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GW 2 Devs/Playerbase Twitter Discussion

Cyrin.1035

By Cyrin.1035
in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

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melodyca.8921

melodyca.8921

Posted
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@Alukah.2063 said:

@"FearTheOyster.5138" said:I'm sad that Price had to be let go, but firing Peter Fries is shocking. An employee should never be punished for sticking up for a coworker when facing a backlash on social media -- even if said coworker is in the wrong. This'll have a horrible affect on your work environment in the long run.

Sorta of agree, but fired for sticking up no. But should be held accountable and reprimanded yes. Then given a second chance.

After this?

She said that in response to TotalBiscuit passing away.

And about 10 other developers made the same remarks. Yes its wrong to do but developer abuse and harassment is not right in any way shape or form. The fact remains many youtubers incite fans to do that. Or do you find that its acceptable for fans to do that?

The bioware dev that made similar remarks also got fired for it.

@PecanBlue.4965 said:Very disappointed in Anet pandering to what is essentially a bunch of whiny gamers getting upset at someone who undoubtedly faces harassment every day, when the Youtuber probably didn't care that much to begin with. An apology from her, sure, but firing them? Thanks for encouraging the already toxic community.

You don't know what went behind the curtains, she could have been asked to apologize and refused.

@Zaklex.6308 said:Actually, I'm disappointed in ArenaNet...and the vast majority of the GW community as well...this is 2018, we all need to move into the now and start learning to separate a persons freedom of speech on PERSONAL social media from what they say on BUSINESS related social media. This actually extends beyond social media and includes sports personal conduct clauses...what you or anyone does on their own PERSONAL time does not reflect on how well they perform a job. I'm going to be quite unpopular with the following, but all of this really started with the Ray Rice thing(look it up if you don't know about that) and the NFL. Now, before you think I condone any type of abuse against another person you'd be so far from the truth it would make me laugh, but having said that, even though what he did to his girlfriend in an elevator during the off-season was atrocious, I do not think it was anyone's business but his and hers alone. If you're going to hold someone else up as a role model, society has a serious issue, the only role models should be your parents(if you have them of course).

The only way society is going to advance is this way: what you do at work or while representing your employer is directly related to that employer; what you do or say on your own PERSONAL time has nothing to do with your employer and until the rest of the world learns this we're all screwed(that even includes if you reference your employer on your own PERSONAL social media handles). I DO NOT CARE what someone does on their own time, nor should anyone else but that person, even the employer should not care what that person does on their own PERSONAL time, but we as a society have forgotten how to separate work from personal time...that is what work hours are for, so those people unable to tell the difference can.

Wake up world, this is 2018, not 1984 or 1950 or anyone other year...time to evolve or die out.

If the person, on their own time and personal social media accounts, is actively promoting themself as a company representative then they have decided to erase the line between personal and professional.

Like I said, that's old school thinking, which almost everyone is still doing...either humankind evolves or it dies out, until humankind can learn to separate personal time from employee time...we as a society are screwed. I do not care if you mention in your private personal social media accounts who you work for, those are for your own private thoughts, I'm smart enough to realize they do not reflect the company you work for, but as we've all seen...there is another single person in America that is smart enough to be able to do that. I won't speak for the rest of the world...let me put my thinking into a simple example...I wear a uniform at work, while I'm wearing that uniform I am representing my employer, the minute I take off any part of the uniform that identifies my employer I am no on my PERSONAL time and I should be allowed to say anything I want that isn't illegal...even if completely contradicts my employers public image...that is the state the world needs to be in, separate the individual from the job, they are not the same thing.

Right, but the person who chose to not separate the personal time from the professional was her. She chose to not evolve, as you put it, and suffered the, very unfortunate, consequences.

Apparently you're unable to comprehend what I'm saying...it isn't only the poster that has to do that, it's also the reader...EVERYONE needs to separate personal time from professional time, even if you list your professional associations on your PERSONAL social media...that is what I am saying. Let me put it this way, say you work an 8 - 5 job, what you say during those 8 - 5 hours reflects on your employer...anything you say outside of those hours, unless you're at a function representing your employer are your PERSONAL opinions and have no reflection on your employer....that is how we as a society need to evolve.

If you spend your personal time insulting and ridiculing your boss customers in public don't expect your boss to keep you around very long.

Actually the BioWare dev was already gone from the company when it happened. Clickbait youtubers like to perpetuate the lie hat he wasn't

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Harrik of Avalone.1867

Harrik of Avalone.1867

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@Toastbrot.9034 said:

@Dyplex.5798 said:I got Path of fire from my brother for my upcoming birthday but after reading the reddit thread and her twitter feed I decided I will return it.I do not support sexism in any shape of forrm, be that against women, men or trans. Please take action anet, this is disgusting behaviour.

Trans people aren't their own gender - trans men are men, trans women are women. If you're referring to people outside the definitions of man or woman, that would be nonbinary.

I don't think sexism against men is possible (given that sexism is based on societal structures enabling it), but that's besides the point.

lmao yes its possibleheres the definition for you incase you forgot:prejudice, stereotyping, or discrimination, typically against women, on the basis of sex

sexism (as any kind of discrimination) requires the existence of a social hierarchy. You can still find attacks against men distasteful but that doesn't make them discriminatory. Also: men can certainly be discriminated against, but not based on gender, but based on class, orientation, ethnicity, etc.

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TheNecrosanct.4028

TheNecrosanct.4028

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I'm surprised to see so many people going on the false assumption that she was fired for her beliefs. She wasn't. She was fired for rude conduct on a social media platform, against an official partner of ANet who, even after her first rude reply, tried to make clear that he wasn't trying to be sexist but just asked a legitimate question. And she still goes on to lambast him for the perceived sexist question. If she was truly fired for her beliefs she would have a very strong case in court and trust me, big companies are not that stupid. It's also anything but the first time someone has lost their job because of a social media debacle. This is not a strange phenomenon in today's world, so I don't understand why people are so up in arms about ANet's supposed violation of free speech rights where there is none. It was her conduct, not her beliefs. A closer look at het Twitter feed shows she is very vocal about her beliefs, so if that ever was a problem for ANet they wouldn't have hired her in the first place.

This not an action taken because of pressure from an angry mob. There is no mob. Most comments about the situation up to the point that MO posted she was fired were rational and merely voicing opinions, not rantings and ravings from an angry mob. Yes, there were some, but there are always exceptions and they tend to prove the rule, as they do here. There is no point in overdramatizing the situation and villianizing ANet or mixing up facts and leaving important information out, though I understand it's a tactic that works perfectly for and on the people who want to discredit a certain party or are not up to date with their information.

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Ashen.2907

Ashen.2907

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@Zaklex.6308 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:Actually, I'm disappointed in ArenaNet...and the vast majority of the GW community as well...this is 2018, we all need to move into the now and start learning to separate a persons freedom of speech on PERSONAL social media from what they say on BUSINESS related social media. This actually extends beyond social media and includes sports personal conduct clauses...what you or anyone does on their own PERSONAL time does not reflect on how well they perform a job. I'm going to be quite unpopular with the following, but all of this really started with the Ray Rice thing(look it up if you don't know about that) and the NFL. Now, before you think I condone any type of abuse against another person you'd be so far from the truth it would make me laugh, but having said that, even though what he did to his girlfriend in an elevator during the off-season was atrocious, I do not think it was anyone's business but his and hers alone. If you're going to hold someone else up as a role model, society has a serious issue, the only role models should be your parents(if you have them of course).

The only way society is going to advance is this way: what you do at work or while representing your employer is directly related to that employer; what you do or say on your own PERSONAL time has nothing to do with your employer and until the rest of the world learns this we're all screwed(that even includes if you reference your employer on your own PERSONAL social media handles). I DO NOT CARE what someone does on their own time, nor should anyone else but that person, even the employer should not care what that person does on their own PERSONAL time, but we as a society have forgotten how to separate work from personal time...that is what work hours are for, so those people unable to tell the difference can.

Wake up world, this is 2018, not 1984 or 1950 or anyone other year...time to evolve or die out.

If the person, on their own time and personal social media accounts, is actively promoting themself as a company representative then they have decided to erase the line between personal and professional.

Like I said, that's old school thinking, which almost everyone is still doing...either humankind evolves or it dies out, until humankind can learn to separate personal time from employee time...we as a society are screwed. I do not care if you mention in your private personal social media accounts who you work for, those are for your own private thoughts, I'm smart enough to realize they do not reflect the company you work for, but as we've all seen...there is another single person in America that is smart enough to be able to do that. I won't speak for the rest of the world...let me put my thinking into a simple example...I wear a uniform at work, while I'm wearing that uniform I am representing my employer, the minute I take off any part of the uniform that identifies my employer I am now on my PERSONAL time and I should be allowed to say anything I want that isn't illegal...even if completely contradicts my employers public image...that is the state the world needs to be in, separate the individual from the job, they are not the same thing.

Right, but the person who chose to not separate the personal time from the professional was her. She chose to not evolve, as you put it, and suffered the, very unfortunate, consequences.

Apparently you're unable to comprehend what I'm saying...it isn't only the poster that has to do that, it's also the reader...EVERYONE needs to separate personal time from professional time, even if you list your professional associations on your PERSONAL social media...that is what I am saying. Let me put it this way, say you work an 8 - 5 job, what you say during those 8 - 5 hours reflects on your employer...anything you say outside of those hours, unless you're at a function representing your employer are your PERSONAL opinions and have no reflection on your employer....that is how we as a society need to evolve.

Your argument is invalidated when an employee uses her PERSONAL account to abuse her employer's customers.

We're just going to have to agree to disagree, since I clearly stated the everyone is going to have to learn to separate PERSONAL from PROFESSIONAL, regardless of whom your dealing with in your PERSONAL social media...in my book, what you say and do on your own PERSONAL time and platforms does not reflect on your employer, even if you're interacting with that employers customers.

Here's a question everyone needs to ask themselves...why do you associate what someone says on their own personal social media with the employer they work for, are people not entitled to think differently and have different opinions than their employer? Shouldn't those people be free to express those differences on their own personal social media accounts, even to people that might be customers of that employer...after all, it's someones private time, they're not on the clock.

That is how I see the world, there's the professional you and the private you, and those two people do not have to think or act the same, nor do they have to walk on eggshells because their employer might not like what they say on their own private time, even to a customer, even a customer that was clearly in the wrong, customers need to realize the same thing...there's a difference between business time and private time.

While declaring that they are representing the company? Just no.

I could, on my day off, stand outside of my place of business and actively speak to discourage customers from doing business with my employer. Those customers, knowing my position of authority when speaking of the company would be influenced to take their business elsewhere. By attacking, verbally of course, those customers I could 3nsure that they would not want to frequent my place of business in order to avoid interacting with me. And my decision to use my position to harm my employer should cost me my job under those circumstances. An employer does not owe an employee purposefully acting to harm the employer continued employment.

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Pyroatheist.9031

Pyroatheist.9031

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@kimeekat.2548 said:I'm disappointed in Arenanet and really upset that Peter is gone. Collecting some things I've said elsewhere in the hope that Gaile or someone sees:

Imo Peter was likely fired primarily because a situation like this is an enormous risk for a wrongful termination lawsuit if the punishment is not applied equally to all involved.

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kimeekat.2548

kimeekat.2548

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@Sarrs.4831 said:

@kimeekat.2548 said:a dev doesn't owe you anything on their own time

If you, as a twitter user, genuinely don't feel a post warrants a response?

Don't respond.

She obviously felt it was a backhanded comment that plays into a larger pattern of sexism that women deal with when they step into games, and as such did warrant a response so I'm not sure what good this advice does.

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melodyca.8921

melodyca.8921

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@PecanBlue.4965 said:Very disappointed in Anet pandering to what is essentially a bunch of whiny gamers getting upset at someone who undoubtedly faces harassment every day, when the Youtuber probably didn't care that much to begin with. An apology from her, sure, but firing them? Thanks for encouraging the already toxic community.

I think its a sad reflection that so many people think its alright to abuse, threaten and harass developers. She went overboard yes but it was a defense mechanism for what goes on in the industry. And I look forward to the day when game companies crack down on the libel, slander, and defamation that is rampant on these youtubers.

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Leo G.4501

Leo G.4501

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@Zaklex.6308 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:Actually, I'm disappointed in ArenaNet...and the vast majority of the GW community as well...this is 2018, we all need to move into the now and start learning to separate a persons freedom of speech on PERSONAL social media from what they say on BUSINESS related social media. This actually extends beyond social media and includes sports personal conduct clauses...what you or anyone does on their own PERSONAL time does not reflect on how well they perform a job. I'm going to be quite unpopular with the following, but all of this really started with the Ray Rice thing(look it up if you don't know about that) and the NFL. Now, before you think I condone any type of abuse against another person you'd be so far from the truth it would make me laugh, but having said that, even though what he did to his girlfriend in an elevator during the off-season was atrocious, I do not think it was anyone's business but his and hers alone. If you're going to hold someone else up as a role model, society has a serious issue, the only role models should be your parents(if you have them of course).

The only way society is going to advance is this way: what you do at work or while representing your employer is directly related to that employer; what you do or say on your own PERSONAL time has nothing to do with your employer and until the rest of the world learns this we're all screwed(that even includes if you reference your employer on your own PERSONAL social media handles). I DO NOT CARE what someone does on their own time, nor should anyone else but that person, even the employer should not care what that person does on their own PERSONAL time, but we as a society have forgotten how to separate work from personal time...that is what work hours are for, so those people unable to tell the difference can.

Wake up world, this is 2018, not 1984 or 1950 or anyone other year...time to evolve or die out.

If the person, on their own time and personal social media accounts, is actively promoting themself as a company representative then they have decided to erase the line between personal and professional.

Like I said, that's old school thinking, which almost everyone is still doing...either humankind evolves or it dies out, until humankind can learn to separate personal time from employee time...we as a society are screwed. I do not care if you mention in your private personal social media accounts who you work for, those are for your own private thoughts, I'm smart enough to realize they do not reflect the company you work for, but as we've all seen...there is another single person in America that is smart enough to be able to do that. I won't speak for the rest of the world...let me put my thinking into a simple example...I wear a uniform at work, while I'm wearing that uniform I am representing my employer, the minute I take off any part of the uniform that identifies my employer I am now on my PERSONAL time and I should be allowed to say anything I want that isn't illegal...even if completely contradicts my employers public image...that is the state the world needs to be in, separate the individual from the job, they are not the same thing.

Right, but the person who chose to not separate the personal time from the professional was her. She chose to not evolve, as you put it, and suffered the, very unfortunate, consequences.

Apparently you're unable to comprehend what I'm saying...it isn't only the poster that has to do that, it's also the reader...EVERYONE needs to separate personal time from professional time, even if you list your professional associations on your PERSONAL social media...that is what I am saying. Let me put it this way, say you work an 8 - 5 job, what you say during those 8 - 5 hours reflects on your employer...anything you say outside of those hours, unless you're at a function representing your employer are your PERSONAL opinions and have no reflection on your employer....that is how we as a society need to evolve.

Your argument is invalidated when an employee uses her PERSONAL account to abuse her employer's customers.

We're just going to have to agree to disagree, since I clearly stated the everyone is going to have to learn to separate PERSONAL from PROFESSIONAL, regardless of whom your dealing with in your PERSONAL social media...in my book, what you say and do on your own PERSONAL time and platforms does not reflect on your employer, even if you're interacting with that employers customers.

Here's a question everyone needs to ask themselves...why do you associate what someone says on their own personal social media with the employer they work for, are people not entitled to think differently and have different opinions than their employer? Shouldn't those people be free to express those differences on their own personal social media accounts, even to people that might be customers of that employer...after all, it's someones private time, they're not on the clock.

That is how I see the world, there's the professional you and the private you, and those two people do not have to think or act the same, nor do they have to walk on eggshells because their employer might not like what they say on their own private time, even to a customer, even a customer that was clearly in the wrong, customers need to realize the same thing...there's a difference between business time and private time.

Good. You have conviction in your views!

Now open your eyes and look at your own perspective critically. Own your biases and understand how they could distort your viewpoints. Take in a bigger picture and reflect.

To answer your question: why do you associate what someone says on their own personal social media with the employer they work for..?

I'll ask you a question: why would anyone be able to discern that you work for a certain employer at all?

In an ideal mass social media environment, your annonymity is your saving grace and narcissism is your worst enemy.

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Wolfheart.1879

Wolfheart.1879

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It's sad to see an outcome like this, but in the circumstances, particularly in the case of Jessica, seemingly unavoidable.

As has been dug up since this fiasco first started, there is a history of very toxic attitudes and positions from this former employee. Some were over the top. In the case of her Total Biscuit comments, utterly disgusting. But they were her opinions, and whatever our opinion of her from those outbursts, it can be argued personal opinion and her work were still separate. Here, her fatal flaw was bringing her work into her personal twitter account. Her initial post was very insightful, and showed that she has/had a deep thought process and care for her job. Maybe she got the wrong end of the stick with the guy's questions, maybe she was annoyed that someone tried to start a conversation. No matter. When she brought her work into her personal account on a public forum, and this dumpster fire started from it, it becomes a work matter.

I don't know if she was offered the chance to apologise and move on. I know there have been some catastrophic foul ups and mistreatment of playerbases across the industry, and many if not most of those still ended with the guilty party retaining their job, if not their pride. Maybe a solution was looked for out of the public gaze first and she doubled down on her attacks. I kinda hope there was that olive branch offered because I try to believe in the good in everyone and believe everyone deserves another chance if they are truly remorseful. I'm not certain in this instance that would have been viable, or even appropriate to look for, but it is a hope.

Peter's fate seems a lot less cut and dry. He fouled up, and pinned his colours to her mast, but I don't see the same level of issue. Maybe his level was enough and Jessica just stepped so far over the line she could no longer see that line. Either way, it's sad that two people have lost their jobs over this debacle, but actions and words can have serious consequences. I'm glad that Anet and MO are working to promote a strong foundation of community interaction based upon mutual respect. We are expected to be respectful to Anet's representatives, and rightly so. It's only fair to expect the same back.

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Kosze.3169

Kosze.3169

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I think this is all bullshit. She doesn't represent the whole game. And I really hope this is just a glass Anet placed on this situation and didn't actually fire her. Yeah, maybe she didn't answer well on her personal twitter.You know who else doesn't? The president of the U.S.A. go fire him.Also, her job here is to write plot on the game, not PR, not customer service, not graphic design, not gaming mechanics. To all of you saying "She's not doing her job correctly" don't be fools. Again, personal Twitter.

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SimBilly.8047

SimBilly.8047

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@Dengar.1785 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:Actually, I'm disappointed in ArenaNet... (snip)

Whether the media is personal or public becomes rather irrelevant when the people you're mistreating are the people who buy and promote your company's product.

Exactly. She was quite vile and extremely rude in response to a player's politely worded post on a public forum where she publicly identifies herself as an Anet employee. Anet made the right decision here.

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Leo G.4501

Leo G.4501

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@"kimeekat.2548" said:I'm disappointed in Arenanet and really upset that Peter is gone. Collecting some things I've said elsewhere in the hope that Gaile or someone sees:

The entire thesis of her twitter thread is that it's the genre that causes the constraint and The Partner's reply was basically like, "slight disagreement: have you instead considered that the problem is just your game" - a friendly pop in to disagree with the entire premise of the thread and her professional perspective with a backhanded comment for the narrative design team about how their implementation doesn't meet his standards because their choices are "just on the checklist for an achievement".

Okay, I don't see that as a backhand. She says the genre is the fault point here but the partner says "perhaps it's just your game"? That's exactly right. SWTOR is the anti-thesis to her observation. Rather than dismiss the comment, why not discect it? Look into how the living story formula plays out and what is optimal, what is constrained, what is detrimental, what could be improved. If the logic is, the way things are is perfect, then that right there is the divide in perspective.

She just wrote a whole thread about why+how that is and Anet has talked about the struggles of branching decisions+dialogue many times, down to the additional resources that unique "end conversation" text options take up even within a single conversation tree, which is why we see player choices primarily in expansions where the story arc is more compact and contained alongside a more traditional ending where the choices can converge once more. Her thread was a personal thought after the AMA, not the AMA itself - and even if it was an AMA he didn't ask a question, he did that thing where someone says, "more of a comment than a question" and I thought the meme war had already been fought on whether that move is a faux pas or not.

No, that isn't a faux pas. It never was.

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Sarrs.4831

Sarrs.4831

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@kimeekat.2548 said:She obviously felt it was a backhanded comment that plays into a larger pattern of sexism that women deal with when they step into games, and as such did warrant a response so I'm not sure what good this advice does.

...This is the exact opposite of what you should do. Internet rule 1: Don't feed the trolls.

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Zaklex.6308

Zaklex.6308

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@Leo G.4501 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:Actually, I'm disappointed in ArenaNet...and the vast majority of the GW community as well...this is 2018, we all need to move into the now and start learning to separate a persons freedom of speech on PERSONAL social media from what they say on BUSINESS related social media. This actually extends beyond social media and includes sports personal conduct clauses...what you or anyone does on their own PERSONAL time does not reflect on how well they perform a job. I'm going to be quite unpopular with the following, but all of this really started with the Ray Rice thing(look it up if you don't know about that) and the NFL. Now, before you think I condone any type of abuse against another person you'd be so far from the truth it would make me laugh, but having said that, even though what he did to his girlfriend in an elevator during the off-season was atrocious, I do not think it was anyone's business but his and hers alone. If you're going to hold someone else up as a role model, society has a serious issue, the only role models should be your parents(if you have them of course).

The only way society is going to advance is this way: what you do at work or while representing your employer is directly related to that employer; what you do or say on your own PERSONAL time has nothing to do with your employer and until the rest of the world learns this we're all screwed(that even includes if you reference your employer on your own PERSONAL social media handles). I DO NOT CARE what someone does on their own time, nor should anyone else but that person, even the employer should not care what that person does on their own PERSONAL time, but we as a society have forgotten how to separate work from personal time...that is what work hours are for, so those people unable to tell the difference can.

Wake up world, this is 2018, not 1984 or 1950 or anyone other year...time to evolve or die out.

If the person, on their own time and personal social media accounts, is actively promoting themself as a company representative then they have decided to erase the line between personal and professional.

Like I said, that's old school thinking, which almost everyone is still doing...either humankind evolves or it dies out, until humankind can learn to separate personal time from employee time...we as a society are screwed. I do not care if you mention in your private personal social media accounts who you work for, those are for your own private thoughts, I'm smart enough to realize they do not reflect the company you work for, but as we've all seen...there is another single person in America that is smart enough to be able to do that. I won't speak for the rest of the world...let me put my thinking into a simple example...I wear a uniform at work, while I'm wearing that uniform I am representing my employer, the minute I take off any part of the uniform that identifies my employer I am now on my PERSONAL time and I should be allowed to say anything I want that isn't illegal...even if completely contradicts my employers public image...that is the state the world needs to be in, separate the individual from the job, they are not the same thing.

Right, but the person who chose to not separate the personal time from the professional was her. She chose to not evolve, as you put it, and suffered the, very unfortunate, consequences.

Apparently you're unable to comprehend what I'm saying...it isn't only the poster that has to do that, it's also the reader...EVERYONE needs to separate personal time from professional time, even if you list your professional associations on your PERSONAL social media...that is what I am saying. Let me put it this way, say you work an 8 - 5 job, what you say during those 8 - 5 hours reflects on your employer...anything you say outside of those hours, unless you're at a function representing your employer are your PERSONAL opinions and have no reflection on your employer....that is how we as a society need to evolve.

Your argument is invalidated when an employee uses her PERSONAL account to abuse her employer's customers.

We're just going to have to agree to disagree, since I clearly stated the everyone is going to have to learn to separate PERSONAL from PROFESSIONAL, regardless of whom your dealing with in your PERSONAL social media...in my book, what you say and do on your own PERSONAL time and platforms does not reflect on your employer, even if you're interacting with that employers customers.

Here's a question everyone needs to ask themselves...why do you associate what someone says on their own personal social media with the employer they work for, are people not entitled to think differently and have different opinions than their employer? Shouldn't those people be free to express those differences on their own personal social media accounts, even to people that might be customers of that employer...after all, it's someones private time, they're not on the clock.

That is how I see the world, there's the professional you and the private you, and those two people do not have to think or act the same, nor do they have to walk on eggshells because their employer might not like what they say on their own private time, even to a customer, even a customer that was clearly in the wrong, customers need to realize the same thing...there's a difference between business time and private time.

Good. You have conviction in your views!

Now open your eyes and look at your own perspective critically. Own your biases and understand how they could distort your viewpoints. Take in a bigger picture and reflect.

To answer your question: why do you associate what someone says on their own personal social media with the employer they work for..?

I'll ask you a question: why would anyone be able to discern that you work for a certain employer at all?

In an ideal mass social media environment, your annonymity is your saving grace and narcissism is your worst enemy.

Which is why you won't find who I work for on the few social media sites I use...it was there, but then people tend to not like my employer, so it no longer says who I currently work for, just a past employer that has been swallowed up by another company...actually all of my past employers basically no longer exist, either through acquisition or from the owner going out of business because of age. Essentially though, I don't care what anyone else thinks about me based on my statements...no one else matters but me, not even my friends, if they think I'm an asshole, I don't care, they're entitled to their opinion...so is everyone else.

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Toastbrot.9034

Toastbrot.9034

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@Harrik of Avalone.1867 said:

@Dyplex.5798 said:I got Path of fire from my brother for my upcoming birthday but after reading the reddit thread and her twitter feed I decided I will return it.I do not support sexism in any shape of forrm, be that against women, men or trans. Please take action anet, this is disgusting behaviour.

Trans people aren't their own gender - trans men are men, trans women are women. If you're referring to people outside the definitions of man or woman, that would be nonbinary.

I don't think sexism against men is possible (given that sexism is based on societal structures enabling it), but that's besides the point.

lmao yes its possibleheres the definition for you incase you forgot:prejudice, stereotyping, or discrimination, typically against women, on the basis of sex

sexism (as any kind of discrimination) requires the existence of a social hierarchy. You can still find attacks against men distasteful but that doesn't make them discriminatory. Also: men can certainly be discriminated against, but not based on gender, but based on class, orientation, ethnicity, etc.

where in the definition of sexism do you read that i wonder? you can't just make up the definition of words because it doesn't fit your narrative lmao

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Brother.1504

Brother.1504

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@Zaklex.6308 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:Actually, I'm disappointed in ArenaNet...and the vast majority of the GW community as well...this is 2018, we all need to move into the now and start learning to separate a persons freedom of speech on PERSONAL social media from what they say on BUSINESS related social media. This actually extends beyond social media and includes sports personal conduct clauses...what you or anyone does on their own PERSONAL time does not reflect on how well they perform a job. I'm going to be quite unpopular with the following, but all of this really started with the Ray Rice thing(look it up if you don't know about that) and the NFL. Now, before you think I condone any type of abuse against another person you'd be so far from the truth it would make me laugh, but having said that, even though what he did to his girlfriend in an elevator during the off-season was atrocious, I do not think it was anyone's business but his and hers alone. If you're going to hold someone else up as a role model, society has a serious issue, the only role models should be your parents(if you have them of course).

The only way society is going to advance is this way: what you do at work or while representing your employer is directly related to that employer; what you do or say on your own PERSONAL time has nothing to do with your employer and until the rest of the world learns this we're all screwed(that even includes if you reference your employer on your own PERSONAL social media handles). I DO NOT CARE what someone does on their own time, nor should anyone else but that person, even the employer should not care what that person does on their own PERSONAL time, but we as a society have forgotten how to separate work from personal time...that is what work hours are for, so those people unable to tell the difference can.

Wake up world, this is 2018, not 1984 or 1950 or anyone other year...time to evolve or die out.

If the person, on their own time and personal social media accounts, is actively promoting themself as a company representative then they have decided to erase the line between personal and professional.

Like I said, that's old school thinking, which almost everyone is still doing...either humankind evolves or it dies out, until humankind can learn to separate personal time from employee time...we as a society are screwed. I do not care if you mention in your private personal social media accounts who you work for, those are for your own private thoughts, I'm smart enough to realize they do not reflect the company you work for, but as we've all seen...there is another single person in America that is smart enough to be able to do that. I won't speak for the rest of the world...let me put my thinking into a simple example...I wear a uniform at work, while I'm wearing that uniform I am representing my employer, the minute I take off any part of the uniform that identifies my employer I am no on my PERSONAL time and I should be allowed to say anything I want that isn't illegal...even if completely contradicts my employers public image...that is the state the world needs to be in, separate the individual from the job, they are not the same thing.

Right, but the person who chose to not separate the personal time from the professional was her. She chose to not evolve, as you put it, and suffered the, very unfortunate, consequences.

Apparently you're unable to comprehend what I'm saying...it isn't only the poster that has to do that, it's also the reader...EVERYONE needs to separate personal time from professional time, even if you list your professional associations on your PERSONAL social media...that is what I am saying. Let me put it this way, say you work an 8 - 5 job, what you say during those 8 - 5 hours reflects on your employer...anything you say outside of those hours, unless you're at a function representing your employer are your PERSONAL opinions and have no reflection on your employer....that is how we as a society need to evolve.

This is social media policy and procedures 101 in most professions. Personal time is yours, when representing the brand your always professional, even in this politically charged times we are living. This is a learning experience for all parties involved. Anet management handled this well, quick, decisive, with a strong internal and public message.

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xarallei.4279

xarallei.4279

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@Pyroatheist.9031 said:

@kimeekat.2548 said:I'm disappointed in Arenanet and
really
upset that Peter is gone. Collecting some things I've said elsewhere in the hope that Gaile or someone sees:

Imo Peter was likely fired primarily because a situation like this is an enormous risk for a wrongful termination lawsuit if the punishment is not applied equally to all involved.

This. The rules must be applied equally or not at all. Either no one gets fired or both do. To apply things in an unequal manner leaves you open to future legal claims. They have to protect themselves and any legal counsel would most certainly have recommended terminating both.

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Zaklex.6308

Zaklex.6308

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@Brother.1504 said:

@Zaklex.6308 said:Actually, I'm disappointed in ArenaNet...and the vast majority of the GW community as well...this is 2018, we all need to move into the now and start learning to separate a persons freedom of speech on PERSONAL social media from what they say on BUSINESS related social media. This actually extends beyond social media and includes sports personal conduct clauses...what you or anyone does on their own PERSONAL time does not reflect on how well they perform a job. I'm going to be quite unpopular with the following, but all of this really started with the Ray Rice thing(look it up if you don't know about that) and the NFL. Now, before you think I condone any type of abuse against another person you'd be so far from the truth it would make me laugh, but having said that, even though what he did to his girlfriend in an elevator during the off-season was atrocious, I do not think it was anyone's business but his and hers alone. If you're going to hold someone else up as a role model, society has a serious issue, the only role models should be your parents(if you have them of course).

The only way society is going to advance is this way: what you do at work or while representing your employer is directly related to that employer; what you do or say on your own PERSONAL time has nothing to do with your employer and until the rest of the world learns this we're all screwed(that even includes if you reference your employer on your own PERSONAL social media handles). I DO NOT CARE what someone does on their own time, nor should anyone else but that person, even the employer should not care what that person does on their own PERSONAL time, but we as a society have forgotten how to separate work from personal time...that is what work hours are for, so those people unable to tell the difference can.

Wake up world, this is 2018, not 1984 or 1950 or anyone other year...time to evolve or die out.

If the person, on their own time and personal social media accounts, is actively promoting themself as a company representative then they have decided to erase the line between personal and professional.

Like I said, that's old school thinking, which almost everyone is still doing...either humankind evolves or it dies out, until humankind can learn to separate personal time from employee time...we as a society are screwed. I do not care if you mention in your private personal social media accounts who you work for, those are for your own private thoughts, I'm smart enough to realize they do not reflect the company you work for, but as we've all seen...there is another single person in America that is smart enough to be able to do that. I won't speak for the rest of the world...let me put my thinking into a simple example...I wear a uniform at work, while I'm wearing that uniform I am representing my employer, the minute I take off any part of the uniform that identifies my employer I am no on my PERSONAL time and I should be allowed to say anything I want that isn't illegal...even if completely contradicts my employers public image...that is the state the world needs to be in, separate the individual from the job, they are not the same thing.

Right, but the person who chose to not separate the personal time from the professional was her. She chose to not evolve, as you put it, and suffered the, very unfortunate, consequences.

Apparently you're unable to comprehend what I'm saying...it isn't only the poster that has to do that, it's also the reader...EVERYONE needs to separate personal time from professional time, even if you list your professional associations on your PERSONAL social media...that is what I am saying. Let me put it this way, say you work an 8 - 5 job, what you say during those 8 - 5 hours reflects on your employer...anything you say outside of those hours, unless you're at a function representing your employer are your PERSONAL opinions and have no reflection on your employer....that is how we as a society need to evolve.

This is social media policy and procedures 101 in most professions. Personal time is yours, when representing the brand your always professional, even in this politically charged times we are living. This is a learning experience for all parties involved. Anet management handled this well, quick, decisive, with a strong internal and public message.

I understand that, and I'm saying it needs to change and it needs to change now, pronto, yesterday, last year...no one should ever be considered to representing a brand when on personal time, even if you display that brand on your personal social media(which is self-defeating until those "brands" realize this simple fact)...that is what I'm trying to get at. If we here in the United States made it illegal for businesses to use an employees personal social media accounts against them, that would be a big step in opening up the avenues of dissent and discussion on all fronts, but that will never happen because...reasons that would probably get me in trouble.

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Sarrs.4831

Sarrs.4831

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@Zaklex.6308 said:If we here in the United States made it illegal for businesses to use an employees personal social media accounts against them, that would be a big step in opening up the avenues of dissent and discussion on all fronts, but that will never happen because...reasons that would probably get me in trouble.

You believe that someone who uses their personal twitter to attack their employer's customers should be protected under the law?...

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Blaeys.3102

Blaeys.3102

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For everyone criticizing these people being fired - take a closer look at what Mike Obrien wrote. "As a result, they are no longer with the company." He never said they were fired. All we know is they are gone. It is just as likely that the company offered a way out of this and they chose to leave instead. We just don't know - and likely never will - and I am sure this decision wasn't made casually.

At the end of the day, it is probably just better for everyone that this is over and behind them.

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