Fractal Frustrations

[Turkeyspit.3965]

Am still only in T3 fractals, but I have exactly 0 intention of 'pugging' T4, based on the few times I've tried to pug T3.

Thing is, I don't understand why people pug T4 and then complain about randoms running random specs? In other MMO's that I've played, there was accessible group content where just about anything goes (think T1-T2), but after that, you didn't form random groups for hardmode stuff, you joined a guild, built a friend list, etc.

[Linken.6345]

@Turkeyspit.3965 said:Am still only in T3 fractals, but I have exactly 0 intention of 'pugging' T4, based on the few times I've tried to pug T3.

Thing is, I don't understand why people pug T4 and then complain about randoms running random specs? In other MMO's that I've played, there was accessible group content where just about anything goes (think T1-T2), but after that, you didn't form random groups for hardmode stuff, you joined a guild, built a friend list, etc.

T4 is still puggable mate t3 less so since people dont have much experience yet there usualy.

[SlippyCheeze.5483]

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@SlippyCheeze.5483 said:

@maddoctor.2738 said:

@SlippyCheeze.5483 said:ANet already have forums for discovering guilds, the most likely way to achieve this, and facilities such as friend lists to keep track of people without one.

Forums are being seen only by a tiny minority of players. If there was an in-game way of seeing guilds then everyone could press the appropriate button, be presented with a list of guilds advertising, pick the one they want, the one that fits their needs, and voila.

FWIW, WoW features one of these, and it is (well, was, up to 2 years ago) quite unhelpful. The volume of guilds, and the extremely limited degree to which they could be described and filtered, meant that unless you were looking for "the first random guild that takes anyone", there was little to no hope of finding anything useful with it.

So, while I don't disagree with you that the forums are limited, I don't believe this is likely to be a successful replacement in GW2 either.

Well in order for such a feature to work it needs to have filtering and shorting options, more like the Trading Post, if it's like the server browser for PVP hotjoin then it won't work at all.

The WoW browser did feature those filters, along with free text descriptions:

!

You can discover the many, many complaints about it trivially with google, which you will find essentially come down to "this is not much use for filtering"

[Eramonster.2718]

@Linken.6345 said:

@"Turkeyspit.3965" said:Am still only in T3 fractals, but I have exactly 0 intention of 'pugging' T4, based on the few times I've tried to pug T3.

Thing is, I don't understand why people pug T4 and then complain about randoms running random specs? In other MMO's that I've played, there was accessible group content where just about anything goes (think T1-T2), but after that, you didn't form random groups for hardmode stuff, you joined a guild, built a friend list, etc.

T4 is still puggable mate t3 less so since people dont have much experience yet there usualy.

Have to agree to this sadly :pensive: . Pug'ed T3 + recs for 2 weeks with a friend working on asc armors. Took 2hours on average to complete T3, dropped recs twice due to time constraint. From my observations and comparing it to T4 players, experience plays a major role.

1) Low dps aside, continuously attacking subject 6 shield form, countless failure trying to open Swamp etc :anguished:. Most of the challenges completed after a few tries or showing them the ropes (while some showed gratitude, a minor few gave up/reacted negatively).

2) Unwillingness to invest on food & fractal pots (Dmg, movement speed and 25% dmg reduction!). Really no reason not to use pots if they have the mastery imo.

3) Profession classes and understanding. From rifle Deadeye staying at max range dying to randoms to Berserker warrior telling "I can't use banners because I'm dps". :astonished:

PS : Would really love Anet to look into some specializations and make them more viable for instanced PvE. (Especially range users. Rifle, longbows etc)

[Feanor.2358]

@Eramonster.2718 said:PS : Would really love Anet to look into some specializations and make them more viable for instanced PvE. (Especially range users. Rifle, longbows etc)

Mate, you're asking for the devs to create a balance that compensates for people not caring what is expected of them or how their build works. Sadly, it is not possible.

[Eramonster.2718]

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Eramonster.2718 said:

PS : Would really love Anet to look into some specializations and make them more viable for instanced PvE. (Especially range users. Rifle, longbows etc)

Mate, you're asking for the devs to create a balance that compensates for people not caring what is expected of them or how their build works. Sadly, it is not possible.

I guess :sweat_smile: . First time seeing a Deadeye in Fractals and I honestly pity their current state in PvE as of now.

[Feanor.2358]

@Eramonster.2718 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Eramonster.2718 said:

PS : Would really love Anet to look into some specializations and make them more viable for instanced PvE. (Especially range users. Rifle, longbows etc)

Mate, you're asking for the devs to create a balance that compensates for people not caring what is expected of them or how their build works. Sadly, it is not possible.

I guess :sweat_smile: . First time seeing a Deadeye in Fractals and I honestly pity their current state in PvE as of now.

To be fair, I've seen Deadeyes perform quite well on Deimos and a particular Daredevil who did really high dps in fractals. People are just fixating too much on golem benchmarks. In the dps department, you can make literally any class work well enough for pretty much anything.

[Eramonster.2718]

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Eramonster.2718 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Eramonster.2718 said:

PS : Would really love Anet to look into some specializations and make them more viable for instanced PvE. (Especially range users. Rifle, longbows etc)

Mate, you're asking for the devs to create a balance that compensates for people not caring what is expected of them or how their build works. Sadly, it is not possible.

I guess :sweat_smile: . First time seeing a Deadeye in Fractals and I honestly pity their current state in PvE as of now.

To be fair, I've seen Deadeyes perform quite well on Deimos and a particular Daredevil who did really high dps in fractals. People are just fixating too much on golem benchmarks. In the dps department, you can make literally any class work well enough for pretty much anything.

That's good to hear :smiley:. Fingers crossed for the next Deadeye I'll bump into performs better.

[Turkeyspit.3965]

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Eramonster.2718 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Eramonster.2718 said:

PS : Would really love Anet to look into some specializations and make them more viable for instanced PvE. (Especially range users. Rifle, longbows etc)

Mate, you're asking for the devs to create a balance that compensates for people not caring what is expected of them or how their build works. Sadly, it is not possible.

I guess :sweat_smile: . First time seeing a Deadeye in Fractals and I honestly pity their current state in PvE as of now.

To be fair, I've seen Deadeyes perform quite well on Deimos and a particular Daredevil who did really high dps in fractals. People are just fixating too much on golem benchmarks. In the dps department, you can make literally any class work well enough for pretty much anything.

I don't know what my Golem DPS is and frankly I don't care. My experience in Fractals, at least up until now, is if the boss is CC'd and you stay out of the ouch, the boss will die. If it takes an extra 60 seconds or 4 minutes for him to die, who cares? But even if you can rip out 30K DPS on a Golem and the boss' defiance bar remains intact, or don't know about the 'dodge' key, you're dead - end of story.

As I've said before, if every pug group I joined in a fractal was composed of 4 other players who had reliable CC on their bars, understood how to use them, and could keep themselves up during the fights, all fractal runs would be easysauce.

[Feanor.2358]

@Turkeyspit.3965 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Eramonster.2718 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Eramonster.2718 said:

PS : Would really love Anet to look into some specializations and make them more viable for instanced PvE. (Especially range users. Rifle, longbows etc)

Mate, you're asking for the devs to create a balance that compensates for people not caring what is expected of them or how their build works. Sadly, it is not possible.

I guess :sweat_smile: . First time seeing a Deadeye in Fractals and I honestly pity their current state in PvE as of now.

To be fair, I've seen Deadeyes perform quite well on Deimos and a particular Daredevil who did really high dps in fractals. People are just fixating too much on golem benchmarks. In the dps department, you can make literally any class work well enough for pretty much anything.

I don't know what my Golem DPS is and frankly I don't care. My experience in Fractals, at least up until now, is if the boss is CC'd and you stay out of the ouch, the boss will die. If it takes an extra 60 seconds or 4 minutes for him to die, who cares? But even if you can rip out 30K DPS on a Golem and the boss' defiance bar remains intact, or don't know about the 'dodge' key, you're dead - end of story.

As I've said before, if every pug group I joined in a fractal was composed of 4 other players who had reliable CC on their bars, understood how to use them, and could keep themselves up during the fights, all fractal runs would be easysauce.

You don't seem to have much experience running in a meta party. I won't CC the boss and I will often not dodge an attack on purpose, both times expecting certain roles from the party to cover for that. It's not that I can't play the way you describe - I've done it in the past - it's just that I find it much more fun to play the way I do now. We're much more efficient as a team than we are when we only play side by side. I don't really care that I can clear it either way. I don't really play fractals to clear, I play it for the particular experience of being an efficient player in an efficient group. The loot is just a bonus. What I was saying above is that you can do that on any class. Provided you have a sensible build and you know how to play it in a group. Unfortunately that pretty much only applies to dps builds.

[SlippyCheeze.5483]

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Eramonster.2718 said:

PS : Would really love Anet to look into some specializations and make them more viable for instanced PvE. (Especially range users. Rifle, longbows etc)

Mate, you're asking for the devs to create a balance that compensates for people not caring what is expected of them or how their build works. Sadly, it is not possible.

I agree with both of you, sadly. You can't compensate mechanically for sufficiently bad players without making it overpowered for decent ones. OTOH, I'd like to have more chance to use ranged weapons, especially rifle, and most of the current options are not very attractive.

[ugrakarma.9416]

the transformation of fractals into raids mindset sucks. Except for some CM and Shattered observatory, theres no need for meta zealotry, if u feel squish just put some bunk traits.

[ugrakarma.9416]

but i agree theres terrible players that dont have both DPS and sustain lmao.

[Feanor.2358]

@ugrakarma.9416 said:the transformation of fractals into raids mindset sucks. Except for some CM and Shattered observatory, theres no need for meta zealotry, if u feel squish just put some bunk traits.

It's not about the need, it's about the desire. I want a meta party, because I'm having more fun with one.

[SlippyCheeze.5483]

@ugrakarma.9416 said:the transformation of fractals into raids mindset sucks. Except for some CM and Shattered observatory, theres no need for meta zealotry, if u feel squish just put some bunk traits.

Do you remember, back in the day, when everyone was complaining about how high tier fractals were hard to get into, because T4 was full of Fractal Elitism™?

[Despond.2174]

GW2 has the probably the friendliest and laid back dungeon community of all MMOs. I pugged everything for nearly 2 years, maybe 5% were bad groups. In fact groups that say "XP, pots+food" usually always run the smoothest, people fly though it, and if someone isn't performing then there's enough doing 20-30k dps to not really worry about it.

Now and then you do get a group that's unbearable but it's not often. Think of it this way, given the dailies aren't something like SO, TO, T4 should takes 25-30min, but a group that's failing over and over, leaving, finding others, you can get a set of dailies that takes 1-1hr30min. Now that's a large chunk of your day especially when there's plenty more than just T4 dailies to do.

But T4s are so easy now, for the most part they are done within 30-40min. Even groups that ask for food+pots and someone doesn't do it, no-one really does anything about it, as long as they aren't AFK or doing nearly zero then no-one really can be bothered with drama.

I've always been the player to be buffed up, even with cheap options in other MMOs, more to do with pride. If you're using even 50copper food it shows you're be considerate. Given GW2 has a near horizontal gear system, food/utilities/pots do play a decent portion since there's not many options to get more stats. We can farm 20g/hr from Istan, I think people can afford a few silver on food lol.

[aceofbass.2163]

@"Deepcuts.9740" said:Food - "lol you don't need food for this, are you noob?"Potions - "I don't buy potions because I need the relics"150AR - "What is AR?"Chill people only please - Rage quit 1st failFull run - they leave after 1st path because that was the only one they needed/wantedDaily T4s - they leave after the 1st one because that was the only one they needed/wantedDaily T4s + Rec - they leave after T4s because those were the only ones they needed/wanted

So true it hurts. Specially the ones who leave once the group has done that only one fractal they need and the leavers once t4 is done and heading to recs although it is posted.

80+ - I get a lot of level 50-60 that get mad if you ask them to leave the partyThis is kinda in an awkward position for me because some people are really exp'd in dungeon and just want to level their alt toon in dungeons. If there's like at least 2 level 80s that's ok for me since they know what they are doing anyway.

[Turkeyspit.3965]

@Despond.2174 said:I've always been the player to be buffed up, even with cheap options in other MMOs, more to do with pride. If you're using even 50copper food it shows you're be considerate. Given GW2 has a near horizontal gear system, food/utilities/pots do play a decent portion since there's not many options to get more stats. We can farm 20g/hr from Istan, I think people can afford a few silver on food lol.

That's a great point, thanks for brining it up.

I remember back in the days of WoW (The Burning Crusade), whenever I went into a Heroic 5-man dungeon, food buff and sharpening stone / mana oil wasn't even considered optional, and I loved it! Then Blizzard removed those buffs from the game =(

[Shadow Chaser.1948]

why don't you guys make static so you never have to deal with scrub like us? All you guys showing is elitism. BTW, this is just gw2. You are not saving world by being better than someone else in gw2 VIDEO game.One thing I hate more than anything, you look for pug and start bitching about it when someone else is not as good as you are. When you advertise on pug, and they meet your advertisement, you don't have room to complain.O and u elite people, try to give them hint/tips instead of non stop verbally abusing them. I have faced this myself when starting out. This is a big problem. If you dont like kick or leave but dont start fighting in game.And there is always that option, make your static and quit complaining about pug.

[ugrakarma.9416]

In the case of Dungeons there is a bad advertisement in the game that induces the newbie to think that a level 40 can do them. They should remove the level description, since does not have any way to a level 40 and equipped with rare, make an ascalon or caudecus full of elite mobs.

[Linken.6345]

@ugrakarma.9416 said:In the case of Dungeons there is a bad advertisement in the game that induces the newbie to think that a level 40 can do them. They should remove the level description, since does not have any way to a level 40 and equipped with rare, make an ascalon or caudecus full of elite mobs.

ofcourse you can I did ac/ta back in the day with 35 and 45 green gear.

[ugrakarma.9416]

@Linken.6345 said:

@"ugrakarma.9416" said:In the case of Dungeons there is a bad advertisement in the game that induces the newbie to think that a level 40 can do them. They should remove the level description, since does not have any way to a level 40 and equipped with rare, make an ascalon or caudecus full of elite mobs.

ofcourse you can I did ac/ta back in the day with 35 and 45 green gear.

from a new perspective, they dont know about speed runs, or tricks, from other games, "level 40 recommended" means u wont get insta killed by normal mobs if u fit that level. See the Twilight Arbor "level 55", you're greeted by elite spiders. That actual level recommendation is extremely misleading about the content.

[ugrakarma.9416]

@Deepcuts.9740 said:I gave up using lfg with EXP in it.Most people have no idea what EXP or even Experienced means. Or at least they act like they don't know. Or they think they can just get carried and nobody will notice.

The vast majority of exp players started pugging, being carried without nobody noticing.

[Linken.6345]

Right ta was 55 I admit cm 45 can be abit tricky with all the projectiles those bandits like to hurt you with.

[Ashgar.3024]

I pug my T4 dailies playing D/D Deadeye nowadays, i'm just bored with Daredevil, i didn't make a Thief to hop around like a Monkey. i keep up in DPS with most meta builds (only thing really beating me consistently is a well played Weaver), don't die and get mechanics done. T4s aren't hard. I can see having an hard-on for min maxing for some CMs but besides that let people live imho.>

@Eramonster.2718 said:

@Feanor.2358 said:

@Eramonster.2718 said:

PS : Would really love Anet to look into some specializations and make them more viable for instanced PvE. (Especially range users. Rifle, longbows etc)

Mate, you're asking for the devs to create a balance that compensates for people not caring what is expected of them or how their build works. Sadly, it is not possible.

I guess :sweat_smile: . First time seeing a Deadeye in Fractals and I honestly pity their current state in PvE as of now.

Its honestly not that bad, Rifle just doesn't work as a "main" weapon but its good enough to work as a switch option. Does an amazing job at dispatching high priority adds for example.