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No resources that actually teach you how to fight and live.


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It occurred to me after years of playing this game that I can only reliably play one class and build with out dying and rage quitting on any content past Season 2. There are not enough dodges, and not enough cds to take the punishment you face when a swarm of enemies gets in your face doing their special attacks in staggered intervals unless you get lucky and kill them faster than they can kill you (that seems like bad game play to me where in a game like ESO I have the resources to block all attacks I need to block, and interrupt all attacks I need to interrupt).

For example if I'm playing Reaper no problems there I basically win in attrition fights anyway 85 to 90 percent of the time.

Guardian I don't have enough blocks and blinds when I have more than 2 enemies trying to kill me (sometimes 2 will even kill me off).

Every other class might as well not even exist for me, Warrior and Revenant make me want to punch holes through my office wall, Mesmer feels like a probability gambling game where sometimes you win and other times you die terribly on Chronomancer following a rotation from Snowcrows.

Maybe it's because I play in the Open World as a solo player that only plays with others when they're around but I just find it hard to believe that after 5 years I'd still be this bad at GW2 playing anything other than a Reaper.

So I'm looking for resources, I just watched a few combat basics videos on YouTube which at this point are not what I'm looking for since that's like being taught the difference between primary and secondary colors, I know what buffs are, I know what blinds are, I know how stability works, I understand blocks, I can't aim a dodge to save my life literally I'll sometimes dodge face first into an enemy. (hell as a Dragon Knight in ESO I don't even bother dodging I just block and interrupt).

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Hmm I have been able to solo play everything story related on my ranger/soulbeast, maybe a bit tough at points, but very much doable.I have also solo played everything up to the point LS3 episode... something... on my thief/daredevil, the points where I struggle vary a bit from when playing ranger, but so far its indeed doable.It would surprise me very much if I was unable to do the same on my necro, ele or engi. Although the struggles may be different and stuff.

Non of them run meta builds... its whatever I feel like wether it is considered the most efficient or not. And honestly it makes sense to me that one might struggle more with classes/builds one is less familiar with.

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Honestly I think a lot of it comes down to practice. The professions I find easiest to play are the ones I've spent the most time playing. If you want to learn to play a new profession I think the best way is just to make a character of that profession and level them up by playing naturally - not grinding or power levelling, no Tomes of Knowledge or scrolls and no/limited XP boosts. Experiment as you're going along - when you unlock a new skill or trait equip it for a while and see what you can do with it and how it affects your character. Same when you get a new weapon or get equipment with 'less desirable' stat combinations. Even if it seems like something you won't want to use try it and find out, you can always swap back later.

But also you need to remember that not all professions are the same, otherwise there would be no point in having more than 1. For example a guardian probably can't block or blind as much as a reaper (necromancer is the profession I've played least so I'm not that familiar with them), but they have a lot more self-heals, boons and condition removal skills, and several teleport/leap skills. So instead of blocking the attacks they absorb or remove the damage or move out of the way (which could be dodging or teleporting).

(Also ESO is fairly similar in that respect. I assume since you said you have enough resources to block, interrupt or dodge all the attacks you need to that you play a stamina based character, probably with a shield. Try playing a magicka based one, especially a warden or nightblade and let me know how you do using the same tactics. I once spent a month almost exclusively playing my DK tank then switched back to my nightblade and I was dying to everything until I remembered I had to move out the way instead of letting them hit me and blocking it.)

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@Zeefa.3915 said:Hmm I have been able to solo play everything story related on my ranger/soulbeast, maybe a bit tough at points, but very much doable.I have also solo played everything up to the point LS3 episode... something... on my thief/daredevil, the points where I struggle vary a bit from when playing ranger, but so far its indeed doable.It would surprise me very much if I was unable to do the same on my necro, ele or engi. Although the struggles may be different and stuff.

Non of them run meta builds... its whatever I feel like wether it is considered the most efficient or not. And honestly it makes sense to me that one might struggle more with classes/builds one is less familiar with.

@Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:I don't know...try asking for advice in the Profession sub-forums for each Profession?I don't seem to have that problem on Professions that I play, more or less, regularly. I do fail miserably on Professions I rarely ever play, of course.

Good luck.

It shouldn't be haphazard enough that it's all profession specific. Shouldn't enemies have basic tells that tell you whether a block/blind/dodge/stability is needed, are there certain actions that handle multiple attacks at once (for example one video suggested that while dodging regardless if you get out of the bad or not you are invulnerable)?

If it all breaks down to specific classes with completely unique mechanics then I can see why no one can balance properly.

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@Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:I dunno. Try the Wiki? The Online Manual? The Extended Online Manual?

This is the 21st century I was looking for a GW2 partner that has actual guides and not videos like 'This is my guide to playing a (fill in the blank)' which is nothing more than a montage of some one playing a class in a skimpy outfit while blaring bad Metal or Techno music.

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@Danikat.8537 said:Honestly I think a lot of it comes down to practice. The professions I find easiest to play are the ones I've spent the most time playing. If you want to learn to play a new profession I think the best way is just to make a character of that profession and level them up by playing naturally - not grinding or power levelling, no Tomes of Knowledge or scrolls and no/limited XP boosts. Experiment as you're going along - when you unlock a new skill or trait equip it for a while and see what you can do with it and how it affects your character. Same when you get a new weapon or get equipment with 'less desirable' stat combinations. Even if it seems like something you won't want to use try it and find out, you can always swap back later.

But also you need to remember that not all professions are the same, otherwise there would be no point in having more than 1. For example a guardian probably can't block or blind as much as a reaper (necromancer is the profession I've played least so I'm not that familiar with them), but they have a lot more self-heals, boons and condition removal skills, and several teleport/leap skills. So instead of blocking the attacks they absorb or remove the damage or move out of the way (which could be dodging or teleporting).

(Also ESO is fairly similar in that respect. I assume since you said you have enough resources to block, interrupt or dodge all the attacks you need to that you play a stamina based character, probably with a shield. Try playing a magicka based one, especially a warden or nightblade and let me know how you do using the same tactics. I once spent a month almost exclusively playing my DK tank then switched back to my nightblade and I was dying to everything until I remembered I had to move out the way instead of letting them hit me and blocking it.)

Alright, so if I typically play tanks then I guess Reaper and Dragon Hunter might be the only thing that works for me I assume.

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@Oldirtbeard.9834 said:

@Zeefa.3915 said:Hmm I have been able to solo play everything story related on my ranger/soulbeast, maybe a bit tough at points, but very much doable.I have also solo played everything up to the point LS3 episode... something... on my thief/daredevil, the points where I struggle vary a bit from when playing ranger, but so far its indeed doable.It would surprise me very much if I was unable to do the same on my necro, ele or engi. Although the struggles may be different and stuff.

Non of them run meta builds... its whatever I feel like wether it is considered the most efficient or not. And honestly it makes sense to me that one might struggle more with classes/builds one is less familiar with.

@Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:I don't know...try asking for advice in the Profession sub-forums for each Profession?I don't seem to have that problem on Professions that I play, more or less, regularly. I do fail miserably on Professions I rarely ever play, of course.

Good luck.

It shouldn't be haphazard enough that it's all profession specific. Shouldn't enemies have basic tells that tell you whether a block/blind/dodge/stability is needed, are there certain actions that handle multiple attacks at once (
for example one video suggested that while dodging regardless if you get out of the bad or not you are invulnerable
)?

If it all breaks down to specific classes with completely unique mechanics then I can see why no one can balance properly.

That's correct. Dodge does two things: it physically moves you in the direction you dodge (faster than normal running speed), but it also gives you a second of invulnerability. Either one of these things will stop an attack hitting you, but which one is most useful depends on what you're dodging. For example if an enemy is dropping an AoE under you then moving out the way is the most important thing, because once you're outside the range it can't affect you. But if it's a quick acting AoE, one that starts doing damage as soon as the circle appears, then there may not be time to move out the way. But that second of invulnerability mean that even if you're still in the circle it won't hurt you. (You can tell if the attack was stopped this way because white text comes up saying 'evaded'.)

And yes, this applies to all incoming attacks. As long as they hit during the dodge animation you'll evade them.

It's also worth remembering that you can combine dodging with normal movement. If an AoE circle appears but doesn't immediately do damage you can start moving towards the edge and only dodge when the damage starts (or just before ideally, but that requires knowing the boss and how long their attack takes to hit, I don't think there's a clear timer). Or for a fast AoE dodge right away and then run the rest of the way out the circle - you'll take some damage but not as much.

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@Ayakaru.6583 said:Rule one of games, if you're being overwhelmed, draw fewer enemies at once, or change your build to be more suited against groups.But primarily, draw fewer enemies

I was under the impression that groups of mobs were tied together other than the obvious culprits like Pocket Raptors, so say I'm on a Guardian if I hit one with a scepter then only that enemy will come at me?

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@"Oldirtbeard.9834" said:

literally I'll sometimes dodge face first into an enemy.

Just curious-- do you have melee assist turned on? If you dodge head-on into the enemy, that function makes sure you stop right in its face. Turn it off, you phase through the enemy instead. I've found that alone makes a huge difference in my survivability in higher level maps. Because, frankly, I stink at dodging. My direction is whatever key I'm double-tapping at the moment-- usually forward ;)

I know you're looking for real solutions, so this probably isn't what you're looking for. Apologies. It's made a huge difference for me, though.

My other "success" tip is taking a look at those meta guides, matching whatever build and gear they suggest as best you can, then giving it a test in low-stress, easy areas until you can get the intuitive feel for what everything does.

Guardian was actually easy for me once I got past level 11. Before that, it's probably one of the hardest classes I've tried to play. Keep aegis up, and whatever sigil skill it is that keeps your health regenerating, and you'll be almost untouchable. Firebrand takes its base survivability down several notches.

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@Oldirtbeard.9834 said:

@Ayakaru.6583 said:Rule one of games, if you're being overwhelmed, draw fewer enemies at once, or change your build to be more suited against groups.But primarily, draw fewer enemies

I was under the impression that groups of mobs were tied together other than the obvious culprits like Pocket Raptors, so say I'm on a Guardian if I hit one with a scepter then only that enemy will come at me?

Some are (like your pocket raptors), some aren't. Always depends on the mobs.

As to your first post, in this game quite a lot depends on knowledge of your class. Know how to use its tools and you'll breeze through most stuff in no time. If you don't know, it's quite a bit harder, though blasting away every open world mob below elites shouldn't be an issue with any class if you have a proper build. The same applies to packs of these mobs.

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I started out with GW2 as a thief - never had any problem with OW, PS and LWS. Then I repeated it with Mesmer, Warrior and Elementalist and almost done with Guardian. Still hadn't occured any problems. You learn how to play by playing and learning from your mistakes. Learn your class skills, time your dodges, remember to switch weapons to maximize damage output. You can try building yourself to have more survivability but IMO it's the best to go full berserk and just kill your enemies before they kill you.

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I spend a LOT of time in the north end of Wayfarer Foothills (outside of Crossroads Haven) testing builds. There is a wide variety of enemies with different attacks (AoE, melee, ranged, etc and even a champion from time to time) that usually won't gang up on me in large numbers. At higher levels, nothing up there should be able to outright kill me. This gives me the opportunity to observe different attacks and to tinker with different builds, traits and rotations without worrying about dying. And even if I'm downed, there is a repair NPC in the Haven nearby so I don't have to go far to get back to tinkering.

You might try something like this to practice with a class/profession that you wouldn't otherwise try?

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Also, I agree with the posted who mentioned scrolling through the profession sub-fora. Most of what I've read there pertains to PvP or WvW, but it helps to give me ideas on how others perceive class mechanics work. I've taken suggestions from there, tried them out and then modified the builds to my own tastes/preferences for owPvE.

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@Oldirtbeard.9834 said:

@Ayakaru.6583 said:Rule one of games, if you're being overwhelmed, draw fewer enemies at once, or change your build to be more suited against groups.But primarily, draw fewer enemies

I was under the impression that groups of mobs were tied together other than the obvious culprits like Pocket Raptors, so say I'm on a Guardian if I hit one with a scepter then only that enemy will come at me?

Pocket Raptors demand AoE, Rolling Devils demand CC, Mordrem Snipers demand moving to the side; each of these HoT mobs, and to a fair degree the mobs in all content thereafter, have their own unique style, and appropriate responses that make them relatively easy to deal with.

The two things that made a big difference to me:

First one was learning that. Once I figured out how the enemies work -- and many of them use skills identical to players -- I was much better able to counter them. Pocket Raptors used to make my cry, and typically die, but once I figured out the trick, bam, no longer a concern.

The second one was to learn to save abilities for when they were needed. If there was a risk that those pesky raptors were gonna get involved, make sure I retain some AoE damage, or at least an AoE cripple, to let me avoid their burst damage.

Beyond that, you might find it helpful to look at the WvW builds on metabattle. Those focus more on survivability than the other builds, and that can be a big help. You are right, though: those mobs are much harder than the core ones, and it definitely is a steep learning curve.

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This game is not good for tank style play, IMO. The first thing you should do is to play a really fragile profession to become accustomed to the constant need of movement, active defense, dodging and kiting. Going in and out of the attack area is a must for many professions, and is what makes the game fun for me at least.

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@Ardid.7203 said:This game is not good for tank style play, IMO. The first thing you should do is to play a really fragile profession to become accustomed to the constant need of movement, active defense, dodging and kiting. Going in and out of the attack area is a must for many professions, and is what makes the game fun for me at least.

This. Once you play a glassy mobile class that forces you to move to survive, playing a more durable class is easy mode (and might screw up your sense of play on your glassy characters).

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@Oldirtbeard.9834

Step 1 for surviving the Open World: Forget the Meta builds!They are aimed at a party of 10 in most cases for raids where someone else does the work for YOUR survival. However, they are a good starting point. If you take one of those builds and make some changes to it: like adding Vitality and Healing Power for Guardian and the likes, as well as swap out several Utility skills, you can solo every non-group (and some group) content with any of the professions you choose. Additionally, dodging is a HUGE part of surviving. Spend some time mastering it. You don't even need to aim it, because most attacks can't hit you while dodging even if you are inside their area.Depending on individual skill some can survive with any kind of build, but even they will find themselves using some more defensive utility skills.

Step 2 is knowing the enemies. When will they do what? Why do they do that? What is that ability actually doing?Stuff like this. They can be figured out by experimenting and seeing it for yourself. For example, if you have a lot of Condition removal/transfer, then you don't really need to care about the big red circle that stacks burning on you, because you can remove that with ease. If your profession can produce a lot of Aegis then you should avoid getting hit by abilities that do little damage or better yet, keep your Aegis for a big spell that you won't be able to avoid anyways. For example if a monster does one big AoE attack and then just normal hits, then ignore the hits and keep fighting, then when he does the big bad thing, then just put on an Aegis and keep fighting, don't even bother dodging in that case.

A huge portion of the Open World content is based around adapting (as well as certain other parts of the game) and knowing what you and the enemy is capable of. Just getting a build from the internet, then going into a fight and being surprised that you die isn't gonna cut it sadly. :(This is basically the only revelation you need. Just because something looks good on paper, that is still just something on paper. If you are bad with dodging and can't improve at all, then build for something that doesn't require you to do it often.Yeah something like that.I don't think what you are looking for exists sadly.If you really want a guide, then I'd recommend checking out Metabattle for this rather than Snowcrows. They have an Open World section for each class. Didn't try those builds myself, but you can give it a go.

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@SlippyCheeze.5483 said:

@"starlinvf.1358" said:If you're gonna be a Hero, at least learn how to do something heroic without being told how to do it.

This is none of: helpful, appropriate, funny. Please, try and be more productive in your forum interactions. Nobody benefits from rudeness.

Yet if you dwell on the question for more then 2 seconds, not only is the OP wrong there not being resources, but action games are more intuitive, with a fair share of deductive reasoning, because there are only so many things you can teach a person when the game play is driven by analytical response. The problem the OP has is one of practice, and how explain the myriad of things to process in a step by step "rotation"?.

Secondly, you can tell weaved throughout the post, his desire is to make the game adapt to how he does things, rather then the other way around. "I want to block and interrupt everything like a Tank" when the game itself isn't designed around that. He understands the concept of dodging, but doesn't like, and avoids trying to use it..... but its so fundamental to the combat, you can't simply not use it and expect do well.

No amount of explaining the game mechanics he needs will help, because he's already aware of them, and actively wants to dismiss them. So only has 2 choices..... learn to use the abilities hes already aware of, or overcompensate with defensive stats, and suffer the consequences of doing so. I can't explain that concept any harder then anyone else here has thus far.

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@SlippyCheeze.5483 said:

@starlinvf.1358 said:If you're gonna be a Hero, at least learn how to do something heroic without being told how to do it.

This is none of: helpful, appropriate, funny. Please, try and be more productive in your forum interactions. Nobody benefits from rudeness.

You know I tend to agree however it is obvious that either the OP does not have the desire or the patience to simply practice. Regardless of what was said either they have the ability to practice and get better or they practice and don't get better in which case even attempting another class would be futile.

I tend to believe that this OP will get better with practice if they simply play more with purpose and some back reading about the class and style before, then go practice starting in simple ways that do not crush their spirits.

Go check out all the skills on a training dummy but seriously if you want something done right do it yourself don't expect others to do it and limit your need to have someone else teach you by teaching yourself to learn in new ways.

Start a lvl 1 character and run the story from start to finish and see how you are doing at the end maybe?

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Movement. Don’t face tank in this game.

I started playing a guardian and struggled after core Tyria but I face tanked everything.

I moved to an elementalist and learned to always be moving and when to dodge/cc/etc and now open world is easy.

My ele is my main but I also play my guardian and a rev at 80 (other classes haven’t hit 80 yet) but most of the stuff open world is a breeze now.

Biggest thing is - Don’t face tank!!

Playing a beefy class like a reaper probably taught you a lot of bad habits you need to unlearn.

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The resources are there, if you don't want to use them that's fine, but you shouldn't be complaining about it then. Most things can be done in this game with a little bit of practice. If you don't know which tactic you should use when fighting a specific enemy, you have two options: Either look that enemy up and learn how to fight it with the help of the internet or just fight that enemy over and over again until you understand how to defeat it. The latter way works just as well as the former, you just need more patience.

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