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Black Lion Chest Suggestion: Allow us to exchange unwanted BLC consumable items for Statuettes.


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Title.

I was gifted with a permanent hair kit last year and I bound it to my account. However, it doesn't stop you from getting the regular ones to drop, so between key farming, map completion and the odd key bought with irl money>gems, I've got nearly 90 Self-Style hair style kits. Deleting them seems like a waste though. Outside of this specific and very limited example, though, I'm sure that I also can't be alone between people who often open black lion chests in having a small fortune in revive orbs, repair canisters, Black Lion Salvage Kits, Upgrade Extractors, Mini Claim Tickets, and lounge passes that I'll almost certainly never use.

Let me trade them back for a couple of statuettes so I can work towards saving for stuff I actually want.

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Black Lion Statuettes are interesting in this regard. You obviously don't want to straight convert such items into cash, but recycling them back into other gem store items via statuettes is a good idea.

Main impediment is that you'd have to introduce a new currency item because a statuette is too high a value for a lot of the trade ins. You'd need the equivalent of statuette scraps to price things appropriately.

Plus it would unleash a backlog of trade ins. A lot of people are hoarding this stuff and would cash it all out. Would be a nice veteran reward in that respect.

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This has been brought up many times before, and I fully support the idea. Even if the conversion rate isn't a 1-for-1, I'd rather exchange my repair canisters et al for statuettes that I could then use to acquire skins, etc from the BL merchant.

But I posted to ask: 90 self style kits in a year? That's a heck of a lot more BL chest opening than "key farming, map completion and the odd key bought with irl money>gems" :astonished:

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Yes, yes please!!!! I have no use for summoning merchants, for instance, whereas I would love to exchange for statues and get transmutation charges, teleports, primers and even save up for more expensive items! I would buy more BLC keys if I knew I wouldn’t be stuck with items I don’t want and can’t sell!

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Why would they do that when they want people to buy more keys for statuettes? Trash items bloating the RNG pool are a staple of lootboxes for a reason. It works.

I have another, more viable solution to this issue, one that also happens to be on the user end. You are guaranteed far less unwanted BLC items if you never buy BLC keys to open the gamble chests. This way, you 'll only have to deal with the few items you get from the tiny amount of keys in-game. A pretty easy task.

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@Mbelch.9028 said:I have many-a hair change kits built up over the years. I have no idea why somebody would need one. I don't delete them as they add to account value, but I'd trade them in a heartbeat.

Some hairstyles are only available with this or the makeover kit and some of us care very much how our characters look. ;)

@AlexxxDelta.1806 said:Why would they do that when they want people to buy more keys for statuettes? Trash items bloating the RNG pool are a staple of lootboxes for a reason. It works.

I have another, more viable solution to this issue, one that also happens to be on the user end. You are guaranteed far less unwanted BLC items if you never buy BLC keys to open the gamble chests. This way, you 'll only have to deal with the few items you get from the tiny amount of keys in-game. A pretty easy task.

No, I would buy more keys if I knew it would range from minimally useful to something really cool, but I may be an outlier.

Your “solution” does not address the issue but rather your own opinion of RNG. Whether I only get the occasional key through story or decide to buy some keys, I find it more rewarding if what I get is at least something I will use. I actually got most of my merchant/trader/etc. summons from keys received during play, log in awards and perhaps other ways that I don’t remember. I only buy a few keys once in a while, when there’s a sale or so. Just playing the game you get can get several dozen of each of these kind of things that may be undesirable for you, which your “solution” does nothing to address. Of course, it is an “easy task” to right click delete but it should be obvious that the point is that we would like to get some value from these items.

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@"VDAC.2137" said:

No, I would buy more keys if I knew it would range from minimally useful to something really cool, but I may be an outlier.

Yes, if that's the case, you would be. Lootboxes in general are not designed to make you feel rewarded from the value you 're getting by opening them. They are designed to leave you "wanting" after opening, for just one more. I 've seen similar requests as the OP from different communities in more games than I can count. Since the practice is so prevalent, it obviously works.

@"VDAC.2137" said:

Whether I only get the occasional key through story or decide to buy some keys, I find it more rewarding if what I get is at least something I will use. I actually got most of my merchant/trader/etc. summons from keys received during play, log in awards and perhaps other ways that I don’t remember. I only buy a few keys once in a while, when there’s a sale or so. Just playing the game you get can get several dozen of each of these kind of things that may be undesirable for you, which your “solution” does nothing to address. Of course, it is an “easy task” to right click delete but it should be obvious that the point is that we would like to get some value from these items.

I never disputed that it would feel more rewarding to have less "trash" items in BLC. But when what you find rewarding goes against what is rewarding for Anet, there is only one outcome. To OP's suggestion specifically, statuettes are an obvious part of Anet's monetization, having them tradeable for undesirable consumables is detrimental to it. There are players, just like OP who have whole bank tabs full of the stuff. Also, with the exception of canisters,BL kits and orbs, you can't really get that much from the rest of the stuff, just from playing casually and log-in rewards. 90 hair-kits is a tad too much without indulging often in BL keys, don't you think?

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@kharmin.7683 said:How would this benefit Anet? Less keys would be purchased than they are now.

Really? You (or others) would be put off buying keys because you had a higher chance at getting something that you value out of them? The worthless items suddenly have some small worth, however the exchange is handled. Junk is still junk and still bloats the lootbox drop table, but if this were implemented, you would have the choice to trade it in or hoard it.

@AlexxxDelta.1806 said:Why would they do that when they want people to buy more keys for statuettes? Trash items bloating the RNG pool are a staple of lootboxes for a reason. It works.

I have another, more viable solution to this issue, one that also happens to be on the user end. You are guaranteed far less unwanted BLC items if you never buy BLC keys to open the gamble chests. This way, you 'll only have to deal with the few items you get from the tiny amount of keys in-game. A pretty easy task.

This would be a viable option if I didn't want those BLC only armor, backpack and weapon skins that they like to add for flavor.

@"Turkeyspit.3965" said:This has been brought up many times before, and I fully support the idea. Even if the conversion rate isn't a 1-for-1, I'd rather exchange my repair canisters et al for statuettes that I could then use to acquire skins, etc from the BL merchant.

But I posted to ask: 90 self style kits in a year? That's a heck of a lot more BL chest opening than "key farming, map completion and the odd key bought with irl money>gems" :astonished:

Yeah, I did a quick forum search for this topic and couldn't find an existing thread to bump (though maybe my keywords were wrong.) I was playing Elder Scrolls Online, and their Loot-crate system with the crown shards was what made me think of it, in all honesty.

It probably wasn't 90 in a year, I'm sure I had some from before I got the hair contract- and even with uh, 30ish characters, I don't change their looks all that often. Even so, it feels like the 3rd slot in chests is reserved for that all important self style hair kit that the game just knows I'm thirsty for.

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I think you're right, because I never get them and instead get transmutation charges.

That said earlier today one of my pet theories was maybe not disproven because of small sample size but before today I would have sworn that if I had a blc in my inventory I wouldn't get a key. At one point I went maps upon maps with no key--but I sure had those chests. Then when I sold them all BING three keys in a row.

But today I had a chest and got a key.

Funny how we get superstitious isn't it? Other pet theories I've discarded is that lower level maps give keys more often and that queensdale has a higher percentage than any other map.

I really really should make a spreadsheet sometime just to point and laugh at myself. It's likely just a flat rate.

As to trading in here is my question: what are you going to keep trading them in FOR once you have everything? THEN will you still buy keys?

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I have the permanent hair kit, too, and keep getting the one-off hair kits. I'd like to be able to trade them in for something, and then stop getting them. This falls under getting duplicate items in my mind and I really feel devalues keys.

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@Etria.3642 said:

As to trading in here is my question: what are you going to keep trading them in FOR once you have everything? THEN will you still buy keys?

I can always use transmutation charges and since I have a lot of alts with only parts of the map open, teleport-to-friend is also useful for me. Oh, and the sigil-remover, especially now that scholar runes cost more than they used to.

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80% of the drops in the BL are intended to be fluff, worthless junk. It's a lotto, not a "bag of mostly cool stuff," and like any lottery, ANet is selling the Dream of Wealth, not actual wealth.Accordingly, it's very unlikely that ANet will exchange any amount of Rez Orbs for even a single measly statuette. I can't imagine why they'd go through any effort at all to undermine their tactics that generate a bunch of income for them.


On the other hand, I think ANet could be encouraged to offer a vendor value to all account bound items (phased into the game over time). Even 1s per stack of bloodstone dust or 1 copper per insta-banker would be enough that most people would sell their excess to an NPC rather than cart it around on the off chance it's useful some day.

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Huh, I guess it’s a different concept than the packs I used to buy in SWTOR: I’d always get some things I would like and could sell the rest. If I buy five BLC keys and don’t get anything that I find worthwhile, I become cross and don’t buy more for months at least! I derive no pleasure from paying something for nothing, but I guess I’m the exception.

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@VDAC.2137 said:I derive no pleasure from paying something for nothing, but I guess I’m the exception.Oh no, you're certainly not alone in feeling that way. I'm just saying that ANet is not selling something; they are selling the anticipation of getting something.

It's roughly US$1+ per key and for that price, I can get a basic lotto ticket in the US. I figure if I'm buying a dream with impossible odds, I might as well aim big.

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@"Illconceived Was Na.9781" said:80% of the drops in the BL are intended to be fluff, worthless junk. It's a lotto, not a "bag of mostly cool stuff," and like any lottery, ANet is selling the Dream of Wealth, not actual wealth.Accordingly, it's very unlikely that ANet will exchange any amount of Rez Orbs for even a single measly statuette. I can't imagine why they'd go through any effort at all to undermine their tactics that generate a bunch of income for them.[...]

From that perspective, adding the statuettes in the first place was "undermining" their BLC tactics, as it set a definitive limit to how many chests you need to get item X.

Offering some way to recycle items you have no use for back into the chest economy (keys/statuettes) would drastically increase the percieved value of chests, while not necessarily increasing the effective value to the same degree.

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While the BLC may be like the lottery, the problem is that unless you get the really rare grand prize, most everything else is worthless. At least the lottery gives you some lesser prizes that have actual value, where as at this point in the game, a lot of the drops from the BLC are worthless. Even if they could be sold to vendors for 1 gold, which would still be a money loser, and least there is some perceived value to it vs it just sitting in storage to never be used.Several other games do provide some trade in value - it is still at a poor exchange ratio, but they must have determined there is some value to this - maybe people are more inclined to buy these RNG chests if they know they will get something of value, it provides players with flexibility (like the statuettes do), etc.

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At least the lottery gives you some lesser prizes that have actual value,Not really. In the US, most government lotteries offer exactly 50% of the proceeds as rewards. Except that includes the jackpot, so the lesser prizes with actual value are far and few between, pretty much like BL Chests.


From that perspective, adding the statuettes in the first place was "undermining" their BLC tactics, as it set a definitive limit to how many chests you need to get item X.Yes, it did.Some people think it was in preparation for dealing with anti-lottery/loot-box fervor.Then again, they did the same thing with BL Tickets, by introducing BL Ticket Scraps. That didn't change the average number of tickets per chest, it just gave people a sense of making progress. Which is exactly what we get from the BL statuettes: a sense of progress.

Offering some way to recycle items you have no use for back into the chest economy (keys/statuettes) would drastically increase the percieved value of chests, while not necessarily increasing the effective value to the same degree.Or they could just stop offering fluff, which would be even easier.

Of course, lots of people like and find use for the fluff. So it's not quite as cut & dried.


I should mention that I don't personally have a problem with ANet offering some sort of conversion, as I have plenty of detritus socked away because I can afford to hang on to it. I just don't see it as likely that they'd offer much more than coppers.

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@Illconceived Was Na.9781 said:[...]Or they could just stop offering fluff, which would be even easier.

Of course, lots of people like and find use for the fluff. So it's not quite as cut & dried.[...]

Exactly: it's not quite as cut & dried. What's fluff to you might be desirable to me. An example: for quite some time, my partner wanted transmutation charges from map completions. Keys were a downgrade as they often neither gave any charges or any other useful stuff.

A trade-in system lets each player decide what is fluff and what is good, drastically increasing the percieved value of the chests.

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