Climbing out of gold is impossible, Change my mind

[Derenaya.3479]

Okay so here I am, stuck in gold since like 200 games and I came to the conclusion that it is impossible to climb out of it if you don't get placed in platin in the first place or win 10 times in a row (which is pretty much impossible). People are just to braindead in gold, necros who go far instead of fighting with their fb, people who run into a 3-1 in mid instead of waiting for the team and so on I'm sure you saw these people as well. I rarely get close games, it's either you won the dice roll and the enemy team has the idiot or you lost it and you loose 500-200.

So my statement stands, try to change my mind.

[Arkantos.7460]

i play ranked with a jalis/glint bunker cc build and im in platin nowhttps://imgur.com/a/3AtvLq3

[otto.5684]

@Derenaya.3479 said:Okay so here I am, stuck in gold since like 200 games and I came to the conclusion that it is impossible to climb out of it if you don't get placed in platin in the first place or win 10 times in a row (which is pretty much impossible). People are just to braindead in gold, necros who go far instead of fighting with their fb, people who run into a 3-1 in mid instead of waiting for the team and so on I'm sure you saw these people as well. I rarely get close games, it's either you won the dice roll and the enemy team has the idiot or you lost it and you loose 500-200.

So my statement stands, try to change my mind.

In my experience, 8 out of 10 games are pre-determined wins/losses. No matter what you do, you will have little impact on the outcome of these games. There is usually 1-2 games out of 10 where you can carry, if you are skilled enough. Theoretically, to go P1 or above you should be able to maintain a win rate between 55-60%; in other words, you will have to be able to sway the outcome of some games.

I do not mean this in a wrong way, considering how many games you played, maybe you are in gold cuz that is as far as your skill can take you.

[Exedore.6320]

For you, maybe. You need to actually be a better player to move out of gold. The rating ranges for gold are slightly above average, and include a large amount of the population (bell curve centered on 1200 rating). Platinum is something like top 10%.

[Derenaya.3479]

@otto.5684 said:

@Derenaya.3479 said:Okay so here I am, stuck in gold since like 200 games and I came to the conclusion that it is impossible to climb out of it if you don't get placed in platin in the first place or win 10 times in a row (which is pretty much impossible). People are just to braindead in gold, necros who go far instead of fighting with their fb, people who run into a 3-1 in mid instead of waiting for the team and so on I'm sure you saw these people as well. I rarely get close games, it's either you won the dice roll and the enemy team has the idiot or you lost it and you loose 500-200.

So my statement stands, try to change my mind.

In my experience, 8 out of 10 games are pre-determined wins/losses. No matter what you do, you will have little impact on the outcome of these games. There is usually 1-2 games out of 10 where you can carry, if you are skilled enough. Theoretically, to go P1 or above you should be able to maintain a win rate between 55-60%; in other words, you will have to be able to sway the outcome of some games.

I do not mean this in a wrong way, considering how many games you played, maybe you are in gold cuz that is as far as your skill can take you.

Well it's kinda as you said except, and don't get me wrong, I know that you don't try to flame me (or is it bm in this game?) but I just feel like my skill doesn't matter. I can tryhard as much as I want (thief) but even if I get close to plat (I was one game away from it) I get a 5 game loosing streak...

[Derenaya.3479]

@Exedore.6320 said:For you, maybe. You need to actually be a better player to move out of gold. The rating ranges for gold are slightly above average, and include a large amount of the population (bell curve centered on 1200 rating). Platinum is something like top 10%.

Yeah I know that but I feel like it doesn' matter if I'm the better player. I can't carry the player in gold. Like how do you save a game with a fb + scourge on your team who loses a 2v2?

[otto.5684]

@Derenaya.3479 said:

@otto.5684 said:

@Derenaya.3479 said:Okay so here I am, stuck in gold since like 200 games and I came to the conclusion that it is impossible to climb out of it if you don't get placed in platin in the first place or win 10 times in a row (which is pretty much impossible). People are just to braindead in gold, necros who go far instead of fighting with their fb, people who run into a 3-1 in mid instead of waiting for the team and so on I'm sure you saw these people as well. I rarely get close games, it's either you won the dice roll and the enemy team has the idiot or you lost it and you loose 500-200.

So my statement stands, try to change my mind.

In my experience, 8 out of 10 games are pre-determined wins/losses. No matter what you do, you will have little impact on the outcome of these games. There is usually 1-2 games out of 10 where you can carry, if you are skilled enough. Theoretically, to go P1 or above you should be able to maintain a win rate between 55-60%; in other words, you will have to be able to sway the outcome of some games.

I do not mean this in a wrong way, considering how many games you played, maybe you are in gold cuz that is as far as your skill can take you.

Well it's kinda as you said except, and don't get me wrong, I know that you don't try to flame me (or is it bm in this game?) but I just feel like my skill doesn't matter. I can tryhard as much as I want (thief) but even if I get close to plat (I was one game away from it) I get a 5 game loosing streak...

I think it is harder to control games as thief, rev and/or mesmer, then lets say Holo or SB. You are more likely to be at the mercy of RNG :/

[Derenaya.3479]

@otto.5684 said:

@Derenaya.3479 said:

@otto.5684 said:

@Derenaya.3479 said:Okay so here I am, stuck in gold since like 200 games and I came to the conclusion that it is impossible to climb out of it if you don't get placed in platin in the first place or win 10 times in a row (which is pretty much impossible). People are just to braindead in gold, necros who go far instead of fighting with their fb, people who run into a 3-1 in mid instead of waiting for the team and so on I'm sure you saw these people as well. I rarely get close games, it's either you won the dice roll and the enemy team has the idiot or you lost it and you loose 500-200.

So my statement stands, try to change my mind.

In my experience, 8 out of 10 games are pre-determined wins/losses. No matter what you do, you will have little impact on the outcome of these games. There is usually 1-2 games out of 10 where you can carry, if you are skilled enough. Theoretically, to go P1 or above you should be able to maintain a win rate between 55-60%; in other words, you will have to be able to sway the outcome of some games.

I do not mean this in a wrong way, considering how many games you played, maybe you are in gold cuz that is as far as your skill can take you.

Well it's kinda as you said except, and don't get me wrong, I know that you don't try to flame me (or is it bm in this game?) but I just feel like my skill doesn't matter. I can tryhard as much as I want (thief) but even if I get close to plat (I was one game away from it) I get a 5 game loosing streak...

I think it is harder to control games as thief, rev and/or mesmer, then lets say Holo or SB. You are more likely to be at the mercy of RNG :/

Hm yeah that‘s pretty much how feel, if my team‘s shit I can‘t +1 or decap. But when I look at how long it took Jawgeous to get out of plat 1 I fear that I‘ll never get out of gold.

[Derenaya.3479]

@"Arkantos.7460" said:i play ranked with a jalis/glint bunker cc build and im in platin nowhttps://imgur.com/a/3AtvLq3

Yeah congratz :D That‘s the winning streak I was talking about in the first post. I mean I get them aswell from time to time but I doesn‘t really help if a loosing streak follows after it.

[MyPuppy.8970]

I usually climb to P2 until i get a losing streak on the last week/day. But I don't care, I have great matches overall, no afk, very few dc, and I feel Q time is shorter in Gold, anyway.

[Sampson.2403]

I tried playing Rev this season and dropped from P1 to G1. Switched back to my main and went back up to P1 almost P2 in one weekend.

If you're in the mindset that you're not in control of your own rank, then you're probably also not in the right mindset to honestly evaluate your own play. When you're in this mindset of "its my teams fault" or "matchmaking is broken", you will fail to identify your own team impact in each game and where it is that you need to improve to get to the next level.

[Alatar.7364]

@Derenaya.3479 said:I just feel like my skill doesn't matter. I can tryhard as much as I want (thief)

There's your answer, right in your own post.

[Derenaya.3479]

@Alatar.7364 said:

@Derenaya.3479 said:I just feel like my skill doesn't matter. I can tryhard as much as I want (thief)

There's your answer, right in your own post.

With the ,,I just feel like my skill doesn‘t matter.‘‘ I meant that I can‘t carry my team because they‘re just to stupid for the game. I know that sounds incredibly arrogant but just go and play in gold, you see thing you won‘t be able to forget.

[Chaotic.9742]

Came back to the game last week and placed gold 3. Went something like 12-4 after that soloQ’ing and climbed to plat easily. Think you’re just describing an xp/build issue. I found that when I tried to support my team, it was 90% of the time lackluster and I had to take a more aggressive build to “carry” any potential liabilities to victory. This from a power reaper/rev perspective.

[Malediktus.9250]

it is possible, I am going up and down between gold 3 and platin 2 all the time this season and I am not a really good pvp playerlast week I was just one win away from top 250 twice. But it never felt like my contribution do much about the outcome of the game. Matchmaking in this game is mostly luck

[syszery.1592]

@Derenaya.3479 said:Well it's kinda as you said except, and don't get me wrong, I know that you don't try to flame me (or is it bm in this game?) but I just feel like my skill doesn't matter. I can tryhard as much as I want (thief) but even if I get close to plat (I was one game away from it) I get a 5 game loosing streak...

The problem is that one sometimes need to find the correct point to stop and try again the next day. I know it sounds funny, but for me some days are just better in terms of team mates/compositions than others...

[Zenix.6198]

I kinda get your frustration.This season im playing weaver exclusively (and not even the boring mender/bunker variant) and im comfortably in plat 1.

But - and this is were I kinda agree with you - I duoQ a lot with a friend of mine that is currently in gold 2 and the things I have seen are mind boggling tbh.At times it doesnt feel like I have any impact on the game whatsoever (winning 1v2s 'n whatnot). Damage is just so out of wack, that you can't rely on your team winning against certain specs even when they 3v1 or 3v2 it.

This obviously is an experience issue, so Im not really mad at gold teammates (even tho I get salty at times) but the fact that stuff like core guard or reaper (but not exclusively those) can literally delete multiple unaware players at once, but it really doesn't help with the feeling of helplessness at times.

[Abazigal.3679]

@syszery.1592 said:

@Derenaya.3479 said:Well it's kinda as you said except, and don't get me wrong, I know that you don't try to flame me (or is it bm in this game?) but I just feel like my skill doesn't matter. I can tryhard as much as I want (thief) but even if I get close to plat (I was one game away from it)

I get a 5 game loosing streak...

The problem is that one sometimes need to find the correct point to stop and try again the next day. I know it sounds funny, but for me some days are just better in terms of team mates/compositions than others...

If we start on this assumption, we will all agree that this is totally random, though it's not entirely the case.

From my experience in all divisions ( except legendary), bronze silver and platinum are more likely balanced in terms of players level. Clearly, most of platinum players have a minimum knowledge. Also, i'd say that anyone that deserves platinum level should be able to easily carry most games in bronze/silver.

However PoF builds did change things a bit, and i am convinced that some builds ( cough mirage or scourge) are a bit too efficient at very low level, leading to absurd situations in gold division. I just had a game where our scourge kept going mid alone and kept dying there ( over 10 times probably). But can you really blame him, since he probably did climb doing it in lower divisions ?

[Koen.1327]

i play a lot with guildies which give me -30 losses sometimes but i've always managed to get back to p1/p2 when playing soloi play ranger, mes, rev and nec mainly, and i dont switch before game although i highly recommend filling up a missing role in your team

maybe map awareness is more important for you as a thief, because it fills many important roles (+1, decapping, stalling)200 games isn't a lot btw it took me a lot longer to get first time in plat, i got 2k games right now and can ride to plat almost on demand

some of your observations:-how do you save a game when fb + scourge loses 2v2? --> this is not suprising to me as not only most firebrands are bad in gold, support is quite useless in gold because teammates die anyway no matter how good the support is. I'd rather make it a 3v2 and may you be the killer.-people who take 1v3s at mid --> very common yes, but as a thief you have the mobility to reverse snowballing during the game by luring multiple enemies away so that your team recovers

you'll get there eventually, and when you do you will probably drop numerous times back to gold againkeep up the good work

[Derenaya.3479]

@Koen.1327 said:i play a lot with guildies which give me -30 losses sometimes but i've always managed to get back to p1/p2 when playing soloi play ranger, mes, rev and nec mainly, and i dont switch before game although i highly recommend filling up a missing role in your team

maybe map awareness is more important for you as a thief, because it fills many important roles (+1, decapping, stalling)200 games isn't a lot btw it took me a lot longer to get first time in plat, i got 2k games right now and can ride to plat almost on demand

some of your observations:-how do you save a game when fb + scourge loses 2v2? --> this is not suprising to me as not only most firebrands are bad in gold, support is quite useless in gold because teammates die anyway no matter how good the support is. I'd rather make it a 3v2 and may you be the killer.-people who take 1v3s at mid --> very common yes, but as a thief you have the mobility to reverse snowballing during the game by luring multiple enemies away so that your team recovers

you'll get there eventually, and when you do you will probably drop numerous times back to gold againkeep up the good work

Okay thank you for your answer, I guess my problem is that I just expect to much progress in a short time. I‘ll keep trying to rank up then.

@syszery.1592 said:

@Derenaya.3479 said:Well it's kinda as you said except, and don't get me wrong, I know that you don't try to flame me (or is it bm in this game?) but I just feel like my skill doesn't matter. I can tryhard as much as I want (thief) but even if I get close to plat (I was one game away from it)

I get a 5 game loosing streak...

The problem is that one sometimes need to find the correct point to stop and try again the next day. I know it sounds funny, but for me some days are just better in terms of team mates/compositions than others...

Yeah I know what you mean. If I don‘t have holidays I normaly stop after two looses in a row but since I have a lot of time atm I often just try to get my rank to where it was before which sometimes work and sometimes gets worse.

[Mysticjedi.6053]

I typically climb from Silver 3 to Platinum 2 all by solo queue when I play my main (Guardian) an entire season. So, yes it is possible.

[Derenaya.3479]

Okay I guess my statement was clearly refuted and I'll just try to rank up anyway. So I'd be interessted in your opinion on what would be the best class to carry?

[Alatar.7364]

@Derenaya.3479 said:Okay I guess my statement was clearly refuted and I'll just try to rank up anyway. So I'd be interessted in your opinion on what would be the best class to carry?

Boonbeast, Holo, Mirage, the least team-reliant professions are good for that.However, it remains a golden rule that if you wanna carry you have to babysit your team, so FB or Scourge as well.

[DragonFury.6243]

@Derenaya.3479 said:Okay so here I am, stuck in gold since like 200 games and I came to the conclusion that it is impossible to climb out of it if you don't get placed in platin in the first place or win 10 times in a row (which is pretty much impossible). People are just to braindead in gold, necros who go far instead of fighting with their fb, people who run into a 3-1 in mid instead of waiting for the team and so on I'm sure you saw these people as well. I rarely get close games, it's either you won the dice roll and the enemy team has the idiot or you lost it and you loose 500-200.

So my statement stands, try to change my mind.

learn how to farm necros and you ll be at plat in no time or at least that what i did

[Sampson.2403]

@Derenaya.3479 said:Okay I guess my statement was clearly refuted and I'll just try to rank up anyway. So I'd be interessted in your opinion on what would be the best class to carry?

If you're in gold, the only players that you're going to carry are bronze & silvers. The better question that you should be asking yourself is what role do I want to fill on my team, and how can I get better at it?