Deaths Judgement

[Leafstorm.1349]

Firstly, I'll just say this isn't really a rage post. Obviously this will get pushback from people who like to play Deadeye as would anything that needs a rework on any class that people like to play. However, deaths judgement needs a serious rework or just to be taken out of PvP all together. That sounds like an opinion however, not only are there many people who would agree with me, quite a few of them play in the upper/top tiers of what this game has to offer for SPvP.

The real question is why? Why add something like an ICD (45s maybe?) or remove the skill? The main problem persist due to either you or your teammates being opened up on for 13-15k initial shot, then 3.5k double taps instantly after from _stealth. This either instantly downs a teammate or makes them/you blow every cooldown to keep alive which drastically puts the fight in the other team's favor. It actually wouldn't be as bad, but all the deadeye has to do is simply dodge to regain stealth, then hit for another 15k and some double taps. WHO thought this was an amazing idea? The access to stealth that deadeye has makes it almost impossible for it to die if they have any clue what they're doing.

There are quite a few classes in the game that have access to amazing burst, but these have a longer cooldown and take setup for it to work. Power Mantra Mesmers can one shot things from stealth, but they must set their burst up again while in combat to do it again if it doesn't work which really doesn't work most of the time. Rangers have amazing burst with worldly impact and what not, but again, this has a ICD and they end up in mele range. Core Guardian also has great burst... nothing that can really hit for 15k unbuffed, but still good. However, once a core guard blows all their CDs, they are easy targets if they don't kite. So why can deadeye simply dodge to regain a 15k hit? Why is it they can double tap after for 3.5k in less than 5 seconds from considerable range? Why is it they have so much stealth? Other classes take precision and timing to burst something down. They need to watch for other class mechanics such as heals and blocks, but all a deadeye really has to do is dodge again.

Please tell me... what have they done to deserve the 20k+ dmg burst in less than five seconds besides buy PoF? Why do they deserve that dmg? They literally do nothing but dodge or gain stealth through one click of a utility trait.

Time to fire whoever made deadeye a thing and didn't test it in SPvP. Why wouldn't you have given them a sword for offhand instead? What a joke.

[Ryan.9387]

Regardless of balance, deadeye deserves no place in pvp. It is never be fun to play against and honestly should just receive the https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Smiter%27s_Boon_(PvP) treatment.

[Jalal.6783]

@Leafstorm.1349 said:Firstly, I'll just say this isn't really a rage post. Obviously this will get pushback from people who like to play Deadeye as would anything that needs a rework on any class that people like to play. However, deaths judgement needs a serious rework or just to be taken out of PvP all together. That sounds like an opinion however, not only are there many people who would agree with me, quite a few of them play in the upper/top tiers of what this game has to offer for SPvP.

The real question is why? Why add something like an ICD (45s maybe?) or remove the skill? The main problem persist due to either you or your teammates being opened up on for 13-15k initial shot, then 3.5k double taps instantly after from _stealth. This either instantly downs a teammate or makes them/you blow every cooldown to keep alive which drastically puts the fight in the other team's favor. It actually wouldn't be as bad, but all the deadeye has to do is simply dodge to regain stealth, then hit for another 15k and some double taps. WHO thought this was an amazing idea? The access to stealth that deadeye has makes it almost impossible for it to die if they have any clue what they're doing.

There are quite a few classes in the game that have access to amazing burst, but these have a longer cooldown and take setup for it to work. Power Mantra Mesmers can one shot things from stealth, but they must set their burst up again while in combat to do it again if it doesn't work which really doesn't work most of the time. Rangers have amazing burst with worldly impact and what not, but again, this has a ICD and they end up in mele range. Core Guardian also has great burst... nothing that can really hit for 15k unbuffed, but still good. However, once a core guard blows all their CDs, they are easy targets if they don't kite. So why can deadeye simply dodge to regain a 15k hit? Why is it they can double tap after for 3.5k in less than 5 seconds from considerable range? Why is it they have so much stealth? Other classes take precision and timing to burst something down. They need to watch for other class mechanics such as heals and blocks, but all a deadeye really has to do is dodge again.

Please tell me... what have they done to deserve the 20k+ dmg burst in less than five seconds besides buy PoF? Why do they deserve that dmg? They literally do nothing but dodge or gain stealth through one click of a utility trait.

Time to fire whoever made deadeye a thing and didn't test it in SPvP. Why wouldn't you have given them a sword for offhand instead? What a joke.

@"Ryan.9387" said:Regardless of balance, deadeye deserves no place in pvp. It is never be fun to play against and honestly should just receive the https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Smiter%27s_Boon_(PvP) treatment.

Yes yes yes and yes. Exactly everything said here. I wish I had something useful to add put damn, you guys hit it 100%

[bq pd.2148]

a one malice backstab will hit more and is alot harder to avoid than a one malice deaths judgement. can you tell me why you complain about the deaths judgement, not about the malicious backstab instead ? if you get hit for 13-15k by a one malice deaths judgement that would probably be a 17-20k one malice backstab (didnt do math now just rough experience from playing alot with both).

[Coolguy.8702]

De is trash in high tiers, its very easy to counter them lol, projectile hate, fight them back while they attack (they’re verysquishy), or LoS.Only class that should be qqing about them are necros, since de can delete them if they dont have a fb

[Stand The Wall.6987]

I think two/ three round burst should have might stacks removed and a higher cd on stealth on dodge thing. other then that it seems fine to me.

[Isle of Stars.3049]

@Coolguy.8702 said:De is trash in high tiers, its very easy to counter them lol, projectile hate, fight them back while they attack (they’re verysquishy), or LoS.Only class that should be qqing about them are necros, since de can delete them if they dont have a fb

I can't count how many times I've killed myself with my own bullet, tbh.Like what MUDse.7623 said, Malicious Backstab hurts more than DJ and more difficult to avoid. In the same kind, DJ will apply the reveal first before the shot, hence the DE will get revealed even if the attack misses or has been blocked. Whereas in MB the reveal applies after the registered hit.

[Math.5123]

DJ if the smallest issue in the deadeyes kit tbh. The mark into knockdown into TRB to global you in .3 seconds is way more annoying than a well telegraphed skill.Also, shadow meld and stealth on dodge trait needs to go.

[DragonFury.6243]

@Coolguy.8702 said:De is trash in high tiers, its very easy to counter them lol, projectile hate, fight them back while they attack (they’re verysquishy), or LoS.Only class that should be qqing about them are necros, since de can delete them if they dont have a fb

SO an entire profession get deleted because of a single skill i ll say this is the greatest design i ever seen

[Isle of Stars.3049]

@DragonFury.6243 said:

@Coolguy.8702 said:De is trash in high tiers, its very easy to counter them lol, projectile hate, fight them back while they attack (they’re verysquishy), or LoS.Only class that should be qqing about them are necros, since de can delete them if they dont have a fb

SO an entire profession get deleted because of a single skill i ll say this is the greatest design i ever seen

I haven't pulled off an insta-kill out of a single skill even with full malice, if you know the build of what you are referring to I would love to know.

[Coolguy.8702]

@DragonFury.6243 said:

SO an entire profession get deleted because of a single skill i ll say this is the greatest design i ever seen

Looks like you play nec. But de deletes them for more than just deaths judgement. Them and rangers entire mechanics shuts them down hard.Deaths judgement should be unblockable since all their other rifle skills get reflected back to them

[Crab Fear.1624]

@Leafstorm.1349 said:Firstly, I'll just say this isn't really a rage post. Obviously this will get pushback from people who like to play Deadeye as would anything that needs a rework on any class that people like to play. However, deaths judgement needs a serious rework or just to be taken out of PvP all together. That sounds like an opinion however, not only are there many people who would agree with me, quite a few of them play in the upper/top tiers of what this game has to offer for SPvP.

The real question is why? Why add something like an ICD (45s maybe?) or remove the skill? The main problem persist due to either you or your teammates being opened up on for 13-15k initial shot, then 3.5k double taps instantly after from _stealth. This either instantly downs a teammate or makes them/you blow every cooldown to keep alive which drastically puts the fight in the other team's favor. It actually wouldn't be as bad, but all the deadeye has to do is simply dodge to regain stealth, then hit for another 15k and some double taps. WHO thought this was an amazing idea? The access to stealth that deadeye has makes it almost impossible for it to die if they have any clue what they're doing.

There are quite a few classes in the game that have access to amazing burst, but these have a longer cooldown and take setup for it to work. Power Mantra Mesmers can one shot things from stealth, but they must set their burst up again while in combat to do it again if it doesn't work which really doesn't work most of the time. Rangers have amazing burst with worldly impact and what not, but again, this has a ICD and they end up in mele range. Core Guardian also has great burst... nothing that can really hit for 15k unbuffed, but still good. However, once a core guard blows all their CDs, they are easy targets if they don't kite. So why can deadeye simply dodge to regain a 15k hit? Why is it they can double tap after for 3.5k in less than 5 seconds from considerable range? Why is it they have so much stealth? Other classes take precision and timing to burst something down. They need to watch for other class mechanics such as heals and blocks, but all a deadeye really has to do is dodge again.

Please tell me... what have they done to deserve the 20k+ dmg burst in less than five seconds besides buy PoF? Why do they deserve that dmg? They literally do nothing but dodge or gain stealth through one click of a utility trait.

Time to fire whoever made deadeye a thing and didn't test it in SPvP. Why wouldn't you have given them a sword for offhand instead? What a joke.

play DE, post some video in high level spvp of you doing all this amazing stuff as DE

if you are ele/necro class and solo against a competent thief/DE......you are gonna die

this is intended.

who can kill DE? engi, ranger, most wars, (at the least DE wont kill these), and a good mirage or a good rev (im not good but i can do it)

necros cant, unless DE is braindead. but let us not forget the scourge and the 2+ seasons of top tier team melting abilities.

suck it up, don't roam in spvp on ele or necro. yuou meant for team fights. STAY IN YOUR LANE

[Egorum.9506]

~Balanced as shit~

[bq pd.2148]

@Egorum.9506 said:~Balanced as kitten~do you want to post this video now everytime you see a thread about a deadeye, for people to explain you again and again that you failed in getting yourself into such a situation to begin with?

[Bazsi.2734]

@"Leafstorm.1349" said:Firstly, I'll just say this isn't really a rage post.

If "REEEE remove DE from the game REEEEE" isn't a rage post, I wanna know how your rage posts would look like.

The real question is why? Why add something like an ICD (45s maybe?) or remove the skill? The main problem persist due to either you or your teammates being opened up on for 13-15k initial shot, then 3.5k double taps instantly after from _stealth. This either instantly downs a teammate or makes them/you blow every cooldown to keep alive which drastically puts the fight in the other team's favor. It actually wouldn't be as bad, but all the deadeye has to do is simply dodge to regain stealth, then hit for another 15k and some double taps. WHO thought this was an amazing idea? The access to stealth that deadeye has makes it almost impossible for it to die if they have any clue what they're doing.There are quite a few classes in the game that have access to amazing burst, but these have a longer cooldown and take setup for it to work. Power Mantra Mesmers can one shot things from stealth, but they must set their burst up again while in combat to do it again if it doesn't work which really doesn't work most of the time. Rangers have amazing burst with worldly impact and what not, but again, this has a ICD and they end up in mele range. Core Guardian also has great burst... nothing that can really hit for 15k unbuffed, but still good. However, once a core guard blows all their CDs, they are easy targets if they don't kite. So why can deadeye simply dodge to regain a 15k hit? Why is it they can double tap after for 3.5k in less than 5 seconds from considerable range? Why is it they have so much stealth? Other classes take precision and timing to burst something down. They need to watch for other class mechanics such as heals and blocks, but all a deadeye really has to do is dodge again.

LoL. You know, acknowledgeing that the meta is teeming with oneshot builds kind of defeats your argument. It's okay for a mesmer to oneshot you from stealth, but for DE it's not? Making the distinction based on the amount of cooldowns needed for setting up an opener burst is also almost irrelevant, the target of your spike doesn't care if you used 6 or 7 skills in total to instagib them. They did not see you coming and they are dead.

Also DE needs to "watch for other class mechanics such as heals and blocks". Having 1 skill thats unblockable doesn't magicly grants immunity from reflects, invulnerabilites etc.

Please tell me... what have they done to deserve the 20k+ dmg burst in less than five seconds besides buy PoF? Why do they deserve that dmg? They literally do nothing but dodge or gain stealth through one click of a utility trait.

What should you do to deserve 20k+ damage bursts? Defeat all raidbosses? Buy PvP damage boost in the gemstore? What are you implying with this question? Literally every class can do 20K bursts if left alone for 5 seconds. You just need an offensive amulet and the build for frontloaded damage.

Time to fire whoever made deadeye a thing and didn't test it in SPvP. Why wouldn't you have given them a sword for offhand instead? What a joke.

Oh sorry, now I really see how this is not a rage post. The insightful criticism (delete Deadeye!) with detailed instructions for the dev team (who to fire) makes it an outstanding contribution for the forums. Have a great day sir, thank you for the feedback!

[iKeostuKen.2738]

+1 on the rework of anything that deals above 2-3k damage, especially from stealth.

Luckily I run Ele and just roam on earth with a no crit trait. Loving it since it makes everything feel balanced, no cheap one shots out of no where either.

[Egorum.9506]

@MUDse.7623 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:~Balanced as kitten~do you want to post this video now everytime you see a thread about a deadeye, for people to explain you again and again that you failed in getting yourself into such a situation to begin with?

<1s kill from stealth and range on 2.5k armor and 21k hp is not even remotely balanced =D

[FyzE.3472]

@MUDse.7623 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:~Balanced as kitten~do you want to post this video now everytime you see a thread about a deadeye, for people to explain you again and again that you failed in getting yourself into such a situation to begin with?

He's posting this video in mesmer threads too btw.

[bq pd.2148]

@Egorum.9506 said:

@MUDse.7623 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:~Balanced as kitten~do you want to post this video now everytime you see a thread about a deadeye, for people to explain you again and again that you failed in getting yourself into such a situation to begin with?

<1s kill from stealth and range on 2.5k armor and 21k hp is not even remotely balanced =D

i see you made a terrible tactical decision and got rewarded with a decap, how is that balanced?in conquest the main underlying decision you have to make is at wich node you are, with how many people and wich builds - this is what the mode is about and what wins the mode. if you fail at this base tactical level how many options should you be granted to even this fail out? can the deadeye then aswell have more options to kill you in 1 vs 2 when you are actually with your babysitter as you should? like more boonrips and unblockables? because going for you while your babysitter is with you is basically the same tactical fail you just did up there.

[sephiroth.4217]

@MUDse.7623 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:

@MUDse.7623 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:~Balanced as kitten~do you want to post this video now everytime you see a thread about a deadeye, for people to explain you again and again that you failed in getting yourself into such a situation to begin with?

<1s kill from stealth and range on 2.5k armor and 21k hp is not even remotely balanced =D

i see you made a terrible tactical decision and got rewarded with a decap, how is that balanced?in conquest the main underlying decision you have to make is at wich node you are, with how many people and wich builds - this is what the mode is about and what wins the mode. if you fail at this base tactical level how many options should you be granted to even this fail out? can the deadeye then aswell have more options to kill you in 1 vs 2 when you are actually with your babysitter as you should? like more boonrips and unblockables? because going for you while your babysitter is with you is basically the same tactical fail you just did up there.

I honestly wouldnt bother.. Silver ranked players could see his mistakes and lack of counter play so just take it as a bronzie complaint

[Fat Disgrace.4275]

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@MUDse.7623 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:

@MUDse.7623 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:~Balanced as kitten~do you want to post this video now everytime you see a thread about a deadeye, for people to explain you again and again that you failed in getting yourself into such a situation to begin with?

<1s kill from stealth and range on 2.5k armor and 21k hp is not even remotely balanced =D

i see you made a terrible tactical decision and got rewarded with a decap, how is that balanced?in conquest the main underlying decision you have to make is at wich node you are, with how many people and wich builds - this is what the mode is about and what wins the mode. if you fail at this base tactical level how many options should you be granted to even this fail out? can the deadeye then aswell have more options to kill you in 1 vs 2 when you are actually with your babysitter as you should? like more boonrips and unblockables? because going for you while your babysitter is with you is basically the same tactical fail you just did up there.

I honestly wouldnt bother.. Silver ranked players could see his mistakes and lack of counter play so just take it as a bronzie complaint

What if he is high plat :open_mouth:

[dDuff.3860]

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@Leafstorm.1349 said:

who can kill DE? engi, ranger, most wars, (at the least DE wont kill these), and a good mirage or a good rev (im not good but i can do it)

This is BS. Only mirage is an issue for deadeye.

[sephiroth.4217]

@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

@sephiroth.4217 said:

@MUDse.7623 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:

@MUDse.7623 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:~Balanced as kitten~do you want to post this video now everytime you see a thread about a deadeye, for people to explain you again and again that you failed in getting yourself into such a situation to begin with?

<1s kill from stealth and range on 2.5k armor and 21k hp is not even remotely balanced =D

i see you made a terrible tactical decision and got rewarded with a decap, how is that balanced?in conquest the main underlying decision you have to make is at wich node you are, with how many people and wich builds - this is what the mode is about and what wins the mode. if you fail at this base tactical level how many options should you be granted to even this fail out? can the deadeye then aswell have more options to kill you in 1 vs 2 when you are actually with your babysitter as you should? like more boonrips and unblockables? because going for you while your babysitter is with you is basically the same tactical fail you just did up there.

I honestly wouldnt bother.. Silver ranked players could see his mistakes and lack of counter play so just take it as a bronzie complaint

What if he is high plat :open_mouth:

then it becomes funny.... and almost sad lmao

anyway, you can clearly see hes looking in a corner casting a flesh wurm and got caught at a bad time... shit happens

[Noha.3749]

"its not fair when a player can down me in a couple of seconds with his incredible single target dmg. Im only capable of downing 5 players fighting on the node if i myself get a good jump-start"

DE Simply trade any AOE potential for great single target dmg.They are played as assassins and thrive as it. Necro on the otherhand are gods in "teamfights".

If you ever played League of legends, just compare it to laning when the enemy got a jungler like "Shaco or Nocturne" and similar champs.They are good for racking up kills and looking fancy and all, but they are kinda bad in larger fights . You generally dont run solo or push out too much alone vs them.All you have to do is play safe and do what YOU do best. Slaughter everyone with your badass AOE dmg and cc, and have mates followup on that glassy ganker when he tries something.

DE Thief = 0 AoE and teamfight, but incredible single target burst.Necro = Incredible AoE and teamfight, but easily kited and ganked if alone.

[Isle of Stars.3049]

@Egorum.9506 said:

@MUDse.7623 said:

@Egorum.9506 said:~Balanced as kitten~do you want to post this video now everytime you see a thread about a deadeye, for people to explain you again and again that you failed in getting yourself into such a situation to begin with?

<1s kill from stealth and range on 2.5k armor and 21k hp is not even remotely balanced =D

• Rolled a class made for teamfights
• Went to a node alone
• Gets killed by a class specializing at taking out lone targets
• https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/
• DE is OP needs nerf!