Request Developers to change Banners to Facets.

[Warlord.9074]

Please, for the love of jeebus change warrior banners to act like facets, so we can pulse their effect without having to drop them on the ground.

This is how to do itTo make it easy, you take a default facet right? Blank slate change its value to match that of the banner it is replacing. Then the active effect would be dropping the banner on the ground. Except it wouldn't drop the banner on the ground it would just pulse that effect. Then change the Banner trait to Inspiring Facets. Or something so the active effects pulse regen or what not. you could do that by just using one of the heralds traits that effect facets change the value and the name.

If you want to keep the idea on banners, you can still call the facet a banner if you must. Use Same icons as the banners so you do not need to create new Art. All you are doing is make the banners work like facets even tho they would still be called banners.

[Warlord.9074]

My proposal wouldn't require extreme code re-writing or creating new art. You are simply taking existing code/ borrowing it and re-using art and changing its values. I am not a developer so I don't know how hard it is, but it is like copy pasta in my opinion.

[Warlord.9074]

Let's be honest. The banner Idea and code is like 6 years old. It was always clunky and was a interesting idea but it is behind the times, it was behind the times the day it came out.

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

I've seen several warriors ask that banners be changed to something similar, you use your banner skill and the banner just summons on your back and sticks with you as you move around.

[Issette.3248]

I like the facet solution. Instead of energy costs fix durations and cooldowns.An active skill that is worth to be used.And the trait keeps the passive buff for a fix duration after using the active skill.

Something like that... Easy active game play for banners.

[Blocki.4931]

Maybe they would see use in WvW in coordinated groups if that were to be implemented. Open world buff as well, though I'd rather run a dozen different skills before ever slotting a banner

[cryorion.9532]

This would be certainly very nice QoL for bannerslave :) or just give banners 2nd ability on utility slot after summon (like ranger's spirits) to change their location where you stand at the moment. Also, making banner casting animation faster would be nice, too.

[Rodrick.1942]

@cryorion.9532 said:This would be certainly very nice QoL for bannerslave :) or just give banners 2nd ability on utility slot after summon (like ranger's spirits) to change their location where you stand at the moment. Also, making banner casting animation faster would be nice, too.

You made the point. Once they make this change, ranger will also ask for it.

[Orion Templar.4589]

The facets idea sounds like a good one. I'd be in support of that.

[starlinvf.1358]

Why not have the banners follow the warrior around? Call them Banner Slaves, and add them to the trait lines. :P

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

@starlinvf.1358 said:Why not have the banners follow the warrior around? Call them Banner Slaves, and add them to the trait lines. :P

Like the squire guy in the fractals? Not sure I want a minion that can be killed and then I'd lose banner.

[starlinvf.1358]

@Red Haired Savage.5430 said:

@starlinvf.1358 said:Why not have the banners follow the warrior around? Call them Banner Slaves, and add them to the trait lines. :P

Like the squire guy in the fractals? Not sure I want a minion that can be killed and then I'd lose banner.

who said it could be killed?

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

@starlinvf.1358 said:

@Red Haired Savage.5430 said:

@starlinvf.1358 said:Why not have the banners follow the warrior around? Call them Banner Slaves, and add them to the trait lines. :P

Like the squire guy in the fractals? Not sure I want a minion that can be killed and then I'd lose banner.

who said it could be killed?

Because I cannot think of any autonomous minion in game that cannot be killed.

• Engi turrets -killable
• Necro minions - killable
• Ranger spirits - killable
• Rev spirits - killable
• Mesmer clones - killable
• Ele elementals - killable
• Thief thieves - killable
• Guardian spirit weapons -more of an attack now, but I believe used to be killable before their revamp.

[starlinvf.1358]

You forgot Gyros - killable

[cryorion.9532]

Wtf, please no... hovering banners following warrior like minions would be nightmare.What about changing banner location just like Ventari's Will on Project Tranquility skill?

[Obtena.7952]

What's the problem you are trying to solve? Pretty sure making banners to facets isn't necessary to fix whatever it is.

If you want banners to pulse while you pick them up, then it would be reasonable to remove the skills you get from equipping a banner. I still don't see what this accomplishes.

[Issette.3248]

The problem what we want to solve is that banners has zero active game play.

[Obtena.7952]

That's interesting because even though your Oracle is telling you banners have zero active game play, my Oracle (here I will give you the source in a second) is telling me banners are meta so maybe you should rethink your simple response. I'm pretty doubtful that if something is so good that it's being used for meta (or is even making the build itself meta worthy), that 'zero active gameplay' is going to be a compelling argument to change banners.

Or right, that source: here you go: https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/warrior/warrior/banner/

Again, what is the problem being addressed here? Clearly, banners are getting more than 'zero' active gameplay and have lots of value when they are used ...

@cryorion.9532 said:kitten, please no... hovering banners following warrior like minions would be nightmare.What about changing banner location just like Ventari's Will on Project Tranquility skill?

We can already move banners by picking them up and putting them down again. I think the only improvement banners need (without ruining their original intent) is to have Inspire break stuns and Sprint grant Stability. This would ensure you could get where you needed to be and replant that banner.

[Issette.3248]

Ouch... my oracle tells me that it is pointless to discribe you what you missunderstood.

[cryorion.9532]

Wow, placing banners and seldom picking them for some laughable mobility is considered active gameplay today... interesting.

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

I get what you're all saying, most of the warrior's here want banners to be able to follow the warrior (not 100% how you'd do it without a banner minion carrying the banner, or having the banner attach to yourself, I'd be more in favor of the latter option). I think having it change to act like Rev facet idea isn't a good one because Rev's have to dedicate energy to maintain the facet, what would we do to maintain it? As far as Obtena's mention that banners do have a spot, yes they do in raids, however in raids you're not moving all over nearly as much as fractals, open world, WvW, sPvP.

As for me what I'd like to see is that you can plant the banner and then you can pick it up and it stays with you and you can weapon swap it like it's another weapon, and it would still pulse it's effects even while you're on other weapons (still has it's normal banner durations/cooldowns), yes some professions would then have 3 weapons they'd be swapping between, however make it so you can only pick up 1 banner at a time. Warrior's would have the unique effect that when they picked up the banner their banner summon skill would become a drop it whenever they want like the ~ key is now.

Before they do any of this however they need to fix inspiring battle standard to work with battle standard. I've also got another thought on the trait that would be nice if they were to do, depending on what banner you've dropped you'd pulse a unique boon to each banner (defense pulses protection, discipline pulses fury, strength pulses might, tactics pulses regen, and the battle standard pulses all 4). That change I honestly think would give banners more play time.

[Lucius.2140]

Probably an option to carry banners in the back and put them on your hand later, with a special action buttons when you have them on your back or are holding them (to hand and to back buttons).

Other case, if you want the effects they have when using them actively but without using them, or them to be more useful passively: then a buff, but they could not be on a facet level since they don't have an upkeep and that will be lassy gameplay (like torrets).

If you want to cast their effects and have them on back, having your normal weapon bar with you: new elite spec and the skill replacing the adrenaline bar. You get 5 "F" skills and can change them depending on the banner selected (either can switch between two banners or make even more of them).

Could create a core elite spec with it, having actual war banner as a hibrid for the adrenaline effects.

[phs.6089]

Good idea, I keep stealing banners makes me feel a bad person

[Obtena.7952]

@Rettan.9603 said:Ouch... my oracle tells me that it is pointless to discribe you what you missunderstood.

Maybe your oracle should advise you to explain yourself better then; banners get used to good effect; if that's 'zero active gameplay', you better explain why if you don't want to be misunderstood.

The fact is that the idea isn't well thought out. As @Red Haired Savage.5430 already pointed out ... how does warrior maintain a facet? I get the fact that carrying around a team buff as a PBAOE effect like a facet is awesome, but that's not what banners are, nor how they should be reworked because people want more usefulness from them outside of raids. They have a theme/concept and it's that particular theme/concept for a reason. We could never possibly guess what that reason is, but I can say with confidence that Anet takes the themes of the things they design and implement in the game very seriously; if you don't believe that, click my sig for an example.

That just one problem; even if Anet did figure out how to allow a warrior to maintain a 'facet banner', it doesn't even make sense to me they would rework them. Seems to me that it's more appropriate to consider facets as a skill for a new espec.

I'm against completely reworking banners into something else; mostly because they do what they do well. I'm not against enabling better use of them, like the ideas I suggested. The concept is pretty clear; they ARE made to be planted and give benefit to a range and they CAN be picked up and moved. They are not meant to be granting their passive AOE benefits while carried around, clearly from how they are designed, so it makes little sense to me that someone would suggest completely the opposite of the original design intention.

[derd.6413]

@"Obtena.7952" said:That's interesting because even though your Oracle is telling you banners have zero active game play, my Oracle (here I will give you the source in a second) is telling me banners are meta so maybe you should rethink your simple response. I'm pretty doubtful that if something is so good that it's being used for meta (or is even making the build itself meta worthy), that 'zero active gameplay' is going to be a compelling argument to change banners.

Or right, that source: here you go: https://snowcrows.com/raids/builds/warrior/warrior/banner/

Again, what is the problem being addressed here? Clearly, banners are getting more than 'zero' active gameplay and have lots of value when they are used ...

@cryorion.9532 said:kitten, please no... hovering banners following warrior like minions would be nightmare.What about changing banner location just like Ventari's Will on Project Tranquility skill?

We can already move banners by picking them up and putting them down again. I think the only improvement banners need (without ruining their original intent) is to have Inspire break stuns and Sprint grant Stability. This would ensure you could get where you needed to be and replant that banner.

active gameplay doesn't refer to whether they're being used or not but rather to how they're being used. what OP seems to have an issue with is that banners are usually used by just dropping the banner leaving it there for the duration of an encounter and only picking it up to carry it to the next encounter.