Warhorn's "Wail of Doom"!

[Brujeria.7536]

another idea i had for this skill is: why not turn it into an pulsing aura that, for 4 seconds, causes a 0,5 s daze each second and siphons life / corrupts a boon ?

[Nimon.7840]

@DeceiverX.8361 said:Going to need to agree with flow, here. Fear is extremely hard to balance with Expertise/condi duration existing in the game, too.

Traited with added duration a 2s base fear bumps to 6s which is completely nuts.

@Anchoku.8142

I hope u noticed this isn't true the moment u wrote that.

You can only get 100% condition duration.

Maximum fear duration you can get from 2 seconds base is 4seconds.But this is only one thing that lets you apply 2seconds fear. And that's from most trash traitline necro has with 60seconds cd: deathmagic

It doesn't increase base fear duration. It never did. (At least not in the last one or two years). The trait just increases duration.

[Rym.1469]

Before Resistance came in to the game I liked this suggestion. Right now, I'd rather see it on some elite specialization weapon down the line rather than as a change to Warhorn.

[ZDragon.3046]

@killfil.3472 said:So... to come back to main topic.... Should the daze be replaced by a fear..?

Without some kind of buff to the fear condition itself or some boon strip on the warhorn I say no it shouldnt.

[DeceiverX.8361]

@Nimon.7840 said:

@DeceiverX.8361 said:Going to need to agree with flow, here. Fear is extremely hard to balance with Expertise/condi duration existing in the game, too.

Traited with added duration a 2s base fear bumps to 6s which is completely nuts.

@Anchoku.8142

I hope u noticed this isn't true the moment u wrote that.

You can only get 100% condition duration.

Maximum fear duration you can get from 2 seconds base is 4seconds.But this is only one thing that lets you apply 2seconds fear. And that's from most trash traitline necro has with 60seconds cd: deathmagic

It doesn't increase base fear duration. It never did. (At least not in the last one or two years). The trait just increases duration.

I realize this now. Definitely weird with how long terrormancer fears used to last. Maybe I'm just unaware of nerfs that have happened over the years.

DM is stronger than people give it credit for. Especially into the current ans recent metas. I recently made a DM core necro build and ran it without issue in solo roaming in WvW. If anything it was stronger than my griever's reaper.

I think fear on WH would still end up situationally too strong or too weak. Resist and stab both negating fear is pretty punishing, but so is a 4s AoE hard CC with an interrupt-tier cast time should the opponent not have either. All it really does is make necro more binary than it already is, which is a huge complaint as it is.

I see comments about thief stolen bundle fear with improv, but it needs to be realized that the cast on it is as long as gravedigger and if casted outside of melee range, the fear doesn't last as long or much longer than the cast itself. As someone who plays thief/reaper, it's also only really good into necros, and even then, if a necro runs OH dagger or a reaper with Suffer, it can be transferred easily.

The fear is thematically cool, but the daze definitely has a more practical and consistent impact in fights.

[BaLzA.8902]

Well ... ...

;)

[Brujeria.7536]

Well the more i think about this topic the more i think they should keep the daze, lower the cooldown, but attach a big chunk of power damage to it. Seeing as all classes are power creeped beyond recognition and seeing how much damage most stuns do nowadays i feel like this wouldnt be too strong at all.

[Lahmia.2193]

@"BaLzA.8902" said:Well ... ...

;)

Not sure if joke for excuse to add meme, but already covered that. One would override the other as you can only have 1 cc on at a time.

[BaLzA.8902]

@Lahmia.2193 said:

@"BaLzA.8902" said:Well ... ...

;)

Not sure if joke for excuse to add meme, but already covered that. One would override the other as you can only have 1 cc on at a time.

Actually i'm a bit confused about that. Are you really really sure that they wont stack?

[Lahmia.2193]

@BaLzA.8902 said:

@Lahmia.2193 said:

@BaLzA.8902 said:Well ... ...

;)

Not sure if joke for excuse to add meme, but already covered that. One would override the other as you can only have 1 cc on at a time.

Actually i'm a bit confused about that. Are you really really sure that they wont stack?

Yes very sure. If you daze something then fear them, the daze will be removed. This is how all hard cc works. And as most people have said, daze is more preferable to fear since it can only be stopped by stun break and stability and not condi removal or resistance, like fear can. So all in all, it would be a nerf to switch the daze out for fear. And since stability can only have 1 stack removed every 0.75s, it would be no different against foes with stability.

edit: the only time it would be an advantage would be against foes with a break bar, since fear and hard cc can work alongside each other there without removing each other.

[Anchoku.8142]

@Lahmia.2193 said:

@BaLzA.8902 said:

@Lahmia.2193 said:

@BaLzA.8902 said:Well ... ...

;)

Not sure if joke for excuse to add meme, but already covered that. One would override the other as you can only have 1 cc on at a time.

Actually i'm a bit confused about that. Are you really really sure that they wont stack?

Yes very sure. If you daze something then fear them, the daze will be removed. This is how all hard cc works. And as most people have said, daze is more preferable to fear since it can only be stopped by stun break and stability and not condi removal or resistance, like fear can. So all in all, it would be a nerf to switch the daze out for fear. And since stability can only have 1 stack removed every 0.75s, it would be no different against foes with stability.

edit: the only time it would be an advantage would be against foes with a break bar, since fear and hard cc can work alongside each other there without removing each other.

Yes, but there are the modifiers to consider so stun versus fear is not as bad a deal with a trait or two.Terror,Dread,Terrifying Descent,Shivers of Dread,Counts as a condition for when count matters.

[Lahmia.2193]

@Anchoku.8142 said:

@Lahmia.2193 said:

@BaLzA.8902 said:

@Lahmia.2193 said:

@BaLzA.8902 said:Well ... ...

;)

Not sure if joke for excuse to add meme, but already covered that. One would override the other as you can only have 1 cc on at a time.

Actually i'm a bit confused about that. Are you really really sure that they wont stack?

Yes very sure. If you daze something then fear them, the daze will be removed. This is how all hard cc works. And as most people have said, daze is more preferable to fear since it can only be stopped by stun break and stability and not condi removal or resistance, like fear can. So all in all, it would be a nerf to switch the daze out for fear. And since stability can only have 1 stack removed every 0.75s, it would be no different against foes with stability.

edit: the only time it would be an advantage would be against foes with a break bar, since fear and hard cc can work alongside each other there without removing each other.

Yes, but there are the modifiers to consider so stun versus fear is not as bad a deal with a trait or two.Terror,Dread,Terrifying Descent,Shivers of Dread,Counts as a condition for when count matters.

That is something I had not considered. Though I still maintain fear is a bad condition because of the amount of counters (all of which are even more common now than ever before) and taking traits for it is generally a bad idea.