additionally all elite specs receive two weapon skins. This pattern hasn’t changed since HoTs release and it wouldn’t necessarily change for scepter/focus. For spellbreaker, the first level exotic dagger can only be used in one of the two hands at a time effectively limiting what a new spellbreaker can use for skills, whereas a daredevil’s staff gives you full access to all the new skills immediately (as do all the other specs). Not receiving dual exotic daggers means that a new spellbreaker has to purchase a 2nd dagger to be able to use his full bar of new weapon skills before finishing his ascended specialization collection. Additionally, as mentioned in my previous post, spellbreaker only receives 1 ascended weapon effectively forcing a spellbreaker to get an additional ascended weapon on their own if they want full new ascended weapons, unlike Daredevil et all. This means Spellbreaker (and the theoretical scepter/Focus)actually gets less value out of its specialization collections/weapons than all other current specs.

The reason I bring up this super long winded examination of the issue is to show that Scepter/Focus would have the same/similar model and the same “drawbacks” that D/D has (the fact that Anet expects Spellbreakers and theoretically all dual weapon elite spec users to buy/craft some of their own equipment instead of just finishing a collection if they want full ascended weapons). Since there wouldn’t be double the weapons given out given the above model there would be no need for double the artwork (skins) to be made for the weapon set. Focus could easily just be a simple ornate book with scepter being given the “higher quality” ascended skin or vice versa. Additionally, as mentioned In my past post, the specialization Armor piece could be swapped out for a Focus skin if so desired by the devs.

I know you mentioned you’re not super hyped for Focus, and that’s perfectly okay! The beauty of the 3+2 mainhand offhand system is that you can replace the offhand or mainhand as you see fit. Focus would just be a necessary compliment for scepter since currently the most synergetic offhand would be axe which has a gap closer teleport on skill 4 (bad for range generally) and no defense. If scepter/Focus or ANY revenant weapon (including future greatsword) wants to do well going forward it absolutely needs to have some defensive utility baked into it. If we only received scepter this means not only would scepter have only two skills for damage/utility/defense (autos don’t count really), but it would also not have any defensive options from existing offhands. Focus just helps fill in any gaps and give the spec more choices.

Lastly and most importantly I want to address the idea of a “controversy” being created by giving double weapons to revenant (or any class) by looking at past reactions. Were people upset when their class only received an offhand compared to specs that received main or two handers? No, not really. Were people upset when spellbreaker received a mainhand and offhand at the same time when there was NO precedent for it from HoT? No, not really. Were people upset that Spellbreaker had to craft/buy an extra ascended dagger to play D/D with max gear unlike all other elite specs? No, not really. Were people upset when Weaver received 42 new skills for elementalist which was effectively double (or even triple+ in some cases) than what most other elite specs from both HoT and PoF have received? No, not really. Were people upset about mounts despite 4 YEARS and HUNDREDS (maybe thousands) of people having posted about how mounts would ruin this game? No, not really.

Generally speaking people are just happy to have new content and new toys and they won’t care too much if one elite spec gets a little bit more than another one if it makes sense thematically and is generally cool/useful. I personally have seen zero or near zero complaint threads about any weapon/specialization issue listed above. That’s not to say they don’t exist, I’m sure they do, but complaints based around those issues are not common and they’re certainly not causing some sort of major problem or loss of players, nor are they complaints or issues of importance held by the vast majority of players. I brought up mounts as well as an example of something that A LOT of the community really didn’t want for years and was much more make-or-break for the game than this scepter/Focus issue ever could be, but mounts were actually amazingly well received in spite of the years of vastly negative forum reactions to the idea. Given all of the past history I don’t think you need to worry or even be slightly wary that double weapons scepter/Focus revenant will somehow splinter the community or cause a massive backlash.

[Dadnir.5038]

I bet the greatsword will be paired to the sylvari Riannoc as a legend. The e-spec being plant related and a clumsy rework of the racial skills. Much the same way that renegade skills are really close to charr's racial skills.

Honnestly I'd rather see a norn inspired e-spec that would finally give a norn alike transformation skills a spot to shine. And I betting on axe as a weapon.

[Klowdy.3126]

The staff is a support weapon for revs. It is tied to our support legend, two of the abilities are support abilities, and one is tied to being attacked. I have tried to like it BECAUSE it is almost 2h melee, but it isn't fun.

As for scepter/focus, what would the collection be for? Are they going to give out only one of the weapons for the ascended collection, or are you going to be forced to do two, completely separate collections? Either way, it isn't going to be fair.

People did care when warrior got dagger for their main hand and off hand. I saw people from all classes complaining about spellbreaker getting two weapons, especially from the soulbeast players that only got an off hand weapon.

[Dace.8173]

@"LucianDK.8615" That wasn't what Klowdy had asked for though. He stated "We are also in desperate need of a melee 2h, something that is nonexistent." which is not true. Revenant has the staff. Now if we want to amend the conversation to discuss the pros and cons of the staff as a 2h melee weapon that's fine. But to continue the discussion acting as if we don't have that option at all is just false. Though I do disagree that the staff isn't a dps weapon. It's got two dps abilities (1 and 2). It has a deflect option. It has an interrupt option. It even heals and removes conditions (something that is a plus in this Scourge heavy condi enviroment). Is a stronger DPS weapon really going to be that much better? Personally, I think the staff is a great weapon (also fun!!!). Is there really that much of a difference? I'm not saying that getting another 2h weapon is bad but I also really don't see the staff as so bad as to not matter in the discussion of weapon choices. I've found the staff to be a very useful weapon in WvW, especially with its interrupt (and the sigil that benefits amazingly from said interrupt). Maybe it's not the STRONGEST weapon to have but let's be frank, most of the Revenants weapons choices right now are really super strong anyway. Enjoyable, yes. Super strong, no.

I guess I would call it versatile. 2 melee DPS, one block/reflect, one heal/condi removal, and one interrupt. So why wouldn't it be considered a good weapon? Maybe I'm just missing something due to how much fun I have spinning the staff around as if I'm a kung fu monk. Also, I'm not twitching over the scepter/focus. I just don't happen to agree with the idea that there is a precedent for it or that it wouldn't be a big deal if done. Being as how I've seen complaints that Daredevil got a melee staff while Druid got a ranged staff I do not see people being ok with it and not causing grief for us.

@"LucianTheAngelic.7054" Yeah, I'm not going to play this game with you. You are jumping through hoops and cutting the hairs awful thin to justify your position. The Spellbreaker simply does not create the precedent you claim it does and I can promise you that most people are not going to care about the whole main hand/off hand distinction. The fact you have to find so many workarounds for the problems even you bring up really does make it clear that they are different. Your solution for the whole Ascended/Exotic problem highlights how different it is, as Spellbreaker did not create the same problem. When they sat down to make the Ascended weapon for Spellbreaker they didn't have to debate which weapon they were going to make (or off hand/main hand distinction). The choice was clear and simple. Pretending otherwise is an intellectually dishonest position. Your seven paragraph justification also refutes the idea that all people care about is getting new shinies. If folks didn't "care too much if one elite spec gets a little bit more than another one if it makes sense thematically and is generally cool/useful" you wouldn't be working so hard to justify your favorite choice. I also believe you solely overestimate just how accepting people are of other professions getting something cool if it thematically makes sense. That is not the side of the playerbase I see often. Your mount example doesn't work as at the end of the day mounts did not increase a professions power and everyone got the exact same mount. People on the forum regularly complain about what one profession gets and what they aren't getting. This entire discussion mostly about what we aren't getting.

Frankly, Revenant has enough issues as is trying to get the development team to get them to a power level that won't result in enough player complaints that we eventually get hit with a nerf. I'm pretty sure two different elite weapons hinder that effort. But I'm done with this. I'm honestly not invested in this discussion enough to read seven paragraphs of justification only for the person writing it to act like it all doesn't matter at the end of the day. I also don't care too much to split the hairs of main hand/off hand that thinly as I am very confident that very few people will see it that way (if they did you wouldn't have needed to make that point in the first place).

[Elric.4713]

Or we could, and stay with me here, get focus as core weapon and scepter with Ritualist.