Deadeye damage is horrible.

[Luclinraider.2317]

Deadeye is now basically an unplayable.....at least with a rifle.

The spec is great, and I am loving the new "Marked for Death" and Malice mechanics.

However, the weapon set with Rifle is horrible. I think it may be the worst weapon set on thief.

1: It has possibly the weakest auto attack...at least SB bounces.....its #1 is literally an extremely slow APS that crits for around 1.8k in full ascended/legendary. It's a joke.

2: It's useful for the the imobi....but honestly, it's damage is bad, and 3 initiative for an imobi just isn't worth it.

3: Nerfed into the ground. 4 Initiative for really low damage, even kneeled its damage is just OK, nothing special, other weapons sets put 4 initiative to much better use.

4: While standing this move is just bad, 5 initiative to jump back a tiny bit, does basically an auto attacks worth of damage and empties your initiative bar so that you can't fight after. While kneeling, you get a big sniper hit, but it's damage is abysmal unless you've at least 5 malice on them, which take at least 10-15 seconds to stack even while attacking. Most thief fights are either won or lost by this time, making it useful maybe every now and then in PvP. As far as PvE goes, it just costs too much initiative to ever be worth it. A 20k crit for 6 initiative, or I could just be spamming unload on P/P for way more damage per initiative.

5. It's a crouch....no damage, just mods some other skill, and none in a way that saves the weapon set.

What rifle's real problem is: Their damage per initiative spent is horrible! The weapon set either needs a damage buff to #1 (Like huge....like 100% damage increase), a small increase to #3 damage (10-20%), and #4 standing just needs to be something else. OR It needs its #1 damage increased...(This really just needs to be done no matter what). And the initiative cost of #3 lowered to 3, and #4 lowered to 4 both standing and kneeling. The current weapon set literally gets 2-3 attacks of and you've drained your initiative bar, leaving you stuck auto attacking....which crits for 1.8k w/ 1 attack per second.....unusable.

Thief already has several quick weapon sets, so I personally don't mind this one being a slower, stationary, weapon. But it needs to do the damage to be worth that trade. Cutting our attacks per second in half at less damage per hit and losing all mobility needs to make us hit like trucks, otherwise it's just not worth using. Ive literally seen more DD and Core thiefs in PvP and PvE guild claim today than I see DE, 2 days after the release, and that's because the rifle is just unusable. D/P and P/P have more DPS on single target, Staff has more DPS on groups, and oh ya, you get 3 dodges, and dont lose all mobility. As it stands now, there is not a single reason to use rifle, and the only reason to be DE is for P/P Single Target DPS.

Buff Rifle's moveset by the above....otherwise you need to remove DE from the list of expansion features, it's basically like we didn't get a new specialization at this point.

[Luclinraider.2317]

Um....I guess numbering things makes them all capital?

Sorry for the weird format....didn't know that happened lol

[Zalavaaris.5329]

I just did a dps test with my rifle. I did around 20k. My daredevil with short bow does just over 18k. Just saying...

[Luclinraider.2317]

Ya, our new specialization does about 1.5k more dps (Insignificant) than a condi/mobility weapon set..........really? lol

[babazhook.6805]

I still think the first fix is a range increase. As is at 1500 other weapons have same range and or that range too easily closed allowing little time to get hits in. Boost it to 1800 as a start then look at tweaking indvidual skills. That 1800 range should be the kneel of course. Kneel should offer something a bit more substantial. (I think standing range is ok)

[Kain Francois.4328]

How about providing us with some dps benchmarks?

[Vindicus.2130]

I mean it's an absolutely horrible PvE spec. Whether or not that's Anet's intention is anyone's guess. What's DE parsing on dummy with 100% crouch time, like 20kish? A number of the new specs are doing 40-50k nps. Deadeye, more like Deadonarrival.

[Luclinraider.2317]

Agreed with above....

This spec needs a fix and fast.

Any word from dev's pls?

[Doggie.3184]

Only thing that does damage is the Kneel 4. Anything else you mine as well use Pistols unless you can't reach a boss or something. The Rifle 3 and Pistol 3 are pretty much the same skill, with Pistols being the better version by a landslide. Both Gun sets have a useless #2 skill of almost the same concept as well. ;x Pierce in that manner just isn't useful unless it's on the auto attack. Neither weapon has AoE which makes using them together problem.

[LazerusKI.7485]

@Doggie.3184 said:Only thing that does damage is the Kneel 4. Anything else you mine as well use Pistols unless you can't reach a boss or something. The Rifle 3 and Pistol 3 are pretty much the same skill, with Pistols being the better version by a landslide. Both Gun sets have a useless #2 skill of almost the same concept as well. ;x Pierce in that manner just isn't useful unless it's on the auto attack. Neither weapon has AoE which makes using them together problem.

havnt tried it yet...but wouldnt it make sense in theory to deal your main damage with something else (like P/P where you can deal a ton of damage without using that much initiative) and once malice is full you swap to your rifle to use deaths judgment as much as possible?

[Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497]

The caps hurt my eyes...

4 Standing isn't terrible. It just doesn't work when it needs to. 5 initiative to jump backwards 600 units and poison nearby foes. Shortbow has the advantage that it is targeted, allowing you to go where you please, but it takes a long time. Death's Retreat is a very fast escape move that can be quickly chained for a large escape distance. But it is also very inconsistent and poorly implemented.

[Tringsh.2380]

@babazhook.6805 said:I still think the first fix is a range increase. As is at 1500 other weapons have same range and or that range too easily closed allowing little time to get hits in. Boost it to 1800 as a start then look at tweaking indvidual skills. That 1800 range should be the kneel of course. Kneel should offer something a bit more substantial. (I think standing range is ok)

Loads of people said this during the beta, I think we would be super lucky to get it.

[R E F L H E X.8413]

I think deaths judgement should hit a little harder without malice and a little less with full malice.

[Aldath.1275]

I think I'm the only enjoying him then. I feel stronger than Holo with rifle and P/P, using full zerk with scholar and even with rare trinkets save my rings which are ascended...

I love it. With rifle I do feel like a sniper, looking for a place to knel down and take the enemies before they even get to me. 2+3 and they fall, sometimes I just need the 2, and 4 gets the job done in one blow against most Forged. I get Holo is cool and has area attacks and whatnot but I'm still doing map completion faster with Deadeye.

I don't think he's as garbage as people makes him out to be. Could be wrong, but let's wait for the pros to do the benchmarking; anyways, makes me feel more unique seeing so many holos and weavers...

[Faaris.8013]

@Zalavaaris.5329 said:I just did a dps test with my rifle. I did around 20k. My daredevil with short bow does just over 18k. Just saying...

But you can have the staff for much more damage when you use the shortbow. Do you have pistols to do another dps test?

[LazerusKI.7485]

@R E F L H E X.8413 said:I think deaths judgement should hit a little harder without malice and a little less with full malice.

even with 7 Malice it doesnt hit that hard. for me its 15k while my Pistol Unload deals 10k :/ (and i can chain one after another while DJ has to wait for energy)Thats why i stopped using it. Compared to the rest of the rifle skills it hits like a truck...compared to other weapons its just fluff

[Zalavaaris.5329]

@Faaris.8013 said:

@Zalavaaris.5329 said:I just did a dps test with my rifle. I did around 20k. My daredevil with short bow does just over 18k. Just saying...

But you can have the staff for much more damage when you use the shortbow. Do you have pistols to do another dps test?

Oh sorry, I should have been more clear. I did a dps test on a dummy using just rifle to test it's dps potential as our long ranged hard hitting weapon. I also tested daredevil using only short bow. My post was just pointing out that using only short bow for damage it almost matches rifle dps.

[lotusedge.6743]

Gonna use P/P for my range until they rework the attacks for Rifle. I like using mark though, so will keep using the traitline.

[Aomine.5012]

Deadeye is not horrible, Rifle is.

Try p/p for a change.

[otto.5684]

I played P/P with deadeye for open world, and it is damn powerful. Though that is not really a measure of anything :/

Ya, rifle in PvE sucks.

[Blood Red Arachnid.2493]

I have used rifle to an effect in PVE. In the PoF maps there are wandering groups that would eat me alive, so whenever I see one I crouch, buff, then start unloading damage. They're half dead by the time they get to me, and then I just switch to a melee weapon. It is good against the champions as well, since the long distance attacks mean I passively avoid most of their mechanics.

The biggest problem with it is that it's damage is rear-loaded. You need to wait 10 seconds before Death's Judgement can hit its hardest. Generally, most enemies don't survive for 10 seconds, so the weapon never peaks. I would like to see the initiative cost for double tap and triple shot to be reduced from 4 to 3, which will increase damage and give more might.

[OlsenSan.2987]

I love daredevil so much that I made a new thief to try deadeye, and I am already in HoT farming HP to make it daredevil as well. I am seeing people talking great things about their new elite spec on other classes, how they are loving it, and all I see is people trying to make deadeye useful ingame and forums.

[Balerios.3679]

@Luclinraider.2317 said:Deadeye is now basically an unplayable.....at least with a rifle.

The spec is great, and I am loving the new "Marked for Death" and Malice mechanics.

However, the weapon set with Rifle is horrible. I think it may be the worst weapon set on thief.

1: It has possibly the weakest auto attack...at least SB bounces.....its #1 is literally an extremely slow APS that crits for around 1.8k in full ascended/legendary. It's a joke.

2: It's useful for the the imobi....but honestly, it's damage is bad, and 3 initiative for an imobi just isn't worth it.

3: Nerfed into the ground. 4 Initiative for really low damage, even kneeled its damage is just OK, nothing special, other weapons sets put 4 initiative to much better use.

4: While standing this move is just bad, 5 initiative to jump back a tiny bit, does basically an auto attacks worth of damage and empties your initiative bar so that you can't fight after. While kneeling, you get a big sniper hit, but it's damage is abysmal unless you've at least 5 malice on them, which take at least 10-15 seconds to stack even while attacking. Most thief fights are either won or lost by this time, making it useful maybe every now and then in PvP. As far as PvE goes, it just costs too much initiative to ever be worth it. A 20k crit for 6 initiative, or I could just be spamming unload on P/P for way more damage per initiative.

5. It's a crouch....no damage, just mods some other skill, and none in a way that saves the weapon set.

What rifle's real problem is: Their damage per initiative spent is horrible! The weapon set either needs a damage buff to #1 (Like huge....like 100% damage increase), a small increase to #3 damage (10-20%), and #4 standing just needs to be something else. OR It needs its #1 damage increased...(This really just needs to be done no matter what). And the initiative cost of #3 lowered to 3, and #4 lowered to 4 both standing and kneeling. The current weapon set literally gets 2-3 attacks of and you've drained your initiative bar, leaving you stuck auto attacking....which crits for 1.8k w/ 1 attack per second.....unusable.

Thief already has several quick weapon sets, so I personally don't mind this one being a slower, stationary, weapon. But it needs to do the damage to be worth that trade. Cutting our attacks per second in half at less damage per hit and losing all mobility needs to make us hit like trucks, otherwise it's just not worth using. Ive literally seen more DD and Core thiefs in PvP and PvE guild claim today than I see DE, 2 days after the release, and that's because the rifle is just unusable. D/P and P/P have more DPS on single target, Staff has more DPS on groups, and oh ya, you get 3 dodges, and dont lose all mobility. As it stands now, there is not a single reason to use rifle, and the only reason to be DE is for P/P Single Target DPS.

Buff Rifle's moveset by the above....otherwise you need to remove DE from the list of expansion features, it's basically like we didn't get a new specialization at this point.

Writting like this i didnt even read your postWell i dont know abouy pve but in pvp deadeye is broken AF and needs nerfs. Thank you

[Saraneth.6021]

@Balerios.3679 said:

@Luclinraider.2317 said:Deadeye is now basically an unplayable.....at least with a rifle.

The spec is great, and I am loving the new "Marked for Death" and Malice mechanics.

However, the weapon set with Rifle is horrible. I think it may be the worst weapon set on thief.

1: It has possibly the weakest auto attack...at least SB bounces.....its #1 is literally an extremely slow APS that crits for around 1.8k in full ascended/legendary. It's a joke.

2: It's useful for the the imobi....but honestly, it's damage is bad, and 3 initiative for an imobi just isn't worth it.

3: Nerfed into the ground. 4 Initiative for really low damage, even kneeled its damage is just OK, nothing special, other weapons sets put 4 initiative to much better use.

4: While standing this move is just bad, 5 initiative to jump back a tiny bit, does basically an auto attacks worth of damage and empties your initiative bar so that you can't fight after. While kneeling, you get a big sniper hit, but it's damage is abysmal unless you've at least 5 malice on them, which take at least 10-15 seconds to stack even while attacking. Most thief fights are either won or lost by this time, making it useful maybe every now and then in PvP. As far as PvE goes, it just costs too much initiative to ever be worth it. A 20k crit for 6 initiative, or I could just be spamming unload on P/P for way more damage per initiative.

5. It's a crouch....no damage, just mods some other skill, and none in a way that saves the weapon set.

What rifle's real problem is: Their damage per initiative spent is horrible! The weapon set either needs a damage buff to #1 (Like huge....like 100% damage increase), a small increase to #3 damage (10-20%), and #4 standing just needs to be something else. OR It needs its #1 damage increased...(This really just needs to be done no matter what). And the initiative cost of #3 lowered to 3, and #4 lowered to 4 both standing and kneeling. The current weapon set literally gets 2-3 attacks of and you've drained your initiative bar, leaving you stuck auto attacking....which crits for 1.8k w/ 1 attack per second.....unusable.

Thief already has several quick weapon sets, so I personally don't mind this one being a slower, stationary, weapon. But it needs to do the damage to be worth that trade. Cutting our attacks per second in half at less damage per hit and losing all mobility needs to make us hit like trucks, otherwise it's just not worth using. Ive literally seen more DD and Core thiefs in PvP and PvE guild claim today than I see DE, 2 days after the release, and that's because the rifle is just unusable. D/P and P/P have more DPS on single target, Staff has more DPS on groups, and oh ya, you get 3 dodges, and dont lose all mobility. As it stands now, there is not a single reason to use rifle, and the only reason to be DE is for P/P Single Target DPS.

Buff Rifle's moveset by the above....otherwise you need to remove DE from the list of expansion features, it's basically like we didn't get a new specialization at this point.

Writting like this i didnt even read your postWell i dont know abouy pve but in pvp deadeye is broken AF and needs nerfs. Thank you

Na, they need buffs bro.

[Balerios.3679]

@Saraneth.6021 said:

@Balerios.3679 said:

@Luclinraider.2317 said:Deadeye is now basically an unplayable.....at least with a rifle.

The spec is great, and I am loving the new "Marked for Death" and Malice mechanics.

However, the weapon set with Rifle is horrible. I think it may be the worst weapon set on thief.

1: It has possibly the weakest auto attack...at least SB bounces.....its #1 is literally an extremely slow APS that crits for around 1.8k in full ascended/legendary. It's a joke.

2: It's useful for the the imobi....but honestly, it's damage is bad, and 3 initiative for an imobi just isn't worth it.

3: Nerfed into the ground. 4 Initiative for really low damage, even kneeled its damage is just OK, nothing special, other weapons sets put 4 initiative to much better use.

4: While standing this move is just bad, 5 initiative to jump back a tiny bit, does basically an auto attacks worth of damage and empties your initiative bar so that you can't fight after. While kneeling, you get a big sniper hit, but it's damage is abysmal unless you've at least 5 malice on them, which take at least 10-15 seconds to stack even while attacking. Most thief fights are either won or lost by this time, making it useful maybe every now and then in PvP. As far as PvE goes, it just costs too much initiative to ever be worth it. A 20k crit for 6 initiative, or I could just be spamming unload on P/P for way more damage per initiative.

5. It's a crouch....no damage, just mods some other skill, and none in a way that saves the weapon set.

What rifle's real problem is: Their damage per initiative spent is horrible! The weapon set either needs a damage buff to #1 (Like huge....like 100% damage increase), a small increase to #3 damage (10-20%), and #4 standing just needs to be something else. OR It needs its #1 damage increased...(This really just needs to be done no matter what). And the initiative cost of #3 lowered to 3, and #4 lowered to 4 both standing and kneeling. The current weapon set literally gets 2-3 attacks of and you've drained your initiative bar, leaving you stuck auto attacking....which crits for 1.8k w/ 1 attack per second.....unusable.

Thief already has several quick weapon sets, so I personally don't mind this one being a slower, stationary, weapon. But it needs to do the damage to be worth that trade. Cutting our attacks per second in half at less damage per hit and losing all mobility needs to make us hit like trucks, otherwise it's just not worth using. Ive literally seen more DD and Core thiefs in PvP and PvE guild claim today than I see DE, 2 days after the release, and that's because the rifle is just unusable. D/P and P/P have more DPS on single target, Staff has more DPS on groups, and oh ya, you get 3 dodges, and dont lose all mobility. As it stands now, there is not a single reason to use rifle, and the only reason to be DE is for P/P Single Target DPS.

Buff Rifle's moveset by the above....otherwise you need to remove DE from the list of expansion features, it's basically like we didn't get a new specialization at this point.

Writting like this i didnt even read your postWell i dont know abouy pve but in pvp deadeye is broken AF and needs nerfs. Thank you

Na, they need buffs bro.

Na they need nerfs bro. At least in pvp