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Top 5 class, underrated roamers?


Jay.3409

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It all depends on the week, this week is a good example of off-spec, as I'm saving money on food (by not running it) and running my squishiest classes (cause it doesn't matter either way what I run, but it makes bad blobbers feel good about themselves when they run me over, which is what I want, delusional "roamers", they'll come in handy sometime later).

Anyway, on weeks like this I like to roam with:-Full Viper Reaper-Full Maurader SB-Soldier / Valkery Staff Tempest

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"Top 5" of the underrated ones would literally be the rest of the classes compared to the top roamers.

I prefer to name "the top 1 lesser seen roamer that has a tendancy to catch me by surprise compared to every other predictable foe" and that one is easy - rev (well, herald, its time we forget vanilla). They can have such ridiculous damage with s/s/staff if they know how to actually play it. A single staff push has bursted me down faster than a shatter mirage. Most arent anywhere near that good of course and bad revs only get carried by the absorption heal, but still.

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@"Dawdler.8521" said:"Top 5" of the underrated ones would literally be the rest of the classes compared to the top roamers.

I prefer to name "the top 1 lesser seen roamer that has a tendancy to catch me by surprise compared to every other predictable foe" and that one is easy - rev (well, herald, its time we forget vanilla). They can have such ridiculous damage with s/s/staff if they know how to actually play it. A single staff push has bursted me down faster than a shatter mirage. Most arent anywhere near that good of course and bad revs only get carried by the absorption heal, but still.

A glass rev is scary. SotM, the staff push, was nerfed heavily in pvp (50%!), but not WvW because it just did way too much. It evades, it CCs multiple times, and it can basically 1-shot a squishy.. so that's a must-dodge. Then you have UA, which also evades and can 1-shot a squishy, so that is a must-dodge (x2, long animation) too.

The only reason it's not broken-OP is its lack of defense + sustain. They have to kill you quickly or they'll probably lose.

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@"Jay.3409" said:Yeah yeah... we got mesmer, dead eye.. and ofc the crowd favorite.. condi mes..

but how bout the underrated ones? what classes do you have fun with roaming that isnt "meta" roamers?

I actually find deadeye to be a pretty bad roamer now. It's a perpetual annoyance and it has great disengage/stealth, but it's not going to kill anyone unless it's +1-ing a fight in progress. It's definitely not going to go 1vX against anyone with half a brain.

Agreed about mesmer. I basically don't engage Mirages when roaming now unless absolutely necessary. It just has way more of everything. I have to outplay it by a ridiculous margin to win. AFAICT, it's not possible to win vs a good Mirage running dodge food and energy sigils.

I'd add full glass Reaper as a surprisingly good roamer (similar to glass rev). It can be really deadly if they catch you off guard, but also need to kill you quickly or they'll lose a longer fight.

Edit: also, Rifle Warrior - the usual defense vs Warrior is to kite, but you can't kite rifle, so then you have to try and out-damage them, but you can't do that because of invulns + resistance. If you aren't expecting it, it can easily win a 1v1, but loses 1vX because it's missing the defense that the usual war builds have.

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@coro.3176 said:

@"Jay.3409" said:Yeah yeah... we got mesmer, dead eye.. and ofc the crowd favorite.. condi mes..

but how bout the underrated ones? what classes do you have fun with roaming that isnt "meta" roamers?

I actually find deadeye to be a pretty bad roamer now. It's a perpetual annoyance and it has great disengage/stealth, but it's not going to kill anyone unless it's +1-ing a fight in progress. It's definitely not going to go 1vX against anyone with half a brain.

that so? why is there another complain thread about how broken our stealth and onshots are?but seriously your wrong on deadeye. in 1 vs 1 they are extremely strong. in 1 vs X they need their opponents not to understand downstate or split far enough in wich case not sure if you can call it 1 vs X anymore.what i have noticed tho with the rework and especially the changes to silent scope wich made deadeye so much more fluid to play, there are alot more deadeyes now in WvW. with that obviously there are also more bad deadeyes. i had several whispers with compliments about how i play my deadeye in the last week, before as i was rather an exotic species people would just whisper how broken it was, now that they have examples of people unable to play it, they value it a bit more when they see a better deadeye. because they can see the difference so it might not be 100% build carried.

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@MUDse.7623 said:

@"Jay.3409" said:Yeah yeah... we got mesmer, dead eye.. and ofc the crowd favorite.. condi mes..

but how bout the underrated ones? what classes do you have fun with roaming that isnt "meta" roamers?

I actually find deadeye to be a pretty bad roamer now. It's a perpetual annoyance and it has great disengage/stealth, but it's not going to kill anyone unless it's +1-ing a fight in progress. It's definitely not going to go 1vX against anyone with half a brain.

that so? why is there another complain thread about how broken our stealth and onshots are?but seriously your wrong on deadeye. in 1 vs 1 they are extremely strong. in 1 vs X they need their opponents not to understand downstate or split far enough in wich case not sure if you can call it 1 vs X anymore.what i have noticed tho with the rework and especially the changes to silent scope wich made deadeye so much more fluid to play, there are alot more deadeyes now in WvW. with that obviously there are also more bad deadeyes. i had several whispers with compliments about how i play my deadeye in the last week, before as i was rather an exotic species people would just whisper how broken it was, now that they have examples of people unable to play it, they value it a bit more when they see a better deadeye. because they can see the difference so it might not be 100% build carried.

Dunno. Maybe I haven't seen a good one in all this time since the redesign. Maybe those players insisted on standing still and attempting to fight the deadeye once they were marked instead of taking cover/LoS or preparing defenses. I mean, if you just sit there waiting for them to appear, you'll definitely die to a DE, but .. most players won't just sit there and die, they'll move to a safe location, or set traps or reveal. If the DE insists on stealthing and disengaging every time rather than trying to finish a kill, I'll just leave, but I don't consider that a loss. It's just a waste of time for both of us.

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Is condi mes really that common? From my experience there are far more holos, power mirage, core wars, spell breakers, and soulbeasts than there are condi mesmers. Deadeyes are on the rise but I'd say Holos are the most common to see now. As far as off-meta a good ol' zerk rifle/gs warrior can be a tough fight, especially if there's anything else near it.

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@coro.3176 said:

@"Jay.3409" said:Yeah yeah... we got mesmer, dead eye.. and ofc the crowd favorite.. condi mes..

but how bout the underrated ones? what classes do you have fun with roaming that isnt "meta" roamers?

I actually find deadeye to be a pretty bad roamer now. It's a perpetual annoyance and it has great disengage/stealth, but it's not going to kill anyone unless it's +1-ing a fight in progress. It's definitely not going to go 1vX against anyone with half a brain.

that so? why is there another complain thread about how broken our stealth and onshots are?but seriously your wrong on deadeye. in 1 vs 1 they are extremely strong. in 1 vs X they need their opponents not to understand downstate or split far enough in wich case not sure if you can call it 1 vs X anymore.what i have noticed tho with the rework and especially the changes to silent scope wich made deadeye so much more fluid to play, there are alot more deadeyes now in WvW. with that obviously there are also more bad deadeyes. i had several whispers with compliments about how i play my deadeye in the last week, before as i was rather an exotic species people would just whisper how broken it was, now that they have examples of people unable to play it, they value it a bit more when they see a better deadeye. because they can see the difference so it might not be 100% build carried.

Dunno. Maybe I haven't seen a good one in all this time since the redesign. Maybe those players insisted on standing still and attempting to fight the deadeye once they were marked instead of taking cover/LoS or preparing defenses. I mean, if you just sit there waiting for them to appear, you'll definitely die to a DE, but .. most players won't just sit there and die, they'll move to a safe location, or set traps or reveal. If the DE insists on stealthing and disengaging every time rather than trying to finish a kill, I'll just leave, but I don't consider that a loss. It's just a waste of time for both of us.

a deadeye can finish most 1 vs 1 rather quick.its just gets long and boring if you outnumber the deadeye as he has a hard time finishing a downed opponent in an outnumbered fight and downstate is just too strong against it, but at the same time he can choose when to fight so if you refuse to give him a fight in wich he can stomp his downed opponents, then he might stall.now if we consider that against good opponents you wont be winning outnumbered anyway and bad opponents still let their allies get stomped while outnumbering a deadeye, thats not something i would consider making a deadeye a bad roamer.

but hey might be i just run into bad opponents that die to a deadeye 1vs1, considering my playtime thats the majority of roamers on EU servers tho..

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Last time i was on. Condi Renegade.

Using Shiro/Mallyx or Mallyx/Kalla. Depending mostly on what I was doing or if I was grouped.

Felt good to spam disenchantment on spellbreakers and gaurdians. And use shiro to push my condition pressure on shortbow to the limit if I managed to hit with the skills.

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The classes I roam with most are:

  1. Burst Medi trap DH Sword/focus and GS - Very bursty, does extremely well against stealth classes or those with mobility. Spear denies stealth which is fun in current meta.
  2. Power 1 shot Soulbeast longbow/GS - Very fun overall to land 30k hits on someone and the mobility from birds and GS is fun, Sic em is fun in current meta.
  3. Condi/healing Staff/shortbow druid - Tanky mobile build, sic em is fun in current meta.
  4. Viper/celestial D/D Tempest - Always fun killing people on this build, seems no one likes dying to a tempest now days, constant rage whispers on this class. Always a good laugh to load up magnetic auras and watch pewpew classes kill themselves.
  5. Shatter Chrono Sword/Sword and GS - Has imagined burden and inspiration for condi removal on illusion summons, good alround build to sustain in 1vx situations.

Lots of fun, not sure if they are underrated or meta or not, just my own personalized builds.

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@MUDse.7623 said:

@"Jay.3409" said:Yeah yeah... we got mesmer, dead eye.. and ofc the crowd favorite.. condi mes..

but how bout the underrated ones? what classes do you have fun with roaming that isnt "meta" roamers?

I actually find deadeye to be a pretty bad roamer now. It's a perpetual annoyance and it has great disengage/stealth, but it's not going to kill anyone unless it's +1-ing a fight in progress. It's definitely not going to go 1vX against anyone with half a brain.

that so? why is there another complain thread about how broken our stealth and onshots are?but seriously your wrong on deadeye. in 1 vs 1 they are extremely strong. in 1 vs X they need their opponents not to understand downstate or split far enough in wich case not sure if you can call it 1 vs X anymore.what i have noticed tho with the rework and especially the changes to silent scope wich made deadeye so much more fluid to play, there are alot more deadeyes now in WvW. with that obviously there are also more bad deadeyes. i had several whispers with compliments about how i play my deadeye in the last week, before as i was rather an exotic species people would just whisper how broken it was, now that they have examples of people unable to play it, they value it a bit more when they see a better deadeye. because they can see the difference so it might not be 100% build carried.

in my experience both playing my deadeye and encountering enemy deadeyes, deadeye is only strong 1v1 when the enemy is not very smart OR the enemy never saw the deadeye coming. But the second one is true for pretty much all bursty builds. If you don't see the glass cannon coming, you will die before you can react regardless of what class that glass cannon build is on.

An actual bursty deadeye has like maybe 1 stunbreak, stun them twice they're dead. And they're so glassy if you can get a channeled damage skill e.g. ranger LB 2 on them the short moment when they are visible, they will get downed while still in stealth as your arrows etc continue to target them as most of them only has like 16k health and many run with only 12k. The other thing is, after every burst that deadeye is useless and has to spend maybe 60s waiting for cooldowns in a safe spot.

As you've said, deadeyes can only win 1 v X if their opponents are stupid enough to spread out and split. In which case it's really just back to back 1 v 1s rather than an actual 1 v X. I did kill 3 people on my deadeye this way just the other day. There were 3 of them, had they went after me I would've died guaranteed. But they somehow chose to run so I just had to target them starting from the slowest.

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@Nate.3927 said:

@"Jay.3409" said:Yeah yeah... we got mesmer, dead eye.. and ofc the crowd favorite.. condi mes..

but how bout the underrated ones? what classes do you have fun with roaming that isnt "meta" roamers?

I actually find deadeye to be a pretty bad roamer now. It's a perpetual annoyance and it has great disengage/stealth, but it's not going to kill anyone unless it's +1-ing a fight in progress. It's definitely not going to go 1vX against anyone with half a brain.

that so? why is there another complain thread about how broken our stealth and onshots are?but seriously your wrong on deadeye. in 1 vs 1 they are extremely strong. in 1 vs X they need their opponents not to understand downstate or split far enough in wich case not sure if you can call it 1 vs X anymore.what i have noticed tho with the rework and especially the changes to silent scope wich made deadeye so much more fluid to play, there are alot more deadeyes now in WvW. with that obviously there are also more bad deadeyes. i had several whispers with compliments about how i play my deadeye in the last week, before as i was rather an exotic species people would just whisper how broken it was, now that they have examples of people unable to play it, they value it a bit more when they see a better deadeye. because they can see the difference so it might not be 100% build carried.

in my experience both playing my deadeye and encountering enemy deadeyes, deadeye is only strong 1v1 when the enemy is not very smart OR the enemy never saw the deadeye coming. But the second one is true for pretty much all bursty builds. If you don't see the glass cannon coming, you will die before you can react regardless of what class that glass cannon build is on.

An actual bursty deadeye has like maybe 1 stunbreak, stun them twice they're dead. And they're so glassy if you can get a channeled damage skill e.g. ranger LB 2 on them the short moment when they are visible, they will get downed while still in stealth as your arrows etc continue to target them as most of them only has like 16k health and many run with only 12k. The other thing is, after every burst that deadeye is useless and has to spend maybe 60s waiting for cooldowns in a safe spot.

the way you describe it might be for a deadeye build around a strong opening burst like you see them in spvp and granted many people copy build for roaming from spvp. but frontloading damage is not as important in WvW roaming encounters and IMO deadeye is alot stronger when build for execute bursts rather than opening bursts. i am not as squishy, dont need to wait 60s in a 1 vs 1 and still can burst most roaming opponents 100%-0% when my execute is build up. so guess we just talk about way different deadeye builds/playstyles, different ways to approach an opponent.

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@Nate.3927 said:

@"Jay.3409" said:Yeah yeah... we got mesmer, dead eye.. and ofc the crowd favorite.. condi mes..

but how bout the underrated ones? what classes do you have fun with roaming that isnt "meta" roamers?

I actually find deadeye to be a pretty bad roamer now. It's a perpetual annoyance and it has great disengage/stealth, but it's not going to kill anyone unless it's +1-ing a fight in progress. It's definitely not going to go 1vX against anyone with half a brain.

that so? why is there another complain thread about how broken our stealth and onshots are?but seriously your wrong on deadeye. in 1 vs 1 they are extremely strong. in 1 vs X they need their opponents not to understand downstate or split far enough in wich case not sure if you can call it 1 vs X anymore.what i have noticed tho with the rework and especially the changes to silent scope wich made deadeye so much more fluid to play, there are alot more deadeyes now in WvW. with that obviously there are also more bad deadeyes. i had several whispers with compliments about how i play my deadeye in the last week, before as i was rather an exotic species people would just whisper how broken it was, now that they have examples of people unable to play it, they value it a bit more when they see a better deadeye. because they can see the difference so it might not be 100% build carried.

in my experience both playing my deadeye and encountering enemy deadeyes, deadeye is only strong 1v1 when the enemy is not very smart OR the enemy never saw the deadeye coming. But the second one is true for pretty much all bursty builds. If you don't see the glass cannon coming, you will die before you can react regardless of what class that glass cannon build is on.

An actual bursty deadeye has like maybe 1 stunbreak, stun them twice they're dead. And they're so glassy if you can get a channeled damage skill e.g. ranger LB 2 on them the short moment when they are visible, they will get downed while still in stealth as your arrows etc continue to target them as most of them only has like 16k health and many run with only 12k. The other thing is, after every burst that deadeye is useless and has to spend maybe 60s waiting for cooldowns in a safe spot.

As you've said, deadeyes can only win 1 v X if their opponents are stupid enough to spread out and split. In which case it's really just back to back 1 v 1s rather than an actual 1 v X. I did kill 3 people on my deadeye this way just the other day. There were 3 of them, had they went after me I would've died guaranteed. But they somehow chose to run so I just had to target them starting from the slowest.

I play DE along with professions I use to counter DE. SA DE is hard to kill with a channel if they trait up CIS. In DE vs DE encounters I run into many of those you talk about built around that singular power burst and they tend to die to a channel attack even as they stealth to my own DE. DE does not in fact have to use DJ to churn out damage. two round burst mixed with the occasional three round burst hits hard. There no waiting for 60seconds for cooldowns as you are not relying on skills with cooldowns. The available INI pool to a thief specced DE is larger then any other thief spec. Added to that using weapons other then Rifle or to complement the same can be very effective in a DE spec.

On my own DE the number one thing that gets me in trouble is not the Stuns. It immobs.

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@babazhook.6805 said:On my own DE the number one thing that gets me in trouble is not the Stuns. It immobs.

I've definitely seen quite a few DE's roaming around lately. They always give my spellbreaker a hard time since they can engage and disengage so freely.

I usually run Guard counter on Adept trait, but if what you say about immob is true, suppose No escape would be worth a shot? (Dazes and stuns inflict immobilize).

That will of course mean you still need to hit a daze or stun on the DE. Same with Magebane, for it to catch him you need to hit a burst.

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