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Superior Sigil of Nullification [Merged]


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@yann.1946 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:S> @Hanth.2978 said:

How is this still a problem? especially after having the Halloween festival and the lab farm for the past 3 weeks? Farming the lab has provided hundreds of gold for even the casual player who frequent's the farm once in awhile. Top that off with logging in getting 2g a day, free by the way and people still won't buy the sigil because of the price. Yeah it sucks we missed the 2s train but that's life, but this festival provided simple easy income to buy enough sigils two or three times over. A lot of people say it's not the price it's the fact that there are so few. Blah Blah Blah, I hope anet introduces a way to craft it that cost 10g mats, then we will see people's true colors. It's not the availability, it's the fact people are salty about the price.

you keep on missing the point:

it's not the price itself but the fact the the gold would go to tp flippers. let it be craftable with icy runestone. 10 gold each. i just crafted my koda warmth i'd be ok with that

Isn't the initial supply that was bought up already back in the economy?The change that flippers would be the ones you're buying from is pretty low.

I think there is some evidence to support the theory that some actors are still attempting to keep the price inflated, though it is surprising to discover it. Regardless, I would agree, not buying the sigils off the tp bc you don't want your gold to go to 'bad ppl' doesn't make much sense this far in. You'd pretty much have to stop using the tp entirely . . .

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@Gop.8713 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:S> @Hanth.2978 said:

How is this still a problem? especially after having the Halloween festival and the lab farm for the past 3 weeks? Farming the lab has provided hundreds of gold for even the casual player who frequent's the farm once in awhile. Top that off with logging in getting 2g a day, free by the way and people still won't buy the sigil because of the price. Yeah it sucks we missed the 2s train but that's life, but this festival provided simple easy income to buy enough sigils two or three times over. A lot of people say it's not the price it's the fact that there are so few. Blah Blah Blah, I hope anet introduces a way to craft it that cost 10g mats, then we will see people's true colors. It's not the availability, it's the fact people are salty about the price.

you keep on missing the point:

it's not the price itself but the fact the the gold would go to tp flippers. let it be craftable with icy runestone. 10 gold each. i just crafted my koda warmth i'd be ok with that

Isn't the initial supply that was bought up already back in the economy?The change that flippers would be the ones you're buying from is pretty low.

I think there is some evidence to support the theory that some actors are still attempting to keep the price inflated, though it is surprising to discover it. Regardless, I would agree, not buying the sigils off the tp bc you don't want your gold to go to 'bad ppl' doesn't make much sense this far in. You'd pretty much have to stop using the tp entirely . . .

Really? Do you remember where this data was mentioned?

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@yann.1946 said:

@Gop.8713 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:S> @Hanth.2978 said:

How is this still a problem? especially after having the Halloween festival and the lab farm for the past 3 weeks? Farming the lab has provided hundreds of gold for even the casual player who frequent's the farm once in awhile. Top that off with logging in getting 2g a day, free by the way and people still won't buy the sigil because of the price. Yeah it sucks we missed the 2s train but that's life, but this festival provided simple easy income to buy enough sigils two or three times over. A lot of people say it's not the price it's the fact that there are so few. Blah Blah Blah, I hope anet introduces a way to craft it that cost 10g mats, then we will see people's true colors. It's not the availability, it's the fact people are salty about the price.

you keep on missing the point:

it's not the price itself but the fact the the gold would go to tp flippers. let it be craftable with icy runestone. 10 gold each. i just crafted my koda warmth i'd be ok with that

Isn't the initial supply that was bought up already back in the economy?The change that flippers would be the ones you're buying from is pretty low.

I think there is some evidence to support the theory that some actors are still attempting to keep the price inflated, though it is surprising to discover it. Regardless, I would agree, not buying the sigils off the tp bc you don't want your gold to go to 'bad ppl' doesn't make much sense this far in. You'd pretty much have to stop using the tp entirely . . .

Really? Do you remember where this data was mentioned?Sry which . . ?
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@Gop.8713 said:

@Gop.8713 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:S> @Hanth.2978 said:

How is this still a problem? especially after having the Halloween festival and the lab farm for the past 3 weeks? Farming the lab has provided hundreds of gold for even the casual player who frequent's the farm once in awhile. Top that off with logging in getting 2g a day, free by the way and people still won't buy the sigil because of the price. Yeah it sucks we missed the 2s train but that's life, but this festival provided simple easy income to buy enough sigils two or three times over. A lot of people say it's not the price it's the fact that there are so few. Blah Blah Blah, I hope anet introduces a way to craft it that cost 10g mats, then we will see people's true colors. It's not the availability, it's the fact people are salty about the price.

you keep on missing the point:

it's not the price itself but the fact the the gold would go to tp flippers. let it be craftable with icy runestone. 10 gold each. i just crafted my koda warmth i'd be ok with that

Isn't the initial supply that was bought up already back in the economy?The change that flippers would be the ones you're buying from is pretty low.

I think there is some evidence to support the theory that some actors are still attempting to keep the price inflated, though it is surprising to discover it. Regardless, I would agree, not buying the sigils off the tp bc you don't want your gold to go to 'bad ppl' doesn't make much sense this far in. You'd pretty much have to stop using the tp entirely . . .

Really? Do you remember where this data was mentioned?Sry which . . ?

The evidence to support some actors are still attempting to keep the price inflated.

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@yann.1946 said:

@Gop.8713 said:

@Gop.8713 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:S> @Hanth.2978 said:

How is this still a problem? especially after having the Halloween festival and the lab farm for the past 3 weeks? Farming the lab has provided hundreds of gold for even the casual player who frequent's the farm once in awhile. Top that off with logging in getting 2g a day, free by the way and people still won't buy the sigil because of the price. Yeah it sucks we missed the 2s train but that's life, but this festival provided simple easy income to buy enough sigils two or three times over. A lot of people say it's not the price it's the fact that there are so few. Blah Blah Blah, I hope anet introduces a way to craft it that cost 10g mats, then we will see people's true colors. It's not the availability, it's the fact people are salty about the price.

you keep on missing the point:

it's not the price itself but the fact the the gold would go to tp flippers. let it be craftable with icy runestone. 10 gold each. i just crafted my koda warmth i'd be ok with that

Isn't the initial supply that was bought up already back in the economy?The change that flippers would be the ones you're buying from is pretty low.

I think there is some evidence to support the theory that some actors are still attempting to keep the price inflated, though it is surprising to discover it. Regardless, I would agree, not buying the sigils off the tp bc you don't want your gold to go to 'bad ppl' doesn't make much sense this far in. You'd pretty much have to stop using the tp entirely . . .

Really? Do you remember where this data was mentioned?Sry which . . ?

The evidence to support some actors are still attempting to keep the price inflated.

Sry I just didn't understand what you were looking for . . .

The price of the sigil has risen the past couple of weeks, from near 9g back up towards 11g. This increase could be the natural result of supply being insufficient to satisfy a poorly considered collection, but some are adamant that since anet had the data to consider the supply before they created the collection, they must not have created a collection where the supply would be insufficient. For these ppl, there must be some other reason that price is rising rather than falling as their theory would predict, and price manipulation would be one explanation of this . . .

Additionally, we have seen on more than one occasion over the past week bulk sell orders dropped on the market, but instead of these orders creating a price ceiling that individual drops are listed below, the bulk orders have found buyers as the price continues to rise. Again this could be easily explained by insufficient supply, but it could also be explained by speculators inflating the price . . .

Finally, the highest buy order is frequently less than 85% of the lowest sell order, with high turnover. So the sigil is ripe for profit taking. With price increasing and so few sigils on the market, if one were so inclined you could collect buy orders for a few days then scoop up just a few of the lowest sell orders and increase the lowest listing by another g, increasing your profit as you drop your buy orders on the market . . .

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@Timo.1065 said:From time to time I look on this topic to find ANet response. No response since the beginning. This is outrageous.

If they were going to comment on or correct this I think it would have happened by now. They're prolly just hoping it will go away at this point, if they are concerned about it at all . . .

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@"yann.1946" said:> We'll then a lot of people are lying when they say their is no reliable source. As long as enough people are playing a consistent amount of sigils get generated.

Problem is that the "consistent amount of sigil generated" is insufficient to satisfy the demand.

There is no way to reliably increase the amount of sigil generated in a reasonnable period of time.

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@Blanche Neige.7241 said:

@"yann.1946" said:> We'll then a lot of people are lying when they say their is no reliable source. As long as enough people are playing a consistent amount of sigils get generated.

Problem is that the "consistent amount of sigil generated" is insufficient to satisfy the demand.

There is no way to reliably increase the amount of sigil generated in a reasonnable period of time.

What is a sufficient amount of sigils then?

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Since the episode was added I have been double checking every exotic weapon I get, throwing every rare weapon I get into the mystic forge to try and get more exotics, and throwing every sigil into the mystic forge to upgrade them until I get exotics.

I have gotten two of the sigils of nullification. That's maybe an average of one a month. If I were to rely solely on RNG to get my sigils it would take me roughly two years.

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@Gop.8713 said:

@Gop.8713 said:

@Gop.8713 said:

@Tyson.5160 said:S> @Hanth.2978 said:

How is this still a problem? especially after having the Halloween festival and the lab farm for the past 3 weeks? Farming the lab has provided hundreds of gold for even the casual player who frequent's the farm once in awhile. Top that off with logging in getting 2g a day, free by the way and people still won't buy the sigil because of the price. Yeah it sucks we missed the 2s train but that's life, but this festival provided simple easy income to buy enough sigils two or three times over. A lot of people say it's not the price it's the fact that there are so few. Blah Blah Blah, I hope anet introduces a way to craft it that cost 10g mats, then we will see people's true colors. It's not the availability, it's the fact people are salty about the price.

you keep on missing the point:

it's not the price itself but the fact the the gold would go to tp flippers. let it be craftable with icy runestone. 10 gold each. i just crafted my koda warmth i'd be ok with that

Isn't the initial supply that was bought up already back in the economy?The change that flippers would be the ones you're buying from is pretty low.

I think there is some evidence to support the theory that some actors are still attempting to keep the price inflated, though it is surprising to discover it. Regardless, I would agree, not buying the sigils off the tp bc you don't want your gold to go to 'bad ppl' doesn't make much sense this far in. You'd pretty much have to stop using the tp entirely . . .

Really? Do you remember where this data was mentioned?Sry which . . ?

The evidence to support some actors are still attempting to keep the price inflated.

Sry I just didn't understand what you were looking for . . .

The price of the sigil has risen the past couple of weeks, from near 9g back up towards 11g. This increase could be the natural result of supply being insufficient to satisfy a poorly considered collection, but some are adamant that since anet had the data to consider the supply before they created the collection, they must not have created a collection where the supply would be insufficient. For these ppl, there must be some other reason that price is rising rather than falling as their theory would predict, and price manipulation would be one explanation of this . . .

We'll this would also be achieved by people considering this the fair price.

Additionally, we have seen on more than one occasion over the past week bulk sell orders dropped on the market, but instead of these orders creating a price ceiling that individual drops are listed below, the bulk orders have found buyers as the price continues to rise. Again this could be easily explained by insufficient supply, but it could also be explained by speculators inflating the price . . .

On this one I agree it seems fishy

Finally, the highest buy order is frequently less than 85% of the lowest sell order, with high turnover. So the sigil is ripe for profit taking. With price increasing and so few sigils on the market, if one were so inclined you could collect buy orders for a few days then scoop up just a few of the lowest sell orders and increase the lowest listing by another g, increasing your profit as you drop your buy orders on the market . . .

Possibility does not imply that it happens tho.

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@Mewcifer.5198 said:Since the episode was added I have been double checking every exotic weapon I get, throwing every rare weapon I get into the mystic forge to try and get more exotics, and throwing every sigil into the mystic forge to upgrade them until I get exotics.

I have gotten two of the sigils of nullification. That's maybe an average of one a month. If I were to rely solely on RNG to get my sigils it would take me roughly two years.

This game is not even remotely designed to farm your own materials. That's what the TP is for. It's fundamental to GW2's design philosophy.

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@Tyson.5160 said:

@Psientist.6437 said:To the studio

I want to have done enough to sufficiently demonstrate my unwillingness to tear down the studio and therefore faith in, to make asking the following apropos.

May the exchange Ai calculate future value? In the context of economic determination that is an important question.

If we except the demanded patience of putting our important current sea's calculated pegger on the trade floor and the one magnitude change needed in the priced label of goods carried within the important place market, would we get fewer extreme events? Would extreme event qualities remain except that of the extremist? In the context of economic determination that is an important question.

Sorry, I’m trying to figure out what your trying to say here.

With this I am trying to maintain a perspective at 30,000 feet where it is apparently easy to get light headed.This thread is about a specific collection and a specific material. It is also, obviously, about how to moderate economic determinism. What is the most common defense of this collection and this material? The economy determines the outcome so eat the values the economy calculates and since players do the calculating we can't hold the studio complicit in the values the economy calculates. The Ai exchange is an important economic actor who calculates the value of a uniquely important product in a manner not completely similar to how players would calculate that value. Players would calculate future value into the current value of that unique product. That would have a significant effect on the entire economy.

Again, I am not trying to tear down economic determinism or the studio, just show how economic determinism doesn't exist in moral perfection or even computational certainty. Economic determinism exists as a plastic narrative where the studio has tremendous potential to tell a story.

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@Astralporing.1957 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:@Obtena.7952 said:You are simply fooling yourself if you think that Anet didn't look at the 'obtainment' of these items for this collection. If anything, they PURPOSEFULLY choose that sigil for a reason.Again, what reason? I have looked over your posts so far, and it's clear to me that you also can't think of one. You simply assume there is one, and your assumption is based on your belief they couldn't have been mistaken - which, as Dante pointed out to you, simply isn't true. They could be mistaken, they have been mistaken in the past, and they will certainly be mistaken on many things in the future. Even as obvious in retrospection as this one.

I will make a stab at guessing the reason, and am pretty sure someone else has already said the same, but have not kept up on all the discussion. It gave “value” to all the tomes and scrolls that have been building up in our banks over the last few years. People have been asking on the forums for those to be worth something and here we now have an instance where the easiest and most reliable way to acquire something, apart from the TP is disposable character leveling.

I think this was an intentional move, but that does not keep it from also being a mistake, meaning that they may not have considered all the ramifications of intentionally choosing this item. I still think it set up a scenario that allowed a very small select few a high degree of control over the supply that lended itself to unethical profiteering.

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@Moira Shalaar.5620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:@Obtena.7952 said:You are simply fooling yourself if you think that Anet didn't look at the 'obtainment' of these items for this collection. If anything, they PURPOSEFULLY choose that sigil for a reason.Again, what reason? I have looked over your posts so far, and it's clear to me that you also can't think of one. You simply assume there is one, and your assumption is based on your belief they couldn't have been mistaken - which, as Dante pointed out to you, simply isn't true. They could be mistaken, they have been mistaken in the past, and they will certainly be mistaken on many things in the future. Even as obvious in retrospection as this one.

I will make a stab at guessing the reason, and am pretty sure someone else has already said the same, but have not kept up on all the discussion. It gave “value” to all the tomes and scrolls that have been building up in our banks over the last few years. People have been asking on the forums for those to be worth something and here we now have an instance where the easiest and most reliable way to acquire something, apart from the TP is disposable character leveling.

I think this was an intentional move, but that does not keep it from also being a mistake, meaning that they may not have considered all the ramifications of intentionally choosing this item. I still think it set up a scenario that allowed a very small select few a high degree of control over the supply that lended itself to unethical profiteering.

Sigils from leveling would generate short term supply. The fact that the price has reached a persistent equilibrium suggests that the persistent MF supply is the more crucial supply. The MF supply of sigils would also be the supply the studio would have been able to best measure when designing the recipe.

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@Psientist.6437 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:@Obtena.7952 said:You are simply fooling yourself if you think that Anet didn't look at the 'obtainment' of these items for this collection. If anything, they PURPOSEFULLY choose that sigil for a reason.Again, what reason? I have looked over your posts so far, and it's clear to me that you also can't think of one. You simply assume there is one, and your assumption is based on your belief they couldn't have been mistaken - which, as Dante pointed out to you, simply isn't true. They could be mistaken, they have been mistaken in the past, and they will certainly be mistaken on many things in the future. Even as obvious in retrospection as this one.

I will make a stab at guessing the reason, and am pretty sure someone else has already said the same, but have not kept up on all the discussion. It gave “value” to all the tomes and scrolls that have been building up in our banks over the last few years. People have been asking on the forums for those to be worth something and here we now have an instance where the easiest and most reliable way to acquire something, apart from the TP is disposable character leveling.

I think this was an intentional move, but that does not keep it from also being a mistake, meaning that they may not have considered all the ramifications of intentionally choosing this item. I still think it set up a scenario that allowed a very small select few a high degree of control over the supply that lended itself to unethical profiteering.

Sigils from leveling would generate short term supply. The fact that the price has reached a persistent equilibrium suggests that the persistent MF supply is the more crucial supply. The MF supply of sigils would also be the supply the studio would have been able to best measure when designing the recipe.

I wholly agree that it would produce short term supply. That does not change the fact that it gives potential “value” to leveling tomes and scrolls. I am not advocating nor defending this, just presenting it as a possible reason for choosing a Sigil that is given in the leveling process.

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@Moira Shalaar.5620 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:@Obtena.7952 said:You are simply fooling yourself if you think that Anet didn't look at the 'obtainment' of these items for this collection. If anything, they PURPOSEFULLY choose that sigil for a reason.Again, what reason? I have looked over your posts so far, and it's clear to me that you also can't think of one. You simply assume there is one, and your assumption is based on your belief they couldn't have been mistaken - which, as Dante pointed out to you, simply isn't true. They could be mistaken, they have been mistaken in the past, and they will certainly be mistaken on many things in the future. Even as obvious in retrospection as this one.

I will make a stab at guessing the reason, and am pretty sure someone else has already said the same, but have not kept up on all the discussion. It gave “value” to all the tomes and scrolls that have been building up in our banks over the last few years. People have been asking on the forums for those to be worth something and here we now have an instance where the easiest and most reliable way to acquire something, apart from the TP is disposable character leveling.

I think this was an intentional move, but that does not keep it from also being a mistake, meaning that they may not have considered all the ramifications of intentionally choosing this item. I still think it set up a scenario that allowed a very small select few a high degree of control over the supply that lended itself to unethical profiteering.

Sigils from leveling would generate short term supply. The fact that the price has reached a persistent equilibrium suggests that the persistent MF supply is the more crucial supply. The MF supply of sigils would also be the supply the studio would have been able to best measure when designing the recipe.

I wholly agree that it would produce short term supply. That does not change the fact that it gives potential “value” to leveling tomes and scrolls. I am not advocating nor defending this, just presenting it as a possible reason for choosing a Sigil that is given in the leveling process.

It goes to show how challenging it is to design a production rate for rewards and happiness.

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@Blocki.4931 said:

@Blocki.4931 said:To anybody in WvW who wants this armor: Your glow is always orange, so it is a bit meh in there.

excuuuuuuuuse me the glow on my boots is blue just as I painted it, even on desert borderland (the map where lightining screws alot with dying of the boots making them all gold in some angles instead of blueish-black with gold hints) :P

Well, there may be slight variations in hue if you have the right colors. I'm red, but I have a bright yellow in WvW and no shade of red changes anything about it.

Enameled crimson def shows red for me on heavy in alpine at night. Didn't check anything else bc I just now saw this. Can you be more specific as to what you tried . . ?

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@yann.1946 said:

@yann.1946 said:> We'll then a lot of people are lying when they say their is no reliable source. As long as enough people are playing a consistent amount of sigils get generated.

Problem is that the "consistent amount of sigil generated" is insufficient to satisfy the demand.

There is no way to reliably increase the amount of sigil generated in a reasonnable period of time.

What is a sufficient amount of sigils then?

The main problem is in distrubution of gold. This stupid move of Anet make few people very rich, and force the rest to pay to this magnats. If sigils would have beed abled to buy from vendors for the same amount of money, like 250 gold. There wouldn't be a problem.

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@Timo.1065 said:

@yann.1946 said:> We'll then a lot of people are lying when they say their is no reliable source. As long as enough people are playing a consistent amount of sigils get generated.

Problem is that the "consistent amount of sigil generated" is insufficient to satisfy the demand.

There is no way to reliably increase the amount of sigil generated in a reasonnable period of time.

What is a sufficient amount of sigils then?

The main problem is in distrubution of gold. This stupid move of Anet make few people very rich, and force the rest to pay to this magnats. If sigils would have beed abled to buy from vendors for the same amount of money, like 250 gold. There wouldn't be a problem.

Simple solution here: when the next episode is released, rush through quickly, skip all cutscenes, skip all dialogue, go as fast as you can to see if another dirt cheap RNG-based sigil is required for a collection in huge numbers and profit from it. Let's make PVE in this game truly competitive and may the fastest players also become the richest. Those that can't play on patch day/hour? Sad to be you, this competition is rigged anyway.

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