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[Merged] Skyscale - Definitely Feeling Like It Needs More - A Few Suggestions


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In a nutshell, after obtaining my Skyscale and maxing out its masteries, I really feel like this mount needs more of something. I find myself still traversing maps mainly with Beetle/Bunny/Griffin combo, which is in all aspects just faster and more convenient than anything the Skyscale does. This is a bit disappointing considering what one has to do to obtain this mount.

A few suggestions that come to mind:

  1. A Reasonable Suggestion That Needs To Happen -> The dive speed on Skyscale needs to be greatly enhanced. It doesn't need to dive as fast as a Griffin, but boy oh boy is it too slow as it is right now. This is a very obnoxious hinderance to mobility.
  2. Somewhat Unreasonable But Not So Unreasonable ->When the Skyscale latches onto a wall, it should rebuild its stamina so that it can ultimately keep jumping, keep making gains, and eventually be able to scale any vertical surface in the game. Let's face it, the players who are obtaining this mount are all of the older players who have played through all of the previous content to even be able to have it unlocked to do the achievements. We have done all of the content before, the difficult way, some of us having done it several times. Obtaining the Skyscale isn't just about the difficult achievements. The Skyscale is also about a player's historical activity, which declares how realistic it is to even aim at having this mount. For what it takes to obtain this mount, players should be rewarded with something special. Give those players a vertical bypass for all of their hours spent playing & supporting this game.
  3. Pretty Far Fetched, But Would Feel Great To Have, Everyone Would Love It -> The Skyscale should have a #2 attack skill that is a 1500 range or so ground targeted attacked, that launches a fireball that hits like a treb, CC included.

I mean, you can't even use it in Dungeons or Fractals or Raids or Competitive Modes. Let's give this thing something to justify the tribulation that was the Skyscale achievements. I think the idea and flavor behind the mount is great, it just needs a bit of tweaking.

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There are videos on the internet showcasing how the mount is both usefull and in cases simply better than the bunny and a great alternative to swapping between the bunny and the griffon.

Tho id like to see an increase at the speed which the mount falls down.

All in all i think its fairly well balance, i dont think we need to make the bunny outclassed in all cases (which some might argue is already the case)

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I have to disagree here. The amount of convenience and comfort the Skyscale adds is simply ridiculous. By flying upwards it can start much higher than the Griffon, by jumping of walls it can reach heights that were difficult to reach using the Springer and you can even stop in midair to reorient or check your surroundings.

Have you tried moving down with your "Mount Ability 2" or engage skill? It might be no griffon, but it should dive as fast as it rises when pressing the jump key.Regarding its jumping ability: You can always get two more jumps (and a little flight endurance as a bonus) by activating your Bond of Vigor.And to top it off, you can even make use of your endurance to charge forward, if you don't need to climb up a wall.

All in all I'd say the Skyscale is a great mount if you're not in a hurry. It can reach higher and further than Raptor and Springer, the flight is more consistent than a Griffon's, the current engage skill is pretty strong and it is able to hover and even fly backwards. I don't really understand why you're complaining.

EDIT: Just checked, the Skyscale is significantly faster moving down than flying upwards.

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I certainly wouldn't mind a (slight) speed increase over all. Otherwise, with all the masteries, I think skyscale is in a pretty decent place. I personally default to it now since it's just convenient enough to not want to switch to griffon or Springer in most cases. I like that the other mounts remain relevant though.

I think alot of people wanted more because they expected this mount to replace griffon which it was never meant to.

I agree that the downward speed could use a small buff though, or allow us to dismount mid air or something. I only really feel this way when doing the meta in Dragonfall though.

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@"Musik.8509" said:All in all I'd say the Skyscale is a great mount if you're not in a hurry.

Which literally everyone is in a hurry, or put into a different perspective, they are wanting to find ways to cut time off their activities. Everyone does this, whether they are trying to keep up following a meta train or simply looking for ways to cut corners and make map completion faster. The only time a player is "Not in a hurry" is when they are exploring an area for the first time or doing story for the first time. <- And that is certainly not the position of a player who is deep enough into GW2 to be able to unlock the Skyscale. No one wants to "go slow and take their time" when they're on their 10th+ world map completion, when they could be hot rodding around on a Beetle, Diving from high places with the Griffin for speed, or jumping up a vertical cliffside very quickly with a Springer, and being able to press #1 at the peak of the jump to make it hit the ground for a much faster land & dismount than the Skyscale provides.

You can strawman me all you want, but the fact remains that this mount is quite impractical for the uses of the hardcore fan base that is more deep into GW2, who are the only ones who even have access to being able to unlock the Skyscale. There are only a handful of places in the entire game that it would be debatable at best, that the Skyscale was actually better than a Griffin/Springer combo. I'll be honest with you, even though many of us have unlocked the Skyscale as of recent, I never see it being used when I follow meta trains, or while doing anything else in the way of actual gameplay. The only time I see players mounting their Skyscales, is when they are AFKing in Lion's Arch, for the status effect. Why? Because it isn't fast enough to keep up with players who are using Beetles/Springers/Griffons. Players who try to Skyscale their way through a map vs. Beetles/Springers/Griffins, often find the event ending before they get there.

All I'm saying is that the mount needs a little bit more of something. Maybe a bit of increased fly speed, bit of increased dive speed. Right now it isn't relevant for any serious use. And don't tell me that isn't true when we are talking about a game community that religiously refers to websites like metabattle and snowcrows for "The best options that can be used."

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I agree with all that, plus I believe it's flight meter needs an increase while removing the near third flight meter consumption that happens just by jumping in the air.

Beside that the most important part would be speed up its flight and dive, I am not saying by a lot but it just does need an increase.

While the mount looks nice and its idea seems great, in its current state it feels extremely unworthy/useless/unviable.

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@Trevor Boyer.6524 said:

@"Musik.8509" said:All in all I'd say the Skyscale is a great mount if you're not in a hurry.

snip
No one wants to "go slow and take their time" when they're on their 10th+ world map completion, when they could be hot rodding around on a Beetle, Diving from high places with the Griffin for speed, or jumping up a vertical cliffside very quickly with a Springer, and being able to press #1 at the peak of the jump to make it hit the ground for a much faster land & dismount than the Skyscale provides.
snip

Hi. 14 world completions and counting (plus 25 HoT completions, multiple PoF completions, and completing all the LW3 maps and 75% of LW4 maps on 25+ characters).

I use the skyscale a fair amount even though it's been available for all of a week, far more than I do the beetle. I prefer relaxed map completion over frantic map completion because I actually enjoy it and have played GW2 too long to be in a hurry about anything other than new content. Don't presume to speak for all players and playstyles.

While your suggestion on increasing the descent speed is a good one, the rest is subjective. It's no different than people saying that the raptor is useless because the jackal is faster on everything but completely flat terrain. The skyscale is niche for some, on par with griffon for others. Not everyone min-maxes with mounts, choosing instead to play what they enjoy. That's why there are people out there who use the springer, skimmer, and warclaw as their primary mount. The reason why you don't see them as much in zergs is because there's a rush to get hits in to get credit. (Throw in the issues with updrafts, mushrooms, etc. instantly draining the skyscale's flight bar, of course you don't see them often in certain areas—it's not fun falling like a rock!)

The skyscale isn't for everyone the same way the skimmer isn't for everyone, and it has more of a learning curve than other mounts. That doesn't make it bad.

As for your other suggestions.

  • 2 would make it pointless and may as well allow free flying. Lack of endurance regen is there specifically to add a skill ceiling to using it, and it already has a generous skill floor once you get the third mastery.
  • And 3 would probably do better by reworking the engage skill so it can be ground targeted or is centred on your target.
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  1. It needs endless flying. Of course without recharging height possibility mid-air except if you collect volatile magic.

  2. It needs endless climbing potential. Even bond of vigor + the 2 usual dodge bar additions are not enough. On mountain massifs the springer is so much better and superior if there are enough platforms you can stand on. At the moment it is a pain in the axx if you hang on the mountain and you desperately need an aditional dodge transformation to climb the last part. You'll sink and climb, sink and climb - terrible mechanic.

Both things wouldn't make it gamebreaking because the griffon and the springer would still be faster on common used routes now matter what.

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I'd be down for a bit more speed on the decent (aka speed when holding the decend button) just because sometimes I want to get on the ground a bit faster without fully dismounting. I dont think it needs faster in the other directions. If anything the only mod I'd love to see is let it just slowly crawl along walls during a cling. Letting it crawl along walls like a geko would be a fairly novel movement option compared to the other mounts and allow you to keep acceding. bunny would be faster if there was ledges but skyscale can go till you run out of cliff. Not a deal breaker though as I'm overall happy with the skyscale so far.

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@Zephire.8049 said:

@"Musik.8509" said:All in all I'd say the Skyscale is a great mount if you're not in a hurry.

snip
No one wants to "go slow and take their time" when they're on their 10th+ world map completion, when they could be hot rodding around on a Beetle, Diving from high places with the Griffin for speed, or jumping up a vertical cliffside very quickly with a Springer, and being able to press #1 at the peak of the jump to make it hit the ground for a much faster land & dismount than the Skyscale provides.
snip

Hi.
14 world completions and counting (plus 25 HoT completions, multiple PoF completions, and completing all the LW3 maps and 75% of LW4 maps on 25+ characters)
.

I use the skyscale a fair amount even though it's been available for all of a week, far more than I do the beetle. I prefer relaxed map completion over frantic map completion because I actually enjoy it and have played GW2 too long to be in a hurry about anything other than new content. Don't presume to speak for all players and playstyles.

While your suggestion on increasing the descent speed is a good one, the rest is subjective. It's no different than people saying that the raptor is useless because the jackal is faster on everything but completely flat terrain. The skyscale is niche for some, on par with griffon for others. Not everyone min-maxes with mounts, choosing instead to play what they enjoy. That's why there are people out there who use the springer, skimmer, and warclaw as their primary mount. The reason why you don't see them as much in zergs is because there's a rush to get hits in to get credit.
(Throw in the issues with updrafts, mushrooms, etc. instantly draining the skyscale's flight bar, of course you don't see them often in certain areas—it's not fun falling like a rock!)

The skyscale isn't for everyone the same way the skimmer isn't for everyone, and it has more of a learning curve than other mounts. That doesn't make it bad.

As for your other suggestions.
  • 2 would make it pointless and may as well allow free flying. Lack of endurance regen is there specifically to add a skill ceiling to using it, and it already has a generous skill floor once you get the third mastery.
  • And 3 would probably do better by reworking the engage skill so it can be ground targeted or is centred on your target.

I actually don't believe anything you've said at all. Your statements are like someone who is fishing for reasons to defend the Skyscale mechanics. Sorry, just pointing out what I felt when reading your response. Hey I could be completely wrong:

  1. You claim 14 world completions and counting (plus 25 HoT completions, multiple PoF completions, and completing all the LW3 maps and 75% of LW4 maps on 25+ characters). What, were you bored enough to build each HoT legendary twice?
  2. You claim "I use the skyscale a fair amount even though it's been available for all of a week, far more than I do the beetle." As if you had rattled off a map comp or two in the same week you unlocked the Skyscale. Come on now.
  3. Then you claim "I prefer relaxed map completion over frantic map completion because I actually enjoy it and have played GW2 too long to be in a hurry about anything other than new content." So you're telling me, that you've completed 14 Central Tyria completions, 25 HoT completions, multiple PoF completions, and all ls3 & 4 maps on 25 characters, and that you have actually achieved this not by setting deadlines and standards, but by doing it slowly? Yeah, No. Then you say you are in a hurry with new content? What? Feels like you said that just to say the opposite of what I said. It doesn't make any sense.
  4. You said "Don't presume to speak for all players and playstyles." Well uuuh, I kind of feel like I could, considering I generally work with and speak with players who participate in the largest trade guild in-game, whom by itself produces probably 50% or more of the legendary items you see posted in the TP. This is no over exaggeration. We accomplish this not by taking this slowly, but by scheduling mass map completions where our fastest players pin up and other players follow them on a 2 day process, 4 hours each day, 8 hour tour in total, for everything in a Central Tyria clear outside of hearts. Players then go back and complete hearts on their own time. If they aren't doing it this way, they are solo running and busting ass to get things done as quickly as possible, all of them. Map completions are probably the #1 thing that people HATE to have to do the most, and thus they try to do it as quickly as possible. If you enjoy doing things slowly, you are the first person in 7 years that I have heard say such a thing. And that isn't speaking for other players as you so strawman me. That's just explaining to you my subjective experience with the community. Big difference there buddy.
  5. Then you go on to say "While your suggestion on increasing the descent speed is a good one, the rest is subjective. It's no different than people saying that the raptor is useless because the jackal is faster on everything but completely flat terrain." Ok, first of all it doesn't even matter if what I said is subjective. Dude if you didn't notice, MOST of the community is pretty upset with the performance of the Skyscale. And comparing Skyscale majority upset vs. discussions about Raptor/Jackal isn't even in the same ballpark. Raptor/Jackal clearly have very visible parameters that would dictate without arguments, when one was better to use than the other, and there are plenty of times in the game where each should be used. The Skyscale on the other hand, there are too few strange vertical experiences where this mount will actually be important, and how often will players ever even be in those places?
  6. You said "The skyscale is niche for some, on par with griffon for others. Not everyone min-maxes with mounts, choosing instead to play what they enjoy. That's why there are people out there who use the springer, skimmer, and warclaw as their primary mount. The reason why you don't see them as much in zergs is because there's a rush to get hits in to get credit." Wait what? Did you just agree with me? So in other words you're saying that certain mounts are required or at the least preferable over others, because they are better faster than others while traversing terrain? Yup, I completely agree with you.
  7. You say "The skyscale isn't for everyone the same way the skimmer isn't for everyone" That's a terrible comparison. The Skimmer is a water mount. No one would use a Skimmer unless they were traveling across the Straits or Devastation of something. And if they were, the Skimmer would be the best option, still twice as fast as a Skyscale would be.
  8. You said the Skyscale has a greater learning curve than other mounts? That's quite the opposite actually. Really what we're looking at is that the Skyscale is the lazy mount. You can fly with it like a Griffin albeit slower and also never fall. You can get vertical with it like a Springer as long as there is an actual vertical ledge and not an overhang or an isolated floating rock, which in that case only a Springer can get to, but it's still slower than the Springer. It could fly over water like a Skimmer even though it's slower. The Skyscale is a way to traverse most things, without swapping mounts. That's all it is. For the purposes of getting things done faster or following an on point meta train, players will still need to use Beetle/Springer/Griffin over Skyscale, because Skyscale is way too slow at what it does.

Look man, I don't want to keep arguing with you. All I'm saying is that I'm not into these "RP aspects of fiddling around on my mount as I sight see Queensdale, because I like how my mount looks." and I don't think most players are either. What I want are things with purpose and viability. I want a reason to be able to use my new cool dragon mount that was a tribulation to unlock. I want it to be viable to use so that it can keep up while following on point meta trains. Right now, it is too slow around the board to be viable for general play, unless you are a rare person who doesn't mind "going slowly."

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@drmambo.7620 said:I certainly wouldn't mind a (slight) speed increase over all. Otherwise, with all the masteries, I think skyscale is in a pretty decent place. I personally default to it now since it's just convenient enough to not want to switch to griffon or Springer in most cases. I like that the other mounts remain relevant though.

I think alot of people wanted more because they expected this mount to replace griffon which it was never meant to.

I agree that the downward speed could use a small buff though, or allow us to dismount mid air or something. I only really feel this way when doing the meta in Dragonfall though.

just use mount skill 8.. the one that launches you off your mount... you take no fall damage and you fall as fast as you normally would without being on a mount... easiest way to drop down.

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@Lithril Ashwalker.6230 said:I want an air attack myself. Not a dismount. It's a bit off topic but this game has air and water movement as well as ground. We have underwater combat so why not unique aerial combat too?

You sir, are a visionary.We can already throw spears off mounts for the krak big show. Make it that we could use spears throughout the entire world of Tyria.

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@pinguadoido.6581 said:

@Lithril Ashwalker.6230 said:I want an air attack myself. Not a dismount. It's a bit off topic but this game has air and water movement as well as ground. We have underwater combat so why not unique aerial combat too?

You sir, are a visionary.We can already throw spears off mounts for the krak big show. Make it that we could use spears throughout the entire world of Tyria.

when gliding, weapon skills convert to aerial versions

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I agree the descend could maybe be a little faster but that's about it on what I agree with. Only other things I'd personally like to see is the wall cling being a manual hotkey instead of automatic and them fixing the issue with things like updrafts and mushrooms giving you the red bar of doom (which I believe they said was an oversight, so I wouldn't be surprised if they end up eventually fixing it).I personally find it more useful than Springer or Griffin in most cases. Even in times I was following people on griffins, I was hardly behind them at all and only a handful of people even used their griffins to go super fast. It's fine.

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Yes, I know there are hundreds of suggestions how to add to skyscale mount already, I myself posted one earlier, but after playing with it for some time, I think I know what it needs:

1: Remove the red bar: There's no way around it, the red "overload" bar has to go. Yes yes, I know it's been added to prevent things like infinite ascending, but let's face it: There's no point in the game that skyscale couldn't reach even as it is currently. (save for invisible barriers) I myself have been to the very top of tarir, top of durmand priory etc... To address the red bar while mounting in midair: Change it so that when you mount like that, you start with your blue bar empty.2: Add at least 50% more of the blue bar, prefferably double it: Same as above you can reach everywhere with skyscale, so why to restrain so much? You have no idea (actually you do) how restraining it feels to mount and shoot up, only to be hit in the face by the top of the flyable canopy. And mounts should be the polar opposite of restraining.3: Stop its descending/gliding mechanic: Once more, same as above. When you reach the top of the canopy, make it being able to maintain that altitude indefinitely. First, we already have the gliding griffon with its wing flap mechanic, there, it makes sense. But skyscale flaps its wings on its own all the time, there's no reason for it to descend, it feels restraining again. Plus, again, there's no reason for this restrain to be there, a devoted player can get anywhere with it. And that fly up, land, fly up again between-steps would be gone, how great that would feel.4: Remove the cooldown-lock while attached to walls: A little QoL, I won't explain why again. A little guide to go around this: Attach, jump, fly up, let it descend to have your jump bar refilled, attach...etc until your skill recharges to gain infinite climbing. No reason for this restrain to be there.5: Increase its Z-tilt angle: I've seen people complaining about it being slow in going down, but I think it's fine when combining engage skill with looking down. What I'd like to see is increasing its max angle while holding right mouse button. Currently, it can ascend/descend at max 45deg like this, increase this to about 60-70. It would feel more natural and address that slow descend issue as well.X: plus just a little interesting QoL: Make it dash in the direction it's moving: Just a little idea, I know it would require more animations, but for example, when strafing sideways, make it perform a roll to the side, how cool that would be? Maybe useless, but cool!

So, what do you think about this? Do you agree? And do you think that devs would add such big freedom to it? I certainly hope so!Betaraptor.4075

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Well, everything here has been mentioned except the side roll.

I can get behind removing the red bar and increasing the flight duration, but I don't think removing the cool down lock or completely removing the descent as you travel to be a good idea.

Rather, reduce the cool down of invigoration to 30 seconds or so or increase how much it refills your bars instead of removing the lock.

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@Betaraptor.4075 said:5: Increase its Z-tilt angle: I've seen people complaining about it being slow in going down, but I think it's fine when combining engage skill with looking down. What I'd like to see is increasing its max angle while holding right mouse button. Currently, it can ascend/descend at max 45deg like this, increase this to about 60-70. It would feel more natural and address that slow descend issue as well.

Hold the descend key and you'll find it goes down more quickly, probably close to 60-70 degrees below horizontal.

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I wish there was a dedicated button for when you decide you want your skyscale to cling to a wall, like if you hold down 2 it'll try to cling but if you don't hold down 2 it will just keep flying. There are a lot of times I'm just trying to fly a little bit up and land on a ledge and the skyscale really wants to keep clinging to the wall and that's not what I want it to do.

I'd also really like if the engagement attack skill was ground targeted in particular. It's very hard to aim. Also I wish the burning scaled with player stats so we have a mount that works great if you play a condition build.

And yes, faster descending is a very important handling concern.

Overall I love it though.

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I've had the Skyscale for almost a week now and I'm absolutely loving it!The only things I hope will be adjusted are:

  1. I wish it could fly forward endlessly without descending. The maxinum height could still be limited by flight juice.A more limited version could be, that the Skyscale wouldn't descent from the height it left from, unless you'd descend intentionally. This way one would continue flying forward endlessly, if they left from a high location to begin with. It would be fun to be able to fly back to the height one left from, if having descended intentionally, though.

  2. Skills should recharge while clinging on walls, even if endurance and flight juice won't.

  3. The flight juice red bar thingy should be fixed when mounting the Skyscale after a jumping pad, BoF after griffon/springer etc. It should count the Skyscale mounting height as the starting point, not "too high" already.

That's only a wishlist though. As said, I'm absolutely loving it anyway. ^^

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