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Exactly What Was the Point of the Patch?


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I'm scratching my head at the Thief changes. At first glance, it appears to be a net gain for the Deadeye, but a big punch in the gut for the Core Thief.

Did the Core Thief really need to be weakened any further than it already was? I'm glad I finally got the expansions!

But really, what was this patch about? Streamlining Deadeye needed to be done (removing the ICD on Silent Scope). Simple QoL improvement. Why all the nerfs?

Can we at least make Stealth on stolen items universal for all Thieves, or remove the Malice requirement? Or make Deadeye's Mark instant cast since stolen items have a cast time?

Maybe a stationary dodge/evade while kneeling (when no direction keys are held) so we can get into a good overlook position, and gain Stealth without losing that position... or to evade a big (unblockable) attack without losing the position? Or even allow a "kneeling" Thief to be able to move at only 25% normal speed? Good QoL improvements are welcome. But why all the needless downgrades?

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In my opinion; the core nerf you are refering to was aimed at condi thief d/d and s/d. They were doing a lot of dmg plus condi bombs people then run for it. Once hit, the person can't move while all the condi thief has to do is either evade(3 and dodge for d/d or IS and dodge spam). So people complained and is nerfed a bit. For power thief, like myself, it was a small hit compared to Necro and Mesmer thus I am content of this. I have a better change on the battlefield against them. I want a more balance so anybody can pick any class and win through experience and skill..... not just spaming 3 and dodge. But I don't speak for all thief players so I will leave for them to speak up. If you watch Sindrener, a very good thief player, he will tell you that he is meh on it. He used s/d core thief and he was happy with the nerf on that side. He loves and hates the changes to blinding powerd. I hope that helps. Let me know if you have more questions.

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For starters, the only unexpected changes were exposed weakness, blinding powder and the way Steal abilitys on deadeye now work. Everything else was already expected.

I won't discuss blinding powder since I actually prefer the current one.

Exposed weakness now deals less damage 1x1 but deals more damage when +1 a target as long your partner is capable of dealing many conditions. Also works like a buff in PvE content since you are pretty much getting a 20% extra damage bonus.

The loss of instant F2 abilitys on DeadEye is indeed, annoying as hell. But on other hand DE is no longer slave to rifle and Silent scope for stealth access.

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Thank you for ya'll's take on the changes. I guess I'm annoyed because the patch seems to kneecap every Core build instead of just condi builds... at least as far as PvP goes.

  • Infiltrator's Strike: Immobilization duration has been split between game modes and will now use a lower 1-second duration in PvP and WvW while using 2 seconds in PvE.
  • Swindler's Equilibrium: This trait has been split between game modes. The recharge time reduced in PvP and WvW is now 50%, while PvE remains at 100%.

Nerfs ALL Sword builds. Even though Sword may have become the chosen weapon over Dagger/Pistol, it was because D/P was nerfed, not because S/x was buffed.

  • Unload: Initiative cost and initiative gain have been split between game modes. The PvP and WvW versions will now cost 6 initiative and refund 1 initiative if all attacks hit. The PvE version will continue to use the previous 5-initiative cost and 2-initiative refund.

Nerfs Pistol/Pistol power builds. Was P/P effective and "cheap?" Yes. Why? Because it offered both damage and survivablity. The damage should have been given to the Dagger and/or Sword, but instead, it just becomes much more expensive. Core builds don't have access to the high damage that Deadeyes have.

  • Exposed Weakness: The damage this trait causes has been changed from 10% damage if the target has a condition to 2% damage per unique condition on a target.
  • Dagger Training: In addition to causing dagger attacks to poison enemies, this trait now grants 5% bonus damage to dagger attacks.

Nerfs ALL builds in PvP environments, both power and condi. Everything but Dagger gets directly shafted. Dagger builds get to choose which way to get shafted... either by the 8% damage loss or the loss of damage and healing from Mug.

  • Potent Poison: This trait has been split and will now grant 20% bonus to poison duration and damage in both PvP and WvW, with PvE remaining at 33%.

Poison is the one condition that makes sense for the Thief to have. Why degrade it instead of just the other conditions?

  • Uncatchable: Previously, caltrops dropped by this trait inflicted cripple for 5 seconds on targets not currently crippled, and inflicted 1 second of crippled on targets already crippled. Now this trait will always apply 1 second of cripple on each pulse. Removed the first pulse when activated. Bleeding duration has been increased from 4 seconds to 5 seconds in PvE, with PvP and WvW being reduced from 4 seconds to 3 seconds.

Reducing the bleed is fine if the goal is to limit the effectiveness of conditions. But why reduce the crippling capability? Does anyone stay inside the AoE for more than a second anyway?

Couldn't we at least get some buff for Lotus Poison? Cut the ICD down to 6 seconds or so. Or, instead, create a Lesser Weakness effect that affects only attacks that are against the Thief who applied it. Lesser Weakness would not affect Endurance, but would retain its Fumble effect only against the specific Thief. Lesser Poison would not have a specific duration, it would simply be present as long the Poison applications by that Thief are present (meaning it can be removed by cleansing the Poison). It would basically be an aggressive but fleeting form of Protection. It would also make the Dagger Training and Potent Poison traits more useful for power builds (of course, I still prefer Dagger Training changing its name so it will affect all weapons, making the 5% Dagger damage increase baseline).

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